[00:01:32] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) UNIQ684c6dcc24613c45-calendar-00000001-QINU - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11745 04CRIT; normal; MediaWiki extensions: General/Unknown; (eperry)
[00:05:07] <demagggus>	could somebody tell me the difference between a tag extension and a parser funcion...I don't really get it!?!
[00:07:49] <Pathoschild>	Parser function: {{#foo:}}.
[00:07:59] <Pathoschild>	Tag extension: <foo> </foo>.
[00:08:57] <Pathoschild>	That's about as much difference as I'm aware of, although I think tag extensions are parsed before parser functions.
[00:09:29] <demagggus>	Pathoschild: OK...thx :)
[00:09:36] <Pathoschild>	Welcome. :)
[00:11:13] <lch>	demagggus, 
[00:11:15] <lch>	http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Tag_extensions
[00:11:22] <lch>	http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Parser_functions
[00:12:06] <lch>	differences are explained in parser functions, top
[00:13:44] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) Script introduces constructs that breaks xhtml - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11746 major; high; MediaWiki extensions: CentralNotice; (azatoth)
[00:14:25] <lch>	haha
[00:14:31] <lch>	marquee things again
[00:14:38] <lch>	brion is going to have fun
[00:14:55] <demagggus>	Ich: thx for the information
[00:16:50] <demagggus>	is it possible to overlap tag pairs, or is it handled like in xml?
[00:17:17] <lch>	prolly not
[00:18:41] <White_Cat>	brion mind reseting <fundraising/> ?
[00:18:56] <brion>	moment
[00:19:41] <AzaTht>	brion: wrote some probs in  http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11746
[00:21:30] <Simetrical>	You know, I quite honestly think that it's considerably more trouble to install Ubuntu Gutsy over Feisty than to install Vista over XP.
[00:21:34] *Simetrical 	glares
[00:21:52] <flyingparchment>	clicking 'upgrade' and waiting an hour or two is too hard?
[00:22:33] <Simetrical>	flyingparchment, when it repeatedly pops up message windows and waits for my response before continuing, it may not be hard, but it's sure boring.
[00:23:27] <Simetrical>	I don't see why it can't defer the actual installation of upgraded packages to the restart, the way it does for ordinary updates.
[00:24:01] <Simetrical>	Maybe a series of *immediately contiguous* popups that are queued up would be appropriate, although I'm not sure why it needs to ask me whether I'd like all my customized config files replaced with defaults (um, no?).
[00:24:16] <Simetrical>	And having ten minutes between each one is no fun.
[00:24:26] <Simetrical>	It's considerably more painful than installing Feisty was to start with.
[00:24:34] *Pathoschild 	just did a clean install.
[00:24:38] *Simetrical 	will file a complaint if he can be arsed
[00:24:44] <Pathoschild>	Upgrades never go well.
[00:25:09] <Simetrical>	It also said *before it even started downloading anything* that I should shut down all programs.
[00:25:18] <Simetrical>	Seriously, what?
[00:25:30] <Simetrical>	It will cause data loss if I run things while packages are downloading?
[00:29:36] <Simetrical>	There's no reason I can see for it to be any more annoying than an ordinary update, aside from upgraded packages inevitably breaking BC.
[00:30:41] <Simetrical>	Otherwise I like Ubuntu a lot, though.  I'm running Folding@Home *while using the computer* and not noticing any speed difference, without even changing priorities for anything, even though it's using ~100% CPU when it can.  How cool is that?
[00:33:14] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Script introduces constructs that breaks xhtml - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11746  (10cesarb)
[00:34:47] <NotACow>	duh!  i are idiot.
[00:35:12] <AzaTht>	NotACow: "i are idiot" does not parse
[00:36:23] <NotACow>	AzaTht: sure it does
[00:37:05] <CIA-36>	03downchuck * r26895 10/branches/mlmw/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Installation fixes (yue/wuu still broken)
[00:37:59] <Simetrical>	AzaTht, obviously "i" is a neologism, specifically a plural proper noun.
[00:38:05] <Simetrical>	And "idiot" is treated as plural, because, uh.
[00:38:20] <AzaTht>	hmm
[00:47:43] *NotACow 	is now starting to deal with the PHP compatibility stubbery
[00:51:05] *Simetrical 	decides to skip removal of obsolete packages for now
[00:51:17] <Simetrical>	Yay, now I just have to restart and hope everything works.
[00:59:42] <NotACow>	yay
[01:00:13] <NotACow>	ugh
[01:00:15] <NotACow>	backquote
[01:05:53] <Simetrical>	LOL @ option in GNOME to show UNIX time in the clock widget-thing
[01:07:24] *Simetrical 	puts that next to his normal clock
[01:08:10] <Simetrical>	. . . @ System Monitor applet changing so that all colors are black on black
[01:21:01] <wikibugs>	04(REOPENED) Portal namespace for Vietnamese Wikipedia - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11603  +comment (10thanhquang.nguyen)
[01:45:50] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Set $wgNoticeScroll to false on all Wikimedia wikis - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11740  (10matthew.britton)
[01:49:05] <wikibugs>	14(INVALID) Set $wgNoticeScroll to false on all Wikimedia wikis - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11740  +comment (10cbrown1023)
[01:52:11] <wikibugs>	03(mod) special:random sometimes displays pages in wikipedia namespace - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11717  (10shushruth)
[01:56:57] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Set $wgNoticeScroll to false on all Wikimedia wikis - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11740  +comment (10brion)
[03:03:52] <CIA-36>	03brion * r26896 10/trunk/extensions/CentralNotice/SpecialNoticeText.php: native toggle support
[03:11:02] <CIA-36>	03brion * r26897 10/trunk/extensions/CentralNotice/SpecialNoticeText.php: 
[03:11:02] <CIA-36>	* hide toggle buttons for anons
[03:11:02] <CIA-36>	* don't die when firebug not there ;)
[03:26:39] <CIA-36>	03brion * r26898 10/trunk/extensions/CentralNotice/SpecialNoticeText.php: fix expiry ... seemed to be session :P
[04:46:01] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Use date format preference on unlinked dates - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4582  (10N/A)
[05:11:33] <wikibugs>	03(mod)  Category listings are not updated when deletion of or edits to a template change the category membership of transcluding pages - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5382  (10N/A)
[05:22:14] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Use date format preference on unlinked dates - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4582  (10N/A)
[05:24:33] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Use date format preference on unlinked dates - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4582  (10l8qjvx002)
[05:26:07] <wikibugs>	03(mod)  Category listings are not updated when deletion of or edits to a template change the category membership of transcluding pages - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5382  (10N/A)
[05:31:31] <CIA-36>	03raymond * r26899 10/trunk/phase3/ (RELEASE-NOTES languages/messages/MessagesTe.php): 
[05:31:31] <CIA-36>	* (bug 11615) Update user namespace on Telugu (te)
[05:31:31] <CIA-36>	** Alias set, file rebuild
[05:33:10] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) Update Namespace translations on Telugu wiki projects - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11615  +comment (10raimond.spekking)
[05:35:11] <wikibugs>	06(LATER) Portal namespace for Vietnamese Wikipedia - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11603  +comment (10jeluf)
[05:48:18] <CIA-36>	03raymond * r26900 10/trunk/phase3/includes/EditPage.php: Add CSS id's for some warning messages
[07:29:35] <tale_>	In making webpages for a football club, which has 10 teams (kids with different ages), would it make sense to create a category for each team?
[07:30:03] <domas>	maybe
[07:30:08] <domas>	are there going to be many pages about the team?
[07:30:23] <tale_>	Probably about ten pages for each team.
[07:30:42] <tale_>	I'm worried that all teams want to have pages with the same names.
[07:37:26] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) Trailing slashes should be ignored when subpages are enabled - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11747 15enhancement; low; MediaWiki: Page editing; (mediazilla.20.nickj)
[07:53:03] <_wooz>	lo
[08:55:13] <khatahn>	what do i have to do so that i don't need to use <br /> on some specific wikipage to get linebreaks?
[08:56:01] <domas>	khatahn: two enters gets linebreaks
[08:56:05] <domas>	<pre> can help too
[08:56:27] <wikibugs>	14(INVALID) UNIQ684c6dcc24613c45-calendar-00000001-QINU - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11745  +comment (10niklas.laxstrom)
[08:57:46] <khatahn>	domas: yeah, but the effect of two enters is not the same as <br />
[09:01:06] <khatahn>	two enters = new paragraph, <br /> = forced linebreak. anyway, just thought there could be something i could set wikipage-wide to get the same effect with one enter as with <br />
[09:10:49] <CIA-36>	03nikerabbit * r26901 10/trunk/phase3/languages/messages/MessagesBcl.php: * (bug 11592) Namespace translations for bcl
[09:11:13] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) Import bcl localization from Betawiki - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11592  +comment (10niklas.laxstrom)
[09:12:08] <Busta>	re
[09:50:07] <piksi>	is it impossible to do recursive {{#if:'s with parserfunctions ? i don't seem to be able to accomplish such
[09:50:22] <MinuteElectron>	probably not
[09:51:01] <piksi>	is there a way to do such?
