[14:18:19] Which Naoko is the real one? :P [14:19:17] i guess i am nkomura1 now [14:19:27] let me let go of nkomura [14:19:59] I'll kick nkomura if you want [14:20:06] please [14:20:18] There [14:20:24] connectivity is flaky on the trian [14:20:35] Ah yes [14:21:10] thanks [14:21:11] They did internet as a test on my commuter train a few months ago, connectivity was good at first but got really bad after a while [14:21:35] i'm using personal modem [14:22:00] but the wavelength is not consistent it seems [14:23:06] Bleh we need a donotdeploy tag :P [14:24:07] something got deployed by mistake? [14:24:16] On Aug 5 Brion merged all changes to Vector [14:24:30] But one of those changes moved something from Vector to common, and he didn't update common [14:24:42] So now N m b in recentchanges aren't bolded anymore [14:25:09] Took me a while to track it down but I've got it now; gonna un-merge the offending rev and poke werdna to deploy [14:25:26] N m b? [14:25:46] *werdna hides [14:26:22] i still can see you andrew! [14:27:16] *MC8 can't [14:30:53] werdna: Committed to wmf-deployment, could you please sync? [14:31:15] link to code review, please [14:31:30] http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:Code/MediaWiki/54861 [15:10:50] RoanKattouw: thx for sorting it out. [15:10:55] Sure [15:12:58] nkomura: For the link CGD, should it replace the existing ext link and int link icons? [15:13:27] yes, that is the current plan [15:13:48] so one link icon -> CGD which supports both internal and external link [15:13:58] Aye [15:14:26] Found a mockup @ http://usability.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=File%3AContentGeneration.pdf&page=2 [15:14:57] :) [15:15:20] parul uploaded all available mock-ups for babaco and beyond [15:15:28] so that is a good place to look [16:55:10] good morning yall [16:57:26] he trevor. feeling better today ? [16:57:32] yes [16:57:50] I don't feel like the plague is just around the corner [16:57:57] thanks for asking :) [16:58:20] health is important. [16:59:30] indeed [17:01:45] Morning [17:02:00] I got a Google calendar e-mail about a meeting starting right now, what's that about? [17:05:37] We were gonna discuss what we wanted to track and stuff among other things [17:08:45] TrevorParscal: Can you either tell me where you got the jQuery UI file in current trunk from or replace it with one that also includes the Tabs module? [17:09:51] ah, I got it from http://jqueryui.com/ - the "current (stable)" link [17:10:23] perhaps go here http://jqueryui.com/download [17:10:32] And that magically includes every module we needed before but not the ones I need now ^^ weird [17:10:38] and build a custom distro with everything except effects [17:10:43] Yeah I found that already [17:10:54] awesome [17:10:59] But in the .zip file in generates I can only find minified combined, not regular combined [17:11:07] *RoanKattouw looks whether the one in trunk is minified [17:11:34] Hmm it's not [17:11:45] Oh wait found it [17:12:14] js/ui/jquery-ui-1.7.2.custom.js [17:12:33] i meant - development-bundle/ui/jquery-ui-1.7.2.custom [17:12:35] etc [17:12:49] Yeah [17:13:03] The one you bundled had all kinds of effects crap, was 299K, this one's 103K [17:13:11] right on [17:13:22] yeah, this will be much better for sure! [17:13:24] Customized to only include what we need, which is Dialog, Tabs, Draggable and Resizable [17:13:35] cool [17:13:45] we can always get more if we need i [17:13:47] *it [17:14:13] Hmm it seems it did have tabs, I'm just doing something wrong ^^ [17:14:53] Hmm maybe calling .tabs() on a hidden element doesn't work [17:16:29] Gah [17:16:31] $j( '#editoolbar-link-tabs' ).tabs(); [17:16:33] *headdesk* [17:17:05] he he he [17:17:12] I make that typo all the time :( [17:17:40] Hmm somehow automatic width isn't providing enough space, I'll set the width manually [17:17:55] Or it was height that was auto, whatever [17:18:35] Aah width defaults to 300px [17:31:50] TrevorParscal: Do you know of any way that