}} - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9240 +comment (10jidanni) [01:49:02] 03(mod) [[Section::...]] variables - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1605 +comment (10jidanni) [01:54:18] 04(REOPENED) Watchlist: Say what "time period" you are talking about when days=0 ("All") - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17867 +patch (10jidanni) [01:54:42] is anyone familiar with DPL? How can I disable the "&" operator? I just don't believe it really can't find e.g. category=AT&T [01:57:08] tried AT%26T and/or AT&T ? [01:58:01] both work in links at least: [[AT%26T]] [[AT&T]] [01:59:32] tried %26, .26. & gives me a heavy error :) [02:27:18] 03(mod) [[Section::...]] variables - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1605 +comment (10jidanni) [02:31:22] hi,all [02:31:34] who know how to use external authplug? [02:32:40] Hello everyone, I have a user, Redirect_fixer, that is kind of causing some havoc on my site. Is this some kind of built in script? [02:52:44] pfruan: which one are you trying to use again? [02:53:57] 03(mod) Microsoft SQL Server/MSSQL support (tracking) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9767 (10dj.bauch) [02:56:22] 03(mod) Microsoft SQL Server/MSSQL support (tracking) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9767 (10dj.bauch) [02:58:09] eghjaytee: yes, and we disabled it for the same reason [02:58:49] I'm not sure how that's done though :\ [03:07:31] eghjaytee: there's a config setting [03:25:50] How is postgres support in MediaWiki? [03:33:34] chuck: far from perfect [03:34:39] a lot of extensions are broken, several core mediawiki features are broken, and we often have new issues and regressions after new releases [03:34:58] Eh.. that's too bad [03:35:46] Somebody here who use Extension:Semantic Forms? [03:36:47] I'm going to branch 1.15 based on the current wikimedia version [03:37:01] TimStarling, No chance for this one for 1.15 then ? https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16129 [03:37:05] driving me mad that one :) [03:37:14] we can't really release a month of unreviewed, untested changes [03:37:15] if there were somebody working full-time on other database support it'd be different [03:37:36] it's not a full-time job [03:38:23] can 1.16 be 2.0 instead? *bounces* [03:38:24] but there could be a few months of work in it, I guess [03:38:28] I'd fix bug 16129, but I'm packing at the moment [03:38:46] also I have no idea what the problem is. [03:38:58] werdna, off somewhere nice, or you mean you have a gun? :) [03:39:16] Tim: gonna at least backport a few things like broken deletion of old images? [03:39:18] buzz_: is the fix in svn? [03:39:33] TimStarling, no. it is unfixed as of yet. [03:39:35] i think [03:39:40] Splarka: is old image deletion broken on wikimedia right now? [03:39:49] buzz_: then no [03:39:54] *Splarka looks [03:40:05] its a nasty one though. broke my entire front page for a day until i worked out what was cuasing it [03:40:07] Tim: ues [03:40:13] Yes, even, sigh [03:40:14] with the help of werdna [03:40:25] TimStarling: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/File:Wiki.png [delete] -> http://www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?title=File:Wiki.png&action=delete&oldimage%5B%5D=20050906184215%21Wiki.png [03:40:35] that %5B%5D breaks the delete URL (trivial workaround) [03:42:07] I search a form extension, where it is possible to use dropdown selection and a user who use the form can add a value to the dropdown when it is not in the list [03:42:19] Splarka: is there a bug report for it? [03:43:43] somewhere [03:43:49] it was fixed, but I believe the fix was reverted [03:44:43] https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18171 [03:44:57] faster than my dialup [03:45:26] Seems to be fixed ok [03:45:39] hmm, would you also backport the live hacks? that is, "current wikimedia version" would include those? [03:46:34] yes [03:47:13] 04(REOPENED) Image Revision [oldimage] Deletion - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18171 +comment (10tstarling) [03:47:13] werdna: ahh, okay, the status is now 'okay', it was 'fixme' for a few weeks [03:47:38] http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:Code/MediaWiki/48837#code-changes [03:48:30] but brion didn't comment on why it is now 'okay', hmm [03:50:20] 03(NEW) Release MediaWiki 1.15 (tracking) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18629 