[00:00:38] We talked about that a few years ago, but then expanded it with Wiki Mechanics. My only comment would be, should we have one super technical mechanic global role (managewiki and and interface stuff), or should we split it into two roles? [00:03:42] I think a super role of that nature has been obsoleted especially by tech's foray into tasking appropriate restricted settings changes, and any function should strive to be of low sensitivity while still adding value [01:38:49] will the onboarding be like some onboarding documentation on the cvt wiki or....? [02:48:55] No reason to not keep it on meta [02:49:13] if anything lower chanceit will be lost and forgotten [03:07:20] figures [03:07:40] but anyway, its 11 in raidarr's timezone so he might be sleeping [03:30:45] pft, good one [03:31:09] I think NA and Rhinos may be the only people here who understand the term sleep schedule [03:32:07] i will admit-i have been known to be up at 12 am stalking irc and scrolling through the most obscure meta pages [03:33:59] Only 3AM, not bad, try to hold onto that [04:34:22] Don't Wikipedia at 3:00 AM. Worst mistake of my life. [07:18:48] I sometimes stay up til 2-5 am, but it's summer season so idrc [07:19:03] im still awake [07:19:38] bingeing TV shows? Nope, I'd binge watch Special:AbuseLog :sunglasses_emoji [07:58:08] The emoji didn't work [07:58:10] And go sleep please [07:58:33] Or I'll summon an NotArcham to turn you into an DND character [09:07:13] the major and relevant points of https://meta.miraheze.org/wiki/User:Raidarr/Volunteer_documentation/Patrolling, and a new practice recently discussed with peers (subject to alteration) of a 3 month cap on lower cvt blocks unless there is specific cause or authorization [09:08:31] what I kind of want to do all at once is a) onboarding summary message, b) polish up ^, c) institute a check-in practice every so often, and have d) build on that as a way for consistent review and feedback so we aren't leaving say @bosco9378wiki in the cold and I apologize for that [09:09:26] what is actually probably going to happen is I or reception close the rfps, someone gets out a) and that rides for the first little while [09:41:08] [1/2] should really keep an closer eye...on mh meta [09:41:08] [2/2] https://meta.miraheze.org/wiki/Requests_for_Comment/Approach_to_identity_verification_legislation [09:43:57] not a whole lot will change as a result of that I think [09:44:24] the big problem is ifwhen a major entity decides to really screw things beyond the mitigations we, with major review from NA, have already done [09:47:15] [1/2] this discussion has already been there for 2 weeks already... [09:47:15] [2/2] now i wonder what's the longest time a discussion has been opened for [09:48:53] @raidarr since tali left, this draft should be null, right? https://meta.miraheze.org/wiki/Requests_for_Comment/Future_of_Miraheze_Commons [09:49:02] as nobody will be working on this draft anymore [09:49:09] unless someone will take the mantle [09:49:38] no action required immediately but I would consider it dead, there are discussions to replace it [09:50:06] discussions can last quite a while depending on circumstance though sometimes it has just been very limited steward supervision [09:50:17] presently for example NA is quite busy and he has carried ops for a good while [09:51:06] yeah i also heard NA is losing sleep over the age verification bs that's been happening so steward availability is much lower [10:00:21] well I would figure its more work and everything on top of everything tbh [10:00:29] but it is a concern for all [11:33:10] this role is called technology team member [11:33:49] no, we will drive you out to the desert and give you a task to eliminate 15 vandals before they eliminate you [11:34:20] spoken like a true mirahezean [13:26:53] Awaiting kidnapping of 2 individuals to the CVT... [13:36:53] awaiting last minute inputs to proceed, I should not be lying this time by suggesting it will be done by my evening either way [13:38:39] [1/3] I do have an interesting matter to see what people make of it if they're interested as a practical field example: https://meta.miraheze.org/wiki/Steward_requests/Requests_for_reopening_wikis#simulationcountry.miraheze.org [13:38:40] [2/3] An understanding of chinese would be immensely helpful but really, part