[16:50:05] We'll be starting the Structured Data on Commons office hour in about ten minutes [16:59:14] About one minute [17:00:06] Okay, let's begin [17:00:08] #startmeeting Structured Data on Commons office hour [17:00:09] Meeting started Thu Jul 18 17:00:08 2019 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is Keegan. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. [17:00:09] Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. [17:00:09] The meeting name has been set to 'structured_data_on_commons_office_hour' [17:00:27] Welcome to another SDC office hour. It's been a little while as features have been released [17:00:42] We have some things that the team can talk about [17:00:55] There's the impending testing and release of "other statements" [17:01:13] There's plans for what's next for the remaining grant time, which is six months, and the six month period after [17:01:20] We can talk about roadblocks for Lua support [17:01:41] Or, if we want to get really fun, a hot topic: should statement orders on the structured data tab be fixed? [17:02:45] There's also ideas for campaign support, if anyone here is interested in that [17:03:25] So maybe we should start with the next release, other statements. risler would you like to tell us what those are? [17:04:17] "Other statements" covers official support for everything beyond Depicts and Captions (aka labels) [17:04:59] in the beginning, we won't have full support for every single Wikidata property because we have to do some front-end work to support certain input types, but we'll cover it all eventually [17:05:21] What will need to wait on to support? [17:06:24] Our initial release will cover everything that takes another entity as its value. We're still working on other input values like Geo-coordinates, Time, multilingual text, etc. [17:07:13] Is there a project overview page? [17:07:38] sario528: there is, it's at https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Structured_data [17:07:47] Thanks [17:10:51] For some reference on properties that can be used in other statements https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Structured_data/Properties_table [17:11:48] With other statements being deployed, I'm looking forward to seeing the community figuring out the data modelling / ontology. Structured data for licenses is an interesting one, for instance [17:12:38] "Interesting" :) [17:13:25] There are still properties to be created, probably, as well as the ontology [17:13:30] So much to do soon! [17:14:30] We already have several Wikimedia Commons-specific properties on Wikidata, and many more will probably be created in the upcoming months and even years [17:14:43] Has anyone lurking looked at other statements yet on test-commons? We haven't "announced" testing yet but they are available there https://test-commons.wikimedia.org [17:16:07] The team is still working out labeling for wikidata links [17:17:36] (which, if anyone has thoughts on how things should link to Wikidata, please share) [17:19:30] What do you mean by "how things should link"? [17:20:43] In the design of the links, instead of having the wikidata label or barcode with the link (which is what Wikidata does), displaying the Q and P numbers directly [17:21:02] Or, reverse that [17:21:13] Wikidata shows the Q 'n Ps, the question is if we should [17:22:51] Test Commons is currently showing the Q/P numbers [17:24:32] The other thing we're thinking about, for after other statements, is campaigns and designing support for them [17:25:45] (Sorry, my computer crashed) [17:25:57] I guess it doesn't do any harm to include the entity IDs [17:26:22] * Keegan nods [17:26:23] For Upload Wizard campaigns, we'll be empowering campaign organizers to customize how structured data fields appear in the campaign interface. [17:26:24] It's also true that other features could be added as well to disambiguate, for example for places (the country) [17:27:16] abian: what would you have in mind, including the label/description [17:28:12] London, UK (Q84) [17:28:30] That is, [label], [label of the country] (QID), for example [17:28:40] right right [17:29:51] But I don't want to mess up your lives either if you have enough on your plates :) [17:30:36] Yeah, the problem with that from a technical perspective is that it's a very special-case thing that wouldn't even work for all cities [17:30:57] Whereas all the other special-case ambiguous items would still have problems [17:31:34] The challenges for this project are many :) [17:31:36] We're pretty focused on supporting broad use-cases first :) [17:32:46] Actually it should work for all cities/towns/villages/administrative entities in general... and, in case the Item is incomplete and there's no country defined, it's possible to just skip that part [17:33:51] Fair point. As mentioned we're looking for ideas before we fix on a design, so that's one to keep in mind [17:35:24] As a bit of an update on Lua support, the debate is raging in the phabricator tickets [17:35:29] The ticket for the request is https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T223792 [17:36:06] The request looks like it's fairly easy to do, *except* for the wb_terms redesing [17:36:08] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T227848 [17:36:11] *redesign [17:36:37] The SDC team might have to wait a few months for the redesign to be implemented to figure out how to pull media items into Lua [17:42:01] Additionally, we'd like community to consider which order statements should appear in. For example, on Wikidata, "instance of" is always at the top if it's present. [17:42:55] this ordering is achieved via a sorted properties feature. Wikidata handles it like this: https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Wikibase-SortedProperties [17:43:10] (the only thing decided for SDC so far that's in fixed position is Depicts first, IIRC) [17:43:16] The Commons equivalent is https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Wikibase-SortedProperties [17:44:26] we'd love for the community to discuss how they'd like to prioritize statements and then have members with the appropriate edit rights edit the SortedProperties page accordingly [17:45:20] FWIW we'll likely be posting about this on-wiki soon [17:45:41] * Keegan rides the netsplit [17:48:14] Okay, we have a little over ten minutes left. I think we've covered most of what I wanted to bring up. [17:48:46] (I'll repost that in a second as people get back from the split) [17:49:11] Okay, we have a little over ten minutes left. I think we've covered most of what I wanted to bring up. [17:49:28] Anything else from anyone out there, or from the team? [17:50:12] Keegan: good job! :) [17:50:42] Steinsplitter: Thanks :) [17:51:30] Thanks for the update! [17:52:23] Folks, I think you should request (or order) :) more feedback more often [17:52:55] I agree [17:54:04] Thanks all for being here and reading along, I think we'll go ahead and wrap this up a few minutes early. [17:54:39] We'll do this again soon, took way too long of a break hosting these while we were releasing stuff [17:55:13] #endmeeting [17:55:14] Meeting ended Thu Jul 18 17:55:13 2019 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) [17:55:14] Minutes: https://tools.wmflabs.org/meetbot/wikimedia-office/2019/wikimedia-office.2019-07-18-17.00.html [17:55:14] Minutes (text): https://tools.wmflabs.org/meetbot/wikimedia-office/2019/wikimedia-office.2019-07-18-17.00.txt [17:55:14] Minutes (wiki): https://tools.wmflabs.org/meetbot/wikimedia-office/2019/wikimedia-office.2019-07-18-17.00.wiki [17:55:15] Log: https://tools.wmflabs.org/meetbot/wikimedia-office/2019/wikimedia-office.2019-07-18-17.00.log.html