[00:20:04] brion, writes turn out not to return anything useful so I had to do a try/catch on an insert (on fail update), but it's updated on trunk now, r57040 [00:20:19] hmm [00:21:02] nimish_g: all you get is a true or false from the UPDATE query, but you can call $dbw->affectedRows() to get the modified row count [00:21:16] (this can give you 0 if your update had no actual affect, but fo ran increment that should be safe) [00:21:17] aaah [00:21:34] i just suspect we'll have more increments than first inserts, so it's probably a little more efficient to try update then insert :) [00:22:04] yeah, and not have it get as far as throwing an exception and then handling it [00:26:43] brion, ok, fixed and tested in trunk [00:29:57] super lemme take a peek [00:40:14] nimish_g: rather than turn it on right before i go home i'm gonna do that in the morning tomorrow :D [00:40:23] it's nice easy code though, will be ready to go :D [00:40:33] ok cool =) [12:07:03] Anyone in here using Internet Explorer 7 or 8? [17:06:14] hey guise [17:06:24] what happened to Naoko? [17:07:04] Probably gone to set up our 10 AM meeting [17:11:37] hey nkomura [17:11:45] nkomura: how do you feel about LiquidThreads tomorrow? :)) [17:12:12] we're sticking it on the test wiki tomorrow, and the strategy wiki once people have banged on it a bit [17:13:30] nkomura: I got a web cam, but I was stupid and bought one that doesn't like Ubunuty :( [17:13:39] hey werdna, let's chat later [17:13:43] i'm in the meeting [17:13:51] nkomura: sure [17:13:54] RoanKattouw: :D [18:02:04] nimish_g_: ok userdailycontribs seems to be working on test now :D [18:02:10] will enable generally in a few mins [18:02:31] cool =) [18:29:51] hey does parul come in today? [18:31:02] She's in the meeting right now [18:32:22] ah [18:32:31] stupid meeting :) -- when does it finish? [18:33:22] 33 mins ago [18:41:51] RoanKattouw: heh [19:05:13] werdna: OK meeting is over, I guess it's lunchtime now [19:06:53] hey parutron [19:06:56] I'm back [19:47:39] no trevor either :( [19:49:09] Dude it's lunchtime [19:49:16] Trevor /always/ eats out for lunch [19:50:14] I remember him saying Melissa refused to pack him lunch cause he'd eat it as a snack and go out for lunch anway [20:01:11] haha [20:01:33] hey we are back from lunch [20:01:40] hey nk :) [20:01:44] i should say mtg/lunch [20:01:59] nkomura: :) [20:02:06] and TrevorParscal [20:02:07] Welcome back guys [20:02:12] Checkout Special:Preferences on prototype [20:02:16] TrevorParscal: you have a few minutes to be harassed for interface ideas? [20:03:29] *nkomura looks prototype [20:03:43] what's different? [20:04:31] I grouped the usability prefs into an "Experimental features" section [20:04:40] in sandbox.1? [20:04:51] ... and it somehow didn't make it to prototype, wtf [20:05:27] i don't see anything either [20:05:52] werdna: i'm going to reboot, brb [20:05:57] nkomura: k [20:06:05] Gah I understand why [20:06:11] We have it globally enabled [20:08:20] Ah, there it is. Fixed [20:08:32] http://prototype.wikimedia.org/en.wikipedia.org/Special:Preferences --> Editing tab --> Bottom [20:11:45] nkomura: [20:11:47] Ah, there it is. Fixed [20:11:48] http://prototype.wikimedia.org/en.wikipedia.org/Special:Preferences --> Editing tab --> Bottom [20:12:17] hey [20:12:22] nkomura: so there are a few lingering issues with LQT, mostly either interface quirks or notification tweaks, but we're looking to do a test deployment pretty soon on testwiki [20:12:44] nkomura: do you want to be included in the test deployment [20:15:14] RoanKattouw: we see them now [20:15:23] Great [20:15:25] looks good, but we need to work on the text [20:15:43] *RoanKattouw <3 first-level functions: $j(this).data( 'replaceCallback' )( 'find' ); [20:15:45] trevor thought the help can be disabled [20:15:59] What help? In the toolbar? [20:16:13] yeah, the language could probably be more clear [20:16:31] Oh [20:16:33] Yeah [20:16:39] *RoanKattouw blames siebrand ^^ [20:16:47] werdna: we will be happy to stage LQT on our prototypes once upcoming release is shipped [20:16:50] Although he was right that "content generation dialogs" doesn't translate too well [20:17:14] we are staging babaco release for tomorrow [20:17:27] nkomura: ah, whoa [20:18:19] TrevorParscal: Is this ok? http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:Code/MediaWiki/56233 