[00:05:06] wheeeeee [11:28:26] https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20175 [11:29:16] thedj: Will poke Trevor about that when he gets in [11:29:23] He's the CSS guy [12:36:08] and i suspect that this is caused by trevor's changes as well... [12:36:09] https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20176 [12:36:13] not sure though. [12:36:23] May be my changes [12:36:33] Appending &returnto and &returntoquery to the log out link [12:37:08] indicates an error in Linker::link() of some sorts, and since SkinCologneBlue extends Skin extends Linker, it may override that function [12:37:17] check. [12:37:19] sounds logical [12:37:21] Or Linker::make*Link() for that matter [12:57:37] RoanKattouw: do you know how the toolbar works per chance ? [12:58:06] Yes, I'm coding in it now [12:58:10] I want to add custom buttons. [12:58:21] for refTools and "extraedittools.js" [12:58:30] Right [12:58:41] Trevor's working on a different API to add/remove/change stuff [12:58:46] Should be committed later today [12:58:56] ah ok. then i won't waste time on that. [12:59:12] i'll await the API changes. [16:50:20] good morning all [16:50:22] I'm at home [16:50:49] trying to take it easy cause I'm getting that feeling that I'm pushing myself too hard [16:51:03] like, pretty much getting sick [16:51:20] but I'm coding :) [16:51:59] aw. I'm the only one in right now. I have the whole corner area to myself [16:52:11] Parul will be in soon [16:52:36] so I have to share? pff, fine [16:52:56] ha - just kick her out into the meeting room! [16:53:42] don't forget to update to head before coding today [16:54:09] merge conflicts will drive you nuts! [16:54:54] hi naoko [16:55:36] hi trevor [16:55:40] how are you feeling? [16:56:36] sort of blah - headache and a scratchy throat [16:57:04] that's not good [16:57:08] take it easy [16:57:11] Not bad enough to not work, but ... yeah.. I'm on my laptop in bed :) [16:57:15] I will for sure [17:00:03] the toolbar works in RTL on IE6 but not IE7... wtf? [17:00:33] i was thinking that it will be good to bring all the prototypes up-to-date with the current deployment version [17:00:41] yeah [17:00:44] i will ask RoanKattouw_away, once he gets back [17:00:51] cool [17:00:53] Yes? [17:01:02] TrevorParscal: I'm coding up CDGs, pretty much finished now [17:01:04] then we can start staging the patch and new development stuff on protototypes [17:01:06] CGD sory [17:01:17] *RoanKattouw goes to update prototype [17:01:20] CGD? [17:01:23] there you are [17:01:27] Content Generation Dialog [17:01:41] exciting stuff [17:02:07] It's mostly a framework I've worked on, and a simple search&replace dialog to demonstrate it [17:02:59] RoanKattouw: are you following the module pattern I created in wikiEditor? did you bundle in jquery ui? [17:03:12] Yes [17:03:18] And I'm just adding it as a new toolbar action [17:05:32] nkomura: Update done [17:05:38] I've been making a list of stuff I want pushed [17:05:41] thanks [17:05:42] *RoanKattouw pastebins [17:06:22] http://dpaste.org/6zuX/ [17:06:36] RoanKattouw: right on - yeah, the dialogs it can launch though, we probably need those to be their own modules cause they might start getting big... we can always break them out [17:07:21] Yeah I see how they can get big [17:07:36] But I'll clean up my code and commit soon [17:09:20] no worries [17:09:36] *TrevorParscal has faith in your ninja skills [17:09:46] RoanKattouw: were the prototypes updated with the current deployment? [17:09:52] nkomura: Yes, just now [17:10:16] "Add topic" shows as the top tab in discussion [17:10:23] i don't think we have implemented that yet [17:11:06] Trevor has [17:11:11] and the drop down menu is gone [17:11:16] (he moved it there that is) [17:11:34] brion made me do it! :) [17:11:45] And rightly so [17:12:12] nkomura: Dropdown is there for me; disappears for you because there aren't any items in it [17:12:18] Only New section and that was moved [17:12:31] so the current deployment status is production + development in progress since yesterday [17:12:34] Logged in as sysop on en prototype I see Delete - Move - Protect - Watch [17:12:56] Not completely; we didn't update everything yesterday [17:13:29] i see the drop-down [17:13:31] so, we need the drop down to dissapear when there are no items in the list to show... [17:13:33] yes? [17:13:54] I think so yeah [17:13:54] TrevorParscal: but i thought the immediate change was to make "+" visible for disussion [17:14:03] cause that should be working just fine... [17:14:34] TrevorParscal: I have a problem here: I wanna do something like { 'bar': 'blah' + gM('foo') + 'blah' } in editToolbarConfiguration but gM() doesn't work yet at that time [17:14:42] showing "add topic" in the top tab needs to be evaluated with multiple languages [17:14:43] Because loadGM() hasn't been called yet [17:14:45] The + as oposed to add topic is a matter of i18n, and we can try and get that pushed through, but... I talked about that in the meeting [17:14:49] Any suggestions? [17:15:25] RoanKattouw: 2 ideas... [17:15:47] i have a concern for de.wp to add tab without careful evaluation [17:16:02] 1, you could accept a function as a parameter, which does the concatenation later on, when that function is ready [17:17:02] nkomura: me too, I've been resisting this the whole time, and brion said he wanted to fix the "i can't see the add topic button" at the expense of the new bug being "I can't see some tabs cause they are overlapping on my smaller screen" [17:17:26] Oh #1 sounds nice, I gotta get used to the dynamic nature of JS more xD [17:17:30] I felt like it was not worth the tradeoff and got overruled, so we moved it [17:18:25] 'addsection' => '+', # do not translate or duplicate this message to other languages [17:18:26] TrevorParscal: i think inserting "+" for now is a compromising solution until we have full evaluation of tab numbers and width [17:18:28] RoanKattouw: 2 is you accept object with { pre: 'blah', periMsg: 'foo', post: 'blah' } [17:18:29] you're using the same default message text as in monobook, right? [17:18:31] the one that's meant to be a small tab bit right? [17:18:34] look farmiliar :) [17:18:44] TrevorParscal: #2 ain't gonna cut it since I've got two messages in there [17:18:49] and you can bum the autoMsg function from toolbar [17:19:12] brion: No, we're not using the same message IIRC but both are customized at least at enwp (not at dewp though) [17:19:14] "when in doubt leave it as is", and as is is a "+" [17:20:08] We changed it for a reason: '+' was deemed to cryptic for people to understand (all of this is IIRC since I didn't make the call) [17:20:26] longer text is predicated on having room for it [17:20:31] brion: i'm in favor of adding "+" for add topic, but having "+" and the reverse triangle next to each other looks confusing [17:20:34] brion: we are using a message that is particular to vector, because of this sort of problem, that monobook and vector display it differently - and this is a good thing