I can autoresize the dialog so the tabs fit? I've got the width hardcoded at 550 px now which is enough for English (500 is just to little), but it'll probably break on German and stuff... [19:01:50] Board election results in @ http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/foundation-l/2009-August/053972.html [19:02:08] New board members: Ting Chen, Kat Walsh and Samuel Klein [19:02:42] Board election results in @ http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/foundation-l/2009-August/053972.html [19:02:43] New board members: Ting Chen, Kat Walsh and Samuel Klein [19:03:16] RoanKattouw: yea [19:03:16] RoanKattouw: oh boy [19:03:23] oh dear... [19:03:31] What? [19:04:01] basically you say $(dialog).size( $(innerContent).size() ); [19:04:06] except size [19:04:11] is NOT the right method [19:04:18] you ahve to do [19:04:31] $(dialog).width( $(innerContent).width() ); [19:04:35] $(dialog). height( $(innerContent).height() ); [19:04:45] or whatever [19:05:04] when I say inner content... [19:05:21] you have to have a div that clips (shows scrollbars when it's contents don't fit [19:05:39] and a div inside that which does not clip (the innerContent of the dialog) [19:05:55] the innerContent will have the size you want to accomadate [19:06:17] you may also want to add 20px or so to all sides to avoid scrollbar recursion [19:06:21] which is when the scrollb [19:06:57] *scrollbar is there, making the area smaller, making the scrollbar there - but if the scrollbar were not there, the area would be big enough that no scrollbar would be there [19:07:04] this happens on IE allot [19:07:09] big surprise [19:09:34] TrevorParscal: OK I give up you do it :D [19:09:54] ha ha ha [19:10:08] Once I figure out how to solve the inconsistent line-ending error caused by my jquery-ui download somehow being marked as svn:executable and not eol-style=native [19:11:13] eww [19:11:31] Got it [19:11:42] Somehow copying the text to a textarea and back solves it xD [19:11:47] Gotta do that anyway to jsmin it [19:12:02] My Windows box doesn't have jsmin so I use http://fmarcia.info/jsmin/test.html [19:28:47] nkomura, parutron, TrevorParscal: First iteration of link generation dialog live on prototype, link in topic [19:29:03] woo hoo [19:29:09] you are plowing away, RoanKattouw [19:29:16] http://svn.wikimedia.org/viewvc/mediawiki/trunk/extensions/BoardVote/voterList.php?view=markup [19:31:44] wfTimestamp( TS_MW, time() ) [19:32:33] What [19:32:38] wfTimestamp() anyone? [19:33:06] TrevorParscal: Ctrl+F for "time" fails in that URL [19:34:10] ?? [19:34:14] really [19:34:20] that code was for nimish btw [19:34:43] Oh OK [19:34:57] Anyway the second parameter of wfTimestamp() defaults to the current time [19:35:02] And the type defaults to TS_MW [19:35:09] So just use wfTimestamp() [19:36:06] TrevorParscal: ok are we meeting you guys for lunch yes/no [19:36:26] me yes.. [19:36:36] other people... not so sure [19:36:56] do you have plans? place? time? [19:37:01] I'm ready now [19:37:07] let's just go meet at the corner and see what happens :) [19:38:29] hrm, on the en-wp prototype, I'm an admin still, it says "edit" on the Main Page, but when I click it it goes to view source [19:38:51] oh, no, it's just red :P [19:42:39] RoanKattouw, just tried internal link, and worked nicely! [19:45:10] external links are working nicely too [19:46:35] nkomura: Aye. I still need the AJAXy check-if-page-exists-and-show-red-or-green widget for internal links, and need to escape the input [19:46:41] Try typing foo]] as link text :P [19:47:14] we can consider pre-filling http:// [19:47:18] That should add [[destination|foo]]]] , need to get those nowikis done [19:47:23] Yes, we should [19:47:26] i think parutron suggested [19:47:30] And we should pre-fill selected text if any [19:47:31] in her mocks [19:47:43] for internal or external or both? [19:48:00] Three out of four boxes, all except external link URL [19:48:23] Also, if both boxes are empty and people start typing a