It's marked FIXME right now [20:20:34] so - they moved a hack for ff2 from the common rtl stuff into monobook's rtl stuff [20:20:36] werdna: how do old threads archived? [20:24:50] "Re-add the RTL lists workaround for Firefox bug to monobook/rtl.css, as common_rtl.css does not seem to be used in Monobook." [20:24:58] nkomura: they drop off the bottom of the page [20:25:09] is it a general fix or a monobook-specific fix? [20:25:16] ah - yes I see the comment... [20:25:18] nkomura I have started posting about Usability Initiative and localisations on the Wikipedias [20:25:25] nkomura: they're paged, like history pages [20:25:37] I noticed that for some languages this already had some success [20:25:44] looks sane - it might take me a while to test in ff2 though... [20:27:06] werdna: I mean archiving pre-LQT threads [20:27:24] nkomura: whatever existing architecture is in place [20:27:33] basically those will be displayed at the top of the page [20:27:37] and can be dealt with by the local wiki [20:28:00] GerardM-: great to hear that [20:28:32] of interest is that a company has been adding localisations for Singhalese for the UI [20:28:32] GerardM-: was there any language-specific feedback we should be paying attention immediately? [20:28:38] no [20:28:47] it is early days [20:29:07] I am at the end of the wikipedias starting with I [20:29:12] The company GerardM- is Calcey [20:29:12] we are working with an external QA firm whose staff in Sri Lanka [20:29:17] is talking about [20:29:18] yeah [20:29:22] Yeah they're the same company [20:29:37] it is great that they are contributing to localization as well [20:30:35] mangala, the head of the company, said the team is really excited to make Sinhala version up to date [20:31:02] but they are doing the translation as volunteer [20:32:27] werdna: it would be great if we can stage LQT on prototype and then deploy it to usability wiki as the next step so that we can observe archiving behavior with real threads [20:34:01] nkomura: it's already on a prototype [20:34:28] Some sandbox, right? [20:34:30] we call it sandbox ;) [20:35:02] prototype has more close-to-production development and data is populated [20:38:26] CIA-12> catrope * r57075 /trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/EditToolbar/ (4 files): EditToolbar: Per this morning's meeting, get rid of the "Replace all" checkbox and change the buttons from "Replace/Cancel" to "Find next/Replace next/Replace all/Cancel" [20:38:33] Now live on prototype [20:40:45] nkomura can I blog about that ? [20:41:02] about? [20:41:06] nkomura: ah I see [20:41:16] well just say the word when you want it on :) [20:41:43] TrevorParscal: you have some time? :) [20:41:47] werdna: will do, can't wait to start using LQT again [20:42:00] :)) [20:42:08] we had it enabled on the very first date when the usability wiki was created [20:42:09] LiquidThreads: Now with 350% more awesome [20:42:21] nkomura, TrevorParscal, parutron: The search&replace dialog now has four buttons; input and criticism welcome [20:42:22] nkomura: yes, but it sucked then [20:42:24] it is now awesome [20:42:36] :) [20:42:42] *TrevorParscal will give input in a min [20:56:57] ok [20:56:59] RoanKattouw: is there shade difference in buttons? First and the third one look one shade and the second and the fourth look another shade on my screen [20:57:10] now the $200 isn't on my head! [20:57:19] There shouldn't be [21:00:46] OK I'm off to bed, drop any input/criticism/suggestions/more tasks in my e-mail [21:04:44] TrevorParscal: next time $200 is on your head, grab it and spend it on food [21:05:09] TrevorParscal: does that mean you have a sec now? [21:05:18] i do [21:05:23] how's thing going? [21:07:21] TrevorParscal: it's going aaawesomely [21:07:24] hitting testwiki tomorrow [21:07:34] just wanted some feedback on a better design for this hideous page [21:07:36] http://bug-attachment.wikimedia.org/attachment.cgi?id=6552 [21:07:49] see https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20644 [21:09:01] ok [21:09:57] new messages should be indicated using a label somewhere like (#) - aka "Discussion (16)" [21:10:09] it's essentially an interface for showing recent unread discussions [21:10:21] it's bold when there are new messages [21:10:29] there is no (#) when there are none [21:10:37] interesting [21:10:45] I was