cause we don't want to alawys use the same language even in different contextes [17:20:38] i thought about it after the meeting last night [17:20:41] given that we know in the long term it will change completely, keep what we know works so we don't have a regression. [17:20:47] but let's prototype it and we can discuss it [17:23:35] guys about the toc. [17:23:35] *RoanKattouw lols at action.html = action.html(); [17:23:56] love it, but now my textarea resize in safari does weird stuff. [17:24:15] the issue with "when in doubt leave it as is" is that vector is not monobook, nor is it just a different css file for monobook, it's structured differently, and a + tab doesn't cary the same meaning as it does in monobook, particularly because in monobook there's extra gap between some tabs that sort of influences their meaning [17:24:21] Textarea resize? [17:24:25] of course, these gaps are also quite inconsistent [17:24:27] RoanKattouw: of the editform [17:24:41] You can resize the textarea in Safari [17:24:43] ? [17:24:47] yup [17:24:50] it's a wonderful feature. [17:25:32] it's actually one of my most favourite changes ever in Safari. So small, yet so useful. [17:26:42] thedj: well, what's going on that's weird? [17:26:56] the toc and the textarea collide. [17:27:00] want me to make a screenshot ? [17:27:10] you are using the TOC? [17:27:24] TrevorParscal: found it by accident in the topic here :D [17:27:33] I don't need a screenshot, I'm aware of that bug - the TOC is not ready at all [17:27:34] Yeah it's live on sandbox [17:27:42] won't be released until sept 9th [17:27:47] ok, as long as you are aware. [17:27:57] yes, thanks for mentioning it though [17:28:15] strange bugs like that often only crop up after releases unfourtunately [17:28:26] i really do like it however. i'm sure there will be dissenters, but i think it's nice. [17:29:21] TrevorParscal: Someone complained that the sed stuff you used to minify CSS trims all the line breaks, hurting performance in some browsers. By comparison, jsmin leaves linebreaks alone. I'd fix it if I could read the sed expressions (I understand about half of them) [17:29:48] I might twek em [17:29:53] *tweak them [17:29:56] ah yes, some browsers use readline on stuff like that sometimes. [17:33:58] there, done [17:34:05] hi parutron [17:34:12] hi nkomura [17:34:35] TrevorParscal: I don't know whether to throw cookies or kitchen sinks at you right now. I appreciate the sed tweak but it does cause a nasty conflict for me :( [17:34:37] we are missing you here this morning! [17:34:44] RoanKattouw updated the prototypes and the tab changes we discussed yesterday are prototyped by trevor [17:34:53] wooo hooo! [17:34:55] that is awesome. [17:35:15] i was going to write about our thinking on the spacing at the top. i think the best spot for it is in the acai release discussion page. [17:35:17] thoughts? [17:35:29] yeah [17:35:38] RoanKattouw: then just update the combine.sh script only [17:35:48] then override any css changes with your own [17:35:49] and if you can link your topic to the discussions re space [17:35:52] it'll be great [17:35:59] TrevorParscal: Yeah theirs-full and rebuild solves it [17:36:03] cause all I did was regenerate the combined and minified version [17:36:05] TrevorParscal: have you had a chance to check on the change in

 font size?
[17:36:13] *RoanKattouw 	raises eyebrow at minification not stripping comments in CSS
[17:37:58] 	brion: SVN server seems to have gotten slower the last few days ^^
[17:38:26] 	Especially when committing
[17:41:45] 	Alright guys, search&replace dialog live on prototype, see link in topic
[17:42:19] 	RoanKattouw: not removing comments? it does for me...
[17:43:14] 	Not removing multiline comments, sorry
[17:43:30] 	You probably need to pass sed some flag to make it match multiline
[17:43:38] 	oh...
[17:43:51] 	hmm - ok - well I will get to it
[17:44:00] 	What the heck
[17:44:08] 	How did I bork the toolbar in prototype this time
[17:44:16] 	looking
[17:45:03] 	nkomura:  a bit confused by this:  if you can link your topic to the discussions re space
[17:45:11] 	it's like the CSS is not there at all
[17:45:14] 	i was going to add my comments as a section on the acai release discussion page.
[17:45:31] 	i could make a separate page and link to it from there, but i think it'll get more eyes on that discussion page itself.
[17:46:21] 	TrevorParscal: Oh wait
[17:46:25] 	The minifier is broken
[17:46:29] 	Only minifies one file then stops :O
[17:46:31] 	oh no!
[17:47:05] 	let me fix
[17:47:21] 	Yep, minifier's fault, combined file itself is OK
[17:48:51] 	TrevorParscal: Could you look at bug 20128 as well?
[17:48:55] 	!b 20128 | TrevorParscal
[17:48:55] --elephant--	TrevorParscal: https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20128
[17:51:30] 	i wrote a comment about reverting the text back to "add topic" from "new section" for en.wp
[17:51:33] 	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MediaWiki_talk:Vector-action-addsection
[17:51:34] 	RoanKattouw: um..
[17:51:39] 	i hope it is the right place...
[17:51:53] 	jquery ui stuff should be... not minifiied, they are doing tricky things in there
[17:51:55] 	nkomura: If it's about local customization of the message, yes, that's the right place
[17:51:57] 	scary things even
[17:52:04] 	may I refactor just a bit?
[17:52:09] 	Sure go ahead
[17:52:16] 	They also provide their own minified version BTW
[17:52:24] 	Which I have lying around somewhere
[17:53:55] 	thanks RoanKattouw
[17:54:31] 	nkomura: Why is Brad Sadler's PHP snipper in effin' MS Word .doc? *sigh* :P
[17:54:56] 	he works in windows environment
[17:55:15] 	you can read w/ Open office right?
[17:56:12] 	Yeah well I used Gmail to preview, then copypasted into my editor and removed the double newlines
[17:56:15] 	Looks fine now
[18:25:15] 	RoanKattouw: I moved some stuff around..
[18:25:21] 	do an update in a sec...
[18:25:27] 	Updating...
[18:25:32] 	:)
[18:26:04] 	using the combined versions of the jquery ui files to start with..
[18:27:09] 	What happened to the js2.combined.* files?
[18:28:17] 	?
[18:28:30] 	jquery-ui-1.7.2.js is in there
[18:28:33] 	why?
[18:28:36] 	Did you just regenerate them or is there now duplicate stuff in there?
[18:28:40] 	Dunno, the diff looked weird
[18:28:51] 	Could be ViewVC's crappy diff rendering that threw me off
[18:29:57] 	i just regenerated them
[18:30:08] 	OK
[18:30:23] 	TrevorParscal: Oh before I forget, *please* set auto-props to svn:eol-style=native
[18:30:32] 	sorry
[18:30:36] 	how do I do that?
[18:30:40] 	It's bad enough in normal cases but with combined files it really gets ugly
[18:30:42] 	Lemme get a link
[18:31:15] 	http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Subversion/auto-props
[18:33:30] 	nimish_g: you should do that too :)
[18:36:07] 	ya, good idea
[18:43:39] 	RoanKattouw: update for new icon! :)
[18:43:57] 	Deploying already
[18:44:02] 	(on prototype of course)
[18:45:03] 	ha nice one
[18:45:36] 	what are you guys looking at?
