[16:00:09] Hallo zusammen. Ist jemand hier zum Thema Umzug vom Toolserver nach Tool Labs? [16:00:19] Ich! [16:00:21] :) [16:00:24] :) [16:02:50] Wir sind heute vor allem da, um Fragen von denen zu beantworten, die die Tools auf dem Toolserver / in Tool Labs für ihre Arbeit nutzen und sich jetzt fragen, was da in zwei Wochen eigentlich passiert. [16:04:03] *** stille *** [16:09:48] Hier ist nochmal der Link zu unserem Kurierartikel von neulich: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Kurier/Edit#Erinnerung:_Tools_laufen_ab_dem_1.7._nur_noch_auf_Tool_Labs [16:10:37] und eine alphabetische Liste aller Tools auf Tool Labs: https://tools.wmflabs.org/ [16:19:15] Und jetzt? Jemand hier, um uns Fragen über die Abschaltung des Toolservers zu stellen? [16:27:44] Wir noch ein Weilchen da... :) [16:37:48] Hey, inzwischen wer da mit Fragen zum Toolserver-Umzug? [16:54:10] So, letzte Chance ... Toolserver-Migration, was heißt das konkret? [17:01:31] Ok Silke, ich denke es wird nichts mehr kommen ;) [17:01:55] Oder gehen wir in die Verlängerung? ;) [17:02:41] Neeeee, Vorrundenaus! [17:02:48] ;) [17:03:03] Tschüß allerseits, schönen Abend, Birgit_WMDE! [17:03:13] Ciao Silke! [17:25:51] Hello! In about five minutes, we will start a session here to discuss https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Phabricator [17:31:10] Hi everybody! [17:31:18] Please feel free to raise your hand if you're here to learn more or discuss Phabricator! [17:31:41] I am going to start with a quick summary of what has happened lately, so we are all on the same information level. [17:32:02] (Please interrupt when needed, though let's try to have questions after finishing this) [17:32:10] oh, and I should tell meetbot to do stuff, I guess [17:32:14] #startmeeting IRC Office Hour on Phabricator [17:32:15] Meeting started Tue Jun 17 17:32:14 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is andre__. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. [17:32:15] Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. [17:32:15] The meeting name has been set to 'irc_office_hour_on_phabricator' [17:32:42] o? [17:32:46] o/ ! [17:32:49] heh [17:32:53] so.... [17:32:54] :p [17:32:56] #info General info: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Phabricator [17:33:21] that's where you can find the basics of this. I won't repeat them now, as we've already covered this in previous IRC office hours. I assume you know why you're here. :P [17:33:33] #info The high-level migration plan is at https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Phabricator/Plan#Migration_plan [17:33:43] #info And planning of tasks is done via a board in the Phabricator Labs instance: http://fab.wmflabs.org/project/board/31/ [17:33:58] Let me quickly introduce the team working on this: [17:34:22] chasemp is here for the Operations team [17:34:30] and twentyafterfour for Development / Release Management [17:34:50] James_F is our proxy for product management, greg-g our proxy for release management [17:34:54] and we have more people helping and providing input, like qgil :) [17:35:10] so what's currently cooking? [17:35:37] twentyafterfour is working on restricting access to certain projects in http://fab.wmflabs.org/T95 , and SUL / OAuth / authentication in http://fab.wmflabs.org/T314 [17:36:08] (folks, please correct me if I'm wrong or add more info if you feel like) [17:36:12] since it's crickets I guess some inside baseball is ok: http://fab.wmflabs.org/T95#40 [17:36:19] heh [17:36:29] ...and chasemp sorted out the subtasks listed in http://fab.wmflabs.org/T294 to set up the Phabricator instance (see the "Blocked by" list) and is working on them. Configuration stuff. [17:36:30] does anyone know if restricting access to the file attachments has been on the board? [17:36:42] without that I don't think we can move ahead [17:36:45] and I don't see it anywhere [17:37:09] twentyafterfour or qgil? [17:37:38] oh yeah, we will need that for attachments in a "restricted" task (related to http://fab.wmflabs.org/T95 ) [17:37:40] I'm