[09:51:06] <MinuteElectron>	The MediaWiki parser generally lacks support for recursive anything, except in special cases of course.
[09:51:13] <piksi>	oh
[09:51:24] <piksi>	well damn :-)
[09:51:27] <MinuteElectron>	Feel free to rewrite the parse ;)
[09:51:35] <amidaniel>	{{ #if: a | {{ #if: b | Hello, world! | Goodbye, world! }} | Something else }} .. should give you "Hello, world!"
[09:51:47] <amidaniel>	Assuming that's what you meant by a recursive if
[09:52:18] <piksi>	amidaniel: my syntax is exactly as that and it doesn't work
[09:52:30] <piksi>	perhaps it gets confused as my statement is so long it doesn't fit in one line
[09:52:54] <piksi>	(i haven't separated anythign with returns though, but dunno)
[09:53:01] <amidaniel>	worksforme: http://amidaniel.com/testwiki/index.php/Bob
[09:54:04] <amidaniel>	There are of course going to be limits on how many types you can nest ifs, but it's most likely the result of a syntax error than a problem with the parser :)
[09:54:11] <amidaniel>	s/types/times
[09:55:09] <amidaniel>	Alright, I gotta get to bed though (4 am already :S), so good luck solving it!
[10:00:22] <piksi>	ah, found the problem
[10:00:37] <piksi>	it was because i was using {{{a}}} instead of a, it needed to be {{{a|}}}
[10:15:03] <moonlight>	can anybody help me on this: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help_talk:Navigation#Editing_the_Toolbox !?
[10:15:22] <MinuteElectron>	don't?
[10:15:40] <moonlight>	MinuteElectron you mean me°!?
[10:15:45] <MinuteElectron>	Yeah.
[10:15:54] <moonlight>	they don't answer me there
[10:15:56] <MinuteElectron>	It is possible to hack the skin, but this is not advised, takes much effort if you want it to work on multiple skins, and makes upgrading tedious.
[10:16:25] <MinuteElectron>	moonlight: If you read the reply, it says it is not possible, and rightly so.
[10:16:26] <moonlight>	well i already did changes to the skins...it looks great...but i don#t know why the feeds aren't shown in one line
[10:16:43] <moonlight>	no no it looks like this...but why!?
[10:16:46] <MinuteElectron>	Ahh, feeds.
[10:16:56] <MinuteElectron>	Can you give us a link to your page?
[10:17:13] <moonlight>	mhm it's not official...because it's for an enterprise
[10:17:26] <moonlight>	like there is no public accses
[10:17:31] <moonlight>	acess
[10:17:42] <moonlight>	my englisch is not very good
[10:17:49] <moonlight>	english
[10:17:50] <MinuteElectron>	Well, there is little we can do to help you then (since we are unable to see the source code).
[10:18:05] <moonlight>	mhm ok...i did changes to the main.css
[10:18:45] <moonlight>	the other problem i can't figure out is how to "speak" to the toolbox... there is no prtlet class called toolbox...
[10:19:21] <moonlight>	how can i help you to help me!?
[10:19:33] <MinuteElectron>	#p-tb
[10:19:40] <MinuteElectron>	@search help
[10:19:40] <mwbot>	Results: [ask, interwiki, magicword, mwbot, namespace, namespaces, parserfunctions, rights, syntax, timezone, usergroups]
[10:19:53] <MinuteElectron>	hmm, i never added it
[10:20:07] <moonlight>	but there is only #p-tb a in the original
[10:20:16] <bottiger>	Is it possible to strip out the parser and render from mediawiki, so you just can integrate it into your own website?
[10:20:32] <moonlight>	bottinger you talking to me!?
[10:20:32] <MinuteElectron>	moonlight:  Well, then you can add your own by hacking the skin as you have already done.
[10:20:37] <MinuteElectron>	no, he is not
[10:20:42] <MinuteElectron>	you are not the center of the world
[10:20:58] <moonlight>	sorry just didn't want to be rude
[10:21:01] <moonlight>	by not answering
[10:21:08] <moonlight>	i already tried that
[10:21:22] <moonlight>	but nothing happened seems as if something has a stronger power...
[10:21:22] <MinuteElectron>	bottiger: Possibly, but I expect it would be easier to write your own. Moving it to your own site would have trouble database-wise as the parser is heavily reliant on the database.
[10:21:46] <moonlight>	like overwriting rules or something
[10:22:51] <bottiger>	MinuteElectron: aha - I sort of expected that. But it would have been nice if you just could call a method which parsed/rendered some wikitext into html
[10:22:53] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Set logo for Hungarian Wikisource - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11708  (10mrekavarga)
[10:23:20] <bottiger>	....with all the features, validation, and other things mediawiki already have
[10:23:37] <MinuteElectron>	bottiger: It would probably make everyone's life easier if that were the case, unfourtunatley no. Feel free to rewrite it though ;)
[10:24:29] <bottiger>	MinuteElectron: naah, there must be at least *one* wiki out there where you can do it :)
[10:24:43] <MinuteElectron>	Sure thing.
[10:25:06] <moonlight>	MinuteElectron: so you don't know an answer!?
[10:25:19] <MinuteElectron>	moonlight: Not without seeing your source code, no.
[10:25:47] <moonlight>	MinuteElectron:so what part of the source code do you want!? i can put it on my user page on mediawiki.org, don#t i!?
[10:26:53] <MinuteElectron>	It would be very difficult to help identify your problem from just one piece of source code. Maybe someone else who has more experience than I do might come along though.
[10:28:41] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Set logo for Hungarian Wikisource - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11708  (10mrekavarga)
[10:28:48] <moonlight>	mhm i can give you the source code, when the page is "broken" (when the feeds show up weired!?)
[10:29:33] <MinuteElectron>	There is more than one person in this channel, maybe they might be able to help you.
[10:29:50] <moonlight>	mhm i think they don#t want to...
[10:30:23] <moonlight>	mhm...then i have to try it again alone...but thanks for your help... :-)
[10:30:38] <MinuteElectron>	Good things come to those who wait. ;)
[10:30:50] <moonlight>	;-)
[10:31:27] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Set $wgNoticeScroll to false on all Wikimedia wikis - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11740  (10cesarb)
[10:32:26] <wikibugs>	04(REOPENED) Set logo for Hungarian Wikisource - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11708  (10gtisza)
[10:45:26] <Lilx>	how can I make a heading without the numbering?
[10:46:20] <MinuteElectron>	Lilx: That is a user preference, see Special:Preferences under one of the tabs to disable it,.
[10:47:07] <Lilx>	but can I make it default for all users?
[10:47:50] <MinuteElectron>	It should be default already...
[10:48:18] <moonlight>	ehm, does anybody know if there is a extra php file for related changes page and what links here page!?
[10:48:29] <moonlight>	and where to find it!?
[10:48:39] <MinuteElectron>	includes/SpecialRecentChanges.php
[10:48:47] <MinuteElectron>	includes/SpecialWhatLinksHere.php
[10:48:49] <moonlight>	ah ok thanks... :-)
[10:49:04] <moonlight>	i've been looking for that pages for some while...but couldn't find it...
[10:50:42] <Lilx>	another question, how can I change the users registration behavior of captalizing the first letter
[10:51:35] <Lilx>	i want to register users with lowercase aswell
[10:53:34] <MinuteElectron>	http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:%24wgCapitalLinks
[10:53:43] <MinuteElectron>	It applies to pages aswell though.
[10:53:49] *MinuteElectron 	is away.
[10:54:04] <flyingparchment>	wgCapitalLinks does _not_ apply to usernames, only pages
[10:57:50] <CIA-36>	03raymond * r26902 10/trunk/phase3/ (4 files in 3 dirs): * (bug 11727) Support plural in 'historysize' message
[10:58:54] <Nikerabbit>	Raymond_: so you didn't rename the message? :<
[10:59:19] <Raymond_>	Nikerabbit: no. it would break 60 localizations 
[10:59:46] <Raymond_>	and IMO for a very minor improvement only
[10:59:57] <Nikerabbit>	Raymond_: at least then they will then get updated if they are updated at all
[11:00:08] <Nikerabbit>	now it just goes unnoticed and makes the statistics crappy
[11:01:06] <Nikerabbit>	it takes, what, 10 seconds to translate it at most
[11:01:13] <Raymond_>	i know. but better the statistic is unhappy than users... I was stabbed in the past for breaking localizations without a very good need
[11:01:46] <Nikerabbit>	Raymond_: stab them back :D
[11:01:56] <CIA-36>	03rotem * r26903 10/trunk/phase3/languages/messages/MessagesHe.php: Update.
