[01:03:59] wait [01:04:03] hii kocka [01:04:14] didn't know you joined miraheze [01:05:11] Apparently I joined it in 2018 but nobody told me about that [01:05:19] oh lol [01:57:29] oh great [01:57:35] time to not use it [01:57:42] my god is that thing awful [01:58:08] and why doesn’t it just support wikitext? why is the whole discussion/post thing a separate, unconnected system? [01:58:18] Oh no [02:17:00] I think people make the lack of wikitext support a much bigger issue than it actually is [02:18:38] During all the time I used Discussions I never once thought 'damn I wish I could run a DPL inside this post' [02:19:38] I mean [02:19:44] it’s more consistency if anything [02:20:08] when I am on a wiki powered by MediaWiki I expect to be able to input wikitext and end up with rich text [02:20:11] what if you want to comply by [[w:User:Tamzin/🤷#:~:text=One%20exception]] [02:20:11] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Tamzin/%f0%9f%a4%b7#:%7e:text%3dOne%2520exception [02:20:24] bleh, i tried to make that link work [02:20:51] https://enwp.org/User:Tamzin/🤷#:~:text=One%20exception [02:20:59] plus there’s no way to do rich text without all the button clicking [02:21:14] I know not everyone will agree, but I think MediaWiki's existent communication tools already suck [02:21:17] you have to type some text then highlight it then tap a button then paste in your UR, [02:21:33] like why not just… type in wikitext [02:21:39] i like how Extension:DiscussionTools works tbh [02:21:47] VE for those who want it, and wikitext for those who don't want it [02:22:06] DiscussionTools does make talk pages a lot more manageable [02:22:41] yeah [02:22:43] But the fact that they tried to make forum software outside of MediaWiki's restrictions still makes a lot of sense to me [02:22:46] that’s what I prefer [02:22:56] I mean fair [02:23:07] but also their implementation SUCKS [02:23:16] it’s just very clunky and [02:23:47] it doesn’t feel like you’re just walking forward while using it, more wading through a pool full of jello if that makes any sense [02:24:24] Their previous forum software really sucked when they were bound by what MediaWiki could do, even though it ended up a lot more manageable than Discussions because Discussions just... aren't feature complete [02:24:39] it’s one of those “clunky, uses far too much JavaScript for anyone’s own good” sorta things [02:24:44] https://archive.md/20250725205839/https://www.404media.co/women-dating-safety-app-tea-breached-users-ids-posted-to-4chan/ [02:24:46] bleh [02:25:15] can't wait for the first data leak coming from mandatory verification from the uk and aussie laws [02:25:54] Like, up until maybe 2018 or so you could edit other people's forum posts using the MediaWiki API, and after they restricted that somehow not even Fandom Staff could perform some very specific actions like moving Message Walls [02:26:20] [1/2] in the [wise words](https://youtu.be/jxi0ETwDvws) of Dylan Beattie: [02:26:20] [2/2] Now JavaScript’s not a bad language / Though it’s frequently misunderstood /Before you see what you can use it for / Please stop to think whether you should [02:28:36] yeah I mean [02:28:58] TBH that seems like a problem with how fandom coded their messaging system, not a problem with MW’s limitations [02:29:05] I think the problem is that [02:29:10] fandom just like sucks at coding stuff [02:29:46] With Discussions, they really just pushed a barely finished forum software implementation upon their entire network of users and gave us very few moderation tools or customization options [02:30:00] I think they would get more open source coding help if they [02:30:19] [1/2] 1: made all their stuff open source, and [02:30:20] [2/2] 2: stopped being a generally shitty company [02:30:36] Their MediaWiki codebase was open source until 2020, it didn't help them at all [02:30:46] > [26/07/2025 12:30] [2/2] 2: stopped being a generally shitty company [02:30:47] tall ask [02:30:51] see point 2 [02:31:24] I opened about 30 pull requests over there and