[18:45:42] 	I was thinking I should add some checkboxes like "whole words only" or "Replace all" (as opposed to replace onec)
[18:45:46] 	http://prototype.wikimedia.org/en-wp/index.php?title=Talk:Main_Page&action=edit
[18:45:56] 	Shift+Reload if it looks broken
[18:46:03] 	Rightmost icon in Advanced section
[18:46:16] 	if I could just get this IE7 thing fixed...
[18:46:22] 	The arwiki issue?
[18:46:25] 	I want to join you in the CGD fun!
[18:46:30] 	heh
[18:46:41] 	toolbar works in rtl on IE6 and IE8 but not IE7
[18:46:43] 	I'm actually not busy now so I'll just get cracking at those checkboxes
[18:48:38] 	is that new icon product of toolbar API and and the placeholder for CGD and media wizzard?
[18:48:50] 	too cool
[18:48:56] 	Aye, it's a first shot at a CGD
[18:49:08] 	Only does search&replace but more complex stuff s of course possible
[18:49:28] 	The main point was to get a proper API first and use s&r as a demo dialog
[18:50:23] 	parutron: Tomasz is gonna give me a DB dump of the enwiki surveys any minute now. It's in a pretty raw format so I'll need to work some magic on it before you can look at it properly, but it's underway :)
[18:50:24] 	so.. I need to fgure out some priorities for us
[18:50:41] 	Throw me some work, I can use it :)
[18:50:53] 	there are several outstanding issues... making a wiki page
[18:50:59] 	OK
[18:53:31] 	Hey why don't I write up an API module for the click tracking thing?
[18:55:13] 	RoanKattouw: nimish_g is working on click tracking
[18:55:20] 	Right
[18:55:27] 	nimish_g see if you can edit this now:  http://usability.wikimedia.org/wiki/Statistical_Evaluation
[18:55:40] 	nimish_g: Do you mind if I start writing up an API module for ClickTracking, or would I be getting in your way?
[18:55:41] 	RoanKattouw:  that is fantastic!
[18:55:52] 	so the priorities for CGD are, links, images(micahel's), tables and references
[18:55:52] 		!log pulling optin_survey table from enwiki on db28 for Roan
[18:56:00] 	so many new faces in our usability chat room!
[18:56:05] 	er, new names, rather.
[18:56:25] 	RoanKattouw: do you want to start working on links for CGD?
[18:56:31] 	Sure
[18:56:47] 	RoanKattouw:  how big is the survey dump
[18:56:58] 	RoanKattouw: I just wrote something this morning that would function as an API, I think
[18:57:04] 	OK
[18:57:05] 	shall we try to load it in google spreadsheet and have it available publicly?
[18:57:07] 		RoanKattouw: fairly small table comparatively Rows: 74809, Data_length: 11059200
[18:57:21] 	nimish_g: I mean like the backend of the AJAX call here to be clear
[18:57:42] 	RoanKattouw: i think that size is not navigable in the spreadsheet
[18:57:59] 	Don't worry, it's not a spreadsheet :P
[18:58:05] 	parutron: if you can peak at the opt-out survey and capture what are the measure reasons for leaving
[18:58:06] 	nkomura: some folks might have put their name in the feedback form. be aware of privacy issues.
[18:58:07] 	right, that's what I wrote...I haven't used jQuery before so I figure the frontend stuff will take longer
[18:58:12] 	for me
[18:58:26] 	thedj: we do not track names though
[18:58:40] 	nkomura: no, but folks might have put them in the comment regardless.
[18:58:55] 	RoanKattouw: isn't it CSV files?
[18:59:00] 	No
[18:59:02] 	thedj: good point
[18:59:52] 	http://prototype.wikimedia.org/sandbox/Work_on_me
[18:59:54] 	:)
[19:00:17] 	i would have put it on collab, but nimish isn't on it yet and this isn't private data
[19:00:26] 	so I just threw it up somewhere
[19:00:28] 	but yeah
[19:02:14] 	RoanKattouw: so, there's some stuff in the fixes you can do
[19:02:18] 	I am working on the first 2
[19:02:47] 	thanks trevor
[19:02:55] 	i added the priority on CGD
[19:03:04] 	if RoanKattouw want to take a crack at links
[19:03:12] 	that'll be cool too
[19:03:16] 	yes
[19:03:40] 	nkomura: Will do, on the phone now
[19:21:58] 	TrevorParscal: you guys up for lunch?
[19:23:00] 	Im at home actually
[19:23:13] 	nimish_g is there though
[19:23:17] 	whee
[19:23:27] 	nimish_g & parutron & nkomura ?
[19:25:52] 	nkomura: also at home
[19:25:57] 	bah
[19:25:59] 	nimish_g: you there?
[19:26:12] 	sorry
[19:26:17] 	we are talking bucket testing
[19:26:19] 	one sec
[19:26:58] 	brion: i'm working from home today
[19:31:04] 	yes I'm here
[19:32:15] 	http://usability.wikimedia.org/wiki/Statistical_Evaluation
[19:32:19] 	how's this?
[19:35:44] 	nimish_g: is the expansion of the toolbar trackable too?
[19:36:03] 	yes it should be
[19:36:50] 	nkomura and TrevorParscal (and parutron): can we have a meeting tomorrow about what stats in general we'd like to use?
[19:36:52] 	i'd like to know the frequency of "advanced", "special characters" and "help"
[19:37:00] 	definitely
[19:37:11] 	we have lots to discuss
[19:37:13] 	sorry we missed you brion-lunch!
[19:37:17] 	let's meet in the morning
[19:37:43] 	and also discuss the possibilities of bucket testing
[19:37:50] 	yay!
[19:37:52] 	cool
[19:38:04] 	so - yeah, eating lunch - brb
[19:38:07] 	isn't exciting?
[19:38:19] 	i'd like to know what event ID covers
[19:38:25] 	but we can talk about it tomorrow
[19:38:34] 	i'm going to take a break too
[19:39:00] 	Out of interest, why not #wikipedia-usability?
[19:39:02] 	Right now, we were thinking just "clicked the bold button" "expanded the toolbar" "clicked this button" and other such
[19:40:01] 	so the event ID is not tied to the session from a user clicks "edit" till "save"
[19:40:07] 	MC8: Accident of history
[19:40:22] 	nimish_g: we can talk about it tomorrow
[19:40:22] 	Heh
[19:40:33] 	nimish_g: btw, did you receive bug assignments from brion?
