[00:53:30] [1/2] Damn I am a moron for not thinking that screensavers were... literal screen, savers. [00:53:31] [2/2] -# It's to prevent screen burning. [00:53:50] Now I see why 3D Pipes were hypnotic. [01:04:40] I mean, they do save your screen, from the evils of burn in [01:10:23] They should call it something that saves screens... [07:15:03] Another major wiki forked: https://wiki.subnautica.com [07:34:07] Today is MONDAY in California [08:46:03] WG promised us several wikis and looks like this is the first one [08:46:52] subnautica 2 wiki can be another one [08:46:53] probably [08:47:03] in 2 days [08:47:12] but I wonder what the others will be 👀 [08:57:28] aren't they like...the same universe? [08:57:48] yeah [08:58:10] dunno if they will be separate wikis or not [08:58:25] but they did say the wiki for subnautica 2 will open in 2 days [08:58:27] They could do like Vampire Survivors ig [08:58:34] yeah [08:58:53] we have Vampire Survivors and Vampire Crawlers technically under one wiki [08:59:07] but they sorta appear as two different wikis [08:59:41] And sidebar and etc, they handled it really well [08:59:56] yeah [09:01:36] we have the Vampire Survivors sidebar navigation only visible in VS pages, and Crawlers navigation only in Crawlers namespace [09:02:27] and advertise the other wiki below the content navigation [09:04:44] do you know how this is done? [09:06:35] Good ol' CSS [09:06:45] [09:07:21] yup [09:10:08] ah okay thanks [09:10:24] That's a lot of CSS. [09:11:10] I think all of the WG wikis have a lot of CSS [09:11:18] https://wiki.subnautica.com/sn/MediaWiki:Common.css [09:11:37] and wiki.gg wikis as well [09:17:32] [1/2] I'm in the "make Common.css as short as possible without losing functionality" camp which is probably the minority here. [09:17:32] [2/2] It's kind of ironic that I've been helping with styling around here for a long time but I never bother to customize my local wikis. [09:17:51] ^^ [09:18:20] i try to keep common.css short, but looking at WG wikis it seems its long length is inevitable [09:18:44] @justleafy2003 would u happen to know why all js is in gadgets [09:19:01] i noticed it on rsw but not sure the reason [09:20:29] I keep everything in either gadgets or template styles on UT/DR, keeps the code modular and allows for conditional loading [09:22:16] conditional loading for performance is what i assume yea [09:22:41] cant go wrong mimicking a wg wiki 🙏 [09:22:49] Most of the SN gadgets are not conditionally loaded so I assume it's just for modularity [09:23:34] nvm 50% are lol I didn't scroll much [09:25:08] Imo most of Common.css can and should be split into TemplateStyles or, if they are loaded globally or require advanced CSS that TS doesn't like, gadgets. Splitting helps with maintainability. [09:45:03] I do that plus splitting site styles from skin styles (I don't need Citizen CSS if someday I switch to Vector) plus GitHub builds [09:45:53] WG wikis are still pretty fast, I guess it's CF magic [09:46:13] Yeah [09:46:32] They cache the page content on CF workers [09:46:48] oh btw Kocka I saw your pfp in the professional.wiki landing lol [09:46:53] We do that on UT/DR too [09:46:58] Lol what [09:47:16] https://www.pro.wiki/articles/mediawiki-and-bootstrap [09:47:22] Rubik jumpscare [09:47:41] Oh lmao [09:48:09] Last time I was checking professional.wiki it was throwing a 503 [09:48:36] Do you use that extension to purge CF cache when articles are edited? [09:48:57] I saw it mentioned somewhere [09:49:03] MultiPurge [09:49:10] I don't like opera nor the gx version of it [09:49:22] But also we use a CF worker to support multiple themes and limited width [09:49:48] [[github:utdrwiki/cache-worker]] [09:49:48] https://github.com/utdrwiki/cache-worker [09:49:49]

[09:50:09] Have I told you guys how much O hate vector 2022 [09:51:28] why would u need a cf worker for these? [09:51:47] It changes the classes based on cookies [09:52:07] light/dark mode? [09:52:21] Yeah [09:52:28] Light/dark/auto [09:52:34] And standard width/wide [09:52:43] achievable with just js and gadgets no? [09:52:57] If you want a flash of unstyled content [09:52:59] JS is render blocking, you could get a FOUC [09:53:00] yeah [09:54:50] oh r u making sure it doesnt flash for logged out users also [09:55:04] Yeah [09:55:17] Logged out users are the only users who get served the cached pages anyways [09:55:32] The worker just passes through if it sees a login cookie [10:01:50] we have a width toggle at deadlock.wiki, theres no flash on reload for logged in users, but there is for logged out [10:01:54] no CF workers [10:16:56] There's Extension:RenderBlocking, though it introduces an additional render-blocking resource to load. [12:13:57] regarding this, each subnautica game will have its own individual wiki apparently [12:15:01] I'm guessing that's why the article path is /sn/ [12:15:18] ah, interesting [12:20:48] philosophically speaking, would minecraft wiki be considered as 5 different wikis under a trenchcoat or one massive wiki? 