[11:02:02] <Raymond_>	he was bigger... ;-9
[11:02:08] <Raymond_>	;-)
[11:02:25] *Nikerabbit 	runs the fuzzybot and get stabbed instead
[11:03:24] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) PLURAL in "historysize" message - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11727  +comment (10raimond.spekking)
[11:10:43] <MinuteElectron>	flyingparchment: Sorry, will remember that in future.
[11:12:44] <amita>	from where i can change the background??
[11:13:04] <MinuteElectron>	MediaWiki:monobook.css
[11:14:21] <amita>	background: #f9f9f9 url(headbg.jpg) 0 0 no-repeat;
[11:14:37] <MinuteElectron>	yep
[11:14:38] <amita>	but where is this headbg.jpg
[11:19:50] <amita>	can nybody tell me where is this headbg.jpg
[11:20:11] <flyingparchment>	amita: .../skins/monobook/
[11:20:22] <flyingparchment>	amita: but don't edit that, put the new image somewhere else
[11:20:59] <amita>	ya that im asking where i put new image
[11:21:04] <flyingparchment>	anywhere
[11:21:14] <flyingparchment>	background: url(/my/path/mynewbackground.jpg)
[11:22:26] <amita>	ok thanx
[11:45:22] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Cannot rename/move images and other media files. - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=709  +comment (10e.martinson)
[11:56:41] <Ravn>	hi all, I want to setup a mediawiki-server under Debian Lenny, and are reading http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Running_MediaWiki_on_Debian_GNU/Linux. Does anyone know if this site is up to date enough to be trusted/does it work?
[12:00:41] <Duesentrieb>	Ravn: i recommend to set up a standard LAMP environment using apt, and then installing mediawiki from the official tarball, in the platform-neutral way.
[12:00:50] <Duesentrieb>	there should be nothing special to do on debian (or even linux)
[12:01:46] <Duesentrieb>	Ravn: if you want math/texvc support, you'll need to have buildessentails and ocaml installed, and build texvc by hand.
[12:02:10] <Duesentrieb>	(or use someone elses binary, it should be fairly compatible across linuxes)
[12:03:21] <Ravn>	Duesentrieb: ok, I just did apt-get install mediawiki1.10, what is LAMP?
[12:04:43] <Duesentrieb>	Ravn: installing mediawiki is exactly what i would *not* have done. LAMP is short for "Linux+Apache+MySQL
[12:04:47] <Duesentrieb>	+PHP"
[12:04:47] <Ravn>	Duesentrieb: ah, LAMP, got it, yes, that's what I did
[12:05:09] <Duesentrieb>	err, installing mediawiki using apt is what i would not have done.
[12:05:14] <Ravn>	Duesentrieb: what? why not?
[12:05:16] *Duesentrieb 	is a bit incoherent today
[12:05:44] <Duesentrieb>	Ravn: because 3rd party packages of mediawiki tend to be a) old and b) put files in odd places and are thus c) unsupported
[12:06:26] <Ravn>	Duesentrieb: ok, so installing LAMP from apt and mediawiki from wediawiki.org or?
[12:06:35] <Duesentrieb>	Ravn: basically: either trust the maintainer of the mediawiki bundle for debian, and use that. but if thuff doesn't work, complain to that guy, nto to us...
[12:06:56] <Duesentrieb>	yes. LAMP from apt and mediawiki from the tarball on mediawiki.org
[12:07:11] <Duesentrieb>	or download.wikimedia.org or wherever it is now
[12:07:18] *Duesentrieb 	uses svn
[12:07:21] <Platonides>	and when you ask how to do odd things, you will find that files are on odd places, or not present at all
[12:09:08] <Ravn>	hmm, ok, I probably do not have that big needs, should I maybe try a different wiki distribution?
[12:10:17] <Duesentrieb>	if you like
[12:10:24] <Duesentrieb>	but give it a shot
[12:10:33] <Duesentrieb>	#mediawiki isntallation is simple
[12:10:50] <Duesentrieb>	unpack into a web dir, open in browser, fill form
[12:10:52] <Duesentrieb>	done
[12:11:25] <Duesentrieb>	if you don't like it, rm -r the dir.
[12:11:39] <Duesentrieb>	well, you'd probably want to remove the db too. but that's it
[12:14:34] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Cannot rename/move images and other media files. - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=709  +comment (10benn.newman)
[12:17:26] <piksi>	is there a way to modify for example the Version -page or other similar pages, i would like to exclude version information for php to prevent attacks and translate the texts?
[12:17:39] <piksi>	i'd love to do this without modifying core files so that the texts would presist in future versions
[12:19:18] <sexie>	hey guys :D:D
[12:20:00] <sexie>	does anyone know which file I need to edit for removing those extra characters when editing?
[12:20:30] <sexie>	I added a plugin sometime earlier. Removed it, but can't remmebr the pages I ned to edit
[12:20:37] <piksi>	wow, that was really descriptive.
[12:21:14] <sexie>	being sarcastic? :P
[12:22:09] <PunkRock>	what does 'those extra characters' mean?
[12:22:09] <sexie>	erm. can you see this line when editing an article at wikipedia >> "Insert: – — … ° ≈ ≠ ≤ ≥ ± − × ÷ ← → · §  Sign your username: ~~~~ "
[12:22:31] <sexie>	Just below this line there are 8-10 lines full of characters.
[12:23:08] <sexie>	I wan't my mediawiki to NOT show these.
[12:25:30] <sexie>	I installed a plugin for those caharcters to show up. It also added some buttons to the edit page. I was able to remove the buttons  (strike, line break etc) but couldn't remmbeer the page which stores the characters
[12:25:40] <sexie>	Hope thats clear now :)
[12:26:02] <PunkRock>	sexie: everything after `Insert' is messed up in my terminal. i don't get your point. maybe you can direct me to a example page?
[12:26:31] <sexie>	just a sec
[12:26:53] <PunkRock>	or maybe you say which character set it is.
[12:29:12] <sexie>	http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/5954/charsettw0.jpg
[12:29:50] <sexie>	thats what I'm getting. The characters, I removed the plugin so they aren't linked. I want this mess to be cleared up :)
[12:30:22] <NotACow>	moo.
[12:30:28] <PunkRock>	Ahh
[12:31:24] <sexie>	Its 'charIsert' plugin IIRC. ut I can't seem to find the page which stores all this mess
[12:32:37] <Ravn>	Duesentrieb: I now tried installing as you suggested, flawless, thanx. Can I just ask you: how about the LocalSettings.php file. What should the file premissions on the one be?
[12:33:04] <PunkRock>	sexie: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:CharInsert
[12:38:21] <sexie>	thanks PunkRock :D
[12:48:37] <Arnomane>	Hi anybody here I can ask a few questions about mediawiki wikidata-branch?
[12:57:29] <PunkRock>	Arnomane: see -> /topic
[13:07:10] <NotACow>	weebles
[13:07:39] <Arnomane>	PunkRock: well flooding the channel with quite special questions until I get the first answer is not what I want ;)
[13:09:36] <Arnomane>	ok one basic question: is there a way to set up an own wikidata wiki with articles that have a multi field edit form?
[13:11:17] <Arnomane>	for example an article page with three distinct fields: abstract, main text, appendix 
[13:12:27] <Arnomane>	and furthermore: if so, is there a a way to tell each field how many bytes you are allowed to write into it?
[13:12:36] <MinuteElectron>	Ravn: it doesn't really matter, 755 will do
[13:15:31] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Cannot rename/move images and other media files. - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=709  (10siebrand)
[13:19:45] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Cannot rename/move images and other media files. - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=709  (10voyagerfan5761)
[13:22:16] <Arnomane>	.oO(the eternal bug)
[13:22:54] <PunkRock>	Arnomane: yes. there is a way. i don't know if someone hacked smthg. like that but you can do it for your own.
[13:22:56] <flyingparchment>	i'm getting a lot of these from my mediawiki: /opt/diffutils/bin/diff3: No newline at end of file
[13:23:00] <flyingparchment>	is that normal?
