[18:44:46] Heya. Time for Metrics again. [18:46:47] I'll be the IRC person this month. [18:46:56] We'll be getting started in about 15 minutes' time. [18:47:43] You can get a 'sneak peak' at the Agenda at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Foundation_metrics_and_activities_meetings#Agenda [19:01:01] hi. [19:01:08] Hey leila. [19:01:11] Going live now. [19:01:42] yup! we see Abbey [19:02:05] Thanks. If you have any audio or visual issues, please report them – brendan_campbell is here and awesome as ever. [19:02:23] leila purple .. must be irccloud? [19:02:35] (Jinx.) [19:03:11] If you have any questions for our speakers, please shout them out in here. I'll try to get them answered, in the Q&A section at the end or directly. [19:03:32] * subbu hopes no one ACTUALLY SHOUTS :) [19:03:36] :D [19:04:21] 277 ppl and 1 puppy .. what is the current staff count? [19:04:34] A fair number of people didn't come [19:04:51] 1 puppy? Where's the others? [19:04:59] no_justification: You didn't bring yours. [19:05:09] Extension:PuppyPile [19:05:15] [Dario] [19:05:31] oh, YouTube is behind, Abbey's still talking form e [19:05:33] drumroll [19:05:54] now i hear dario :D [19:06:20] James_F: I was gonna come in today actually, but I'm under the weather :) [19:06:35] no_justification: Sorry to hear that. Hope to see you here soon. :-) [19:06:48] more background on Dario's talk re: WikiCite is available here: https://research.wikimedia.org/structured-citations.html [19:06:49] BTW SFMOMA (which some of the audience can see looking out of the window right now ;) has an art+feminism editathon too in march https://publicknowledge.sfmoma.org/calendar/ [19:07:25] J-Mo: Thanks! (Love the new research micro-site.) [19:07:29] HaeB: Neat. [19:07:37] thanks, James_F [19:07:54] One update coming up in March was missed. Here it is! [19:07:59] * Women in the Wikimedia movement: the Community Engagement department is hosting a series of conversations that focus on the role of women in Wikimedia programs, in technical spaces, and in leadership. Conversations are scheduled on March 8 and 21st. Find out more: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Community_Engagement/Women_in_the_Wikimedia_movement:_Conversations_with_communities [19:08:15] Aha. Thanks, mcruz. That sounds really great. [19:08:58] oops.. very sorry about missing that update! Thank you Maria for adding it here. [19:09:16] structured citations at last :D [19:09:33] brion: Praise it when it's shipped! ;-) But yeah, this is really brilliant work. [19:09:51] praise early, praise often [19:11:27] does the wikidata set cover everything in journal of science set? i assume yes. [19:11:55] no worries, AbbeyRipstra! I think it was missed from the slides altogether =) [19:11:58] subbu: I'll ask. [19:12:54] James_F, and related .. as for the rest in wikidata .. are they a gap in the journal of science set? Or are they not "quality" sources? [19:13:12] * James_F nods, added. [19:14:56] if folks are interested in machine-readable data for citations of scientific videos, i was recently shown this project - https://av.tib.eu/ - could be of interest later [19:15:38] at least some of it is open data, but i'm not 100% sure the details [19:15:59] [Greg V. and Sam] [19:17:16] oh man that brings back memories, report card meeting! [19:17:34] brion: It was a fun time. [19:22:37] * awjr claps vigorously for sam and the rest of comms for the major improvements to metrics [19:22:52] That link is https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Foundation_metrics_and_activities_meetings/February_2018_RFC [19:23:34] [Katherine] [19:23:51] there was actually an office wiki discussion some months ago where folks voiced the opposite impression - that the meeting had become more staff-centric in recent years, and doesn't seem to receive a lot of interest from volunteers any more [19:25:16] HaeB: I'd encourage you to give feedback on the meta page. [19:25:42] and apparently the youtube recordings for the https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Research/Showcase get far more views now than those for the metrics meeting [19:25:57] HaeB: I can ask varnent and Sam now but I'm not sure they'd have an answer. [19:25:58] James_F: i don't think the above informatio fits into that question format [19:26:15] HaeB: Be bold and add to the (talk?) page? [19:26:33] What is the question exactly? [19:27:21] HaeB: i dont think that's necessarily true, but dario does do a great job of curating that series [19:27:57] i can get some analytics on that later, though [19:28:14] That collection Katherine mentioned is