enhancement; Normal; MediaWiki: General/Unknown; (tstarling) [03:50:47] 03(mod) Release MediaWiki 1.15 (tracking) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18629 (10tstarling) [03:51:00] 03(mod) Image Revision [oldimage] Deletion - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18171 (10tstarling) [03:51:45] I would also like to see 16129 fixed before release, but it seems a doozie (mostly because if it was easy it'd probably be fixed by now, heh) [03:55:43] really, the problem there is that we use the same object for configuration as for parse context [03:56:10] we should create a parse context object at the start of each parse, but use the same configuration object each time [03:57:51] do you have a list of backports started? (example: r49775 ) [03:58:05] (and if not, should we add them to that tracking bug as comments?) [03:58:16] you can put them on the tracking bug if you like [03:59:00] what is the bugzilla magic for linking to revisions: r##### or rev##### or rev ##### or something? [04:00:07] r#### seems to work [04:01:11] *Splarka makes a little list [04:02:42] 03(mod) Message handling in parser - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17329 +comment (10tstarling) [04:02:49] *werdna starts transcoding about 60 GB of dvds [04:03:23] It's about 8 DVDs, so it'll take probably <10 GB once compressed [04:03:29] way easier than taking 8 DVDs overseas [04:04:43] werdna: 49685 and 49730 backportable? two live hacks from last week [04:04:52] "fix silly typo" "* Fixed unblocking of hidden names (bug 18543) * Added permission check" [04:05:23] ask aaron [04:05:30] I just checked them [04:05:46] and tested them [04:06:07] I don't remember the impact, but it seemed important enough to live-merge. [04:07:28] seem a bit Wikimedia specific but were changes to core [04:07:53] I can't parse that [04:08:55] 03tstarling * r50059 10/branches/REL1_15/: Branch for MediaWiki 1.15 [04:09:04] *Splarka explodes that-> "They seem a bit edge-cased to Wikimedia's specific setup, but were changes to core files" [04:09:13] two more: r49222 r49191 [04:11:12] hmm, domas did a lot of live hacking to recentchanges and watchlists, optimizing them so they didn't kill everything when you tried to load 5000 [04:11:23] but that's probably more a feature than a bug/regression [04:11:53] 03tstarling * r50060 10/branches/REL1_15/phase3/: Branch for MediaWiki 1.15. Copying from the version currently deployed on Wikimedia: r48811. Will backport important fixes committed since then. [04:12:11] like http://svn.wikimedia.org/viewvc/mediawiki?view=rev&revision=48983 [04:12:38] TimStarling: At some point I need to check if I've fixed all the change tags filesorts [04:12:45] those are fixes that should probably be backported [04:13:50] > 17:43 brion: live-merging r48923 to make CURL timeout for upload-by-url configurable [04:13:52] feature, heh [04:14:12] ok, you'd better add a comment to the tracking bug if you find any that need to be backported [04:14:55] I have a list of 8 so far... [04:15:54] * 22:45 logmsgbot: brion synchronized php-1.5/includes/specials/SpecialBlockip.php 'to r48899 - fixes for hiding' [04:16:22] 03tstarling * r50061 10/branches/REL1_15/extensions/: Branch for MediaWiki 1.15 from trunk r48811. [04:16:30] I am not sure what he meant by this, the latest rev on that one was http://svn.wikimedia.org/viewvc/mediawiki?view=rev&revision=48892 [04:21:38] 03(mod) Release MediaWiki 1.15 (tracking) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18629 +comment (10agarrett) [04:25:57] *Splarka leaves a big comment [04:26:03] 03(mod) Release MediaWiki 1.15 (tracking) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18629 (10herd) [04:26:12] that's all I could find interesting [04:26:14] thanks [04:27:00] np [04:28:11] 03(mod) Release MediaWiki 1.15 (tracking) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18629 (10agarrett) [04:28:57] I think Brion and I stopped fixing things and went to sleep at r48825 [04:29:03] damn, aaron is the king of "live sync this so I can test it" [04:49:32] 03(mod) Release MediaWiki 1.15 (tracking) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18629 (10tstarling) [04:49:44] 03(mod) lighttpd + sqlite installation failure - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17611 (10tstarling) [05:06:22] 03(mod) Release MediaWiki 1.15 (tracking) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18629 (10tstarling) [05:07:28] /* feed links */ [05:07:28] -a.feedlink { [05:07:28] +a.feedlink, a.feedlink { [05:07:55] does that change specificity? [05:08:33] 14(DUP) New variable {{SECTIONNAME}}, analogous to {{PAGENAME}} - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=12434 +comment (10jidanni) [05:09:03] *werdna grabs luch [05:11:04] maybe they meant #feedlinks a ? [05:11:29] er.. no.. hmm [05:12:24] TimStarling: where is this revision/patch? [05:12:44] wikimedia live copy [05:12:55] that shouldn't actually end up changing anything, unless there is another non-comma-delimited selector before it [05:13:14] skins/common/common_rtl.css [05:13:18] like say you had #bodyContent\na.feedlink {} then it would change something [05:14:27] ahh [05:14:28] http://svn.wikimedia.org/viewvc/mediawiki/trunk/phase3/skins/common/common_rtl.css?r1=46474&r2=46488 [05:14:30] it was fixed [05:14:45] but not live merged since it isn't broken [05:14:51] http://svn.wikimedia.org/viewvc/mediawiki?view=rev&revision=46488 [05:17:15] is it possible to place a leaderboard size iframe at the bottom of monobook skin? [05:18:09] http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Hooks/SkinAfterBottomScripts ? [05:18:56] thanks... [05:19:14] im reading that now [05:21:35] just commtting a few things that are sitting around in my working copy [05:21:41] 03tstarling * r50062 10/trunk/phase3/includes/Status.php: Sanitize cleanCallback on wakeup. Extra security check for APIs like SecurePoll/auth-api.php. [05:23:31] sorry but where can i browse the mediawiki source online? i can never find it with google when i forget the URL [05:23:38] 03tstarling * r50063 10/trunk/phase3/includes/db/Database.php: Log function name for SHOW PROCESSLIST query in getLag(). [05:25:06] hippietrail: bookmark http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/SVN [05:25:44] "You can browse the code structure using the [http://svn.wikimedia.org/viewvc/mediawiki web interface]" [05:25:48] 03tstarling * r50064 10/trunk/phase3/includes/api/ApiQuerySiteinfo.php: Add lots more information to the siteinfo query. Based on the JS variable list. [05:25:59] thanks splarka. sometimes i change browsers or reinstall or etc etc etc [05:26:09] k, just remember: mw:SVN [05:26:29] or !svn on mwbot [05:26:31] aha easy [05:28:17] 03tstarling * r50065 10/trunk/phase3/index.php: Commit master changes on all ajax requests. There's no reason that this should be the responsibility of the callee. Causes annoying bugs when omitted. [05:29:34] 03tstarling * r50066 10/trunk/phase3/config/index.php: Don't double-escape RootPW error. [05:30:27] there's a link from svn.wikimedia.org [05:31:53] most software-related things are under mediawiki, some like bugzilla are under wikipedia and svn is wikimedia [05:32:33] bugzilla is wikimedia.org [05:32:47] the only thing at mediawiki.org is the website [05:33:01] we could easily add some redirects though [05:33:54] must be getting old [05:34:41] yeah there is a redirect for bugzilla from wikipedia to wikimedia. for some reason i always remembered it at wikipedia and it worked. maybe there's a link from some page [05:35:03] 03tstarling * r50067 10/trunk/phase3/includes/RefreshLinksJob.php: Wait for slaves after each page (from live patch). [05:35:52] wanted to see how sitematrix is implemented to know whether to get that info from the db on toolserver or via the api [05:36:07] it's from the configuration [05:36:10] not the DB [05:36:49] aha so api is always the best way [05:37:23] depends on what information you want, and what you're using it for [05:37:27] im about to file a feature request to be able to ask for partial sitematrix via the api for say just wiktionary or just one language [05:37:49] im using it to find out which language codes have wiktionaries [05:38:32] you can just get all.dblist from noc.wikimedia.org [05:38:50] in translation tables we link to the native wiktionary of foreign terms, if they have a wiktionary [05:38:51] http://noc.wikimedia.org/conf/all.dblist [05:39:33] nocnocnocnocnoc ? (-: [05:40:22] WHO's there? [05:41:06] so what is noc? [05:41:24] a noc is a small furry animal [05:41:37] it is named after its call [05:41:51] network operations center :P [05:41:53] it can be heard in the morning, calling for mates, "nocnocnocnoc" [05:42:19] *werdna wonders if TimStarling was out too late last night [05:42:41] *hippietrail pours TimStarling another drink [05:43:13] http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://noc.wikimedia.org/ [05:43:19] it's hardly a new joke [05:44:58] So apparently it's been there since July 2006 [05:46:13] funny ... for me it looks like a defacement ... but i guess its the original content [05:46:37] larousse went down, we didn't have backups of the old website [05:47:07] with http://noc.wikimedia.org/conf/all.dblist it might not be trivial to tell which prefixes are languages and which are special... such as specieswiki [05:47:44] hippietrail: if you just want to look for wiktionaries, egrep '^\w+wiktionary$' [05:48:00] and then chop off the 'wiktionary' and you have the ISO language codes [05:48:35] werdna yes but some few are not iso codes such as 'tokipona' and 'basic' [05:48:44] TimStarling: I don't know about others, but I usually use svn merge -c, not svn up (with reference to https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18629#c4) [05:48:55] no simplewiktionary ?? [05:49:03] hippietrail: well, I'm sure somebody of your skill and experience can find a workaround :) [05:49:08] *Splarka wants dumbed down word defitions [05:49:10] simple not basic sorry [05:49:22] oh, there is [05:49:44] svn up is probably better, if there are no intervening changes [05:50:14] because you don't get conflicts, and it's obvious where the change came from [05:50:26] swine flu mostly concerns me because I suspect the UK will prefer citizens over noncitizens in medical care :/ [05:50:33] (random comment) [05:50:39] I'm currently analysing the diff for merges [05:52:38] 03tstarling * r50068 10/trunk/phase3/ (4 files in 4 dirs): Assorted minor live patches to command-line scripts. [05:52:51] morning [05:53:13] hi Nikerabbit [05:53:49] hey [05:53:57] yo [05:55:24] hey AaronSchulz [05:57:21] AaronSchulz, when you have some free time: https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18629#c2 [05:59:42] *hm* offtopic, werdna ... but its better to be foreign and pay cash than to wait, when I recall medcare in uk [06:00:15] 03tstarling * r50069 10/trunk/phase3/includes/ExternalStoreDB.php: Small-scale data loss logged on Wikimedia along these lines: invalid URL written to old_text with the user thinking their edit has succeeded. This change should prevent that scenario. [06:01:28] kraehe: hmm, travel insurance would cover it I assume [06:02:56] they had a simple system for seeing doctors when I was in the UK [06:03:34] you dial the doctor's number at 7:55am, get answering machine [06:03:39] you hang up, hit redial [06:03:59] at 8:00am, you start getting engaged signals instead, continue redialling [06:04:20] then with a bit of luck, you connect to the receptionist before the appointment book for the day fills up [06:04:26] the open hours for appointments are necessarily very narrow, so they can claim to accomodate "everyone who called" [06:05:01] then when I went there, they didn't even ask me for ID, they just treated me as an NHS patient [06:06:16] the Australia/UK reciprocal health care agreement allows you to be treated by the NHS in the UK, but they didn't actually bother to confirm that I was australian [06:07:01] *Splarka makes note to adopt australian accent when visiting UK and sick [06:07:16] in Australia, UK citizens can apply for a reciprocal health care card, which I believe works like a medicare card [06:07:26] but Angela has never bothered [06:08:00] she could apply for expenses on a case-by-case basis if she had to go to hospital or something [06:08:50] yay, laptop now in INDIANAPOLIS, IN [06:11:20] [obligatory] http://xkcd.com/281/ [06:11:52] AaronSchulz: wait, wasn't it in Alaska yesterday? [06:12:13] yep, china -> alaska -> indiana [06:12:28] that's an odd route [06:25:24] if it was good enough for the native americans, it should be good enough for your laptop [06:40:21] headesplode! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exploding_head_syndrome [06:41:08] http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/YourHeadASplode [06:44:54] AaronSchulz: setUsernameBitfields looks kind of scary [06:45:24] like break the whole site and leave nothing but a smoking mess scary [06:45:51] I always thought it was "smoking crater" [06:45:56] have you discussed it with Brion or anyone? [06:46:26] *Splarka prefers glassy fields [06:48:04] hello? [06:50:08] mmm, there was some interserver lag for a sec there [06:50:15] *AaronSchulz was looking through codereview [06:50:40] well, it was OKed a while back [06:53:22] do you think it's a good idea? [06:55:51] already heavily used by