[00:41:15] Aw dang. Missed it. [01:22:57] (PS1) Totten: wmf_civicrm/db_switcher - Parse DB URLs which include ports [wikimedia/fundraising/crm] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146668 [15:47:17] hey atgo. [15:47:57] hey K4-713 [15:48:10] I made it with plenty of time for the call. [15:48:25] ...I'll buy myself a cookie later. [15:48:38] wooo! [15:48:51] Did they say anything about what specifically they were going to ask us? [15:49:02] Or, even generally, I suppose. [15:49:05] nothing at all [15:49:16] Well, that's... one way to do it. [15:50:17] yeah.. i imagine it'll be pretty straightforward [15:51:35] atgo: Gah. Two minutes, wireless was okay. [15:51:59] huh? [15:52:06] It kicked me off. [15:52:16] And now I've incremented. [15:52:33] ahh indeed [15:53:00] So, in the 8 minutes we have until this call: I had a thought yesterday. [15:53:14] And it was one of those "Why Didn't I Think Of This Years Ago" things. [15:53:32] You know how we have all those limbo queues? [15:54:43] If we just made the CRM understand what the difference between a completed and a pending transaction was, we could stop doing that. [15:55:11] K4-7131 that does sound nice [15:55:19] 'course, there would be a lot of work making sure that the reporting definitely ignored things that weren't real. [15:55:27] And, deduplication would be an even bigger problem... [15:55:46] ...but I still think it would be nicer than what we do now. [15:56:11] And if it isn't, we can just delete it. [15:57:00] It would potentially, however, break the hell out of ecom. [15:57:07] Because: Assumptions. [15:57:46] I'd like to figure out a good time to give it a try, though. But it does seem that it's going to have to be after pizzzacat has some dash things going. [15:58:47] ecom replacement dash things. [16:01:42] atgo: omg, that was like calling the future with a broken time machine. [16:01:53] haha [16:08:05] atgo: Wow, this dude. [16:08:13] K4-713 yeah [16:08:18] Unbelieveable. [16:09:01] BAHAHA [16:09:06] ermmm [16:09:17] i'm pretty ready to punch someone right now [16:09:27] I think I need a shower. [16:11:26] atgo: That report is for chumps, btw. [16:11:50] but the cool statistics! [16:13:45] omg. [16:13:50] that. [16:14:15] "Obviously, you are two very intelligent ladies..." [16:14:27] * K4-713 tries to figure out how to punch people over the phone [16:15:12] So... when I said that I thought we were having trouble engaging people to get what we were really after, because to them we were an unknown degree of liability... [16:15:43] I expect everybody to approach us as if we only just heard of PCI yesterday. [16:15:47] yeah [16:16:00] The cool-ass doc we get is almost certainly going to reinforce that. [16:16:08] ooooh! what is this credit card of which you speak? [16:16:13] how is money? [16:16:16] Credit.... card? [16:16:31] You mean we shouldn't save all the data in cleartext? [16:16:35] ZOUNDS. [16:16:56] ok.. well it sounds like at least they'll connect us to the right people. [16:17:02] Yeah, maybe. [16:17:45] i wonder if it would help us to be more clear about what we have/what our goals are in the next one (this afternoon) [16:18:09] I don't know. I was pretty clear with AT&T and they still wanted to, you know, *go* to the data center and look at machines. [16:18:29] I basically said "LOL no". [16:19:32] If they think that bit is their responsibility, we have a fundamental misunderstanding. [16:19:41] We want advice. [16:20:57] I understand wanting to audit our systems to that end, because how can you advise based on data you don't have. [16:21:27] Hm. [16:21:40] Actually... [16:21:50] atgo: I think this might be a dirty mechanic type situation. [16:22:12] what do you mean? [16:22:23] I bet they're trying to use fear to sell us the undercoating on the payments cluster. [16:22:28] (CR) Awight: [C: 2] "Good feature, thank you!" [wikimedia/fundraising/crm] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146668 (owner: Totten) [16:23:27] It would explain the extreme patronization