https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Strategy/Wikimedia_movement/2017 [19:29:46] brendan_campbell: dario said that, i haven't checked myself [19:30:32] HaeB: I can say from an organizer's perspective that the interest in Metrics by the community has increased during the time I have been involved with it. I cannot speak to what it was before - so not able to offer a long-term comparison. But over the last year there's been an increase in inquiries we get about it from people outside the organization. I recognize others on Office-Wiki disagreed with that, but it was not clear to me [19:30:32] what their metrics or citations were. [19:31:01] people do watch metrics on commons, as well [19:31:15] Right - which makes metrics of views harder to measure. [19:33:57] Quick analytics check on YouTube, it looks like Jan Metrics got 282 views, and Dec got 191. Comparatively, Research got 149 in January and 116 in Dec. [19:34:12] reminds me we need to get media view stats more integrated [19:34:24] yes, please, Brion!! [19:34:25] brion: i would love that [19:34:28] brion: Is there a task? Can I help? [19:34:35] lemme check [19:35:38] old task https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T108522 also https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T88775 [19:36:06] Nice. [19:36:30] there are per-file stats i believe these days, though we might need to tweak that to handle transcodes and things more consistently [19:37:12] And how much of a file do you have to stream before it counts as a "view" and all those canards that people argue about w.r.t. YouTube etc. no doubt. :-) [19:38:01] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T149642 <- was for the stats we currently have, links to the existing tools [19:38:18] https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Analytics/Data_Lake/Traffic/Mediacounts is probably the best overview [19:38:21] ideally you'd have finer-grained detail like how far things get etc [19:38:35] ah perfect thanks HaeB [19:40:25] "inkl." < German is leaking into those slides :) [19:40:47] brendan_campbell: thanks - like i said, i didnt check myself, maybe he had looked at earlier months. still an interesting ratio for dec and jan [19:41:14] "phase 2" makes me think of magnus and the early php wiki script :D [19:41:32] brion: Phase 3 will make you cry. ;-) [19:41:52] :D [19:42:11] HaeB: definitely worth looking at. i think more people watch the metrics stream, but the research showcase may get more views after the fact [19:42:29] just a hunch, can look at the numbers later [19:43:01] i have the feeling i'm going to be doing a lot of documentation/planning this next fy :D [19:44:12] varnent: so the concrete question would be: given that there have been concerns (voiced in a recent office wiki discussion) that the metrics meeting has actually become more staff-centric and seen less interest from the volunteer community in recent years, what are we doing to reach out to people who are not watching the meeting currently? [19:44:49] future of mediawiki \o/ [19:45:02] (given that the RfC seems targeted at the current audience only, cf. the first question: "Why do you attend, watch, or otherwise follow this meeting?") [19:46:33] HaeB: Correct, before we expand the audience, we want to figure out what audience we should be expanding to. If the feedback is this should be even more staff-focused, doing a bunch of community outreach would be a poor use of our time. People not attending may instead then need to be reached in other ways. :) [19:47:56] Any more questions? [19:48:23] [Anne G.] [19:49:00] *should be more staff focused (not even more - sorry - was typing too fast) [19:49:02] [Katherine] [19:52:33] [Anne G.] [19:53:26] Any more questions? [19:54:44] quickie question -- do we know what kind of ramp-up time we can expect for staff growth as our plans get bigger? [19:54:50] oops too late :D [19:55:22] brion: Not sure, sorry, though I imagine not too quickly (fast growth is very hard to run). Ping Katherine with that? [19:55:41] Has a single community member spoken a line of dialogue in this channel today? :( [19:55:50] * HaeB muses about the slight cognitive dissonance between Katherine's points about the importance of KPIs and accountability (fully agree!) and the fact that both metrics and reporting about core WMF activities (what did we spend donor money on recently?) have been all but eliminated from the metrics and activities meeting [19:56:12] tzatziki: Not this week, AFAICS. [19:56:39] James_F: yeah i'll inquire later [19:57:00] Womp. :( [19:57:07] I wonder if any are watching. [19:58:00] \o/ [19:58:13] HaeB: indeed some metrics are nice ;)