oversights [06:55:53] 06:15 < TimStarling> the Australia/UK reciprocal health care agreement allows you to be treated by the NHS in the UK, but they didn't actually bother to confirm that I was australian [06:56:04] Does it work for people on youth mobility visas, though? [06:56:09] have you ever tried it with a user with 3000 edits? [06:56:11] seems fine [06:56:19] surely it'd cause tens of seconds of replication lag [06:56:47] wouldn't be much worse than renameuser [06:56:53] yes it would [06:56:57] because renameuser does it as a job [06:57:08] instead of doing three thousand in one go [06:57:09] no, not until there are 10000 edits [06:57:11] renameuser is f***ed up [06:57:20] renameuser still does it in batches, right? [06:57:24] that's no reason to commit more crap code [06:58:53] renameuser can and does cause problems [06:58:55] werdna: no batches for < 10000 [06:59:32] in any case, I assume that hiding users isn't used for users with more than a few hundred edits [06:59:39] perhaps it would be prudent to enforce that in code [07:00:06] and then if it needs to be done, somebody can contact a shell user [07:00:34] what number? [07:02:01] I don't know, make it configurable [07:02:15] ugh [07:04:01] RenameUserJob needs to be rewritten [07:05:03] we're talking about having non-MySQL job queue systems [07:05:18] network based daemons [07:05:28] it's not really appropriate to have job types that let you destroy the whole database [07:05:43] what if someone accidentally forgot to firewall the job queue system? [07:06:39] Q Wanted to make my 'welcome template' work for all users, so put "please drop me a line some time on [[User talk:{{REVISIONUSER}}|my own talk page]]. [07:07:19] ^obv problem I realise *now* {{REVISIONUSER}} is last editor; no way to put the person making the page in permanently? [07:07:50] {{CURRENTUSER}} will likely never be core or enabled on WMF [07:08:05] but you can fake it with javascript or one of several extensions [07:08:51] if however, you mean the opposite... {{REVISIONUSER}} for hte one making the revision, just subst it [07:09:02] [[User talk:{{subst:REVISIONUSER}}|my own talk page]] [07:10:20] Splarka yes, I mean the user subst'ing the template onto the talk page; so yes, I see - subst the var and when the template is subst'd the 'poster' will be in there permanently, yes? [07:10:29] yah [07:10:38] it is very similar to ~~~, though not auto-linked [07:11:03] you could have a parameter where the editing user inserts their name [07:11:14] yep makes sense; I use ~~~~~~ [07:11:16] ...for the sig [07:11:19] {{User:Chzz/welcome|me=Tim}} [07:11:57] or isn't that cool enough? [07:12:10] but users are stupid! [07:12:16] less thinking = better, or some such [07:12:16] TimStarling thx yes, an alternative; but trying to keep it simple/short etc. I think the above is neater - automatic = less chance of typo [07:12:24] however, http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:Code/MediaWiki/48149 revisionuser is 1.15+ [07:12:40] I'll grant you automatic, but neater? [07:12:42] chzz: with tim's method, no subst is needed [07:12:52] a compromise would be: [07:13:01] I would say ugly and impossible for anyone to understand [07:13:28] {{subst:User:Chzz/w}} which contains {{User:Chzz/welcome|me={{subst:REVISIONUSER}}}} [07:13:28] Splarka well, we'll always want to subst the welcome anyway - we want the new user to see the code of the welcome, not some transcluded template. That's the policy on en, anyway [07:13:44] ahh, alwayssubst, gotcha [07:15:00] I'm assuming even the thickest users know how to type their own name [07:15:05] so your 1st answer looks fine I think; just {{subst:REVISIONUSER}} in the template [07:15:10] maybe that's not true, eh? [07:15:26] TimStarling Nah, def not. [07:15:43] do both [07:16:01] I just answered a helpme in a section entitled "== What is X ==" - which is the sample given in the 'how to ask for help' instructions [07:16:17] {{{mysig|[[User:{{{me|{{subst:REVISIONUSER}}}}}|{{{me|{{subst:REVISIONUSER}}}}}]]}}} [07:16:39] ah yes [07:16:48] make it so that anyone can use your welcome template [07:16:58] yes [07:17:06] but nobody can alter it and adapt it as their own without making their eyes bleed [07:17:19] good plan Splarka [07:17:34] *Splarka wonders who invented this syntax [07:17:34] well; actually I encourage ppl to copy it and make their own version [07:17:47] ...all the more reason to make the coding good [07:17:54] I just invented