half got closed because they really just didn't account for any volunteer development [02:31:48] The voldev program was dead since about 2013 or 2014 [02:32:12] why improve a horrible company’s awful codebase for free that doesn’t even accept your pulls when you could just work on some other open source thing that doesn’t suck and values your contributions and you as a contributor [02:32:24] Well, yeah [02:32:24] seems pretty straightforward why they got no help [02:32:56] Which is why open source really isn't a cure for their problems [02:33:05] [1/2] speaking of awful code [02:33:05] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/615786602454581249/1398493297818730606/IMG_8110.png?ex=68858fe0&is=68843e60&hm=c3ff6675d12a286df527f7c1ffa416b62dc68bb86ef8dd28a16cbe1fd08df567& [02:33:37] the mastodon app on tablet has been extraordinarily broken since they removed the two column layout [02:34:03] and now the discord app isn’t letting me tap and hold to reply to this [02:34:16] speak of the devil, and they shall appear [02:34:25] anyways [02:34:48] to be fair I was replying to one of those “AP shenanigans” posts that made the reply list contain the whole bee movie [02:34:50] but still [02:35:00] no excuse for it to do… that [02:35:28] you called? [02:36:44] https://tonsky.me/blog/gaslight-driven-development/ [03:23:54] i wonder if the mediawiki [mirage](https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Skin:Mirage) skin is good [03:27:18] and if any miraheze wikis use it [03:27:35] So many floating HTML elements. Also doesn't play nice when you have many menus in your sidebar. [03:28:11] so is it bad? [03:28:21] Used to have it turned on in our wiki and personally I liked it better than Cosmos, but eventually we turned it off to limit our skins to 4 [03:28:32] It's ok [03:29:38] In terms of which skin doesn't take much time to start up / which skin looks good without much configuring, you can ca me the world's biggest Medik fan [03:30:18] So should I use it? [03:30:26] it kinda looks nice imo [03:30:53] It also has a dark mode [03:31:16] I think you should try it for yourself. It's not like it's a skin that breaks apart along the seams or anything, but it is also a rlly old skin [03:31:20] `$wgMirageRightRailVisibleToAnonByDefault` which removes the right rail to non-logged out users [03:31:29] isn't vector legacy also old [03:31:33] and lots of wikis still use it [03:32:06] if it isn't flagged with a "unstable", it's good enough for me [03:32:20] Oh, Mirage doesn't have a built-in dark mode, what you're looking at is another extension called [[mw:Extension:DarkMode]] [03:32:20] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:DarkMode [03:32:21]

[03:32:34] Lots of editors have a vendetta against Extension:DarkMode [03:32:53] [1/2] thought it did? [03:32:53] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/615786602454581249/1398508346289422457/image.png?ex=68859de4&is=68844c64&hm=01f67b7a69bde613d31e9aa7b9e97eceaddbc6db0e9be33a8d0f811149aec948& [03:33:20] One man's "legacy" is another man's "robust" [03:34:13] (what's robust) [03:34:50] So I've never experimented with this, but I think it may mean that Mirage can support DarkMode (but you have to provide the CSS file for said dark mode), and prolly Mirage can only load one theme at a time (the user can't switch between themes) [03:35:36] [1/2] "$wgMirageTheme [03:35:36] [2/2] This setting controls the default theme of Mirage, when the Theme extension isn't installed. Currently, Mirage supports the neutral and darkmirage themes." [03:35:46] At least when we turned it on in our wiki there was no built-in Mirage Dark mode (except for Extension:DarkMode) [03:36:07] When did you turn it on? [03:36:46] Yeah if you have to set $wgMirageTheme then you prolly can't toggle between themes like you do with Citizen [03:37:10] Just like how it used to be in fandom [03:37:12] I think [03:37:24] It was back when we were just migrating / building our wiki so we were experimenting with the wiki look [03:37:34] When did you