just thinking an icon with a red number on it if appropriate [21:10:47] but that's a good idea [21:11:03] maybe we could not display it if there are none... [21:11:16] and there'd need to be a header on the watchlist if you have new messages. [21:12:18] also, do we have the ability to know which messages on the page are new? [21:12:47] might be interesting [21:13:09] a little button at the top of the page.. "Show new messages on this page" or so [21:13:14] because I would love to do this thing that wave does, which is that each message has a colored line on the left when it's new, and when you click on the message, the line fades away (ajax call happens to say "I read it!"( [21:13:27] then when scanning through you can see what's new [21:13:45] and then when reading, you can click anywhere on the message to mark it as read [21:13:59] there's another way to do it, which is how google voice does it [21:14:00] hmm [21:14:01] mebbbe [21:14:08] that's pretty performance-nasty though [21:14:25] oh [21:14:31] they changed over to wave style now.. [21:14:59] well, you can wait a few seconds before sending the request off if you want - hoping to group them together [21:15:03] roan gone? [21:15:07] bah [21:15:09] and you can also flush them before unload [21:15:13] i'm trying to figure out why he applied http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:Code/MediaWiki/56298 [21:15:14] Roan is asleep [21:15:23] since it doesn't look like it would have any effect on anything [21:15:37] hmm [21:16:12] don't know in particular [21:16:33] werdna: are we really going to have issues marking posts as read by users? [21:16:33] TrevorParscal: it's not just that, it's the mechanics of storing read/unread status for every message for every user [21:17:00] I'm assuming that we should store the read status, not the unread status [21:17:07] how do we currently know how many messages are unread if not marking read/unread for each message for each user? [21:17:10] I suppose it *could* be done, hmm [21:17:21] I'll stick a bug up at any rate [21:17:26] yeah, mark read status [21:17:37] hm actually it just looks like it'll break stuff [21:18:41] 21:18 < wikibugs> (NEW) LiquidThreads should store read/unread status for all messages for all users - https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20890 enhancement; Normal; MediaWiki extensions: LiquidThreads; (agarrett) [21:18:53] TrevorParscal: any thoughts on the design of the new messages page itself? [21:19:38] hmm - so you are saying there will be a listing of new messages for the person to read? [21:19:51] how does the system know if the user is interested in the message? [21:19:54] yes [21:20:01] TrevorParscal: if they're watching the thread [21:20:01] is it new messages in threads they have participated in? [21:20:05] ah [21:20:05] ok [21:20:06] or the talk page. [21:20:09] right [21:20:12] ugh this is a horrible interface [21:20:16] threads you participate in are automatically watched, too [21:20:23] well, they are watching the page, the talk page comes with it like it or not [21:20:35] so, you really need to have 2 lists [21:20:57] discussions about pages I'm watching, and discussions I'm a part of (not that language though) [21:21:11] both could be generated from existing data - yes? [21:21:36] in theory yes [21:22:55] we really need somewhere between 0.5em - 1em of padding on the left side of the posts [21:23:10] yes, you said you were going to submit a patch, so I haven't touched that [21:23:17] i need to do some CSS magic [21:23:18] if you don't think you'll get time, I can get around to that [21:23:25] sorry - don't worry about it I will poke at it [21:24:01] aaawesome [21:24:06] but feel free to get me to do it [21:24:11] I realise this isn't actually your job :D [21:24:25] you could add a