of the fun is how you'd approach it if you just don't, which is typically true of senior Miraheze volunteers at any given time. [13:38:40] [3/3] The trick for me is deducing what sort of discussion took place, which at least one administrator disputes besides the founder's local log entry suggesting a joint decision (if I translated correctly) [13:41:35] [1/2] Yeah "共同商议决定" means that a discussion took place and a joint decision was reached. [13:41:36] [2/2] > 更改了“simulationcountrywiki”的设置“closed, nsfw-primary” （共同商议决定。） [13:47:36] [1/2] on [[SR/D]] there are 7 archives but there's also archive 8 and 9 [13:47:36] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1225560610628964423/1528035512701554698/obraz.png?ex=6a5cd577&is=6a5b83f7&hm=d351d8a99735b5cc3e471e18ee6e0dbb5f048291fb24ce331cc7e8d4f4ce7e38& [13:47:37]

[13:47:37] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1225560610628964423/1528035520016285747/obraz.png?ex=6a5cd579&is=6a5b83f9&hm=981a2ee2c28b0f67358fbc9c342489efcee9a15221451b26e34660eb37193959& [13:48:14] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1225560610628964423/1528035672374382653/obraz.png?ex=6a5cd59d&is=6a5b841d&hm=d9fc0eaccc7dd8d0c398f5150b650d16f818be1837f4789e28027816171dc087& [13:51:57] The list is updated manually unfortunately. You are welcome to update the archive links yourself though. [13:53:47] i'll update it but i just don't know the `Until DATE` part [13:58:16] Most recent edits on the archives should give a rough approximation. [13:58:31] I thought a bot handled it, guess not [13:59:30] I believe a bot puts things in the archives, but it doesn't automatically list and date those archives on the main page. [14:12:24] I usually look at the signature on the last response of the page. [14:17:05] oh yeah [14:58:56] [1/2] @posix_memalign what the [14:58:56] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1225560610628964423/1528053464809345034/obraz.png?ex=6a5ce62f&is=6a5b94af&hm=838543b0e8b4b72bcc87013fdd7aeb1032d3c454d9182ed42bd0770fe0bfe40c& [15:00:17] im gonna use the last response from the `ARCHIVE FULL` revision [15:02:37] BeeBot stopped working for a while so NA archived some pages manually [15:02:46] ohh [15:03:01] [1/2] should be correct [15:03:01] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1225560610628964423/1528054493978034317/obraz.png?ex=6a5ce725&is=6a5b95a5&hm=3b9346c4895b7837c1d1b80b2b7f59e4e68a88865fba68d633fcc435586f1a32& [15:05:21] Oh I see what you mean now. NA archived threads onto the wrong archive because the link is not present in the archive page. [15:06:33] TBH we can probably build a Lua module that reads page wikitext and then creates the archive box automatically. [15:14:13] yeah (idk lua) [15:16:27] im gonna move the archives by NA to archive8/9 correctly (hopefully) [15:21:56] whoops [15:22:02] time to give na the trout [15:36:38] Time to give whoever created the new archive page without updating the navbox the trout. 😄 [15:36:45] Could be me [15:37:16] I'll double-check the boxes this morning as part of my stroll through the SR board [15:46:44] not too biggie, easy hit for someone interested [15:47:21] Some of these are obscenely overdue for a new page anyhow [15:54:35] Ah, BeeBot created the archive on its own recognizance. [15:55:07] How do you trout a bee? [15:55:23] Might need a smaller fish. [15:55:34] Minnow? [15:55:40] @posix_memalign or others, would love a Lua-fied version that does this automagically, the other thing I could think as a workaround is nesting them as subpages and do a 'list subpages' magic thingy [15:56:17] Yeah we can use one of those subpage extensions on Meta, but we'd lose the timestamp-based text unless we go the Lua route. [15:56:51] As long as they're sequential, I think it's a little less critical, but the untils are handy when you're looking for a specific archive entry [15:58:26] Until then, adding 'check if BeeBot got sneaky' to my procedure when I get around to archivals [15:59:51] > How do you trout a bee? [15:59:51] chop down the flowers? [16:01:10] Oooooh, found another sneaky beebot archive [16:02:37] And another [16:03:05] [1/2] Would it be doable to make it log somewhere when it makes a new archive? [16:03:05] [2/2] I don't know how it works at all (or if that would actually be helpful). [16:03:29] It doesn't happen terribly