guys migrate? [03:37:53] Pretty recent, was just last April [03:38:36] Oh [03:38:59] I wish there was a way to check what wikis use a skin [03:39:48] You can, but you have to open DevTools [03:40:23] special:preferences if logged in should also tell you [03:40:52] Lol why did I forget about preferences [03:41:10] there's also special:managewiki/settings -> $wgDefaultSkin i suppose [03:49:15] I mean it just [03:49:19] doesn’t work right [03:49:34] the extension is bad [03:49:58] not like “first second generation blizzard employee” bad but bad nonetheless [03:56:55] [1/2] PetraMagna digged up info on which skins are more likely to be used as a default skin on a wiki here: [03:56:56] [2/2] https://meta.miraheze.org/wiki/User:PetraMagnaBot/default_skins.json [04:17:59] Oh that's cool [04:18:11] I want to see the wikis using it though [04:18:18] Like, how they look [05:05:54] never saw anyone use wikiforge [05:13:42] That only works with the theme extension. You can install it and give it a try. [05:18:40] [1/2] It doesn't look too bad [on a test page](https://exttest.mirabeta.org/wiki/Theme?useskin=mirage&usetheme=darkmirage). Obviously you'd need to fix all the broken CSS, but at least there's something to get you started with. [05:18:40] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/615786602454581249/1398534967109357618/image.png?ex=6885b6af&is=6884652f&hm=3a44d61035ff4df8667271df44828cfb744cc20010cf5f61771d7e26fa11b226& [05:20:28] hmm [05:20:45] I wonder if I should use Cosmos instead, they both look nice skins [05:22:10] Wish the pages of both Cosmos and Mirage told us their pros and cons [05:22:17] Would love to see someone review theme and themetoggle, though. AFAIK they do similar things. Theme has a few stylesheets out of the box to reduce the workload for a few skins, but themetoggle doesn't, and I'm not sure if there's anything else worth mentioning. Themetoggle is maintained by wiki.gg and might receive more maintenance and fixes. [05:30:50] I think Cosmos' biggest advantage is the fact that many more wikis use it, so it receives more fixes and is more likely to remain usable in the future. In particular, Miraheze volunteers frequently push patches to the skin, so you are much more likely to see problems fixed if one arises on your wiki. [05:42:41] True... I guess I'm gonna have to go with Cosmos instead, since I'm not really sure if Mirage gets updates often [06:07:13] [1/2] Every time I see this I'm reminded of [[w:Orangestar]], whose favorite voice bank is IA. [06:07:13] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orangestar [06:07:13] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/615786602454581249/1398547187163725824/image.png?ex=6885c211&is=68847091&hm=fe4112e44123be80cb8db83b0b7d67788bf7bf86e8cbb0f08287e54faaf8324a& [06:07:14]

[06:08:07] I also wrote that Wikipedia article, though when I look at it now, the quality of the writing is pretty bad. [06:12:22] https://mastodon.social/@GroupNebula563/114918049115737434 [06:12:27] I’m funny on the internet [07:05:47] who put orangestar on the internet archive [07:06:18] anyone knows working twitter posts or just images scrapper that is not on fucking phyton [07:06:45] working twitter posts? [07:06:56] oh, (posts or images) scraper [07:07:10] i _guess_ there's nitter, but you need an account to host it yourself [07:07:47] ok nvm it's too late [07:08:13] all posts deleted? i don't understand [07:08:19] ? [07:08:22] huh, weird [07:08:40] nitter is junky, working once in a while [07:08:56] i already had a hard time looking for specific tweets [07:09:28] el*n musk trying to make the experience of using twitter as miserable as possible [07:11:38] well yeah i realized that my fave artist who only had twitter might nuke it before moving to bsky, and ofc bsky will miss all older arts [07:11:57] ouch... [07:12:12] nitter says no posts, logged out x says no posts [07:12:14] idk [07:12:29] my scraper of choice is gallery-dl, but 1) it's python, and 2) i don't have an account to use it with, so i can't list posts [07:12:32] looking for links i posted on discord now lol [07:14:07] https://wiki.archiveteam.org/index.php/twitter#Workarounds [07:17:01] (kinda curious what the account is) [07:52:41] https://mastodon.social/@simple_sabotage/114891249010895673 [10:20:36] Hello folks. [10:21:11] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/615786602454581249/1398611098038698024/FB_IMG_1744146787612.jpg?ex=6885fd96&is=6884ac16&hm=c3247099e45f04089b3325d74597810e98bd90a1a796f077700b8cec0f7849b9& [11:29:14] I don’t really think thats MediaWikis fault [11:29:27] Fandom devs are just really bad [11:31:49] My point is, it carries assumptions that just don't hold for regular forum software [11:33:28] So just starting anew and integrating with MediaWiki isn't inherently a bad idea [11:34:03] It probably makes a lot more sense in any case to support a subsection of html and implement it themselves [11:34:18] Rather than calling out to the parser for every single message wall/feed post [13:24:29] [1/2] Think God Mirahaze is now in the USA, right? [13:24:29] [2/2] At least... I hope it is, now lol [13:31:00] The legal entity behind Miraheze is in the USA, yes [13:31:28] Not that it matters because they're deciding to follow UK law for some reason? [13:31:37] [1/3] Question: What about Wikis with +18 content? [13:31:37] [2/3] I previously asked about what to do with that content, and every time, I was told that "hiding it under a navbar is enough". [13:31:37] [3/3] Well... is that still enough, now that this bullshit law is in effect? [13:31:49] Personally I'd have liked to see the Board put up a fight but apparently they're not up for that [13:32:06] Or should I start backing up all of my Wiki and start looking for an alternative? [13:32:51] I'd say wait until there's an official announcement, Cosmic said there'd be one [13:32:55] (By "navbar", I mean, a collapsible bar) [13:33:01] let's see what they say [13:34:15] Alright. Just in case, I'm making a dump of my Wiki and uploading it to archive.org. [13:34:27] always a good idea to have backups yeah [13:34:59] but anyway until they say something it's business as usual, just without the ability to send emails I guess [13:39:19] And suddenly, I got logged out of my Wiki and can't log back in. [13:40:16] "No active login attempt is in progress for your session." [13:43:06] [1/2] an example of uk based platform forced to have verification for all users is sheezy.art [13:43:07] [2/2] hopefully, this shit gets reverted [13:43:50] Nvm, fixed it [13:43:53] hopefully, but I doubt the bill itself will be reversed [13:44:21] I think the best we can hope is that at least entities not in the UK will stop giving a shit about these laws [13:44:39] Same here.... but my country is in the EU, and we have a similar bullshit law. [13:44:39] DSA. [13:44:43] Digital Safety Act. [13:45:03] The law is probably in effect for all platform providing service in the country [13:45:07] This is just my personal opinion, but think about it: The UK, excluding London is extremely poor, they're not in the EU, all that keeps the US and UK together is their "special relationship" [13:45:16] surely they won't come for everyone if we all break the law :3 [13:45:38] China has similar laws, and we don't give a shit [13:45:55] pornhub solution - block uk ips instead of adding verification [13:46:12] Uhm.... https://discord.com/channels/407504499280707585/1318961150230139012/1318965440722112575 [13:46:14] the based solution 😎 [13:46:39] well i might not give a shit, ive been hopping on vpns for 4 years now but [13:46:51] yeah, average people will get tired [13:46:56] Not to get political, but didn't some Bri'ish police chief threaten to demand the extradition of American internet trolls during the British "far-right" protests? lol [13:46:57] and drop the platform simply [13:47:05] ive been seeing this all in real time [13:47:09] yeah I remember that, I was against us just complying without putting up any fight, I still am [13:47:16] now 90% of russians are on fucking telegram [13:47:33]