link destination, the link text needs to automatically copy that [19:48:43] Even better, as long as they haven't changed anything in the link text box it needs to mirror the destination box [19:48:44] wikia has a nice extension called link suggest [19:48:58] Ah yes [19:48:59] we initially wanted to use that, as they agree to make MW extension [19:49:09] will need to check in with their status [19:49:56] If nothing's set in stone with them yet I prefer writing something up myself [19:50:06] Stealing the search suggestions script and tweaking it a bit should do it [19:51:22] as long we acknowledge the usage of their script, it should be ok [19:51:43] I'm talking about our own search suggestions script here (MediaWiki's) [19:51:49] The one we're using in the search box already [19:51:56] ah [19:52:28] but if wikia has it working already, why do we want to reinvent? [19:52:41] True [19:52:46] Provided their code isn't insane [19:53:28] do you want me to look up the code location? [19:53:39] they provided on our wiki already [19:53:55] Yes please [19:58:30] https://svn.wikia-code.com/wikia/trunk/extensions/wikia/LinkSuggest/ [19:59:10] the last time i met inez in the spring, he was talking about changing javascript library from yui to jquery [19:59:24] i don't know if it had happened or not [20:00:44] here's the link of extensions we evaluated which are relevant to the usability project [20:00:46] http://usability.wikimedia.org/wiki/Environment_Survey/MediaWiki_Extensions/Nomination [20:06:38] No it's still using Yahoo stuff [20:10:09] Sidenote, http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:EditWarning might be good to adapt into Vector, prehaps? [20:11:27] MC8: interesting [20:11:38] bookmarking... [20:12:03] nkomura: That's one of the things we wrote ;) [20:12:21] Wait it's not [20:12:34] By complete accident I wrote an extension by the same name [20:12:35] no the one MC8 is pointing is about edit conflict [20:12:39] Yeah [20:12:44] not for leaving the page without saving [20:12:51] it is worth looking into [20:13:09] Yes [20:13:55] We're definitely not incorporating that into the skin itself though, it'd remain an extension [20:15:40] I saw a nicer looking one somewhere else, I'm going hunting :) [20:43:29] http://svn.wikimedia.org/doc/classUser.html [20:44:14] ? [20:44:40] Or is that for nimish? [20:44:57] yeah, that's for me =) [20:45:02] Sorry, gotta get used to the luxury of having a third developer :P [20:47:17] $wgUser->getEditCount(); [20:47:27] indeed [20:55:04] those docs are way out of date :D [20:55:09] I've got mwref.werdn.us [20:55:12] which is slightly more up to date [20:55:21] actually I think they're up to date [20:55:26] just nobody documents in that format anymore [20:55:32] the general solution is "read the code" :D [20:55:57] werdna: They're regenerated daily, they're up-to-date [20:56:07] As far as the code comments are of course [21:00:45] RoanKattouw: I sent you feedback I've collected [21:01:15] Yeah I got it [21:01:18] Replied too [21:01:30] Basically just mentioned which ones we already knew about, for referenec [21:14:42] TrevorParscal: For detecting when a text field changes I wanna listen on keypress and paste, anything else? [22:30:45] hehe, email is full of "How to slim down: Use Acai" spam [22:31:34] haha [22:33:27] Niftyness: catrope * r54899 /trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/ (6 files in 4 dirs): EditToolbar: Add escaping, pre-filling (http:// for URL field, selection for others) and smart link between internal link target and internal link text [22:38:18] parutron: http://prototype.wikimedia.org/en-wp/index.php?title=New_England&action=edit --> click link icon in toolbar [22:39:52] steve is manning my machine now [22:39:56] be back soon [22:41:50] hi parutron [22:42:06] hi andrew! [22:42:13] busy fixing up my machine with steve now [22:42:15] be back soon [22:42:17] have fun :P [22:47:59] RoanKattouw: I like :) [23:05:36] brion: We should talk about LocalisationUpdate tomorrow