[19:41:23] 	nkomura_break: I haven't yet, I'm just writing some database backend stuff for the click tracking
[19:46:20] *TrevorParscal 	(and the team) beat brion to the punch :)
[19:52:28] 	:o
[19:55:54] 	Fatal error:  Call to a member function userIsWatching() on a non-object in /srv/org/wikimedia/prototype/wikis/s/includes/specials/SpecialMovepage.php on line 284
[19:55:54] 	at http://prototype.wikimedia.org/sandbox/Special:MovePage/NavigableTOC
[19:58:38] 	hi all. Need to talk to someone about the usability beta; are you aware that there are issues with vandal fighting gadgets on it?
[19:59:15] 	I have a user i'm talking to, who tells me that twinkle fails to function, despite a prefs option to enable it
[19:59:55] 	nkomura-break is a misnomer!
[19:59:59] 	you are working on your break!
[20:00:01] 	tee hee.
[20:00:21] 	i posted a blurb about the header space
[20:00:24] 	Taking a break from not working?
[20:00:24] 	http://usability.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Releases/Acai#Usability_Team.27s_Thoughts_on_the_Header_Spacing
[20:00:31] 	hi oldlaptop
[20:00:44] 	This is the user i mentioned
[20:00:51] 	team, let me know if there are any changes i can make to more accurately express our point of view.
[20:00:53] 	Haggisburger: I'll investigate those issues some time this week, but it's probably a question of Twinkle not being Vector-compatible
[20:01:52] 	It must not be, there's a userprefs gadget to make it Vector-compatible
[20:01:55] 	roan: new things shouldn't break old stuff, it's supposed to increase usability, not mess things up which are already working! :)
[20:01:58] 	That does not work
[20:02:15] 	Haggisburger: Right
[20:02:21] 	That gadget wasn't written by us, we can't guarantee it'll work
[20:02:51] 	But we needed to restructure the page, and there's some gadgets out there that are so monobook-specific that the only way to make them work was to just copypaste monobook and call that Vector :P
[20:03:02] 	So liase with the people who wrote it before deploying something which knobbles it :D
[20:03:16] 	We didn't deploy it, it's opt-in
[20:03:22] 	It's not like we forced it on you
[20:03:58] 	just one thing then, if you opt in, can you opt out?
[20:04:06] 	Haggisburger: Yes
[20:04:24] 	There's a link on the top of the page that says "Leave Beta"
[20:04:37] 	Which was also mentioned on the "Welcome to Beta" post-opt-in success page
[20:04:57] 	ok
[20:05:03] 	It does look good though.
[20:05:14] 	The only problem I have is Twinkle
[20:05:45] 	I just think that you should make sure everything works before putting the beta out. That way you minimise or eradicate complaints like this...
[20:06:02] 	It's beta. We're trying to work everything out.
[20:06:02] 	Sorry, make sure everything is compatible
[20:06:18] 	beta, by definition, needs fixing
[20:06:20] 	If it was already working, it wouldn't be beta, would it???
[20:06:24] 	:)
[20:06:26] 	Haggisburger: Can't do that without deploying. Chicken and egg problem :)
[20:06:37] *Haggisburger 	d'oh
[20:06:51] 	MC8: Yep
[20:07:06] 	It's a *beta*
[20:08:22] *Haggisburger 	slurps his fennel seed tea down and prays his headache will go away.
[20:08:40] 	walked into my front door tonight. Literally.
[20:09:34] 	Ow
[20:09:55] 	Easy, i didn't open it.
[20:10:03] 	Oh sorry, misread that
[20:10:23] *Haggisburger 	saw 'how' for some reason
[20:10:43] 	i worry http://usability.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Releases/Acai#Usability_Team.27s_Thoughts_on_the_Header_Spacing is too wordy
[20:11:13] 	it sounds a bit... like.. "here's so much text you just give up" rather than a simple explaination...
[20:11:14] 	Haggisburger: twinkle works here
[20:11:25] 	Haggisburger: and this is also detailed on the twinkle page.
[20:11:42] 	Oooh
[20:11:45] 	Is there any way of getting import rights on http://prototype.wikimedia.org/en.wikipedia.org/ to get rid of some of the redlinks (Template:Citation and so forth), or should I copy&paste?
[20:11:58] 	the problem is more likely that the user has other javascript enabled which is NOT compatible and halts the execution of JS before twinkle is reached.
[20:12:09] 	aha
[20:12:13] 	wrong name of chan ??? should be a dash, not an underscore
[20:12:58] 	So knobble the other js first, and twinkle will fire up?
[20:13:06] 	likely
[20:13:12] 	RoanKattouw: actually this chan is not under wikimedia GC
[20:13:20] 	!b 20128 | TrevorParscal
[20:13:20] --elephant--	TrevorParscal: https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20128
[20:13:22] 	Oldlaptop: there ya go
[20:13:29] 	TrevorParscal: Could you poke at that? -----^^
[20:13:30] 	haggisburger .... why don't you do the liasing twinkle is not MediaWiki
[20:13:40] 	thedj: D'oh, would
[20:13:58] 	Ooops, hit Enter instead of Shift
[20:14:06] 	GerardM-: As thedj just said Twinkle isn't even broken. Another Gadget is broken, halting JS execution and disabling Twinkle
[20:14:13] 	Gadget breakages snowball, unfortunately
[20:14:22] 	Would Friendly do it?
[20:14:29] 	AzaToth: Isn't it #wikipedia*, not #wikipedia-*?
[20:14:35] 	That bug looks like css in monobook that needs to be moved to common
[20:14:36] 	MC8: nope
[20:14:39] 	wait
[20:14:48] 	AzaToth: I don't know what that means and I don't really care either until Freenode staff complain (if they ever do)
[20:15:15] 	aug 03 23:09:48          you're marked for  #mediawiki, #wikimedia, #wikipedia, #wikiversity, #wikispecies, #wikinews, #wikisource, #wikibooks, #wikiquote, #wiktionary ( #project-* , project/* and wikimedia-commons/*)
[20:15:34] 	gerard: i would liase, but twinkle's author is a better person to do that.
[20:15:39] 	yes, the channel name is illegal, but no one cares, so, meh
[20:15:48] 	Oldlaptop321: i have not tested friendly on vector, but this discussion belongs on en.wp
[20:15:51] 	AzaToth: You're GC, aren't you? {{sofixit}} :P
[20:15:56] 	AzaToth: ORLY, then why do we have a secret channel for staff that contains an underscore?
[20:15:57] 	MC8: I'm not
[20:15:58] 	I just use it, bogged if i know how it works!
[20:16:05] 	AzaToth: Always thought you were :|
[20:16:07] 	MC8: it wouldn't be fixable anyway
[20:16:08] 	thedj: Yes
[20:16:14] 	MC8: only CC
[20:17:00] 	RoanKattouw: just wanted to point out this isn't officially an wikimedia IRC channel
[20:17:01] 	???
[20:18:40] 	RoanKattouw: they might have actually made an channel with underscore instead of dash just to be able to circumvent onwiki regulations
[20:19:24] 	if its not an official channel, it should be ## should it not, azatoth?
