[00:14:26] <Simetrical>	Okay, time for me to try booting into my fancy new ext4 RAID1 setup with a copied root filesystem soon.
[00:14:31] *Simetrical 	braces to go down in flames
[00:14:44] *Mike_lifeguard 	films
[00:16:50] <Splarka>	It burst into flames! Get this scotty!
[00:18:09] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) Transfer of Mot�: lemmata from wa.wiki to wa.wikt - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17547  +comment (10rhalsell)
[00:19:27] <wikibugs>	04(REOPENED) Transfer of Mot�: lemmata from wa.wiki to wa.wikt - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17547  (10rhalsell)
[00:19:35] <Simetrical>	Off I go!
[00:20:31] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Transfer of Mot�: lemmata from wa.wiki to wa.wikt - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17547  (10rhalsell)
[00:24:44] <CIA-58>	03demon * r52333 10/branches/maintenance-work/ (4 files in 2 dirs): 
[00:24:44] <CIA-58>	* Move wfInitStats() to SiteStats::init(), update callers
[00:24:44] <CIA-58>	* Port initStats.php
[00:29:42] <dergringo>	Hi =)
[00:30:22] <dergringo>	Is it possible to detect the user configured interface language from inside a php script?
[00:31:48] <Mike_lifeguard>	I hope so, otherwise there'd be no point in setting it, since it couldn't have any effect :)
[00:31:56] <Mike_lifeguard>	how that's done though, I don't know
[00:33:13] <CIA-58>	03daniel * r52334 10/trunk/WikiWord/WikiWordIntegrator/src/ (55 files in 6 dirs): filter framework
[00:33:41] <Duesentrieb>	dergringo: $wgUser->getLanguage() or some such
[00:34:29] <dergringo>	Thanks
[00:35:53] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Unexpect behaviour when substing templates with substed parser functions. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8675  +comment (10herd)
[00:35:56] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Transcluded substitutions are treated as literals (neither transcluded nor substituted) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5453  +comment (10herd)
[00:36:13] <Splarka>	oh come on, I didn't even add a +comment, that was a straight up (DUP)
[00:36:30] <Splarka>	werdna: how come wikibugs always seems to get weirder ^_^
[00:37:56] <CIA-58>	03skizzerz * r52335 10/trunk/phase3/includes/Title.php: * follow-up to r52301: make it more clear what this loop is trying to accomplish (per suggestion by werdna on IRC).
[00:38:44] <Mike_lifeguard>	Splarka: there's an open bug... but nobody knows what the problem actually is
[00:38:49] <Mike_lifeguard>	it's like a poltergeist
[00:39:56] <Splarka>	go in to thelight@gmail.com, bugzilla-anne
[00:40:20] <Simetrical>	That failed . . . interestingly.
[00:40:32] *Simetrical 	tries to figure out how to get his monitor to work at the right resolution again
[00:42:46] <Betacommand>	is there a way to find all open bugs?
[00:44:45] <Splarka>	Betacommand: just that, all bugs that are new/reopened/assigned?
[00:44:56] <Splarka>	all products, all components?
[00:45:17] <Splarka>	https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/query.cgi?format=advanced   go here and click [search]
[00:45:37] <Splarka>	and/or try: https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/buglist.cgi?bug_status=NEW&bug_status=ASSIGNED&bug_status=REOPENED
[00:46:28] <Betacommand>	Splarka: thanks
[00:47:43] <Splarka>	mew
[00:55:21] <Simetrical>	It's fascinating how you can mess up your displays by fiddling with xrandr.
[00:55:47] <Duesentrieb>	fuck yea
[00:55:51] <Duesentrieb>	anyway, time for bed :)
[00:55:56] <Duesentrieb>	3am, wtf
[01:11:49] <Simetrical>	You know those adjustments you can make to the screen position and size by pushing buttons on your monitor?  This is the first time I've ever actually had a use for that.
[01:25:15] <^demon>	Simetrical: Got your comment.
[01:28:44] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Make user IDs more readily available with the API - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19195  (10herd)
[01:35:28] *Simetrical 	is a big fan of doing everything on trunk.