that just happened. [16:23:33] yeah that was ridiculous [16:23:48] grumble. [16:24:03] Is it too early to drink? [16:25:02] oy. [16:25:33] I'm... going to go punch a wall. brb [16:30:32] atgo: The other best part about that call? "I'm going to get this other guy to talk to you. I mean, I'm *totally* qualified to do it. So very, very qualified. I just choose not to." [16:30:41] Like, three times. [16:30:43] ha yep [16:30:52] oh well. maybe the other guy will be better [16:30:59] But this dude was so qualified. [16:31:55] I don't know that we're going to find anyone more BAHAHA, no. [16:35:23] ha what is this all about? [16:36:30] pizzzacat we had a call with a dude that was not only remarkably unhelpful but also super patronizing [16:36:33] such is life [16:37:11] aww [17:10:36] Jeff_Green: any thoughts about how we will duplicate our logs to the server admin wiki? [17:10:51] I can copy that python class over if it seems reasonable to you. [17:11:06] time to write a wikibot? [17:11:15] I'm not sure that's something we even want to do [17:11:22] ejegg: there is already a py module that does it... [17:11:34] oh, cool [17:11:51] Jeff_Green: right. but only cos we have varying levels of msg publicness, right? [17:12:03] yeah [17:12:13] ejegg: https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Morebots [17:12:41] Jeff_Green: so can we just make that explicit? I think we very much do want the deployment tree-ishes to be public somewhere. [17:12:55] Oh, didn't know that guy does edits too! [17:13:02] isn't that crazy? [17:13:06] i like it [17:13:30] I was revulsed at first but now am in the mixed feelings camp along with Jeff_Green ;) [17:14:14] ejegg: seems like it should be decomposed further, so the wiki-appending thing is a service layer. [17:14:45] right, redirectable inputs and outputs [17:15:10] cos for example, I would like to do the same thing, but without copy+pasting the code... [17:18:44] i dunno anything [17:19:20] I'm not sure what the world gains by knowing intimate details of fundraising deployment? [17:19:35] the repos are already public right? [17:20:28] Jeff_Green: it's mostly for us to find, quickly, later. Then, the public and other WMF techsen can help find bugs. Also because obscurity will not offer us any security. [17:21:11] I do appreciate your point, though. I think I'm just being knee-jerk about us deviating from the norms. [17:21:14] if we just need to find things quickly later wouldn't it be more useful to have it close to where deployment happens? like in a log on boron or something? [17:21:46] yeah I suppose we don't even care, we just need it to be a permanent record somewhere. [17:21:51] i think the norm for operators of fundraising/payment systems is to be fairly secretive :-) [17:22:00] so awful... [17:22:02] it *is* in syslog [17:22:08] yep [17:22:12] permanent, so that's something [17:22:22] I know what you mean though [17:22:40] twice I've had to go figure out when/where we patched payemtnswiki for the same stupid CVE [17:22:48] actually for me what was most effective was git log [17:22:56] oh hrm that is approximate [17:22:58] what if we started using release tags? [17:23:10] I would love that. [17:23:13] and deployment was based on tagged releases [17:23:18] That's my favorite. [17:23:21] me too [17:23:30] But would we log that publically? [17:23:42] wouldn't it be in the repo? [17:23:46] gerrit? [17:24:30] well, e.g. let's say a subtle bug is discovered and we want to know which donations were affected by it. [17:24:44] ok [17:24:49] the gerrit logs are probably inaccurate to within an hour or so. [17:24:58] we'd want to have the exact timestamp of deployment. [17:25:22] oic. well syslog is the best bet for that I think [17:25:33] hrmph. OK I will relent for now. [17:25:52] let's finish murdering alumiium instead! [17:25:55] & will poll other techsen to determine weather [17:26:00] agreed [17:26:13] Lemme know when I should test the IPN endpoints. [17:26:20] i'm messing with moving IPN listener now, in my vb host [17:26:28] and I totally agree with putting unsub on paymentswiki, but will defer to K4 [17:26:50] does it seem reasonable? [17:26:52] heckyeah [17:27:12] good. otherwise I'm at a bit of a loss of where to host it [17:27:45] is it necessarily a mediawiki thing? [17:28:00] Jeff_Green: yep [17:28:05] ok [17:28:37] i think that was actually p gehres' idea [17:44:27] is somebody working on the paypal listener? because i actually just got a question from caitlin about something in there [17:46:05] and by listener i mean nightly audit [17:47:15] atgo: err [17:47:20] atgo: actively working, no [17:47:37] ah ok.. i just saw a build failed in jenkins thing [17:47:38] atgo: can u forward the Q? I see tha failure now [17:47:53] https://wikimedia.mingle.thoughtworks.com/projects/online_fundraiser/cards/1795 [17:47:59] atgo: ccogdill? Yeah we're emailing to ask WTF about a few days ago [17:48:11] this is a different issue [17:48:18] atgo: this morning's failure is just a host/ssh thing [17:48:27] mm ok [17:48:34] I'll run again [17:48:48] awight don't worry about this card unless it's related to what you're already doing.. it's not urgent [17:48:52] hey atgo, I created that card to basically notify Katie Paypal had *never* done something she thought it did [17:49:04] yeah thanks ccogdill [17:49:04] :) [17:49:24] awight: So, that CR I was needing today... [17:49:34] mhmm. seems like you may have gotten that already, but let me know if you need clarification [17:49:45] awight: It's the commits referenced here: https://wikimedia.mingle.thoughtworks.com/projects/online_fundraiser/cards/1797 [17:49:50] I do need awight’s help on the bad_audit_line issue, but it’s not urgent. [17:50:02] ccogdill: oh? pls forward email or whatever I can do [17:50:29] I emailed yesterday on the existing and rather long thread. want me to forward in a fresh one? [17:50:31] ccogdill: What isn't paypal doing? [17:50:44] I don't have that backscroll. [17:50:48] we’re not registering recurring cancels in civi that happen in paypal [17:50:51] but I think that’s okay [17:50:57] it’s not much extra work for Donor Services [17:51:03] Wait, it never did that? I know we get those messages. [17:51:04] we emailed about this yesterday [17:51:16] And I've seen the code that is meant to handle them. [17:51:25] ccogdill: oh wow we need to fix that. [17:51:27] well we may not be using the messages? [17:51:35] Yeah... but it certainly worked at some point. [17:51:52] it's bad to have broken code sitting around, no matter what. especially if it is causing people extra work. [17:51:57] it was in Josh’s process to do the refund on both PP and Civi, so I think t’s been this way for awhile [17:52:08] Maybe. [17:52:14] ccogdill: refund or cancel? [17:52:16] sorry *cancel, not refund [17:52:19] ah [17:52:26] Yeah, we should get those. [17:52:40] ccogdill: fwiw, please make a list of anything you find yourself doing more than... once... so we can triage [17:52:51] thank you for mentioning it! [17:52:53] sure thing [17:53:07] recurring cancels in PP don’t come up super often so it’s not a huge priority [17:53:10] Yeah, manual processes are usually easier for the computer to do. [17:53:16] ...usually. [17:53:20] :D [17:53:28] unless we're supposed to send a nasty letter, then creativity is desirable [17:53:59] Word. [17:54:36] K4-713: hah, that's good--we get paypal cancellations through both the listener and the audit script. [17:54:47] mhm [17:54:58] I *know* I've had to handle those in the past. [17:55:03] :[ [17:55:20] But, uh, how about that CR? [17:55:30] (CR) Awight: [C: 2] "Wow, that's succinct!" [wikimedia/fundraising/tools] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146610 (owner: Katie Horn) [17:56:22] awight: Looking at the different record types in the WR1 docs makes me mad we didn't do more of them. [17:56:30] YEP [17:56:42] But, now WX can swoop in and make everything nicer. [17:56:45] you could have stopped at "makes me mad" [17:56:51] haha [17:56:52] and left out "now" [17:57:04] s/now/any frigging