often, it's when the archive hits a certain byte limit [16:04:17] So if a better archive solution comes up before then, less work that way [16:04:42] Actually, I guess one could filter for logs of page creation by beebot [16:04:59] Makes sense. [16:05:00] That's pretty straightforward with special:log [16:08:33] Ok cool [16:12:34] [1/3] https://meta.miraheze.org/wiki/Steward_requests/(Un)deletions/Archives [16:12:34] [2/3] Lua module seems to be working. [16:12:35] [3/3] It's written by an LLM but I think the code is pretty easy to understand and not difficult to maintain if any issues arise. Currently it auto-generates the list when the `text` argument is not present but can be used by default if it seems to be working reasonably well. [16:23:16] [1/2] Performance seems to be okay. On https://meta.miraheze.org/wiki/Steward_requests/Requests_for_reopening_wikis/Archives it takes about 0.3 seconds and only uses 2 expensive parser functions. [16:23:17] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1225560610628964423/1528074690386591835/image.png?ex=6a5cf9f4&is=6a5ba874&hm=ed06a2f3afd65cf58a610d11803fc05e93899222cf44a57bffa3a497a4dd2cbd& [16:24:50] Yeah, tested on checkuser page and it's doing great. [16:25:08] Heaviest one by far is going to be reopen wikis archive [16:27:46] Yeah, I'm convinced [16:28:22] Heh. [16:28:31] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1225560610628964423/1528076010342322359/image.png?ex=6a5cfb2f&is=6a5ba9af&hm=095a535638231a82ead102124b841c91d6aa7ebccaf5b95c1d97de91bc2dc88f& [16:29:04] Not quite sure how 2090 happened there [16:29:18] Guessing some date didn't escape properly [16:35:31] [1/2] `` [16:35:31] [2/2] Yeah Idk what that is [16:36:46] It seems to be a deliberate attempt at circumventing the archival bot. Stripping out comments and such on the Lua side is going to be difficult, so we might as well just remove the comment. [16:44:10] [1/2] time to fix archive 7 from NA's edits lol [16:44:11] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1225560610628964423/1528079950521962800/obraz.png?ex=6a5cfeda&is=6a5bad5a&hm=5e14c77f9f63bcd53c7af6df9d6ed56efbdd765faf617fe995e97fdb107f5fbf& [16:44:51] guessing he didn't had a lot of sleep over the days, kinda worrying for them [16:45:08] oh 😭 [16:45:22] na is really busy irl, i do feel quite bad [16:46:03] oohh 😭 [16:53:45] Removing comments is easier than I expected so this is now fixed [17:04:11] done archive 8 [17:09:55] archive 9 is done [17:11:14] [1/2] wow [17:11:14] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1225560610628964423/1528086758833524868/obraz.png?ex=6a5d0531&is=6a5bb3b1&hm=22585557ca56bd7acd1f9c404aaa2a194ee023d2425a5eaab5f97b39c7d6f989& [17:12:47] [1/2] woah -38k bytes [17:12:47] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1225560610628964423/1528087148899860500/obraz.png?ex=6a5d058e&is=6a5bb40e&hm=fa372e3b84ecc517c7374c9cfbb5c6c38be814a3ae2041d9dde866d1bf165baa& [17:13:34] [1/2] woah -38 thousand bytes [17:13:34] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1225560610628964423/1528087346824741017/obraz.png?ex=6a5d05bd&is=6a5bb43d&hm=08f914af59ca1f8677e8abf8ce9a86f166c4e8d81c9a865302a44e7ef7210e2c& [17:33:51] [1/2] Well, that's email queues, trust and safety queues, and steward queues demolished. 😄 [17:33:51] [2/2] @nukesme thanks for doing some archival cleanup. 🙂 [17:34:08] I'll do a pass on the unactioned discord CVT stuff and that's probably it from me for today. [17:34:31] ur welcome [17:34:33] :D [17:46:52] Mad lad [17:48:59] CVT emails are always weird because not everyone gets all the emails, I have a decent few of unread requests that apparently weren’t sent to you [17:49:32] I’ll try and knock a few out though I’m a bit busy today, but we should probably also agree you understand the timeframe for when we don’t bother dealing with very old requests anymore [17:51:31] I already got the queue caught up as far as I'm aware (or I skipped some that were obviously spam or LTAs trying to get in.) [17:51:52] Just got one that appears to be written entirely in third person, that's a first. [17:52:12] Huh [17:52:27] Yeah, anything 3+ days stale immediately gets a templated "is this still needed" response [17:53:11] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1225560610628964423/1528097316328968382/image0.jpg?ex=6a5d0f06&is=6a5bbd86&hm=97d04384747d19335c54ac4389b65a1e82d5ae5eaa79fd1c10e9c4a0c6650f4d& [17:53:43] Yeah, just