[13:23:16] <MinuteElectron>	Well, no ;)
[13:23:24] <PunkRock>	Arnomane: i think you would have to right it for your own.
[13:25:34] <PunkRock>	 /right/write/
[13:25:37] <PunkRock>	meee
[13:25:53] <Arnomane>	PunkRock: there is a way completly different in style for the same thing with semanticForms but IMHO this extension is ugly and I am somewhat confused by semanticmediawiki... (I fear it is too much for what I want)
[13:26:34] <PunkRock>	Arnomane: What do you want then?
[13:26:45] <Arnomane>	although wikidata is even superior in that aspect cause there is virtually no documentation
[13:27:26] <Arnomane>	I just want the ability to define a multi part article, each field with a fixed maxium input size
[13:27:33] <moonlight>	does anybody know something to the topic force preview!?
[13:27:49] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Cannot rename/move images and other media files. - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=709  (10siebrand)
[13:27:52] <Arnomane>	moonlight: it is enabled for anons in wikipedia by default
[13:28:14] <PunkRock>	Arnomane: then the SMW is for sure an overkill.
[13:29:09] <moonlight>	Arnomane: i'm building my own wiki and want to implemt it, i've put the code into Mediawiki: common.js and did it for the usergroup user...but nothing is happening :-(
[13:29:12] <Caldrin>	Hi! I have the following problem: I upgraded from Mediawiki 1.8 to Mediawiki 1.10. Now "section edit" links are on the left side in front of the section heading instead of the very right side as before. My users are already knocking on my office door to lynch me, because they think thats bad. Is there any simple way to get them back to the right side again?
[13:30:00] <MinuteElectron>	Caldrin: css
[13:30:10] <Arnomane>	PunkRock: and of course the semanticforms have a very "geeky" syntax and system, I cannot expect my wiki users to understand it, even if they dont really need to define new input forms ;-(
[13:30:19] <Caldrin>	Yeah, I already guessed this. But I don't know any CSS.
[13:30:38] <MinuteElectron>	.editsection { float:right;}
[13:30:47] <MinuteElectron>	in the page MediaWiki:monobook.css
[13:31:06] <Arnomane>	moonlight: one moment
[13:31:15] <Caldrin>	MinuteElectron: great, you are my saviour.
[13:31:24] <MinuteElectron>	Your welcome, have a nice day.
[13:31:27] <moonlight>	Arnomane: :-)
[13:32:27] <PunkRock>	Arnomane: geeky? hm. oh man. if they are geeky what would you think about our bowiki.
[13:33:34] <asmarin>	hola.solo por curiosidad. cuantos hispanohablantes ahi en este canal? 
[13:34:39] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Cannot rename/move images and other media files. - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=709  (10voyagerfan5761)
[13:36:14] <Arnomane>	moonlight: hm I couldn't find what I searched for ;(
[13:37:10] <moonlight>	Arnomane: i found 2 diffrent things i could do to force preview...i tried booth...wait i give you the links...
[13:37:19] <moonlight>	http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:FAQ#How_can_I_force_users_to_preview_before_they_save.3F
[13:37:47] <moonlight>	i'm working with 1.10 and there wasn't such a part...which i have to replace...i searched for it... :-(
[13:37:55] <Arnomane>	PunkRock: which bowiki? well I am also just a bit cautious if I get some problems due to the new features of semantic mediawiki
[13:38:22] <moonlight>	so i did: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Force_preview
[13:39:41] <moonlight>	but nothing is happening and the problem is that on that (where the show the code) page they don't explain, if one has to do anything else or if adding the code to common.js is everything...so i thought...maybe i forgot something!? something to add in some other oage or code!?
[13:44:49] <moonlight>	have an idea!?
[13:59:06] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Medium-trust mode for Special:Import using uploading user' s credentials and current timestamp - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8319  (10clamengh)
[14:01:16] <omnivibe>	is there a way to have a sitemap for a wiki?
[14:01:38] <omnivibe>	I don't mean a google-sitemap, but rather a wiki-page with all the namespaces listed on it?
[14:01:51] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Cannot rename/move images and other media files. - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=709  (10l8qjvx002)
[14:04:41] <asmarin>	omnivibe see on maintenance subdir
[14:05:03] <asmarin>	if you have php cli
[14:05:41] <MinuteElectron>	asmarin: That is Google Sitemap.
[14:05:46] <MinuteElectron>	Not normal sitemap.
[14:05:48] <asmarin>	:-S
[14:06:09] <asmarin>	sorry :-$
[14:06:21] <omnivibe>	It's okay :)
[14:06:43] <Duesentrieb>	omnivibe: all *namespaces*? does that make sense?
[14:06:55] <Duesentrieb>	omnivibe: all categories, yes... and that exists.
[14:07:00] <Duesentrieb>	or all pages. that exists too.
[14:07:15] <Duesentrieb>	you can also get the categories as a dynamic tree, if you want
[14:07:47] <omnivibe>	sorry... I'm new to mediawiki :) Yes, all pages
[14:07:55] <Duesentrieb>	Special:Allpages
[14:07:59] <MinuteElectron>	Special:Allpages
[14:08:01] <Duesentrieb>	can be filtered by namespace too
[14:08:39] <Duesentrieb>	for a sitemap, i'd recommend the CategoryTree extension though. if you use categories.
[14:12:45] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Log parameter during search does not show up - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11714  (10roan.kattouw)
[14:15:29] <wikibugs>	03(mod) special:random sometimes displays pages in wikipedia namespace - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11717  +comment (10roan.kattouw)
[14:17:33] <Ravn>	hi all; I have now a fresh mediawiki setup and just want to ask a question regarding backup. If I do mysqldump wikidb > bachup.db will I backup everything in the wiki, so that I can just read in this file in mysql again to get the whole wiki back to a prev. state?
[14:20:01] <CIA-36>	03catrope * r26904 10/trunk/phase3/ (RELEASE-NOTES includes/Title.php): (bug 11744) Incorrect return value from Title::getParentCategories()
[14:20:24] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) Incorrect return results from Title::getParentCategories() - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11744  +comment (10roan.kattouw)
[14:24:56] <Duesentrieb>	!backup | Ravn 
[14:24:56] <mwbot>	Ravn : http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Backing_up_a_wiki
[14:25:14] <Duesentrieb>	Ravn: short answer: yes. long anser: no...
[14:25:49] <CIA-36>	03catrope * r26905 10/trunk/extensions/ChangeAuthor/ (LEESMIJ README): ChangeAuthor: Correcting filename in README
[14:32:36] <CIA-36>	03rotem * r26906 10/trunk/phase3/RELEASE-NOTES: Trying to remove BOM.
[14:32:56] *RoanKattouw 	apologizes for being on a Windows box and inserting BOMs everywhere
[14:36:04] <Ravn>	Duesentrieb: ok, thanx, when they say filesystem, do they mean /var/www/wiki only or some place else?
[14:36:36] <Duesentrieb>	Ravn: only there, unless you are using a 3rd party bundle that places stuff in other directories
[14:36:44] <Duesentrieb>	linux distribution bundles tend to do that
[14:37:14] <Duesentrieb>	RoanKattouw: BOM is not a windows thing... use a decent editor :P
[14:37:16] <Ravn>	ok, good, as I of now does not have any such things.
[14:37:28] <RoanKattouw>	Duesentrieb which causes it? Notepad? Wordpad?
[14:37:38] <Duesentrieb>	Notepad. Wordpad possibly.
[14:37:51] <Duesentrieb>	who uses those anyway?
[14:37:56] <Duesentrieb>	for programming, no less?
[14:38:24] <Duesentrieb>	there are several decent editors for windows...
[14:38:50] <RoanKattouw>	Just for editing RELEASE-NOTES and similar files
[14:39:32] <Duesentrieb>	err...
[14:39:39] <Duesentrieb>	why not use a decent editor for thta,
[14:39:43] <Duesentrieb>	...that, too?
[14:39:57] <RoanKattouw>	Yeah, I should
[14:40:13] <Duesentrieb>	why use more than one editor anyway?
[14:40:18] <RoanKattouw>	I use Maguma Open Studio which is somewhat buggy but pretty decent overall
[14:40:22] <Duesentrieb>	a decent editor allows you to have multiple files open...
[14:40:34] <RoanKattouw>	I should just unlearn the reflex of opening text files like README with Notepad/Wordpad
[14:40:36] <RoanKattouw>	Bad me
[14:40:51] <Duesentrieb>	RoanKattouw: just change the file assoc
[14:41:08] <RoanKattouw>	You can't associate anything to files with no extension
[14:41:09] <Duesentrieb>	oh, no extension, no assoc
[14:41:11] <Duesentrieb>	windows sucks :)
[14:41:12] <RoanKattouw>	At least not in Windows
[14:41:28] <RoanKattouw>	.php is associated to OpenStudio of course
[14:41:35] <Duesentrieb>	and .txt?