guessing sensitive bug tickets get sensitive attachments, I know rt is the same [17:37:47] but I think it's not explicitly listed in that task yet [17:38:06] well, I wrote in T95 "but some attachments and some comments (spam or exposing private information) are also marked as private" [17:38:14] twentyafterfour: are you around? [17:38:50] chasemp, thanks for explicitly mentioning it again on that ticket [17:39:43] hmm, looks like twentyafterfour isn't around. pity. so we'd have to wait for his reply on the ticket... [17:39:57] fwiw I looked upstream at related things [17:40:04] and saw no mention of hidding attachments [17:40:07] so it made me really wonder [17:40:16] as it seems non-trivial in the current scheme [17:41:24] Thanks for investigating! I myself can't judge how complex this will be. Would love to get twentyafterfour's comment on that ticket (or later here on IRC when back) [17:42:17] Hmm, to quickly continue with what people (well, /me, who is left) are doing: [17:42:33] I've been mostly commenting on open tickets in the last days, plus a bit thinking and discussing tougher items [17:42:54] For example, data migration from Bugzilla ( http://fab.wmflabs.org/T39 ) will be interesting as we have user accounts and tickets (which is a chicken and egg problem) [17:43:10] We also aliases in Bugzilla, and URLs on wikis to Bugzilla buglists (buglist.cgi) and I don't see us trying to preserve really every URL to not break, to be realistic. [17:43:19] There are also some bikesheddier topics like how to organize projects and iterations, whether we need a severity field, which task statuses we want etc. Once I've made up my mind a bit more on those items I'm going to do a public call on wikitech-l for more feedback. [17:43:46] So that's my very high-level overview how things are right now. [17:44:13] Comments, questions, discussions, more details wanted? [17:45:37] ...or maybe we've had so many office hours in the last months that only the "Phabricator migration" team members are left on IRC and you have no questions left? ;) [17:48:01] regarding file permissions [17:48:06] epriestly pointed me to [17:48:07] https://secure.phabricator.com/T4589 [17:48:17] that may have to go up on our list [17:49:05] uh, definitely yes [17:49:11] thanks for finding that and investigating [17:49:18] * andre__ subscribes and adds the Wikimedia project to it [17:49:35] I'll also mention that in our http://fab.wmflabs.org/T95 [17:51:26] No other folks with comments or questions about Phabricator around here? I'm surprised :) [17:51:53] silence is consent in this context? we must be doing a bangup job [17:52:51] consent or disinterest ;) [17:53:20] well, maybe at this stage (after deciding to go for Phabricator) people have not that many questions anymore. Might become way more again once we know when it's going to go live [17:53:36] Well if they're disinterested that'll sure change once the move actually happens. :P [17:54:53] "The Night is Dark and Full of Terrors" etc... [17:55:03] parent5446: exactly. probably same with toolserver in two weeks ;) [17:56:16] ref silence, it is probably normal at this point [18:05:24] andre__ I'm here sorry... [18:05:32] twentyafterfour, heh, no problem [18:05:41] reading bac klog [18:05:50] twentyafterfour, basically http://fab.wmflabs.org/T95#39 (last three comments) [18:06:09] but that discussion also takes place in #phabricator a bit, just summarized [18:10:27] wouldn't it be enough to have the task hidden if the files couldn't be easily discovered without access to the task? [18:11:21] not easily discovered won't be enough for the financial data attachments [18:11:32] twentyafterfour: but wouldn't that be more like obscurity than security? :-/ [18:11:37] epriestly just talked a bit about this in #phabricator [18:11:46] (dunno, I'm not a security engineer) [18:11:46] it seems files have object associations [18:11:59] the idea is for a file to be default your viewing only [18:12:06] and then anyone who can view an associated object [18:12:09] can view the file also [18:12:23] so