it, I didn't think you'd be compelled to actually use it [07:17:56] Splarka somebody with braces? [07:18:02] :-) [07:18:03] I thought users would stop and think... [07:18:18] "hey, maybe it isn't such a good idea to fill up this screen with braces and " [07:19:51] *Splarka snickers [07:20:07] it's called job security [07:20:13] 03aaron * r50070 10/trunk/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Tweaked account hiding & renaming limits [07:20:29] make end-use easy, and the backend a nightmare [07:20:30] job security through obscurity, eh? [07:20:47] though it doesn't really make sense for volunteers eh [07:22:03] ty Splarka / TimStarling - I'll use that. Now I can go back to c# parsing XML from the API which, by comparison, should be a doddle :-) [07:22:52] "MediaWiki syntax: 8 years of inspring people to go learn C derived languages instead" [07:23:25] {{{{{{fact}}}}}} [07:23:58] now see, parameter name based on the parameter value of parameter named 'fact' [07:24:13] Splarka: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_standard <--way too short for a basic article :( [07:24:40] {{sofixit}} [07:24:47] hehe [07:24:53] NOTDIC ? [07:25:27] *Splarka is reminded of.. Random != funny And who wrote RandomSelection? >_> [07:26:48] http://farm1.static.flickr.com/119/294168009_b25decaddf.jpg [07:28:58] needs a catch [07:30:03] 03(mod) Release MediaWiki 1.15 (tracking) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18629 (10tstarling) [07:34:51] 03(mod) Indicate in output whether an interwiki link is marked local - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18562 (10happy-melon) [07:38:05] werdna: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Voice_of_All/General_Bullshit_Defense [07:38:11] one more til I hit 20 :) [07:41:36] #20: Assuming that anyone that uses a very common logical logical trap or fallacy is automatically wrong. Not everyone is completely cogent in... saying stuff. [07:42:04] oop, logical trap/logical fallacy, not logical logical [07:42:07] sounds like ad logicam [07:42:08] (proof) [07:42:13] Already mentioned [07:42:20] tldnr [07:43:05] but not exactly the same [07:43:49] it would boil down to "using lists of general bullshit defense to defeat any argument" [07:51:22] Splarka: depends what you mean by "defeat" :D [07:51:55] isn't that the chewbacca defense? [07:52:42] no, though taken to an extreme, it would be a clintonian defense [07:53:32] "It isn't my fault, I was bookended by 12 years of bush" [07:54:24] Splarka: though that gives me an idea of what to add [07:55:50] skipping logic steps can be misinterpreted as fallacies [07:59:51] AaronSchulz: "Show your work" ? [08:05:32] Hey, I found out that Semantic MediaWiki is what I've been looking for since a long time... :) Would people that know about these things rather recommend to install standard SMW or SMW+ ? [08:05:49] aka, what are pros and cons? [08:08:25] you might try #semanticmediawiki [08:36:10] is it possible to define a template with variable number of arguments? [08:40:09] kraehe: the number of arguments is not fixed or limited. however, there is no way to loop over arguments. [08:40:44] I search a form extension, where it is possible to use dropdown selection and a user who use the form can add a value to the dropdown when it is not in the list [08:41:03] so its not possible to display/expand the variable number of arguments, Duesentrieb ? [08:41:25] there are some parser function extensions that implement looping... but eek, scary [08:41:35] 03(mod) Release MediaWiki 1.15 (tracking) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18629 +comment (10roan.kattouw) [08:41:52] look for 'foreach' and 'loop' on http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Parser_function_extensions [08:41:59] kraehe: not per default or with standard extension.s yes, htere are extensions that allow it, to warying degree. [08:42:13] kraehe: be warned that this effectively makes templates a programming language. [08:42:37] this is... scary... [08:43:03] kraehe: perhaps you would be better of writing a simple extension to do what you want [08:43:12] *Splarka pokles TimStarling who enjoys saying how apocalyptic this is [08:44:09] http://wiki.kephra.de/extensions/SecondSettings.txt <- btw extension ... my shameless plug on progress of (ab)using mediawiki as a cloud database for secondlife [08:44:41] noob need some help with updating a wiki page with a program [08:44:51] !bots [08:44:51] --mwbot-- I