[01:35:55] *^demon 	thinks he's going to break stuff
[01:36:15] <Simetrical>	That's why it's best to break it on the first commit where you only changed one maintenance script. :)
[01:36:26] <Simetrical>	If you break everything at once, that's going to be more of a pain to fix.
[01:36:39] <Simetrical>	Are you really testing that all these maintenance scripts you're changing over still work?
[01:37:50] <^demon>	To some extent. I don't have the environment required to fully test all functionality of all of them. It's mostly a copy+paste with a bit of cleanup, so functionality shouldn't really change.
[01:38:02] <Simetrical>	Famous last words.  :)
[01:38:49] <^demon>	I'm doing a merge locally to look over.
[01:53:49] <^demon>	Simetrical: I think I can do a pretty low-conflict merge to core.
[01:53:58] <Simetrical>	Nobody changes maintenance/ much.
[01:54:36] *Simetrical 	is reading some technical info on Google Wave, and is a little less skeptical
[01:54:56] *Simetrical 	was pretty close to sold when he heard "open protocol intended to replace SMTP" :P
[01:57:05] <^demon>	Heh
[01:59:07] <Simetrical>	Suggested features for SMTP replacement: 1) authentication. 2) lines more than 80 characters.
[02:02:52] <CIA-58>	03demon * r52336 10/trunk/phase3/ (58 files in 6 dirs): (log message trimmed)
[02:02:52] <CIA-58>	Merge maintenance-work branch:
[02:02:52] <CIA-58>	* (bug 16322) Allow maint scripts to accept DB user/pass over input or params if no AdminSettings.php
[02:02:52] <CIA-58>	* (bug 18768) Remove AdminSettings.php from MediaWiki core
[02:02:52] <CIA-58>	* (bug 19157) createAndPromote error on bad password
[02:02:55] <CIA-58>	* (bug 14201) Create AdminSettings.php during wiki installation, in the same way as LocalSettings.php
[02:02:57] <CIA-58>	* Introduce new Maintenance class framework and port a good number of scripts over; the ones that are left are a little more complicated. Read the docs.
[02:04:52] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) Create AdminSettings.php during wiki installation, in the same way as LocalSettings.php - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=14201  +comment (10innocentkiller)
[02:04:54] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) Allow maint scripts to accept DB user/pass over input or params if no AdminSettings.php - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16322  +comment (10innocentkiller)
[02:04:58] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) Remove AdminSettings.php from MediaWiki core - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18768  +comment (10innocentkiller)
[02:05:07] <CIA-58>	03aaron * r52337 10/trunk/extensions/Renameuser/SpecialRenameuser_body.php: Handle log_user_text (bug 19359)
[02:05:35] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) createAndPromote error on bad password - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19157  +comment (10innocentkiller)
[02:05:41] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Maintenance script cleanup - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19133  (10innocentkiller)
[02:05:52] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) Ensure that RenameUser accounts for log_user_text - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19359  +comment (10JSchulz_4587)
[02:06:32] <Simetrical>	What's "false, true" do at the end of addParam()?  Boolean options like that are really hard to understand, you probably shouldn't use them.
[02:09:29] <^demon|afk>	Simetrical: $required, $needsValue
[02:09:44] <^demon|afk>	But yeah, I need to clean that up. And rename to addOption, for consistency
[02:11:20] <^demon|afk>	Anyway, going afk for awhile. Hopefully people will try things and break it.
[02:11:34] <^demon|afk>	Or find that it's not broken :)
[02:13:40] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) API tags links to Special:Search subpages with flag "missing" - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19370 minor; Normal; MediaWiki: API; (snottygobble)
[02:15:33] <OverlordQ>	beside syntax errors? ;)
[02:16:58] <brion>	take that, zh mysql search!
[02:17:05] <brion>	i think i got it working the way i want finally
[02:17:32] <mathieu__>	good night all
[02:17:48] <brion>	whee... now to make sure i didn't break it for serbian ;)
[02:21:27] <brion>	victory is mine!
[02:21:42] <brion>	jebus did someone touch every maint script?