[14:41:49] <RoanKattouw>	Notepad ...
[14:41:56] <RoanKattouw>	But are there any .txt files in SVN?
[14:46:33] <Bryan>	hello
[14:47:12] <Bryan>	is there anybody who knows since when the user scripts were available in MediaWiki?
[14:47:19] <Bryan>	or was it already builtin in phase 3?
[14:47:27] <RoanKattouw>	Bryan just what are user scripts?
[14:47:29] <Bryan>	2
[14:47:37] <RoanKattouw>	You mean like User:Bryan/Monobook.js ?
[14:47:38] <Bryan>	User:Bryan/monobook.js, etc
[14:47:44] <RoanKattouw>	They were there in 1.10
[14:47:56] <RoanKattouw>	Whether they were there earlier I don't know
[14:48:20] <Bryan>	they have been there for some years
[14:48:30] <RoanKattouw>	Check in SVN in the REL_1_* branches, in the RELEASE_NOTES files
[14:48:47] <RoanKattouw>	One of those relnotes has to have user scripts in the New Features in 1.x section
[14:49:55] <Pathoschild>	$wgAllowUserJs was introduced in 1.3, so user scripts might have been introduced then or earlier.
[14:50:08] <Bryan>	hm ok
[14:50:28] <Bryan>	i'll check the releasenotes
[14:56:41] <Bryan>	hm. maybe I should ask Magnus
[15:28:06] <jlerner>	does order matter in LocalSettings.php? in other words, can you set a variable like $wgSitename toward the bottom?
[15:28:17] <RoanKattouw>	jlerner sure
[15:28:21] <jlerner>	so long as there are no earlier uses of in LocalSettings.php itself...
[15:28:26] <jlerner>	RoanKattouw: cool, thanks
[15:28:43] <RoanKattouw>	But watch out that you should put it AFTER the line that says require_once('includes/DefaultSettings.php');
[15:28:46] <RoanKattouw>	Or something like that
[15:29:01] <jlerner>	heh, sure
[15:29:20] <jlerner>	you can require extensions prior to setting $wgSitename 
[15:29:25] *jlerner 	asks the same question ;-)
[15:30:07] <jlerner>	RoanKattouw: thanks for your help yesterday btw - re adding a newline to MediaWiki:gotacount
[15:30:17] <jlerner>	MediaWiki:gotaccount
[15:30:22] <RoanKattouw>	Did I help you yesterday?
[15:30:24] <RoanKattouw>	I don't remember
[15:30:35] <RoanKattouw>	Not do I remember anything about MediaWiki:Gotaccount
[15:30:46] <RoanKattouw>	 /s/Not/Nor/
[15:32:50] <jlerner>	RoanKattouw: you're right, i was confused
[15:42:14] <steko>	hi
[15:42:26] <RoanKattouw>	Hi
[15:42:42] <steko>	I have read many times FAQs and other documentation, but just to be sure:
[15:43:18] <steko>	is there a way to run commandline mainteinance scripts from the web (I am on shared hosting with safe mode ON) ?
[15:51:59] <RoanKattouw>	steko yeah there is somehow
[15:52:11] <RoanKattouw>	PHPshell I believe it's called
[15:52:26] <RoanKattouw>	You have to install that, and then you can run shell commands through the web interface
[15:52:28] <steko>	RoanKattouw: I think it can't work with safe mode ON
[15:52:44] <RoanKattouw>	I've never used it though, so I have no idea how it works, or whether it works with safe mode on
[15:52:44] <steko>	but i'll give it a try
[15:55:32] <loxs>	Hey guys i was wondering if anyone has done much customisation on the mediawiki TOC? I would like to try and make it always visible when scrolling through a page and make it possible to expand the trees in the menu does anyone know if this has been attempted by anybody else before or point me in direction?
[15:59:05] <RoanKattouw>	loxs you will have to do that in CSS I think
[15:59:19] <RoanKattouw>	So you have to edit MediaWiki:Monobook.css
[15:59:25] <RoanKattouw>	(or MediaWiki:StyleYouAreUsing.css)
[16:00:44] <loxs>	ok so its all in the monobook.css
[16:01:54] <RoanKattouw_eats>	loxs I think so
[16:02:01] <RoanKattouw_eats>	I'm not an expert on CSS  though...
[16:03:49] <loxs>	no its ok im OK with css should be able to find my way round
[16:03:56] <loxs>	just surprised no one else has done this before
[16:04:06] <loxs>	considering the TOC is useless if you have long mediawiki pages
[16:04:23] <RoanKattouw_eats>	loxs you're back to the TOC instantly by pressing the Home key
[16:04:26] <loxs>	as your TOC is half the page then when your in the middle of your document you have to go to the top again to get to your TOC
[16:06:35] <NotACow>	what if yyu don't have a home key?
[16:09:12] <loxs>	exactly
[16:09:24] <loxs>	the TOC is the only poor thing about this project imho
[16:09:33] <loxs>	thats why i would like it in the sidebar
[16:09:37] <loxs>	and make the sidebar static
[16:09:53] <loxs>	then chuck in some js to make the TOC collapseable and expandable
[16:10:54] <NotACow>	you can certainly do that in a custom skin and you might be able to do it merely with end-user css & js customization
[16:11:56] <NotACow>	I HATE call_user_func
[16:12:40] <RoanKattouw_eats>	Why?
[16:27:42] <steko>	RoanKattouw_eats: phpshell does not work with safe mode ON
[16:27:48] <steko>	no luck for me
[16:28:09] <steko>	too bad admin scripts cannot be run from web
[16:28:14] <dachary>	hi
[16:29:12] <Hojjat>	hi dachary
[16:29:51] <dachary>	How can i dump the content of a mediawiki and load it elsewhere (i.e. in another database) ? Is there a maintainance script for this purpose ?
[16:31:43] <Hojjat>	dachary: I'm not sure if I understood your question, but I think you can backup the database and restore it elsewhere
[16:31:54] <Hojjat>	both Postgre and MySQl support this, as far as I know
[16:32:46] <dachary>	i mean, just dumping the content, not dumping all the database with all the users and history
[16:32:57] <dachary>	and reloading the content (articles) in another database
[16:33:13] <Hojjat>	oh, I think it is possible
[16:33:17] <RoanKattouw_eats>	@search backup
[16:33:17] <mwbot>	Results: [backup]
[16:33:19] <Hojjat>	actually, Wikimedia does it
[16:33:25] <RoanKattouw_eats>	!backup | dachary
[16:33:25] <mwbot>	dachary: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Backing_up_a_wiki
[16:33:42] <Hojjat>	RoanKattouw_eats: good job; I had to search for the link :)
[16:33:54] <RoanKattouw_eats>	steko that's actually a good thing, what if everyone were able to run them?
[16:33:57] <dachary>	wow
[16:34:05] <dachary>	!sex | dachary
[16:34:11] <dachary>	no work ?
[16:34:12] <RoanKattouw_eats>	lol
[16:34:17] <RoanKattouw_eats>	@list
[16:34:19] <Hojjat>	LIK
[16:34:20] <Hojjat>	LOL
[16:34:28] <RoanKattouw_eats>	Doesn't work either
[16:34:30] <Hojjat>	@list | Hojjat
[16:34:34] <steko>	RoanKattouw_eats: also user rights management is run through web interface, and not everyone is able to run them
[16:34:36] <Hojjat>	pity
[16:34:40] <RoanKattouw_eats>	steko true
[16:35:07] <steko>	not not mention page locking, rollbacks, etc
[16:35:24] <RoanKattouw_eats>	steko true, we have user rights separation in MW
[16:35:33] <RoanKattouw_eats>	And one could write an extension that allows shell access through MW
[16:35:47] <RoanKattouw_eats>	But that's very, very, *very* scary stuff
[16:36:04] <RoanKattouw_eats>	You're practically putting your server's life in the hands of MW's perms system
[16:36:05] *Hojjat 	adds more "very"s to that
[16:36:40] <steko>	RoanKattouw_eats: true.
[16:36:49] <RoanKattouw_eats>	Gotta go now, though
[16:36:53] <steko>	:)
[16:39:31] <NotACow>	whee
[16:39:50] *NotACow 	proliferates interfaces
[16:47:52] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Define Utilisatrice: as an alias for User: on fr.wikipedia - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11682  +comment (10alistrius)
[16:54:54] <piksi>	are there extensions or some easy way to clean old modifications (the history) ?