if you have time [23:08:04] that'd be spiffy [23:08:39] Gerard and Tom M are getting kinda impatient [23:08:53] Tom M says he'll be busy starting next week, so he wants to get it over with this week if possible [23:09:20] And it'd be awesome if someone could demo it in a lightning talk on Wikimedia [23:09:28] Or mention it in a presentation on i18n or whatever [23:12:49] try/leave beta should probably be tighter connected with skin change. i opted in, thus got vector and new edit toolbar and then in special:preferences i turned skin back to monobook, but still have new toolbar. couple people gave me similar feedback about being a bit confused by such behavior. [23:13:03] and hello everybody by the way ;-) [23:13:30] howdy [23:13:44] yeah, any proposal on how to make them more connected? [23:15:10] idk if there is any hook on skin change which may help? [23:15:22] or on preferences submit or so [23:16:22] hook on preferences save would be useful anyway [23:22:00] TrevorParscal: dude you have got to try the 'page speed activity' tab w/ google page speed [23:22:00] Danny_B: You opted in using the opt in link, then opted out using a different way, and you expect consistent behavior while taking inconsistent actions? [23:22:13] it'll record the net activity etc over multiple pages, not just for page load [23:22:15] ROCKS [23:22:24] TrevorParscal: parutron: http://prototype.wikimedia.org/en-wp/index.php?title=New_England&action=edit --> click link icon in toolbar [23:22:29] Link CGD ---^^ [23:22:49] love it! [23:22:57] RoanKattouw: tell it to dummies... [23:23:17] the content in these dialogs has much larger text [23:23:19] Danny_B: Dummies don't know about the preferences and use the "Leave Beta" link we explicitly tell them exists on the "Welcome to Beta" page, was the idea [23:23:25] we need to do something about that... [23:23:42] Modify or override CSS rules in the jQuery UI skin [23:24:16] something [23:24:19] RoanKattouw: i'm forwarding the feedback. you're free to throw it away if you don't think it's useful [23:24:22] It needs some attention [23:24:24] but seriously [23:24:28] this is awesome [23:24:48] your front end skills are rocking my socks off [23:24:51] etc. [23:25:06] Danny_B: Sure, we're not shooting the messenger :) but I feel we're being pretty explicit as it is [23:25:22] brion: do you know YSlow? [23:25:43] *TrevorParscal uses it [23:25:54] Page Speed is a YSlow-like thing [23:25:56] we know [23:26:08] TrevorParscal: My front end skills are all jQuery UI's work ;) anyway it also does nifty things like prefilling with selection or http:// , and smart mirroring between the textboxes on the internal link tab [23:26:23] And TBH I just used parutron 's design verbatim [23:26:24] i noticed [23:26:30] and it takes the selection if there is any [23:26:33] I love that [23:26:38] sweetness [23:26:42] And it escapes evilness like ]] in links as best as it can [23:26:51] the text is rather big [23:26:57] nimish_g: a nice quickie for you: https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17777 :) [23:27:02] maybe we can go even grayer/darker [23:27:05] we need to add some open search stuff to this too [23:27:05] It doesn't do anything with internal link titles containing | or ]] though; it should probably choke on invalid titles in general [23:27:07] Danny_B: google page speed kicks yslow's ass [23:27:08] for the background [23:27:13] to verify a page exists and suggest pages as you type [23:27:17] Yes [23:27:21] The former I'm gonna do tomorrow [23:27:31] And Parul prototyped that as a checkbox / red cross [23:27:59] forget how i had it, but might be nice if the text labels came before the entry boxes [23:28:07] like this, it's a lot of vertical action [23:28:09] Yeah [23:28:19] parutron: I'll be annoying you about LiquidThreads again soon [23:28:20] *RoanKattouw puts all that look-and-feel stuff on Trevor's plate ;) [23:28:24] but these seem like visual tweaks [23:28:26] I've been rewriting some icky internal stuff [23:28:34] hey