[02:23:25] <Splarka>	<joke type="old">Okay, /maintenance/ show us on this doll where the bad demon touched you</joke>
[02:25:08] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) Bugs after Maintenance script rewrite - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19371 normal; Normal; MediaWiki: Maintenance scripts; (overlordq)
[02:28:09] <CIA-58>	03brion * r52338 10/trunk/phase3/ (5 files in 4 dirs): (log message trimmed)
[02:28:09] <CIA-58>	* (bug 8445) Multiple-character search terms are now handled properly for Chinese
[02:28:09] <CIA-58>	Big fixup for Chinese word breaks and variant conversions in the MySQL search backend...
[02:28:09] <CIA-58>	- removed redunant variant terms for Chinese, which forces all search indexing to canonical zh-hans
[02:28:09] <CIA-58>	- added parens to properly group variants for languages such as Serbian which do need them at search time
[02:28:11] <CIA-58>	- added quotes to properly group multi-word terms coming out of stripForSearch, as for Chinese where we segment up the characters. This is based on Language::hasWordBreaks() check.
[02:28:14] <CIA-58>	- also cleaned up LanguageZh_hans::stripForSearch() to just do segmentation and
[02:28:28] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) Multiple search terms are not enforced properly for Chinese - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8445  +comment (10brion)
[02:28:48] *Splarka 	installs a "Problem" light on wikibugs
[02:28:52] <CIA-58>	03dale * r52339 10/branches/new-upload/phase3/js2/mwEmbed/ (6 files in 5 dirs): updated archive.org timed text example
[02:29:28] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Bugs after Maintenance script rewrite - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19371  (10overlordq)
[02:40:37] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Remove AdminSettings.php from MediaWiki core - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18768  +comment (10jidanni)
[02:45:56] <brion>	hrm
[02:45:58] <brion>	Notice: Undefined variable: self in /Library/WebServer/Documents/trunk/includes/Setup.php on line 160
[02:46:11] <brion>	who the fuck did this rewrite?
[02:46:37] <brion>	don't commit it if nothing works please :)
[02:46:51] <brion>	revert time...
[02:47:11] <charitwo>	:o
[02:47:37] <Splarka>	"oh s(c|n)ap!"
[02:49:39] <CIA-58>	03brion * r52340 10/trunk/phase3/ (58 files in 6 dirs): 
[02:49:39] <CIA-58>	Revert r52336 "Merge maintenance-work branch:"
[02:49:39] <CIA-58>	Seems to have broken a bunch of stuff. Don't commit giant non-critical changes that break Setup.php and all maint scripts. Thanks!
[02:49:55] <brion>	^demon|afk: what's that thing meant for anyway?
[02:51:28] <^demon|afk>	brion: The maintenance overhaul?
[02:53:35] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) updateSearchIndex has MySQLisms - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19372 normal; Normal; MediaWiki: Maintenance scripts; (overlordq)
[02:54:13] <brion>	^demon|afk: yeah
[02:54:49] <^demon|afk>	I was trying to do a general code cleanup for the maintenance scripts in general. I see the problem with $self in Setup.
[02:55:43] <Skizzerz>	brion: btw, what's the chance of extending the hooks system to work with non-php code? :P
[02:56:10] <brion>	Skizzerz: you could make a php shunt i suppose which calls an external prog :)
[02:56:53] *Skizzerz 	would be doing it mainly for fun... it'd be kinda cool to see a working mediawiki extension written in python or something
[02:57:12] <^demon|afk>	brion: As far as I've been able to tell and test, the scripts themselves have been working fine post-cleanup. 
[02:58:14] <OverlordQ>	^demon|afk: see bug 19371
[02:59:00] <^demon|afk>	OverlordQ: Got it.
[02:59:26] <brion>	whee :D
[02:59:50] <^demon|afk>	Just needs some more cleanup :)
[03:00:26] <brion>	Skizzerz: the main issue is that these languages don't generally have a way to cleanly interact, so you need to shell out or marshal values around very awkwardly; it's unlikely to perform very well for something that's gonna run frequently.
[03:01:01] <Simetrical>	brion, clearly we should switch to Parrot.