[16:59:30] <jlerner>	piksi: yes
[17:00:21] <jlerner>	looking
[17:00:40] <jlerner>	piksi: maintenance/deleteOldRevisions.php 
[17:02:00] <piksi>	jlerner: oh, it was in maintenance scripts. have to start looking there more often. thank you
[17:14:32] <bernard>	hello
[17:15:19] <MinuteElectron>	Hello, how may we help yo today?
[17:15:21] <bernard>	is mediawiki going to have a better language for programming templates?
[17:15:37] <bernard>	I mean loops and so on
[17:16:05] <MinuteElectron>	There are many extensions that increase template functionality, but it is doubtful any more advanced templating functions will be built into the core.
[17:16:58] <MinuteElectron>	Brion has already vetoed using basic enhancements such as StringFunctions (an extension) on Wikimedia websites - and Wikimedia is the primary user.
[17:17:34] <MinuteElectron>	Loops are a possibility, but they are difficult due to the possibility of infinite recursion - which must be avoided at all costs.
[17:19:13] <bernard>	what do these extensions allow to do ?
[17:19:54] <bernard>	that's true with any language
[17:20:03] <MinuteElectron>	There are certain extensions such as StringFunctions and NumberFunctions, that allow advanced handelling of data types.
[17:20:12] <MinuteElectron>	Feel free to browse our full library though:
[17:20:14] <MinuteElectron>	!extensions
[17:20:14] <mwbot>	MediaWiki has been built so it can easily be customized by adding extensions. This is usually a simple process. See <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Extensions> for details on writing an extension and <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension_Matrix> for an overview of known extensions.
[17:20:19] <bernard>	if a PHP page or a JS has an infinite loop it will a big problem as well
[17:20:40] <MinuteElectron>	Loops are more of a problem with wikitext due to the audience it is aimed at.
[17:20:41] <bernard>	thx for the link, I look at it immediately
[17:20:45] <MinuteElectron>	No problem, enjoy the rest of your day.
[17:31:40] <[ace]an[9el]>	Is there a way to include semantic forms into the preview/show changes sections?
[17:37:07] <NotACow>	yay
[17:37:09] <NotACow>	call_user_func is dead
[17:37:35] <NotACow>	now to slay call_user_func_array
[17:38:07] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Log parameter during search does not show up - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11714  (10robchur)
[17:39:26] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Correct project namespace for Kannada Wikipedia - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11717   +shell; summary; +comment (10robchur)
[17:57:21] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Define Utilisatrice: as an alias for User: on fr.wikipedia - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11682  normal->low; +comment (10vigneron.nicolas)
[17:57:31] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) Parser issue for HTML definition list - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11748 15enhancement; normal; MediaWiki: Page rendering; (ycombarnous)
[17:59:31] <NotACow>	damn
[17:59:33] <NotACow>	this one won't be easy
[18:22:05] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Sitenotice/anonnotice not displayed - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11705  (10N/A)
[18:40:23] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Define Utilisatrice: as an alias for User: on fr.wikipedia - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11682  (10michaeldaly)
[18:42:39] <NotACow>	bwa ha hah!
[18:44:42] <flyingparchment>	brion-office: does mediawiki handle if-modified-since by checking the page_touched   and not rendering the entire page?
[18:46:41] <jimbojw>	hey guys - there are two "delete" options for a page right? one just deletes it but keeps the history, the other cascades down and clears out all revisions
[18:46:53] <jimbojw>	right? or am I mistaken
[18:47:10] <flyingparchment>	jimbojw: sort of
[18:47:13] <MinuteElectron>	yeah
[18:47:19] <flyingparchment>	jimbojw: mediawiki only has one that deletes the entire page and lets it be undeleted
[18:47:28] <MinuteElectron>	You can either delete everything, or jsut a specific revision.
[18:47:32] <flyingparchment>	jimbojw: on wikimedia we run oversight, which lets you super-delete deleted pages
[18:47:58] <jimbojw>	ah I see - so it's an extension that provides the cascading
[18:48:16] <MinuteElectron>	no
[18:48:42] <MinuteElectron>	You either delete the entire page, or a specific set of revisions from that page (all can be restored).
[18:48:48] <MinuteElectron>	That is by default.
[18:49:14] <MinuteElectron>	Or if you install oversight you can delete a page, or a specific set of revisions from that page (and none can be restored).
[18:49:49] *NotACow 	proliferates anonymous inner classes
[18:51:26] <[ace]an[9el]>	Is there a function that submits values to the next page something like: $wgOut->redirect() ?
[18:53:53] <brion-office>	flyingparchment: page_touched, user_touched, and $wgCacheEpoch
[18:53:58] <flyingparchment>	yeah
[18:54:00] <brion-office>	any of them newer than If-Last-Modified will rerender the page
[18:54:05] <brion-office>	all of them older sends 304
[19:00:56] <NotACow>	yay!  one instance dead!
[19:03:08] <Scrappy>	I'm trying to create a site using MediaWiki 1.11.0, where I'm using template ... I want to have text displayed only if a variable as part of that template is defined ... I've found the #if constructs, but I can't seem to figure out how to get it so that it will allow me to include HTML as part of the 'then' condition ...
[19:03:27] <Scrappy>	I've seen it done on wikipedia, so assume its possible, but that I'm just missing some extension?
[19:03:53] <Scrappy>	pointers to docs on this would be greatly appreciated .. the code works if I don't include any HTML tags, it sonly if I add html tags that the results go screwy
[19:13:46] <R_King>	are there any good sites that have documentation on bot-writing?
[19:19:49] <Pathoschild>	R_King: Well, there's the pywikipedia bot framework in python, which takes care of all the background stuff like interfacing with MediaWiki.
[19:21:46] <CIA-36>	03brion * r26907 10/trunk/extensions/CentralNotice/ (CentralNotice.php SpecialNoticeLoader.php): 
[19:21:46] <CIA-36>	Use user language selection for picking actual notice text.
[19:21:46] <CIA-36>	The 'raw' site language is still used for picking site enable/disable selections.
[19:24:45] <klapzin>	hello, any people here use "Access Control per Groups" ?
[19:26:28] <Klenje>	hi
[19:26:34] <minute>	klapzin: Nearly everyone does.
[19:26:41] <minute>	s/Nearly//
[19:26:46] <Pathoschild>	!rights
[19:26:46] <mwbot>	http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:User_rights
[19:26:49] <klapzin>	minute, you use it ?
[19:26:52] <Pathoschild>	klapzin: See that page. :)
[19:26:55] <minute>	Everyone does.
[19:26:57] <klapzin>	ok
[19:27:05] <Klenje>	In a Wikipedia edition, I want to add a drop down menu with the licence in the image upload form. the strings are there, but I don't know what to do to activate them
[19:27:09] <klapzin>	you use access control per groups, and ldap ?
[19:27:28] <klapzin>	my users is on AD domain
[19:31:25] <minute>	klapzin: yes, there is an LDAP extenison.
[19:31:27] <minute>	!extensions
[19:31:27] <mwbot>	MediaWiki has been built so it can easily be customized by adding extensions. This is usually a simple process. See <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Extensions> for details on writing an extension and <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension_Matrix> for an overview of known extensions.
[19:31:49] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Template parameters unavailable to XML-style parser tags - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2257  (10bugzilla.wikimedia.org)
[19:31:56] <klapzin>	minute, i use ldap extension, and now it works fine
[19:31:59] <minute>	ok
[19:32:24] <klapzin>	but when i try to use User Control by page in mediawiki, dont work
[19:32:32] <jimbojw>	where is the number of characters for a revision stored? I notice in Special:Recentchanges the (+xxx) or (-yyy) declarations, but nothing pops out at me in the `revision` table as storing that info
[19:33:11] <minute>	jimbojw: That information isn't stored for revisions.
[19:33:18] <wikibugs>	14(WFM) Wrong/no logo for Wikimania private wiki - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11743  +comment (10james)
[19:33:38] <jimbojw>	minute: how is it calculated?
[19:33:44] <minute>	It isn't.
[19:33:49] <jimbojw>	it must be
[19:33:57] <minute>	oh?
[19:34:02] <jimbojw>	it shows up in [[Special:Recentchanges]]
[19:34:08] <jimbojw>	therefore it must be deduced in some fashion
[19:34:26] <minute>	Ahh, you want to know how it is calculated in recent changes.
[19:34:30] <minute>	?
[19:34:45] <jimbojw>	yes - because I want that information for myself
[19:34:56] <minute>	I haven't a clue.