day now/g [17:57:35] Don't you love it though, when there are *mixed* fixed-width delineation lines in the same file? [17:57:42] Isn't it the best thing? [17:57:54] Totally my favorite. [17:58:03] They must have had a helluva mainframe [17:58:10] ... [17:58:28] Of the many lighted ping-pong balls variety. [17:59:55] K4-713: can you look at something? [18:00:03] I guess fixed-width is nice when you're going over the dot matrix printout with a highlighter. [18:00:05] hurm? [18:00:17] ... looking for patterns ... [18:05:09] (CR) Awight: [C: 2] "Mostly harmless?" (1 comment) [wikimedia/fundraising/crm] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146636 (owner: Katie Horn) [18:05:30] pahaha [18:06:00] Okay, now I just need to remember how these codebases are deployed... [18:06:21] (wheeeee) [18:06:36] Seriously though, I don't remember the last time I updated fr-tools. [18:23:18] Okay dudes. I'm going to try not to blow up our civi install now. [18:23:36] But, you know, if something goes amiss, is was me. [18:23:52] 11:23.... yeah, why not. [18:24:18] oh, speaking of civi, i'd like to try out my client cert. Could you make me an account after you update? [18:24:35] Maybe. :) [18:24:51] (yeah, I can totally do that... maybe I'll do that part first) [18:24:56] if I nuke everything by mistake on my first login, I totally won't blame your deploy... [18:25:00] * ejegg crosses fingers [18:25:02] :D [18:27:03] ejegg: You should have an email with account stuffins shortly. [18:27:14] * K4-713 goes to blow it all up [18:27:21] thanks! [19:32:42] (PS1) Ssmith: Add gauge config [wikimedia/fundraising/dash] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146853 [19:32:44] (PS1) Ssmith: Add fraud gauge setup input box and assoc. events [wikimedia/fundraising/dash] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146854 [19:33:41] and with that, I'm coming in to see y'all fr-tech :p [19:54:40] (CR) Awight: [C: -1] "Looks like a typo." (1 comment) [wikimedia/fundraising/dash] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146853 (owner: Ssmith) [20:19:59] (CR) Awight: [C: 2] Add fraud gauge setup input box and assoc. events (1 comment) [wikimedia/fundraising/dash] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146854 (owner: Ssmith) [20:43:59] (PS3) Katie Horn: WIP - DO NOT MERGE - GC DD: SEPA compliance [extensions/DonationInterface] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/145731 [20:44:32] (CR) jenkins-bot: [V: -1] WIP - DO NOT MERGE - GC DD: SEPA compliance [extensions/DonationInterface] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/145731 (owner: Katie Horn) [21:06:35] * ejegg *might* have stomp running locally... but not its web console [21:07:16] Anybody know what to do when jetty gives you 503/service unavailable with 'IllegalStateException' ? [21:08:26] only thing I can find online is opening stomp port, but I can telnet to localhost 61613 just fine [21:18:02] ejegg: oh wow [21:18:23] wow? [21:18:51] setting up activemq is the least fun thing about -draising [21:19:31] yeah, somebody mentioned that... which is why i have procrastinated till now :P [21:20:31] a month in, I should probably have a local replica of at least a chunk of the system! [21:29:21] ahh, it was file permissions. jetty wanted to write to /usr/local/apache-activemq/tmp [21:35:59] tech standup? [21:55:25] mwalker: I hear there are some notes from the CN handoff meeting? [21:55:59] are there? [21:56:02] * mwalker doesnt know [21:56:08] um... [21:56:18] should I ask sumana then?