[03:01:06] <brion-away>	heheheh
[03:01:07] <Skizzerz>	yeah, I was just thinking about how such scripts would be able to access methods of globals
[03:01:09] <brion-away>	dinners
[03:01:25] <Simetrical>	Skizzerz, they can pass strings back and forth, that's about it.
[03:01:50] <Skizzerz>	well, it'd be a lot of bouncing back and forth
[03:02:16] <Skizzerz>	but you could pass serialized strings that could be eval()'ed or whatnot into something useful on the other end
[03:02:48] <Skizzerz>	of course, eval is evil
[03:03:41] <Simetrical>	The idea of Parrot is to have a common bytecode and interpreter for many scripted languages, with only the bytecode compiler differing.
[03:03:54] <Simetrical>	So you could hypothetically call one language's libraries from another.
[03:04:17] <Simetrical>	I don't think it's usable yet for existing languages, though.
[03:04:22] <Simetrical>	But it's a pretty cool idea.
[03:04:25] <Skizzerz>	darn
[03:04:36] <Skizzerz>	and I was so looking forward to writing something useful in lolcode
[03:04:55] <Simetrical>	There's no reason PHP, Python, Perl, Ruby, etc. should all reimplement all the stupid details like garbage collection and exceptions separately.
[03:08:25] <CIA-58>	03demon * r52341 10/branches/maintenance-work/maintenance/ (9 files): (bug 19371) Bugs after Maintenance script rewrite
[03:08:53] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) Bugs after Maintenance script rewrite - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19371  +comment (10innocentkiller)
[03:11:31] <Skizzerz>	Simetrical: but then you can't have fun error messages like "unexpected T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM"
[03:11:52] <Simetrical>	Skizzerz, that one is more fun for me than most, because I know Hebrew.  :P
[03:12:14] <Simetrical>	פעמים נקודותים
[03:12:18] <Skizzerz>	sometimes I purposely trigger it just to mess with people :P
[03:23:40] <CIA-58>	03demon * r52342 10/branches/maintenance-work/ (includes/Setup.php maintenance/Maintenance.php): $self doesn't exist anymore. Add getName() method to Maintenance for this.
[03:51:22] <CIA-58>	03aude * r52343 10/trunk/extensions/SlippyMap/ (8 files): new code, split into class files
[04:38:15] <CIA-58>	03aude * r52344 10/trunk/extensions/SlippyMap/SlippyMap.class.php: static map fixes
[04:59:08] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) HTTP 500 Error when loading some articles - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19373 normal; Normal; Wikimedia: General/Unknown; (public.wiki)
[05:04:09] <Nikerabbit>	morning
[05:05:49] <fn][>	how do I get the infobox on the right side, similar to this? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stargate_atlantis
[05:20:56] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Upgrade to the latest version of GeSHi (1.0.8) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10967  (10tstarling)
[05:25:46] <CIA-58>	03tstarling * r52345 10/trunk/extensions/SyntaxHighlight_GeSHi/SyntaxHighlight_GeSHi.class.php: Added a profiling section for the parser hook.
[05:28:27] <Splarka>	ooh
[05:28:54] <Splarka>	Tim, while you're in there, what parts of the html returned are from the extension, rather than GeSHi itself?
[05:29:36] <Nikerabbit>	the wrapper spans/divs I guess
[05:29:43] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Multiple search terms are not enforced properly for Chinese - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8445  +comment (10hippytrail)
[05:29:47] <Nikerabbit>	if you want to fix teh classes, it should be possible
[05:30:44] <TimStarling>			if ( $enclose === GESHI_HEADER_NONE ) {
[05:30:44] <TimStarling>				$out = '<span class="'.$lang.' source-'.$lang.'"> '.$out . '</span>';
[05:30:44] <TimStarling>			} else {
[05:30:44] <TimStarling>				$out = '<div dir="ltr" style="text-align: left;">' . $out . '</div>';
[05:30:44] <TimStarling>			}
[05:30:52] <Splarka>	right
[05:30:54] <TimStarling>	just that, pretty much
[05:31:00] <Splarka>	can you put a class="geshi" or /something/ in there?