werdna [23:28:40] ahhh cool [23:28:44] RoanKattouw: yes, focus on function [23:28:51] I will make things look pretty later [23:28:57] warning: tomorrow i will be busy helping naoko with some wikimania stuff [23:29:05] And Naoko asked about the title suggestion stuff and said something about using Wikia's LinkSuggest, but I'm more in favor of adapting the existing search suggestions for the search bar, should be trivial, just a different API query [23:29:11] yeah functionality seems on it's way [23:29:20] can we do some type of link/article validation? [23:29:23] parutron: Ah so you are gonna put your stamp on it even though you're not there, good :) [23:29:32] parutron: Absolutely, coming tomorrow [23:29:37] YAY [23:29:42] roankattouw is the best [23:29:48] It's 1:30 again as usual so I'm idling and putting off going to bed :) [23:29:58] :D [23:30:00] haha. i hope you at least sleep in late [23:30:16] No, I get up at 9. Not because I have to, but to ensure I get enough sleep [23:30:18] brion: i did not say anything about comparation nor i was suggesting it, on the contrary i actually was wondering about some comparation from you since i am not familiar with that google's tool [23:30:30] well get thee to bed! [23:30:42] enough sleep = 7 hours! [23:30:45] Because the way I work now I sit all day, and after a few days of that I'll lie awake in bed till 5:30 (that happened a few days ago) [23:31:18] *RoanKattouw needs activity to feel alive, fortunately school starts in a few weeks [23:31:34] Physical activity that is [23:31:56] parutron: sounds fun. are you going? [23:32:33] *werdna toys with skyscanner for a bit [23:32:39] going to what?? [23:32:53] Danny_B: :D [23:33:08] well, i highly recommend google page speed ;) it's broadly similar to yslow! but has some nice improvements [23:33:24] Yay @ https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17647#c5 [23:33:33] parutron: Wikimania [23:33:38] some additional checks, as well as just plain spiffy things -- it tests all your js/css and images for minification and lossless recompression, for instance, showing you exactly how much you could save [23:33:47] i'm not - i will be getting married instead [23:34:02] gettin' married's nice too :) [23:34:18] parutron: ooh, congratulations! [23:34:22] tee hee. [23:34:28] thank you! [23:34:29] Trevor's having a baby instead [23:34:45] i heard all about brion's experience and wanted to copy. [23:34:50] i know - so soon! [23:35:00] werdna: well he's already married, so he had to find something else to do ;) [23:35:03] we will be celebrating many things here come september [23:35:07] haha [23:35:13] parutron: Perhaps you will not arrange your honeymoon around anime conventions :P [23:35:16] parutron: way less trouble to just head down to city hall like we did ;) [23:35:17] i think a lot of married people choose that! [23:35:20] *werdna gently jabs at parutron [23:35:24] erm, at brion [23:35:33] if only i had know brion!!! [23:35:34] haha [23:35:40] hey werdna it was a science fiction convention, not anime! [23:36:00] science fiction conventions, maybe. surfing weather --> definitely. [23:36:02] fun fact: According to the internet, the cheapest tickets I could book to the US would be 100 USD each way, and would be to New Orleans via North Carolina, February-March next year. [23:36:06] and we also hit a fleetwood mac concert ;) [23:36:12] O_O [23:36:13] brion: that's okay then :P [23:36:31] science fiction conventions seems even better than anime conventions [23:36:32] is this on ryanair "we can't afford seats on our planes so just sit on the floor"? [23:36:43] werdna: :O Holy shit that's like EUR 70, then another EUR 50 for the train and I'd be in New Orleans [23:36:46] brion: it's US airways [23:36:59] freaky [23:37:01] also on ryan air: "pay your flight by gambling on our planes" [23:37:14] parutron: haha, yeah [23:37:16] i can't fly from here to los angeles for a hundred bucks [23:37:16] those are fun [23:37:23] http://www.skyscanner.net [23:37:32] brion: In a few years you'll be able to take the train for less than that though [23:37:34] brion: really? I booked LAX-SFO for $88 a week in advance [23:37:49] werdna: one-way, sometimes, maybe :) [23:37:51] werdna: Any cheap flights from London to SFO? [23:38:02] *brion tends to take round trip flights though ;) [23:38:07] parutron: Yeah, the British like gambling [23:38:23] skyscanner.net has this great feature where you can give "Entire year" as your dates, and entire countries or the whole world as your departure and destinations [23:38:28] those debaucherous brits! [23:38:50] that's how Lauren and I found our trip to Italy, we entered "United Kingdom", added the dates, and left the destination field blank [23:39:23] and it said "UK from $X, France from $Y, Italy from $Z" and so on until Japan (which was in the region of 1000 GBP each) [23:39:37] brilliant website [23:39:49] parutron: they charged us 5 pounds for 50 mL of pepsi [23:39:59] like.. an ounce or two I guess [23:41:27] What 50 mL [23:41:35] That's like 1/4 of a glass [23:41:39] yeah [23:41:43] it was totally hilarious [23:44:31] oh my gosh! [23:44:46] I'm thinking of writing something in my spare time quite similar to SkyScanner, the idea being you plug in timetables for all kinds of transport (from MUNI and london underground to amtrak and flights) and it tells you the best way to get from one address to another [23:45:06] optimised by cost, time, whatever [23:45:40] haha in all of your free time - what time is it there? [23:46:18] nearly 1am [23:46:52] Lauren's already asleep, having got up at 6. I'm not there yet, got up at 9 [23:48:25] RoanKattouw: in November (month randonly chosen a few months out), I can get Gatwick-SFO for 176 going over (stopover in Charlotte, NC), and SFO-Heathrow for 176 coming back (stopover in philadelphia) [23:48:37] werdna: 176 what? [23:48:40] total cost is 353 GBP [23:48:44] so I guess 400 EUR [23:48:44] Ah GBP [23:48:59] Hm KLM direct flight from AMS is like 560 EUR [23:49:06] http://www.skyscanner.net/flights/lond/sfo/november-2009/november-2009/cheapest-flights-per-month-to-san-francisco-international-from-london-in-november-2009.html [23:49:17] Return tickets to London are another 99 [23:49:18] it'd cost the extra 160 EUR to get to London, I think [23:49:24] 99 [23:49:30] ah [23:49:36] what's that, Eurostar + ICE? [23:49:44] wait, ICE is DB [23:49:52] Thalys? [23:50:04] No, Eurostar + "IC Brussels" [23:50:09] The cheap-ass alternative to Thalys [23:50:11] ah [23:50:23] and that takes you AMS-Brussels and you take eurostar from there [23:50:24] I see [23:50:36] Domestic train from my place to Rotterdam C, then IC to Brussels, then Eurostar [23:51:12] Then you'd have to take a train to Gatwick. [23:51:17] Yeah [23:51:22] Oh that's outside of London [23:51:24] That's another 15 EUR or so if you take the cheaper option [23:51:28] Gatwick is well out of london [23:51:31] Hm [23:52:00] Maybe I should get a Railplus card, only EUR 15 for me and 25% off on all international trains in Europe (except Thalys and Eurostar *sigh* ) [23:52:16] Oh wait London - Gatwick is not international:P [23:52:23] You'd take Victoria Line from Kings Cross (where eurostar arrives) to Victoria, and then either Gatwick Express or ordinary Southeastern/First Capital Connect service. [23:52:37] actually I think First Capital Connect stops at Kings Cross [23:52:45] Isn't Gatwick in the Northeast? Then why go to Victoria [23:53:11] Gatwick is South of London [23:53:13] Oh [23:53:20] Oh is that the one near Crawley? [23:53:31] On M23 [23:53:39] no idea [23:53:41] I drove past there once [23:54:02] apparently yes, you can take First Capital Connect from St. Pancras to Gatwick. [23:54:33] nimish_g: thx :D [23:55:38] werdna: Hm anyway it's probably not gonna cut many costs and only add like 7 hrs of train time [23:55:43] RoanKattouw: yeah :P [23:55:55] brion: no worries. also, naoko suggested we meet at some point to discuss the click tracking stuff I'm making [23:56:01]