[15:31:14] Oh noes, Did Gayle disable freenode access now? :P [16:04:54] Theo10011: How d'you mean? [16:05:33] nevermind marktraceur [16:05:46] see wikimedia-l [16:05:49] for context [16:07:05] Any particular thread? [16:09:59] marktraceur: He's referring to "[Wikimedia-l] Go away, community (from WMF wiki at least)". [16:14:37] Ah. [16:22:08] *sigh* why must it be this way [16:22:28] it must be some way. [16:23:41] Theo10011: Yeah, but we, as sentient beings, get to decide how to react to this stuff [16:24:58] And what should be our response? [16:25:09] conform? [16:25:24] Theo10011: Should I answer as a Foundation employee or a guy sitting at home in IRC? [16:25:34] lol [16:25:44] I'm not sure I can do the former, it's too early and too coffeeless for me to make official statements. [16:25:46] I wouldn't want you to jeopardize the first one, so I'll refrain. [16:25:53] Hah. [16:26:18] It's still all petty stuff. [16:26:24] handled poorly [16:26:35] and it gets compounded over and over [16:27:47] Theo10011: I appreciate that it sucks to see your rights stripped when you've contributed to something for a long time. Losing a community is hard. But I'm not sure I can disagree with the decision, given the nature of Foundationwiki [16:28:25] Theo10011: Having final say on how the organization is represented seems like a valid tack for an organization to take [16:28:34] marktraceur, I can. See, the difference in contributions is order of magnitudes apart. No one on the staff really maintains or updates stuff there. [16:28:46] Most staff members make 2-3 edits a year, they have enough wikis and list to follow. [16:28:56] A lot of the info there used to be outdated about chapters etc. [16:29:00] Theo10011: Well, and AFAICT we aren't saying "Hey, don't contribute" [16:29:02] when it was opened up for eveyone [16:29:30] Mz and people like THO, do a ton of tedious stuff. [16:29:41] *nod* [16:29:42] categorizations, template, trying to make order out of things. [16:29:58] This was very poorly handled. [16:30:10] Philippe goes on and on about this rights stuff all the time. [16:30:18] looks like his eventual step in this direction [16:30:20] in reality, it's all a plan to get the wiki rot and replace it with a drupal website [16:30:42] Then they should just do that Nemo_bis, it would generate far less acrimony [16:31:05] The core of the issue is, some people, prob. philippe and a couple of others, don't trust others. [16:31:07] nooo "poor mediawiki he's so pretty and sweet" [16:31:17] sounds like erik :P [16:31:21] Nemo_bis: I think the steering committee is leaning towards http://www.opentext.com/wsm/index.htm #itsfunnybecauseitmightbetrue [16:31:52] People should trust people dang it. [16:32:05] marktraceur, there's a steering committee? [16:32:06] especially when they have years of history and contribution to speak for them [16:32:09] marktraceur: we can always ask what CMS Nupedia or Citizendium used [16:32:25] Thehelpfulone: That was suuuch a joke, nothing there should be taken seriously [16:32:31] :p [16:33:03] Nemo_bis: But will we get the level of enterprise support we need? [16:33:43] Theo10011: We're an engineering organization, by and large. It makes sense to us that people should have only the rights they need, and that make sense on that wiki. [16:34:01] what what what!? [16:34:03] We are? [16:34:16] when did we become and engineering organization? [16:34:31] Theo10011: We have a lot of engineers on staff! [16:34:45] Ah, well it was the global organization before that. [16:34:46] OK, maybe I should say, there are a lot of engineers on staff. [16:34:59] Before the funding was increased for engineering, it was the "Global south" [16:35:02] that didn't pan out [16:35:08] Theo10011: Well, and maybe that's the cause of some dissonance. [16:35:09] so now we're becoming an engineering org. I suppose [16:35:30] Ya but there is still a community dept. [16:35:34] and advocacy dept. [16:35:38] That's true. [16:35:47] but there are no bills to fight, so I guess this is what they do half the time. [16:36:18] OK, maybe. [16:36:32] * marktraceur should probably reiterate he's speculating, in a bathrobe no less [16:36:49] Completely understand marktraceur, no reason to reiterate. [16:36:57] Good good. [16:37:04] I tend to err on the side of caution :) [16:37:14] understandable [16:38:04] that's why I suggested not jeopardizing the former. ;) [16:38:14] But philippe doesn't show up a lot on IRC [16:38:23] and its only sat. :( [16:38:32] Theo10011: In any case, I suspect the overtones that the engineers set is a little hard for LCA to fight against, even if they're inclined to. [16:38:49] And now I should go find coffee. And half-and-half. [16:38:59] what's a half-and-half? [16:39:03] Theo10011: Some folks come on during the weekend [16:39:14] the cookie? [16:39:35] Theo10011: It's half milk, half cream [16:39:36] or the milk [16:39:42] ahh Americans! :P [16:40:05] You know it means a different thing the world over? [16:40:08] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Half_and_half [16:40:11] I just learned! [19:40:56] msg nickserv identify wikimail [19:43:46] wing2: You might want to change that... [19:44:24] lol