🤔 [12:21:19] same with vampire survivors, hollow knight, deep rock galactic, and slay the spire. are each of them considered two wikis or one? 🤔 [12:22:19] I see no point to separate wikis unless they're completely different universes [12:22:35] I guess the singular term wiki is only a vague concept fenced by an administrative division which can sometimes be very arbitrary [12:24:06] a wiki can have multiple at times contrary or complimenting scopes but to make it make sense a single running installation should probably be the dividing line of a wiki and it only gets blurry when you have very distinct 'sub communities', and, I'd think importantly, people committed to organizing those communities [12:27:53] does fandom automatically links to their known forked wikis? [12:28:52] i just noticed a fandom has citation to our wiki and the link is wrapped by while other links on the page are not. ig editors won't bother to do this so maybe it's like some automatic process? [12:29:06] they globally phalanxed minecraft.wiki and balatrowiki.org [12:29:10] and render all wiki.gg links as text [12:29:28] our wiki is at miraheze.org [12:29:47] and it's rendered as text (source code with ) [12:30:00] weird [12:30:04] I don't think they do that tbh [12:30:32] okay [12:30:49] i don't think i have a place to test this bc they've desysopped me [12:31:19] What's the link so I can test myself? [12:31:34] https://dubdb.fandom.com/wiki/%E5%96%9C%E7%BE%8A%E7%BE%8A%E8%88%87%E7%81%B0%E5%A4%AA%E7%8B%BC_(Cantonese) [12:33:04] appears as a normal link to me [12:33:09] I've just edited it [12:33:13] lmfao [12:33:25] https://tenor.com/view/machoman-wrestling-gun-wwe-gif-5184546 [12:33:53] But yeah I had no issue, probably the editor glitched that time [12:34:32] could it possibly have to do with pasting links in VE? maybe? [12:34:58] i never realized it's that simple [12:35:48] i was thinking about the conspiracy theory at first 🤣 [12:35:54] Page history indicates they used source mode of the visual editor [12:36:28] I mean, it was flipping a coin. Either it was that simple or I got phalanxxed :kek: [12:36:42] that really makes sense. i've little knowledge about ve [12:37:11] [1/2] > could it possibly have to do with pasting links in VE? maybe? [12:37:11] [2/2] guess I was close [12:38:14] cuz I knew VE has problem with pasted content, especially if it may contain wikitext [12:38:52] Yeah happened to me the few times I used VE [12:39:24] If it thinks you're trying to paste text and not a link for whatever the reason it wraps it [12:39:48] Maybe they're using AI [12:39:51] i thought too ill of fandom [12:40:12] Well, I've seen worse there [12:41:59] they disabled our entire common.css 🤣 bc we used it to lead users to new location (it did work well for a few months before they found it) and it looks not good w/o css at all [12:42:00] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/615786602454581249/1503739017517203606/image.png?ex=6a047197&is=6a032017&hm=80e7add9fc4704d3183fc2b2847c5a593c2bc4d5fe6808f28510a7c189b4c08d& [12:42:08] (phalanxx) [12:42:42] i know nothing about fandom's abusefilter [12:42:49] That's crazy [12:44:04] just no reason, i still remember they don't allow us to create a page named `Paddi Joins the Team` but grammatically wrong `Paddi Join the Team` and disambiguated `Paddi Joins the Team (episode)` are both creatable [12:44:35] [1/2] the moment we moved to miraheze we did this [12:44:35] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/615786602454581249/1503739667735122010/image.png?ex=6a047232&is=6a0320b2&hm=2d918cdd273e8c4c57c988d4d894dbd96a9c0346a5b768b45f372b9604f8b5b5& [12:45:18] what are they cooking [12:46:58] [1/2] idk [12:46:59] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/615786602454581249/1503740269428740137/image.png?ex=6a0472c2&is=6a032142&hm=6ba74208f041e3739e973fec8172d9b0d998b257e2340aa630191fc663d439ff& [12:47:38] (screenshot from last year) [12:49:04] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/615786602454581249/1503740795809960106/image.png?ex=6a04733f&is=6a0321bf&hm=7246a7535a892eaccd042f1cbbf7e0edd9c7cb8b9709606c4ad2f2f8f0952c72& [12:51:21] good