[20:19:42] 	Haggisburger: ## is topic channels
[20:19:58] 	Does it matter? :|
[20:20:08] 	MC8: which one?
[20:20:21] 	(9:19:20 PM) Haggisburger: if its not an official channel, it should be ## should it not, azatoth?
[20:20:28] 	gotta stick to protocol, mc8!
[20:20:39] 	zOMG bureacracy
[20:20:40] *Haggisburger 	is being pedantic
[20:20:45] 	sorry
[20:20:47] 	##php is about php, #php can be php's official channel, but doesn't have to be
[20:20:47] 	I bet it was quiet in here until I joined....
[20:21:11] 	it's just what it says, it's not that strict
[20:21:37] 	but say someone created an #php channel, then the PHP folks can take that channel by force, but they can't take #php
[20:21:41] 	right, azatoth. And this channel is about the topic of wikipedia's usability. It's not officially about wikipedia, per se.
[20:21:41] 	##php*
[20:21:45] 	:)
[20:22:08] 	Haggisburger: it's no the "semi-official" wikipedia usabillity channel?
[20:22:24] 	erm, it's only wikipedia I assume here?
[20:22:34] 	or is it the whole media?
[20:22:36] 	srsly, does it mattah?
[20:22:42] 	Haggisburger: It's about an official project and is registered by one of its employees
[20:22:53] 	fairy nuff.
[20:23:06] 	to be technical: you would need to rename to ##wikipedia_usability, #wikipedia-usability, or file a group contact form for the usability team
[20:23:14] 	but no one cares, so it does not matter
[20:23:19] 	I do ???
[20:23:23] 	and me
[20:23:32] 	(if cloaks are involved, I do, as I want one [otherwise, meh])
[20:23:36] 	then go complain in #freenode, and see how far you get
[20:24:08] 	Lots of ze dramaz over a IRC channel name, eh?
[20:24:26] 	back to the other question right then
[20:24:34] 	brion: Could you sync the fix for https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20171 and re-enable EditWarning?
[20:24:41] 	is this channel ONLY for wikipedia usabillity?
[20:24:41] 	i'm not quite sure how to take that comment, prodego.
[20:25:07] 	or is it for whole wikimedia?
[20:25:37] 	According to the terms of the grant our primary focus is enwp, and we're officially called the Wikipedia Usability Initiative
[20:25:48] 	ok
[20:26:03] 	so wikinews can throw them self into the wall ???
[20:26:39] 	(repeating, it got lost in the drama earlier) Is there any way of getting import rights on http://prototype.wikimedia.org/en.wikipedia.org/ to get rid of some of the redlinks (Template:Citation and so forth), or should I copy&paste?
[20:26:56] 	MC8: Sure, what's your username?
[20:27:02] 	microchip08
[20:27:17] *AzaToth 	waits for a sign when I can use jquery in twinkle
[20:27:40] 	MC8: Made you a sysop, that should do it
[20:27:45] 	thanks
[20:27:49] 	Don't mess up the site kthx ;)
[20:28:00] 	famous last words
[20:28:25] 	roankattouw: wp:BEANS....
[20:28:45] 	Don't put ideas in his head.
[20:28:49] 	:)
[20:28:56] 	RoanKattouw: You're no fun :P
[20:29:04] 	(woo, enwp sysop at last?)
[20:29:19] *AzaToth 	wonders of the copyright interface hole still exists
[20:30:41] 	perhaps you should add http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Help:Gadget-ImageAnnotator to the standard
[20:31:06] 	MC8: Also be aware that in order to fix all red links you'd have to import nearly all of Wikipedia, so don't be over-ambitious ;)
[20:31:33] 	RoanKattouw: Yeah, I know :P
[20:31:55] 	RoanKattouw: WP:BEANS
[20:32:03] 	AzaToth: you can import jquery
[20:32:43] 	thedj: difficult
[20:33:00] 	the tempooral disalignment problem
[20:33:07] 	It's publicly available from Google and at http://en.wikipedia.org/w/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/js/js2/jquery-1.3.2.js
[20:33:35] 	yeah, that's how i include it atm.
[20:33:47] 	simply from the usability extension.
[20:34:23] 	thedj: sadly still isn't an option to include it via includeScript
[20:34:56] 	as I dont' want to have all users compaining 10% of the time it doesn't work as jquery loaded after twinkle
[20:35:42] 	use my twinkle loader.
[20:36:04] 	no wai
[20:36:10] 	too ugly ???
[20:36:58] 	and it would require an thirld level of loading
[20:37:34] 	I'll wait until jquery is enabled per default instead
[20:38:34] 	parutron: great message.  i don't think it is too wordy.  you want to sign your message though.
[20:45:03] 	TrevorParscal: steve sent us the screenshot in which WP logo is cropped ...
[20:45:10] 	yes
[20:45:13] 	I responded
[20:45:27] 	we've already fixed that - it was part of another bug
[20:46:37] 	Could we stretch the edit summary box to the width of the whole screen?
[20:47:22] 	MC8: I'm looking into bringing the save, preview, cancel, edit summary, and minor edit controls into the wikiEditor UI
[20:47:31] 	which may result in that field being larger
[20:48:22] 	RoanKattouw: any fixes you need marked acaifix etc?
[20:48:42] 	brion: YES PLEASE
[20:48:54] 	brion: http://dpaste.org/CCGM/
[20:49:12] 	When r54778 is deployed EditWarning shoud be safe to turn back on
[20:50:53] 	r54806 fixes some rendering issues as well
[20:50:56] 	just marked it
[20:51:03] *RoanKattouw 	adds to pastey
[20:51:42] 	sort of supersedes r54793
[20:51:53] 	Yes but they depend on each other
[20:51:58] 	So both need to eb merged
[20:52:13] 	Merging r54806 without merging r54793 is gonna cause nasty conflicts
[20:52:21] 	understoo
[20:52:39] 	merge both - I was noting that for a reviewers benefit
[20:52:47] 	OK
[20:53:03] 	brion: Do you want me to merge them into the branch or are you gonna do it?
[20:54:40] 	RoanKattouw: some of those at least aren't tagged as acaifix
[20:54:53] 	Hmm
[20:54:55] 	stupid css.
[20:55:05] 	i've got a meeting in 5 minutes
[20:55:14] 	so much predates usage of shared.css
[20:55:33] 	brion: "acaifix" != "stuff we want deployed" ;)
[20:55:43] 	hrm
[20:55:47] 	well that's sure what i consider it to mean
[20:55:54] 	so what do you think it is?
[20:56:00] 	Fixes for Acai?