[19:35:03] <jimbojw>	and I figure RC must be doing it in some performant fashion
[19:35:19] <minute>	Try looking in editpage.php
[19:36:16] <jimbojw>	mmmmm ok
[19:36:29] <jimbojw>	why there?
[19:36:53] <minute>	because i believe that is where edits are saved
[19:37:31] <jimbojw>	yes yes, but that isn't where the character differences are calculated, right?
[19:37:33] <minute>	Doesn't that new fundraising banner break the cache?
[19:37:40] <minute>	jimbojw: Why wouldn't it be?
[19:38:06] <jimbojw>	because SpecialRecentChanges doesn't ever instantiate an EditPage instance
[19:38:13] <jimbojw>	so how could it use information therefrom
[19:38:21] <minute>	Well, the difference is stored in the database.
[19:38:35] <jimbojw>	ah ok, that was my original question
[19:38:38] <jimbojw>	where it it stored?
[19:38:43] <minute>	In the RC table.
[19:38:50] <minute>	AFAIK
[19:38:52] <jimbojw>	you mean `revision` ?
[19:38:55] <minute>	no
[19:38:58] <minute>	I mean recentcahnges
[19:39:07] <minute>	*recentchanges
[19:39:15] <jimbojw>	oh ok
[19:39:17] <minute>	revision!=recentchanges
[19:39:23] <jimbojw>	clearly
[19:44:42] <HardDisk_WP>	[[test]]
[19:45:36] <minute>	lol
[19:49:27] <klapzin>	!acl
[19:50:53] <Duesentrieb>	!cms
[19:50:53] <mwbot>	You are advised to install an appropriate content management package for per-page read restrictions. We will not be held responsible should a password or bank details be leaked, leading to loss of funds or one's job due to borked hacks. See <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Category:Page_specific_user_rights_extensions> if you really want too.
[19:51:02] <Duesentrieb>	klapzin: ----^
[19:51:31] <Duesentrieb>	!acl is see !cms
[19:51:31] <mwbot>	Successfully added keyword: acl
[19:55:58] <minute>	!cms del
[19:55:58] <mwbot>	Successfully removed keyword: cms
[19:56:06] <minute>	@alias acl cms
[19:56:18] <minute>	@alias acl is cms
[19:56:30] <minute>	@alias acl
[19:56:41] <minute>	!alias acl cms
[19:56:45] <minute>	bah
[19:56:55] <minute>	!acl is !cms
[19:56:55] <mwbot>	Keyword "acl" already exists. Use "!acl del" to remove it.
[19:57:06] <minute>	!cms is You are advised to install an appropriate content management package for per-page read restrictions. We will not be held responsible should a password or bank details be leaked, leading to loss of funds or one's job due to borked hacks. See <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Category:Page_specific_user_rights_extensions> if you really want too.
[19:57:06] <mwbot>	Successfully added keyword: cms
[19:57:09] <minute>	!acl del
[19:57:09] <mwbot>	Successfully removed keyword: acl
[19:57:15] <minute>	@alias acl cms
[19:57:18] <minute>	!acl
[19:57:26] <minute>	!acl is see !cms
[19:57:26] <mwbot>	Successfully added keyword: acl
[19:57:29] <minute>	:|
[19:57:39] <minute>	Sorry for the spam.
[20:01:13] <Pathoschild>	minute: Regarding fundraising banner cache, see <http://svn.wikimedia.org/viewvc/mediawiki/trunk/extensions/CentralNotice/README?revision=26194&view=markup>. It's three weeks old, though, so I don't know if it accurately describes the current system.
[20:02:00] <minute>	Oh, it is all JavaScript.
[20:02:03] <Pathoschild>	Yep.
[20:02:16] <minute>	<--- dumbass
[20:03:49] <klapzin>	minute, how i make the AD user administrador in mediawiki ?
[20:03:55] <CIA-36>	03downchuck * r26908 10/branches/mlmw/ (6 files in 5 dirs): Fixed installation, db prefix was broken
[20:04:05] <minute>	klapzin: Visit Special:Userrights as an administrator.
[20:04:11] <klapzin>	ok
[20:04:13] <klapzin>	Thansk!
[20:04:32] <klapzin>	minute, do you have a page with this kind of explication ?
[20:04:54] <minute>	i don't have ldap properly set up on my system
[20:10:35] <CIA-36>	03downchuck * r26909 10/branches/mlmw/includes/SkinTemplate.php: Quick fix to page sets
[20:10:42] <klapzin>	minute, how i add more groups ?
[20:10:53] <minute>	localsettings.php
[20:10:57] <minute>	!configuration
[20:10:57] <mwbot>	Currently MediaWiki can be configured by using variables in LocalSettings.php. A full list of settings is available at <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Configuration_settings>. A web-based configuration panel is planned but does not yet exist.
[20:18:53] <CIA-36>	03brion * r26910 10/trunk/extensions/CentralNotice/SpecialNoticeText.php: localize show and hide links
[20:19:23] <NotACow>	wgActionPaths
[20:19:27] <NotACow>	what are these used for?
[20:19:41] <Duesentrieb>	NotACow: turning wiki links into urls
[20:20:07] <Duesentrieb>	err. there should be no "s" at the end. or.... is that something new?
[20:20:17] <NotACow>	Duesentrieb: no, my typo
[20:20:28] <NotACow>	Duesentrieb: there are none defined in the base product, correct?
[20:20:32] <Duesentrieb>	NotACow: and i misread anyway :) 
[20:20:45] <Duesentrieb>	NotACow: ActionPathes let you use edit/Foo instead of Foo?action=edit
[20:20:56] <NotACow>	oh, those
[20:21:04] <Duesentrieb>	don't know the details though
[20:21:17] <NotACow>	Duesentrieb: so it's a config file option
[20:21:30] <Duesentrieb>	yes. most wgXXX variables are
[20:23:12] *NotACow 	is trying to decide which container class to replace it with :)
[20:24:41] <[ace]an[9el]>	Guys - is there a way to post to another page? I have an AlternateEdit hook that redirects to another edit form, but I would like it to submit to the edit form instead. Is that possible?
[20:46:05] <NotACow>	whee
[20:46:18] <NotACow>	two usages of compatibility arrays eaten
[20:58:41] <CIA-36>	03brion * r26911 10/trunk/extensions/CentralNotice/SpecialNoticeLoader.php: wildcard support in enablers
[20:59:14] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) Update Special:Wantedpages - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11749 15enhancement; low; Wikimedia: Site requests; (malafaya)
[21:00:37] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Update Special:Wantedpages - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11749  +comment (10axel9891)
[21:00:44] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) Typo correction to collections statistics - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10233  +comment (10malafaya)
[21:01:46] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Template parameters unavailable to XML-style parser tags - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2257  (10jburos)
[21:01:58] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Update Special:Wantedpages - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11749  (10malafaya)
[21:02:45] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Update Special:Wantedpages - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11749   +shell (10raimond.spekking)
[21:26:47] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Template parameters unavailable to XML-style parser tags - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2257  (10bugzilla.wikimedia.org)
[21:28:46] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Template parameters unavailable to XML-style parser tags - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2257  (10bugzilla.wikimedia.org)
[21:39:14] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Template parameters unavailable to XML-style parser tags - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2257  +comment (10gtisza)
[21:42:21] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) Sitenotice/anonnotice not displayed - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11705  +comment (10cannon.danielc)
[21:43:47] <Grimnir>	hi. I have a problem with a mediawiki installation. There is one articel, that is a problem. It's on 570 kbytes, and it can be saved in the database via the mediawiki interface, but the page can not be viewed again. First when I delete the particular instance in the text table in the database I can use that particular article again
[21:44:08] <Platonides>	what's the error?
[21:44:28] <Grimnir>	It just doesn't display the article
[21:44:35] <Grimnir>	no error message
[21:44:39] <Platonides>	what is displayed? 
[21:44:41] <Platonides>	a blank page=?
[21:44:55] <Grimnir>	I've tried to change $wgMaxArticleSize, but it doesn't work
[21:44:57] <Grimnir>	yes, a blank page
[21:45:05] <Platonides>	it's a php error
[21:45:13] <Platonides>	see your logs or increase the php verbosity
[21:45:34] <Grimnir>	are you sure, it's a php error?
[21:45:35] <Platonides>	i guess it will be a php memory limit or timeout for being so large
[21:45:48] <Platonides>	php gives an error executing that page
[21:45:50] <Grimnir>	oh, I didn't think of that
[21:46:10] <Platonides>	as errors are hidden, you see a blank page ;)
[21:46:25] <amidaniel>	Had some problems with some ungracious dying of the api on large articles, didn't know there were any memory issues with the std interface though
[21:46:32] <Grimnir>	I don't have access to the php.ini, so where would you suggest I change the verbosity? in index.php ?