thing mc and balatro wikis now have redirects. mc.wiki and balatro.wiki, so you can now link to these proper wikis from fandom this way [12:51:23] https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/613386504898871316.webp?size=48 [12:52:55] mc.wiki must be a fortune per year [13:17:01] does wg publicly share their financials aside from the 2023 runescape post [13:37:01] im not familiar with CF workers at all, how do users edit the js and css associated with them? [13:37:26] can it only be adjusted server side? [13:41:06] Only users with access to the Cloudflare dashboard can deploy them [13:41:59] ah [13:42:01] quite the drawback [13:42:39] Generally we kept our worker as simple as possible because it's another layer to account for [13:43:00] WGL does some crazy stuff with them like inserting a recent changes module into page content [13:43:23] haha thats exactly what im asking for [13:43:55] deadlockwiki has one but its not in a CF worker so it flickers on reload [13:45:19] UT/DR has one too and we did some special caching on the API URL for fetching the recent changes activity but it still flickers for a bit [13:45:59] howcome youve not resolved the flicker? [13:46:14] I mean it's still a gadget [13:50:39] The only meaningful way I can think of to prevent flicker would be doing what WGL did, we just didn't want that kind of complexity [13:54:14] Haven't seen that widget but I guess the RSS feed could avoid that flicker? [13:54:40] complexity is my fear when implementing [13:55:21] especially with the trust needed for cloudflare dashboard access [13:58:06] Hmm what do you mean [14:13:37] have you explored using for it? (im unfamiliar with the extension so apologies if my question sounds stupid) [14:14:39] I mean it still has to make an HTTP request to fetch the recent changes [14:15:29] oh so its still gonna do it [14:15:58] I suppose it's going to be less noticeable but yeah [14:16:32] I think it's probably not worth fussing over it unless it's pushing your content [14:17:29] For us it's at the bottom of the sidebar so it's not that important [14:18:14] yea ours is in the middle so its a small bit of a layout shift for the sidebar [14:19:26] I could however think about implementing custom sidebar modules into our skin, so that users see some sort of loading state before it's populated with data [14:20:19] we did have this for ours previously, but i found itd just cause 2 flickers [14:20:31] youd get the very quick "loading" flicker then the content right after it [14:21:01] If the height depends on the contents then yeah you would [14:21:12] Something like https://something/w/api.php?hidebots=1&urlversion=1&days=7&limit=50&action=feedrecentchanges&feedformat=rss/rss? I don't know if it does the request client or server side though [14:21:16] For us the height only depends on the number of items which is almost always 4 [14:23:20] If it made the request server side then you'd have to effectively disable page caching to get the module to always display up to date information [14:25:54] Yeah it's server side and cached in memory [14:30:04] The thing is that in our setup there is page caching on Cloudflare going on if you want the render the module on the server and always display up to date information you'd have to purge all page caches whenever anything gets edited [14:30:17] ...or use CF workers to insert the module, like WGL do [14:30:44] btw kai your recent changes sidebar diff links are wrong [14:30:52] It should be I presume [14:33:48] i am not sure what u mean [14:34:24] oh the things r swapped [14:34:24] [1/2] These links [14:34:24] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/615786602454581249/1503767304041922590/image.png?ex=6a048bef&is=6a033a6f&hm=012ed89e39e9eb8f8b74ffce89deb62207565f75bce481c4d1a35c376ace5afe& [14:35:09] It says the edit is by LVL but links to the edit by the anon [14:35:18] Because the revision IDs are inverted in the URL [14:35:31] oh [14:35:33] thank you [14:35:35] ill forward [14:37:06] to view diff from the previous you only need one parameter [14:37:27] special:diff/ shows difference between and 's previous [23:56:34] [1/2] Thanks autocorrect [23:56:34] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/615786602454581249/1503908777961717900/Screenshot_20260512_185603_Docs.jpg?ex=6a050fb1&is=6a03be31&hm=05774ddd1b6e68062e077feb4e746b0b51e7b1bfe8601754eb68614a116edb5c& [23:58:26] I was just rambling on in a google doc about a random deltarune theory I came up with last night, and then I see that lmao