it's all inherited rights other than 'author' [18:12:26] which is cool I think [18:13:07] but that depends on some in-progress work [18:13:18] and the API doesn't currently support security mechanisms on file uploads [18:13:32] he suggested using the api for tickets and then doing something more direct for files [18:13:41] https://secure.phabricator.com/diffusion/P/browse/master/src/applications/diffusion/controller/DiffusionBrowseFileController.php;125b8dad7bb5a06939faa122785c29230439d558$871-877 [18:13:43] chasemp: thanks for summarizing [18:14:15] you may be the man to build one-off file upload tool :D [18:14:22] dunno if that's better or extending teh api [18:14:25] but we'll need one of the other [18:15:01] my understanding is files in teh files application are only those could otherwise view also [18:15:07] so it's also based on these restrictions [18:15:24] but yeah this will be a big blocker I guess [18:15:57] So the api is missing file policy support? we would need to add the ability to modify files' policy objects from the api? [18:16:26] so yes to the first question [18:16:37] second one, that or even just set a perms policy for upload [18:16:40] and then we can mass upload [18:16:55] and tehn associate with a ticket (the current file association via api is old and crusty) [18:17:11] seems upload currently has no context for this [18:17:15] via pi [18:17:17] api that is [18:17:32] ok .. I could work on that, can you make a task and assign it to me? maybe even an upstream task would be appropriate [18:17:52] do you have #phabricator logged? [18:17:55] I can send you the convo if not [18:18:02] will make way more sense than my brief version [18:18:13] as epriestly is a better explainer of phabricator things :) [18:18:30] yes I have #phabricator [18:19:01] ok I'll read through it and make the task [18:19:29] convo [18:19:29] http://fab.wmflabs.org/P8 [18:19:37] ok cool [18:19:43] yeah I can make the task no problem [18:19:47] just unsure of which task to make [18:20:43] I think improving the api is more useful than a one-off tool and probably not more difficult [18:20:57] understood, that was kind of my thought but [18:21:03] if I'm not doing it, whatever works is cool with me [18:21:09] certainly it would be more useful gonig forward [18:22:27] should this be a separate task to tackle in fab.wmflabs.org, potentially blocking T95? [18:22:32] just wondering how to keep an overview [18:23:19] honestly the structure of blockers etc there has gotten confusing with the trusted user tool stuff now in the mix there but offloaded to another instance entirely [18:23:41] that was my way of saying, not sure [18:25:49] make a task that says we need secured files, and link to the upstream ticket [18:26:06] chasemp, simply ignore the trusted user tool for the time being if things are confusing :) [18:26:08] I have to step away from the computer for a minute, I can make the ticket when I'm back if someone doesn't beat me to it [18:26:14] alright [18:26:20] * andre__ also needs to grab dinner soon [18:29:03] Alright then, I'm going to close this office hour [18:29:05] #endmeeting [18:29:05] Meeting ended Tue Jun 17 18:29:05 2014 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) [18:29:05] Minutes: https://tools.wmflabs.org/meetbot/wikimedia-office/2014/wikimedia-office.2014-06-17-17.32.html [18:29:05] Minutes (text): https://tools.wmflabs.org/meetbot/wikimedia-office/2014/wikimedia-office.2014-06-17-17.32.txt [18:29:05] Minutes (wiki): https://tools.wmflabs.org/meetbot/wikimedia-office/2014/wikimedia-office.2014-06-17-17.32.wiki [18:29:06] Log: https://tools.wmflabs.org/meetbot/wikimedia-office/2014/wikimedia-office.2014-06-17-17.32.log.html [18:29:12] thanks andre__ [18:29:28] well, thank you and everybody who showed up! :) [18:31:53] andre__, thank you [18:32:01] thanks for coming! :) [18:32:09] sorry for my half-backed participation :) [18:57:55] ok I read all the backlog in #phabricator and I guess the api improvements might be more difficult than the php one-off so I retract my recommendation ;)