[21:46:48] <amidaniel>	Grimnir: Do you have access to the apache logs for the server?
[21:47:10] <Grimnir>	I don't think so
[21:47:13] <Grimnir>	but i'm not sure
[21:47:38] <amidaniel>	Grimnir: Do you have like a control panel dealio from your hosting provider?
[21:48:33] <Grimnir>	yeah, I'm looking to see if I can get the apache log
[21:49:11] <Grimnir>	ok, I get a log. What would I be looking for?
[21:50:28] <amidaniel>	Look for a recent PHP Fatal error
[21:51:01] <TheFearow>	When trying to run the installer, it complains aboutt permissions, so I set it to 777. Then it sends me a 0-byte php file that Firefox wants to download.
[21:51:03] <TheFearow>	Any ideas what could be causing it?
[21:51:14] <Grimnir>	nah, it's not a very good log...
[21:52:43] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Template parameters unavailable to XML-style parser tags - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2257  (10bugzilla.wikimedia.org)
[21:52:46] <amidaniel>	TheFearow: Permssions on what dir? config?
[21:54:00] <amidaniel>	Grimnir: Well, I'd suggest you set $wgMaxArticle length to something reasonable, like 200k, nuke that article from the db and cleverly split the text into a few different articles
[21:54:40] <TheFearow>	amidaniel: Yeah.
[21:54:49] <Grimnir>	shouldn't it be possible, though, to have articles with a size of about 500 kbytes?
[21:56:03] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Template parameters unavailable to XML-style parser tags - 10http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2257  (10jburos)
[21:56:06] <amidaniel>	Grimnir: 5MiBs is going to kill most browsers, and if you're on shared hosting, you likely won't have enough memory to process article requests of that size
[21:56:54] <Grimnir>	no no, i'm only talking about 500 kbytes, not 5 mb
[21:58:02] <amidaniel>	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Article_length#Technical_issues
[21:58:35] <TheFearow>	amidaniel, any ideas? I'm not getting anything to the php error log.
[21:58:48] <AaronSchulz>	amidaniel: I can't log into voicewikidb :/
[21:59:22] <amidaniel>	AaronSchulz: Oh, shit, I forgot to update your rights. Second
[22:00:44] <amidaniel>	AaronSchulz: Should be good to go
[22:01:01] <AaronSchulz>	http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Voice_of_All&diff=cur#I_hear_you.27re_good_with_scripts...
[22:01:03] <AaronSchulz>	ugh
[22:01:24] <AaronSchulz>	ah, tis working now
[22:01:47] <amidaniel>	TheFearow: Okay, so when you hit Submit on the install form, it opens up a php stream and serves you a 0b file?
[22:03:24] <TheFearow>	No, when I go to the config directory it serves me an 0byte file
[22:03:58] <TheFearow>	If I set it back to readonly on the dir I get the "you must make the config writable" error, but when I make it writable and refresh, its doing the 0byte thing again
[22:04:31] <amidaniel>	TheFearow: Does it serve you a php file or just give you a blank screen?
[22:04:31] <Grimnir>	Fatal error: Allowed memory size of 16777216 bytes exhausted (tried to allocate 590752 bytes) in (snip)includes/Parser.php on line 465
[22:04:46] <amidaniel>	Grimnir: Thar ya go; it's memory
[22:05:03] <Grimnir>	hmm... how do I do something about that?
[22:05:09] <amidaniel>	Unless you have the power to change the amount of memory you're alloted, you're going to have to change your practices
[22:05:14] <TheFearow>	a php file, which it wanted me to download
[22:06:25] <amidaniel>	TheFearow: Hm .. sounds like a problem with apache/php config. What happens if you navigate directly to config/index.php or config/index.php5
[22:06:28] <amidaniel>	?
[22:06:32] <TheFearow>	So you know, i'm using xampp on an iMac
[22:06:33] <TheFearow>	let me check
[22:06:51] *amidaniel 	shivers at the words "xampp" and "iMac"
[22:07:07] <TheFearow>	that was with /config/index.php, going to /config/ gives just a blank page (no download)
[22:07:15] <jlerner>	AaronSchulz: Extension:ConfirmAccount is great
[22:07:19] <Grimnir>	TheFearow, if it makes you download a php file, it's probably because it's empty. try to download it, and you will probably find out its size is 0 bytes
[22:07:28] <TheFearow>	php5 is also blank.
[22:07:35] <AaronSchulz>	ta
[22:07:39] <TheFearow>	Grimnir: I already stated its trying to get me to download an 0byte file
[22:07:56] <Grimnir>	oh, sorry... i missed that...
[22:08:00] <TheFearow>	I have display errors, log errors, and error reporting set to E_ALL
[22:08:36] <TheFearow>	going to index.php is download 0byte, going to index.php5 or just the config dir is blank file but in browser
[22:08:44] <amidaniel>	Hrm .. can you open up the index.php file and look to see if it appears correct? May have been a problem with an svn co or something screwing up 
[22:10:29] <TheFearow>	This is downloading the packaged version, and I have oepend index.php in dreamweaver and textedit and it even shows some content in design view.
[22:11:50] <amidaniel>	Would you mind redownloading the files again? This sounds like you have a screwy file somewhere that's sending headers early, etc.
[22:12:04] <amidaniel>	Also, have you run php apps on this machine before without problems?
[22:12:31] <TheFearow>	Yep, its a server used 99% for PHP/MySQL dev
[22:13:07] <TheFearow>	I'll re-extract - I did notice upon attempting to manually create localsettings it complained about not finding something but thats likely my fault
[22:14:46] <TheFearow>	Same result on re-extraction. Can someone zip and upload latest SVN version? I prefer SVN, but behind a restrictive proxy.
[22:15:53] <amidaniel>	Sure, just a sec
[22:17:02] <TheFearow>	Thanks. First time ive had annoying problems with a mw install :p
[22:18:16] <TheFearow>	Same thing upon redownload of release ver
[22:21:12] <amidaniel>	http://cs.unm.edu/~dccannon/phase3_200710231619.zip
[22:21:30] <amidaniel>	should be uptodate with some crap in there you don't need ;)
[22:21:38] <TheFearow>	Thanks
[22:22:41] <TheFearow>	All my wikis run latest SVN, but using proxy right now and my sites are down so I cant steal it from them (never trust non-tech friends to upgrade PHP).
[22:22:51] <amidaniel>	heh
[22:51:58] <amidaniel>	TheFearow: Any luck?
[23:10:32] <grahampage>	Hi all, I'm wonder why when I use a parser hook through $wgExtensionFunctions and it is breaking the [edit] links on my sections, when you click one it says the section does not exist... is this a bug?
[23:15:05] *NotACow 	abuses bit vectors
[23:15:11] <jlerner>	AaronSchulz: q about Extension:ConfirmAccount
[23:15:22] <AaronSchulz>	bit vectors?
[23:15:36] <jlerner>	is there a way to save all the user-entered information
[23:15:43] <jlerner>	it seems to get deleted on account approval
[23:16:24] <AaronSchulz>	the extra stuff is private, and only there for confirmation, so it gets deleted
[23:16:36] <AaronSchulz>	NotACow: meow meow
[23:16:43] <NotACow>	AaronSchulz: w00t
[23:17:06] <AaronSchulz>	ahh, I love my IMVU character
[23:17:12] <NotACow>	AaronSchulz: imvu?
[23:17:23] <AaronSchulz>	wikipedia it!
[23:17:48] <AaronSchulz>	jlerner: so, no way short of changing the code
[23:17:52] <AaronSchulz>	and where would you dump it?
[23:18:55] <NotACow>	AaronSchulz: i'm too lazy :)
[23:19:15] *NotACow 	is trying to replace the permissions table with an actual table :)
[23:22:17] <jlerner>	AaronSchulz: ok, thanks
[23:24:32] *NotACow 	is probably going to get the logic on this backwards and make it so sysops can't edit
[23:25:46] <amidaniel>	weee
[23:26:35] <grahampage>	Why would running text through a parser extension break all [edit] links?
[23:26:41] <CIA-36>	03downchuck * r26912 10/branches/mlmw/maintenance/ (3 files in 3 dirs): MySQL installation fixes
[23:30:58] <CIA-36>	03downchuck * r26913 10/branches/mlmw/includes/SkinTemplate.php: Set namespace hack (for null language)