to the end of each post for starters [21:24:32] things like this floating image http://prototype.wikimedia.org/sandbox.3/Talk:Main_Page [21:24:36] would get fixed [21:26:23] TrevorParscal: filin' a bug [21:27:06] filed :) [21:29:24] you could add some space at these places -> http://img406.imageshack.us/img406/8735/picture1fmc.png [21:31:51] the RHS is dependent on screen resolution [21:31:56] or do you mean I should pad that thing? [21:33:06] there should be padding between the left edge (outline) of the message and the content of the message [21:33:09] it needs more padding [21:34:03] does the 'watch' just let you watch that particular thread? [21:35:00] werdna: see: http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/7620/picture2ce.png [21:35:07] look at my firebug thingy [21:35:16] nimish_g: yeah [21:35:18] that's the idea [21:35:37] TrevorParscal: what in particular am i looking at? [21:37:03] the extra attribute for the post wrapper [21:37:08] it's highlighted [21:37:21] bottom right [21:37:40] if you add that attribute, you will have the padding I'm talking about for the left side [21:38:06] also, we may want to bring the distance of the sub-post indent to 1.5em down from 2em [21:38:15] sorry [21:38:21] I should just edit the CSS myself [21:38:23] :) [21:39:43] *TrevorParscal wants to add "margin-left: 1em" to .lqt-thread-info-panel {} to solve right side padding issue [21:45:11] werdna: you coming to the all-staff? [21:45:52] TrevorParscal: I don't know. Maybe. [21:45:58] right on [21:46:16] I'm trying to setup some time when I can throw like 2 days at LQT and work directly with you [21:46:40] in person would be alot of fun, but it doesn't have to be in person of course [21:46:59] What is your schedule with LQT? [21:48:25] in person would be handy [21:48:30] well the plan is a test deployment tomorrow [21:48:36] provisionally, strategy wiki next week, but we'll see [21:49:18] oh [21:49:22] that fast? [21:49:23] wow [21:49:46] all of what I will be working with you on is aesthetic [21:49:50] so, that's fine [21:50:07] but I want to work with you on this stuff before any large scale deployment [21:51:00] well, as I say we'll see [21:51:08] right on [21:51:19] ok - keep me in the loop on deployment schedules for it if you can [21:51:27] ok, will do [21:51:29] I'm going to cut out some time for it as soon as I can [21:51:59] it's been worked on heaps in the last few months, ready to shake it down on some small sites to see how it goes [21:53:15] is anyone using http://prototype.wikimedia.org/sandbox.1/Main_Page [21:53:18] ? [21:56:37] adam_miller: as far as i can tell, sandbox 1 and 5 are free [21:56:52] http://usability.wikimedia.org/wiki/Sandbox [21:56:56] you can grab them [21:57:40] I'll take 5 then for staging UI related changes [21:58:47] cool, pls make sure to update the description so that other do not over-write accidentally [21:59:13] is there documentation on deploying? i'm in the dark on deploying to staging. [22:00:04] that'd be a question for TrevorParscal or Roan [22:02:27] TrevorParscal will talk to you in a minute [22:06:40] ok [22:07:05] adam_miller: we "deploy" via configuration [22:07:41] so, what happens is, when a feature you are adding can be made as an extension, then just make it as an extension and configure the sandbox to include the extension. [22:08:41] when the feature you are adding cannot be made as an extension, you need to add a global variable to includes/DefaultSettings.php and then use that variable to make the feature you are using be able to be turned on and off - then configure the sandbox to turn it on [22:10:20] all that for some image and css changes? [22:12:03] which route would you recommended for segregating new UI changes? [22:15:54] well, what are you changing? [22:16:10] css and images for the vector skin [22:16:11] did you see how I added a configuration for the watch/unwatch? [22:17:31] no i didnt - where can i find that? [22:17:49] look at the Vector.php file [22:18:36] http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:Code/MediaWiki/57030 [22:18:38] i see it in there, would I need to set $wgVectorUseIcon in DefaultSettings.php? [22:18:56] well, it's set to false in the default settings [22:19:08] to turn it on for your wiki, you set it to true in your LocalSettings.php [22:21:35] so, if you are just adjusting colors to meet the new palette, it's going to be a work in progress, and it's not a new feature [22:21:43] so just do it in head [22:22:04] it's really a judgement call [22:22:06] make sense? [22:22:32] going to staff meeting for 15min [22:22:37] be back in a bit [22:22:41] yeah seems overkill to break css and image changes out into a config feature, but the other stuff makes total sense now that im looking at it [22:23:03] are the staging instances using head? [22:32:30] I gotta head out for a while...dinner and things. I'll check back in later.