> [21:56:24] you were updating that talk page at least, right? [21:56:30] oh; that was just sumanah poking me about the rtf [21:56:31] *rfc [21:56:42] you can see the diff on the rfc page [21:56:51] it was mostly just clarifying things [21:57:16] oh ok cool. I was thinking you had dumped all your misc thoughts about CentralNotice [21:57:22] nah [21:57:40] most of that is in the rfc/mingle/bugzilla already [21:57:42] hehe, well don't worry about it then [21:57:48] and the bits that arent are likely not important [21:58:04] K4-713 come to 35? [22:01:48] (CR) Ssmith: Add gauge config (1 comment) [wikimedia/fundraising/dash] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146853 (owner: Ssmith) [22:05:41] pizzzacat: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/wikitech/481791 [22:11:22] (PS2) Ssmith: Add gauge config [wikimedia/fundraising/dash] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146853 [22:13:15] (CR) Awight: [C: 2] Add gauge config [wikimedia/fundraising/dash] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146853 (owner: Ssmith) [22:13:52] atgo: I'm gonna wait to respond to PPena's question until we can chat again? [22:14:10] yeah i think we should sit down all 3 of us and just make a decision. [22:14:53] atgo: OK let's do. I'm happy to launch whenever, but we need to hammer out how to handle the static and where the big red button will be. [22:15:51] yeah.. i'm heading to floor 6 now if you want to join to see if she's available [22:16:33] atgo: ok, headed. [22:29:39] (CR) Awight: [C: 2 V: 2] Add gauge lib and gauge widget view/template [wikimedia/fundraising/dash] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/145739 (owner: Ssmith) [22:30:02] (PS2) Awight: Add fraud gauge setup input box and assoc. events [wikimedia/fundraising/dash] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146854 (owner: Ssmith) [22:30:09] (CR) Awight: [V: 2] Add fraud gauge setup input box and assoc. events [wikimedia/fundraising/dash] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146854 (owner: Ssmith) [22:31:30] atgo: Woot, got a SEPA DD payment all the way through with no errors on my local. Finally. [22:31:36] wow! [22:31:47] I do need something from you now, though. [22:31:59] Well, probably from either a megan or a jessica, but... [22:32:08] There's that e-mandate checkbox. [22:32:27] I need to know what the text next to it should say. In English. [22:32:39] Then I can put it in for translation. [22:33:06] As a placeholder for now, I have "By checking the following box, I hereby acknowledge that I am agreeing to Things." [22:33:20] (PS1) Awight: parameterize postback url [wikimedia/fundraising/PaymentsListeners] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146961 [22:36:34] (PS4) Katie Horn: WIP - DO NOT MERGE - GC DD: SEPA compliance [extensions/DonationInterface] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/145731 [22:38:08] (CR) jenkins-bot: [V: -1] WIP - DO NOT MERGE - GC DD: SEPA compliance [extensions/DonationInterface] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/145731 (owner: Katie Horn) [22:39:07] ahhh ok [22:39:12] K4-713 let me work on that [22:39:18] Sure. [22:39:30] I'm happy we're finally at the point where it's, you know... relevant. [22:40:23] yeah sounds good [22:40:24] agreed [22:46:42] (PS1) Awight: missing static signature [wikimedia/fundraising/crm/civicrm] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146967 [22:48:16] (PS2) Awight: typo causing whitescreen [wikimedia/fundraising/crm/civicrm] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/142168 [22:48:49] awight: argh. I forgot how much of a pain in the patoot it is to add new validation errors to DI forms. [22:51:18] K4-713: it's the woorst [22:51:27] K4-713: we should... fix that [22:51:54] Yeah, I mean, there's some great stuff here. [22:52:05] But it's mixed in with the alligators. [22:52:29] bobbing for plovers [22:53:27] blararargh [22:53:38] I think I just lost a finger. ;) [22:54:17] Also, how is it that in the whole history of this extension, we've never had a mandatory checkbox before? [22:54:49] hahaha [22:54:51] because HTML [22:55:12] knock knock: oh I couldn't tell if there was someone there [22:55:22] It's so much harder to steal code (from yourself) that doesn't exist. [23:11:42] (PS1) Awight: simplify calling signature [wikimedia/fundraising/crm] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/146978 [23:23:01] atgo: you wanna talk about reports "phase 2" ? [23:29:48] sure!