[20:56:04] 	yeah
[20:56:06] 	and thus needing to be deployed
[20:56:11] 	stuff to be deployed to fix acai
[20:56:16] 	if it ain't a fix, it ain't gonna be deployed
[20:56:33] 	But there's other stuff we want to deploy as well like better charts and caching in Special:PrefStats
[20:56:50] 	that's an acaifix
[20:56:52] 	ok, well make up your mind as to what you're tagging for deployment in acaifix and i'll look at it later
[20:56:54] 	:D
[20:57:00] 	OK
[20:57:02] *RoanKattouw 	acaifixes
[20:57:08] 	indeed
[20:58:10] 	OK two of those were missing acaifix, now tagged
[20:58:33] 	thanks roan - sorry about the confusion
[20:58:52] 	brion: OK my list is now identical to the non-OK revs on http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:Code/MediaWiki/tag/acaifix
[21:00:29] 	TrevorParscal: re the font size comment from steve
[21:00:53] 	we haven't change the font size of the text (not tab labels) right?
[21:00:53] 	?
[21:01:14] 	no change in font size, there was a fix in a bug that caused things to render the wrong sizes
[21:01:19] 	steve said his friend finds the text size in Vctor is a few points smaller
[21:01:26] 	and on some computers, the fonts could be wrong too
[21:01:46] 	it should be correct now - deploying changes in a bit
[21:01:52] 	ok cool
[21:01:57] 	TrevorParscal: I acaifixed http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:Code/MediaWiki/54786 BTW
[21:02:02] 	how are you doing on RTL for the toolbar
[21:02:09] 	?
[21:02:17] 	RoanKattouw: awesome!
[21:02:36] 	nkomura: well, I've diagnosed it, now I have to find a reasonable solution
[21:02:44] 	I should have it fixed by today
[21:03:01] 	but yeah, it's only in IE7, iE6 and 8 work fine.. and everything else too...
[21:03:05] 	if you think you will need time
[21:03:12] 	we should disable beta from RTL
[21:03:20] 	which may be a prudent path
[21:03:27] 	why don't we do that
[21:03:31] 	TrevorParscal: I've set up parutron with a DB copy of enwiki.optin_survey through phpMyAdmin (although she's not answering my PMs), I said she could ask both of us for questions about PMA and SQL queries and stuff
[21:04:08] 	I think we will deloy the fix tomorow, so let's act based on that plan
[21:04:12] 	RoanKattouw: are you proposing the stats per hour?
[21:04:18] 	i think that is too granular
[21:04:28] 	we don't need such granular data
[21:04:34] 	nkomura: No, I'm proposing to cache them per-hour
[21:04:39] 	It's a performance improvement
[21:04:46] 	oh sorry
[21:04:48] 	Doesn't change granularity in any way
[21:04:48] 	misread
[21:05:09] 	That way we can safely expose it to the public without blowing up the database servers
[21:05:18] 	did you see my email about 6 hours increments for breakdown for a day?
[21:05:46] 	You wanna break down in 6-hour increments? Easily done
[21:05:49] 	db query from public makes me worried
[21:06:05] 	nkomura: What it does is it queries once, remembers the results for an hour, then queries again
[21:06:05] 	but everything is a db query
[21:06:10] 	thats why caching is good
[21:06:14] 	So the number of queries does not depend on the number of view
[21:06:16] 	s
[21:06:18] 	That's what caching means
[21:06:21] 	RoanKattouw: i think it is better to stagger
[21:06:26] 	the deployment
[21:06:35] 	caching, and public
[21:06:37] 	What do you mean stagger?
[21:06:57] 	she means deploy caching
[21:06:58] 	are we doing one step deployment to introduce caching and move prefstats to public?
[21:07:00] 	test in production
[21:07:06] 	then make it public
[21:07:10] 	exactly
[21:07:16] 	I don't see why we'd need that
[21:07:17] 	safe way to go
[21:07:24] 	to be safe
[21:07:26] 	I've tested that the cache works
[21:07:44] 	And it's not like I invented caching; I used MediaWiki's built-in cache, which is used all over the place
[21:07:59] 	I'm just clarifying her suggestion - but... if brion doesn't mind, it's always fine to be on the safe side of things
[21:08:03] 	But it's live on prototype if you wanna test :P
[21:08:03] 	if brion-meeting ok's it, i'm fine with it
[21:08:08] 	OK
[21:08:17] 	RoanKattouw: it's not that we don't trust you :)
[21:08:20] 	heh
[21:08:24] 	but i'd rather review the updates and make it public
[21:08:24] *TrevorParscal 	trusts RoanKattouw 
[21:08:33] 	right on
[21:08:39] 	we can do it however you like
[21:08:40] 	we can even move to public next week
[21:09:07] 	RoanKattouw: of course, we always do what we feel it works
[21:09:14] 	Yeah
[21:09:38] 	From a technical POV it's a small, clean and clear change that improves performance a lot
[21:09:43] 	but there are so much unknowns
[21:10:04] 	i am all for making the performance improvements today
[21:10:19] 	sounds simple to do
[21:10:23] 	i feel it would be wiser to confirm the legend and increments ourselves
[21:10:28] 	before making it to public
[21:11:07] 	and also the performance concern as we tackle granular data (even with caching)
[21:12:26] 	Oh I didn't add a legend, was supposed to
[21:12:30] *RoanKattouw 	goes and adds it
[21:13:49] 	RoanKattouw and parutron: did you see my email about misplaced survey question in "feedback survey"?
[21:13:58] 	that's needs to be fixed as soon as possible
[21:14:02] 	Yes
[21:14:05] *RoanKattouw 	fixes
[21:14:09] 	yes!
[21:14:19] 	Which question was it again
[21:14:37] 	"What could we have done differently?"
[21:14:39] 	?
[21:14:42] 	yes
[21:14:52] 	that question should NOT be in the beta feedback survey
[21:15:48] 	Fixed
[21:15:52] 	Updating prototype
[21:15:57] 	yay
[21:16:35] 	"What features do you hate about monobook?"
[21:18:18] 	That sounds oxymoronic
[21:18:22] 	"features" vs. "hate"
[21:21:13] 	RoanKattouw: thanks, looks good
[21:21:30] 	MC8: i don't hate anything about monobook
[21:21:53] 	we observed new users have hard time navigating around
[21:22:01] 	so we want to make it easy to use
[21:22:01] 	nkomura: mm. "features that we need to improve on using monobook?"
[21:22:34] 	Make the edit button a different colour? (light yellow?)
[21:23:11] 	MC8: you mean look&feel?
[21:23:31] 	i think the color tone on monobook is beautiful, it is subjective of course
[21:24:12] 	I like monobook, personally, but I know that other people don't.
[21:24:28] 	But on Vector, prehaps make the edit button yellow :)
[21:24:53] 	parutron has new color palette for the upcoming release
[21:25:18] 	so the tab on the active page will have a little more noticeable color
[21:25:41] 	nkomura: Legend and six-hour increment links done and live on prototype now
[21:26:37] 	MC8: http://usability.wikimedia.org/wiki/Babaco_Designs#Color_Scheme
[21:26:55] 	RoanKattouw: thanks will have a look
[21:27:00] 	what would be the url?