don't know anything about "bots". [08:44:56] bah, solly bot [08:45:04] !api [08:45:04] --mwbot-- The MediaWiki API provides direct, high-level access to the data contained in the MediaWiki databases. Client programs should be able to use the API to login, get data, and post changes. Find out more at . For client libraries in various languages, see . [08:45:14] Mio: see there [08:45:40] !bots alias api [08:45:40] --mwbot-- Successfully added alias: bots [08:46:06] I think !bots would be better aliased to !bot [08:46:19] which links to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Creating_a_bot and such [08:46:38] the API and bots are not synonymous [08:46:42] !bot [08:46:42] --mwbot-- A bot is an automatic processes which interacts with MediaWiki as though they were human editors designed to make easier automated actions which are arbitrary to make manually. For an overview how to create a bot and a list of known frameworks can be found on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Creating_a_bot [08:47:00] theres also a pywikipedia entry for that bot framework [08:47:03] Splarka: yes, true, though api clinet code is very very closely related to bots :) [08:47:09] !bots del [08:47:09] --mwbot-- Successfully removed keyword: bots [08:47:14] !bots alias bot [08:47:14] --mwbot-- Successfully added alias: bots [08:47:31] *kraehe wonders, where I could find better documentation of the $action part of userCan hook ... I think some $action like 'raw' or 'submit' do not exist ... how is the url action mapped into $action of userCan hook [08:47:31] I've never used the API code with a bot, heh [08:47:44] well, that's wehat it's there for [08:47:45] "so what, who are you?" [08:47:51] but that's also the problem with the huge bot püage: [08:47:53] false! [08:48:01] it doesn't even seem to have a link to the api clinet code page [08:48:02] your not one of the ones that scrape the html are you? [08:48:06] it is there for many things, a subset of which are bots [08:48:08] which should be the primary way to build bots. [08:48:38] Splarka: well, the edit api is for bots. queries cane be used for many things [08:48:42] I've written dozens of javascript features that use it [08:48:53] and many of those use api write [08:49:23] I've also submitted 18 bugzilla bugs concerning the API [08:49:37] driven purely from the POV of javascript ^_^ [08:51:00] 03(mod) Problem in edit with form - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18621 (10nahidshahin) [08:51:47] Splarka: OK, you are right, JS stuff too. that's quite close to bots though. [08:52:08] *Splarka bites Duesentrieb with his metal aperature [08:52:20] 03(mod) Watchlist: Say what "time period" you are talking about when days=0 ("All") - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17867 +comment (10jidanni) [08:53:18] -Duesentrieb :) look where ?? [08:53:36] hmm, really? no link to the api at all there? [08:53:48] *Splarka looks [08:53:49] Mio: and [08:54:58] 03(mod) $wgRCLinkDays perfect for SpecialWatchlist.php too - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17867 summary (10jidanni) [08:55:10] hmm [08:56:53] oop, you added it [08:57:33] [mw] User [[mw:User:Duesentrieb]] used edit summary "\b(excellent|wonderful|useful|keep up|go on|favorites|unknown)\b" [[mw:API]] (+54) Diff: http://www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?diff=252373&oldid=242049 "/* Useful Links */ [[w:Wikipedia:Creating_a_bot|Creating a Bot]] howto" [08:57:34] haha [08:57:59] Splarka: hm? [08:58:13] Splarka: yea, i cross-linked them [08:58:30] the cvn bots flagged on your edit because it contained 'useful' [08:59:26] wtf is cvnbot? [09:00:16] *Mio raises his hand :) anyone have any SxWiki code examples [09:01:26] *Mio started installing mediawiki monday and started php coding yesterday so feeling a little lost :) [09:01:37] Duesentrieb: http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Countervandalism_Network [09:02:01] the crazy people who watch all the IRC changes [09:02:07] Mio: so don't use php, it sucks for bots anyway :) [09:02:21] it actually sucks for most things [09:02:35] Splarka: oh, the vandal fighters. [09:05:02] can i have a quick example sql query to show the titles of pages in a given category please? [09:05:08] Duesentrieb :) it bots that I want to lookinto :) [09:05:57] 03(mod) Release MediaWiki 1.15 (tracking) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18629 +comment (10nospam) [09:06:08]