a whole mess of 'if user were to have an account created, would user be able to contribute without the onerous IP block restrictions preventing user from engaging with the community' [17:54:25] Confusing, but the human experience is a broad one, whatever floats their metaphorical boats. [17:55:24] Oh, so all the remaining ones shouldn’t be action? [17:56:02] If you don't see a response from me and they aren't giving you red flags, go for em [17:56:17] There's every possibility I may have misread them too [17:56:52] > [17:56:52] Didn't we add that as an example instruction of how to sign posts, so it wouldn't be archived? [17:56:52] But if they're like more than 2 weeks stale, then probably not worth doing [17:57:29] That probably got directly copied into the request body from the example, yeah [17:57:38] ah [17:57:46] The problem was it was included in some of the archive pages, throwing off the lua results [17:57:53] ah [17:58:02] But petrus fixed the lua behind it to ignore comments, so we should be all good now [17:58:16] ah, nice :) [17:58:22] thanks, posix_memalign :) [17:58:34] (Thanks again for that speedy turnaround, petra! really nice to not have to worry about beebot stealth-creating new archives) [17:59:02] Not to mention one less point of friction w/r/t keeping things tidy and timely [18:10:16] Okay, that’s more the standard I was looking for [18:14:32] could use dpl, maybe that would be more efficient? [18:20:39] Both solutions would end up using `mw.title.newBatch` anyway so I don't expect the different to be huge. DPL could avoid some spurious title queries though since the module queries all 50 pages at once. [18:43:06] Did I do it? [18:43:13] I DID IT [18:45:05] Orang [18:45:49] :Done: [18:48:21] Now go check DMs [18:50:03] Done [18:50:05] with the [18:50:06] thing [18:55:30] @crystalite13 woah you're an global patroller now... [18:55:44] time to open that revocation vote for flexing!! [19:00:30] https://meta.miraheze.org/wiki/Meta:Administrators%27_noticeboard#Autopatrolled_for_Fearless guess i'm nominated again for autopatroller 👀 [19:01:48] would be nice to have it to lessen patroller load when i do translation work (eventually) [19:02:32] Oh nice [19:04:47] yep, that is the primary reason for `autopatrolled`. for me, my criteria are fairly low. Enough edits to establish you understand the purpose and scope of Meta, you're reasonably active, and you know how talk pages work and don't forget to sign your posts [19:05:27] Hey Doug [19:05:41] hey :) [19:07:43] <_arawynn> I managed to forget signing when I accepted the nomination as Wiki Reviewer [19:08:31] hi [19:08:49] test irc [19:08:59] :o it works [19:09:08] Cough cough [19:09:24] still ended well for you in the end, no? [19:09:43] <_arawynn> I got elected, obviously 😂 so yes [19:10:14] @crystalite13 congrats on global patroller :D [19:10:28] Ty [19:10:42] <_arawynn> from me as well congratulations [19:10:56] i cleaned up archives [19:12:04] today [19:12:22] archive 7 had stuff after it was fully done [19:12:33] so i had to move it to archive 8/9 [19:12:38] :D [19:16:26] woah, that was fast [19:17:06] I think you’re due for it at this point [19:17:49] if you say so, i wonder what's the lowest edit count a user had when they get autopatroller... [19:18:30] Maybe the recommended minimum of 150 [19:18:50] But, of course, edits are just a number [19:19:01] but it was recommended...i wonder is it like 50 or something [19:19:12] i have like 5.6k edits [19:19:20] meta edits, not global btw [19:19:26] oh yeah [19:19:47] then thats 9 [19:19:57] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1225560610628964423/1528119151632191498/8be.jpg?ex=6a5d235c&is=6a5bd1dc&hm=44885cd2287054d4bc91cac12b897c5b6088d2d23b0dd4b7d812b58baae8041f& [19:20:09] i dont like that philosophy delete it now [19:20:24] Comeone guys [19:20:39] 50 constructive edits better than like 150 chatty edits [19:21:14] @nukesme oh you came to miraheze via a roblox game, that's cool [19:21:17] [1/2] 3 of my edits [19:21:17] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1225560610628964423/1528119486052569258/obraz.png?ex=6a5d23ac&is=6a5bd22c&hm=19f95a61bcfa458db29dedb2eda54ba6d798f8f39aa7937e436c6467aa52bb55& [19:21:26] yeah lol [19:21:56]