[21:27:18] 	http://prototype.wikimedia.org/en.wikipedia.org/Special:PrefStats/skin
[21:27:29] 	thanks
[21:28:23] 	nkomura: My theory is that the edit button should be easily noticeable (I did a talk on WP as a project, most people used it every day and didn't notice the word "edit")
[21:28:55] 	MC8: we observe that during the usability study
[21:29:15] 	Ah.
[21:29:30] 	we will evaluate vector in the next usability study in september
[21:30:13] 	if people still have hard time, we may need to make it easier to be found
[21:31:52] 	RoanKattouw: i reloaded the page, but still shows 4 hrs increments
[21:32:07] 	Yes, it doesn't show 6-hr increments by default but there's a link for it
[21:32:25] 	The by-default increment is variable and strives for about 15 bars
[21:32:42] 	oh thanks
[21:33:19] 	i don't think we need 4 hr increments and 6 hr increments both
[21:33:34] 	sorry i didn't know you implemented 4hr already
[21:33:43] 	I didn't
[21:33:51] 	It's a magically shifting increment, the 4 hr one
[21:34:20] 		The by-default increment is variable and strives for about 15 bars <--- that's what the 4-hr thing is you're seeing
[21:34:32] 	Tomorrow it could be 5 hours because the data set has grown
[21:34:48] 	It's basically a failsafe so the graph doesn't get too huge or too small
[21:35:08] 	i see
[21:35:19] 	so on hourly graph
[21:35:27] 	shall we cut off after 24 bars?
[21:35:43] 	we know that within 24 hours, opt-out rate drops significantly
[21:36:07] 	so i don't think there is a point in displaying so many bars which clutters the graph
[21:36:34] 	hrm, error when I move something on the prototype sandbox
[21:36:55] 	nkomura: I'll look into that later
[21:36:55] 	Fatal error:  Call to a member function userIsWatching() on a non-object in /srv/org/wikimedia/prototype/wikis/s/includes/specials/SpecialMovepage.php on line 284
[21:38:17] *RoanKattouw 	updates code
[21:39:40] 	Also prototype is running bleeding-edge code, so it may break sometimes
[21:40:18] 	Out of interest, are you random coders, WMF employees, or what? You've not got cloaks :/
[21:40:53] 	I'm a WMF employeee
[21:40:59] 	Roan is a contractor for WMF
[21:41:16] 	ah
[21:41:44] 	MC8: Hey I have a cloak! :P
[21:41:54] *thedj 	tries to communicate en.wp issues back to the team.
[21:42:07] 	but that's all unofficial bussiness.
[21:42:53] 	RoanKattouw: I remember /whois-ing you...
[21:43:21] 	RoanKattouw  ???Roan Kattouw???
[21:44:40] *Prodego 	would like a special skin with lots of ajax
[21:45:10] 	the trouble with js files is that they don't load immediately
[21:45:33] 	so there is a noticable delay before, say, loading tabs
[21:45:44] 	but this usability initiative is mostly for 'new' people
[21:45:48] 	TrevorParscal and RoanKattouw:  do we have a clean list of fixes for brion for deployment?
[21:45:49] 	not the 'power users'
[21:46:07] 	nkomura: yes
[21:46:14] 	nkomura: Yes, the acaifix tag
[21:46:41] 	Prodego: Aye, edit toolbar performance sucks, I'm meaning to look into that one day
[21:46:57] 	When I have time and am on a train or in a car or something
[21:47:26] 	RoanKattouw: I know of a few things we can do, but stabilizing the software has taken precedence obviously
[21:47:53] 	question about http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:Code/MediaWiki/tag/acaifix
[21:48:17] 	all "new"s need to be reviewed and deployed?
[21:48:32] 	Yes
[21:48:38] 	All ok's (white) already live
[21:49:19] 	haha, Chad just reverted a commit he made himself over a year ago: "	Revert r35877, early commit that can only be explained by a complete naivete. Nobody ever used this because they weren't idiots."
[21:49:42] 	so everything highlighted in yellow?
[21:49:47] 	and new
[21:49:57] 	Yes, that's what we want Brion to deploy
[21:50:12] 	Brion knows that, he wrote the software that does the white-and-yellow marking :P
[21:51:08] 	that works great
[21:51:36] 	i'm just dazzled with the amount of changes we are pushing out today
[21:52:23] 	TrevorParscal: i am going to start working on slides so will be away from this room
[21:52:32] 	ok
[21:52:39] 	will you ask brion-meeting to disable beta from RTL languages?
[21:52:55] 	all of beta?
[21:53:01] 	Vector works great
[21:53:04] 	nkomura: I'll write a bio for those slides on the train tomorrow
[21:53:07] 	it's just the toolbar
[21:53:26] 	yeah but the beta is not complete without the toolbar
[21:53:39] 	so it is better to halt it until we have beta working
[21:53:58] 	showing beta landing page and not offering the toolbar is inconsistent messaging
[21:54:11] 	it will be just a few more days, i hope
[21:54:51] 	RoanKattouw: thanks!
[21:55:20] 	brion!
[21:55:33] 	LOTS of comments on wikiEd compatibility
[21:56:03] 	and scripts
[21:56:18] 	boo-yah
[21:56:19] 	\o/
[21:56:29] 	welcome back, brion
[21:56:52] 	so i was just talking to TrevorParscal to consider disabling beta from RTL languages
[21:56:58] 	:(
[21:57:10] 	toolbar does not display for IE7 & 8
[21:57:18] 	no, just IE7
[21:57:22] 	IE 6 and 8 are fine
[21:57:26] 	k
[21:57:37] 	heh
[21:57:38] 	what do you think?
[21:57:42] 	http://usability.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Editbox&diff=2646&oldid=2465 possibly?
[21:57:51] 	I suggest we disable the toolbar extension for those languages if we do anything
[21:58:22] 	but i think the beta does require toolbar to be complete
[21:58:36] 	MC8: sweetness
[21:58:54] 	I will have a fix tomorow
[21:58:54] 	so we show old toolbar instead?
[21:58:58] 	I'm working hard on it now
[21:59:15] 	if the edit toolbar extension is disabled it would show the old toolbar
[21:59:17] 	i know you do, TrevorParscal
[21:59:46] 	but it gives us anxiety when we know things are broken out there
[22:00:18] 	and as a result we rush through
[22:00:46] 	brion: what do you think?
[22:01:13] 	TrevorParscal: I'm extending JS's RegExp object with an escape() function I found on the internet, is it OK if I just throw that in jquery.wikiEditor.js ?
[22:01:23] 	I could create a file for random JS stuff but that seems pointless
[22:01:46] 	what module is using it?
[22:02:02] 	An anonymous function in EditToolbar.js technically
[22:02:17] 	In practice, the s&r button
[22:02:32] 	then place it inside the onload function of EditToolbar.js
[22:02:45] 	make it as non-global as possible.... basically
[22:03:52] 	OK
[22:04:05] 	nkomura: i'm not super worried; if it's broke people can opt right back out
[22:04:22] 	brion: that's true
[22:04:27] 	I may have an IE7 fix within the hour
[22:04:36] 	TrevorParscal: Doesn't need to be in onload AFAIK, put it in top level of EditToolbar.js
[22:04:43] 	TrevorParscal: you are not feeling well today, don't push it
[22:05:01] 	brion: Could you review+push the revs marked acaifix and reenable EditWarning after that?
[22:05:02] 	:) I'm cuddled up in bed with my laptop...
[22:05:58] 	i'll be idle from this room a bit
[22:06:07] 	ping me if you need me
[22:06:42] 	brion: thanks for accommodating yet another deployment request :-)
[22:10:57] 	RoanKattouw: shortly :D
[22:12:01] 	ok let's find that code review window...
[22:17:04] 	heh yeah tab overload, I know the feeling
[22:19:23] 	TrevorParscal: how are you running the js tests? is this something we could automate and upload results for to code review?
[22:19:39] 	right now it's very ad-hoc
[22:19:52] 	but given some more time, yes, that would be awesome to do
[22:20:19] 	Should be a simple AJAX API call
[22:20:39] 	sweet
[22:31:39] 	By the way, re http://usability.wikimedia.org/wiki/LQT_layout_and_look_musing there's http://simple.wikibooks.org/wiki/User:Microchip08/monobook.css (don't remember where I got it from)
[22:32:08] 	http://simple.wikibooks.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Gadget-commentgradient.css even
[22:33:44] 	ok now the vector updates...
[22:33:47] 	nkomura_idle: If you happen to finish any bio slides today, could you send me an example of one? Just so I know what to aim for
[22:40:54] 	ok looks good
[22:45:02] 	RoanKattouw: sure
[22:45:17] 	will do
[22:47:09] 	RoanKattouw and TrevorParscal: I just checked in a basic backend for clicktracking, my first wiki extension =)
[22:47:22] 	hooray!
[22:47:40] *TrevorParscal 	just lost all traction he had in getting IE7 to behave
[22:47:50] 	and it *doesn't* melt when used, which is even more awesome
[22:48:55] 	Aye, reviewing right now
[22:50:26] 	i'm taking a break
[22:50:50] 	my brain is getting discombobulated
[22:53:01] 	ok reenabling editwarning
[22:53:14] 	Awesome, thanks
[22:54:46] 	nimish_g: I left a comment on CodeReview. It should e-mail you about it if you set it up right
[22:56:32] 	Bleh what good is a regex escaper that doesn't escape $ and ^
[23:05:58] 	RoanKattouw:  thanks =) I guess I don't have it set up for that, but I saw the comments
[23:06:17] 	OK
[23:06:49] 	Go to Special:Preferences on www.mediawiki.org and check the relevant E-mail me for ... preference if you want those mails
[23:06:51] 	RoanKattouw: what would be the url of publicly available prefstats?
[23:07:03] 	for en.wp for example?
[23:07:46] 	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:PrefStats/skin
[23:07:53] 	or /usebetatoolbar or /useeditwarning
[23:09:35] 	thanks
[23:12:26] 	OK, I've twiddled with the usability wiki to make it more... useable
[23:23:16] 	CIA-32>	catrope * r54827 /trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/EditToolbar/ (4 files): EditToolbar: Extend search&replace dialog with case sensitive/insensitive checkbox and regex checkbox
[23:23:21] 	Now live on prototype ---^^
[23:25:35] 	OK I'm calling it a day, see you all tomorrow
[23:29:18] 	brion: is there a way to store null in the database using Database::insert ?
[23:30:10] 	nimish_g: sure
[23:30:14] 	array( 'field' => null )
[23:30:18] 	works as you'd expect it to
[23:31:43] 	hm, I keep getting errors doing that from somewhere in DatabaseMysql
[23:34:06] 	as above yes :)
[23:34:12] 	nimish_g: where you seeing it?
[23:34:24] 	keep in mind that the field needs to not be defined as 'not null' or mysql might whinge at you ;)
[23:36:09] 	it is... I have this: 	$data = array(
[23:36:10] 				'is_logged_in' => $is_logged_in,
[23:36:10] 				'namespace' => (int) $namespace,
[23:36:10] 				'event_id' => (int) $event_id,
[23:36:10] 				'user_contribs' => null
[23:36:11] 			);
[23:36:11] 			
[23:36:13] 			$db_status = $dbw->insert('click_tracking', $data, __METHOD__);
[23:36:20] 	wow, that copy-paste didn't do what I thought it would
[23:38:52] 	basically it's inserting into the DB fine (as null) but also giving me: mysql_real_escape_string() expects parameter 1 to be string, object given in /Users/nimishgautam/Sites/prototype/includes/db/DatabaseMysql.php on line 252
[23:39:40] 	nimish_g: can you show the whole function?
[23:39:48] 	soudns like something's not getting passed in the right place
[23:39:56] 	pastebin is your friend :D
[23:40:00] 	pastebin time!
[23:40:09] *brion 	muses we should have a nice real-time multiuser code editor :)
[23:40:26] 	can bespin do that yet?
[23:40:36] 	what's the deal with bespin?
[23:40:47] 	I mean... is it ready yet?
[23:41:25] 	can't we be one of the first to try it out?
[23:41:34] 	who do we know over there... ? :))
[23:42:51] 	http://pastebin.com/m67675e30
[23:44:00] 	https://bespin.mozilla.com/
[23:44:08] 	they've been actively developing it, looks very spiffy ;)
[23:44:17] 	we should track somebody down and make friends ;)
[23:44:40] 	d'oh, the 'edit open source' button is 'coming soon'
[23:44:58] 	nimish_g: 'object given' is suspicious
[23:45:05] 	what's $contribs if it's not null?
[23:45:10] 	and $is_logged_in?
[23:45:29] 	(consider also normalizing that with a ($is_logged_in ? 1 : 0))
[23:46:31] 	contribs is supposed to be a number too - so it should be cast as well?
[23:46:32] 	contribs is stored in the DB as an int
[23:46:45] 	you cast the other ints
[23:46:53] 	but I wanted to differentiate between users with 0 contributions and not logged in users (with null) contributions
[23:47:07] 	nimish_g: well clearly something in there is an object, not an int :)
[23:47:11] 	rely on is_logged_in then
[23:47:31] 	hm ok
[23:47:45] 	when is_logged_in is false, contribs should always be null
[23:47:55] 	anything else is strange and should be caught
[23:48:40] 	ok
[23:50:18] 	http://pastebin.com/m40877e63  this is a fun tool!
[23:53:18] 	http://pastebin.com/m692e3c68
[23:56:00] 	even better -> http://pastebin.com/m29a0ec06
[23:58:20] 	ok - I gotta help mel with cadence now..
[23:58:23] 	cyall tomorow
[23:59:30] 	whee
[23:59:53] 	eehw