[05:31:05] <Splarka>	https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16324
[05:31:24] <Splarka>	as it is, the next object down gets like: <div class="php source-php" style="font-family:monospace;"> or <pre class="php source-php">
[05:32:15] <Splarka>	so to select them all you have to (CSS2) [class^="source-"] ... or .php, .javascript, .css, .everything...
[05:32:44] <Nikerabbit>	geshi-source perhaps?
[05:32:52] <Splarka>	hmm
[05:32:54] <Nikerabbit>	what classes does geshi itself use?
[05:33:06] <Splarka>	$lang and source-$lang
[05:33:17] <Splarka>	and then a zillion little ones
[05:33:21] <Nikerabbit>	that's not geshi itself
[05:33:29] <Splarka>	well, no.. but that is what is there
[05:33:41] <Splarka>	hmmm
[05:33:48] <Splarka>	.source-javascript .kw1 {color: #000066; font-weight: bold;}
[05:33:48] <Splarka>	.source-javascript .kw2 {color: #003366; font-weight: bold;}
[05:35:07] <Splarka>	Nikerabbit: the problem is, broken mp3 here but... with the upgrade, all <pre> borders should start to disappear, and people won't like that
[05:35:37] <Annemarie>	Really?
[05:35:46] <Annemarie>	Like the dashed border?
[05:36:09] <Nikerabbit>	I just don't want to conflict with a glass geshi is using itself
[05:36:17] <Splarka>	ahhh, good point
[05:36:23] <Splarka>	class="mw-geshi" ?
[05:36:58] <TimStarling>	on both the span and the div?
[05:37:14] <Splarka>	hmm, yah, probably a good idea
[05:38:06] <TimStarling>	does anyone know how to remove an external from a working copy?
[05:39:08] <Splarka>				$out = '<span class="mw-geshi '.$lang.' source-'.$lang.'"> '.$out . '</span>';
[05:39:15] <Splarka>				$out = '<div class="mw-geshi" dir="ltr" style="text-align: left;">' . $out . '</div>';
[05:39:19] <Annemarie>	Google says svn ci I think.
[05:39:28] <Annemarie>	svn delete, then svn ci.
[05:39:30] <Splarka>	people can specify more with div.mw-geshi or span.mw-geshi
[05:39:36] <CIA-58>	03tstarling * r52346 10/trunk/extensions/SyntaxHighlight_GeSHi/SyntaxHighlight_GeSHi.class.php: Added a class to the wrapper to allow site CSS to re-add the dashed borders on wikis that want them.
[05:39:39] <Splarka>	Nikerabbit: thoughts?
[05:39:46] <Nikerabbit>	about what?
[05:39:52] *Splarka 	offers Tim some fresh baked brownies <3
[05:39:53] <TimStarling>	svn delete would remove it from the repository
[05:40:14] <Splarka>	Nikerabbit: same class on both div (block) and span (inline) should be fine, right?
[05:40:14] <TimStarling>	I just want to change a working copy to use --ignore-externals without disrupting anything
[05:40:30] <Annemarie>	svn pedit svn:externals  ?
[05:40:56] <Nikerabbit>	Splarka: tim already put them in :)
[05:41:10] <Splarka>	Nikerabbit: yah, saw that just as I said "thoughts?"
[05:41:56] <TimStarling>	it would kind of work
[05:42:24] <TimStarling>	it'd be like a local patch, since you can't actually check in from wikimedia's working copy
[05:42:45] <Nikerabbit>	TimStarling: svn externals can be locked to a specific version, no?
[05:43:47] <TimStarling>	it would still be insecure
[05:50:52] <wikibugs>	03(mod) html generated by GeSHi SyntaxHighlight <source> does not have a consistent class. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16324  summary; +comment (10herd)
[05:50:58] *Splarka 	leaves bug open until someone can verify
[05:52:00] <Nikerabbit>	I wish the parser added mw-pre to pre's it generates or something
[05:52:14] <Nikerabbit>	then there would not be collisions :o
[05:54:06] <Splarka>	you'd have to have exceptions for user input like <pre class="foo">
[05:54:29] <Splarka>	so it'd resolve to <pre class="mw-pre foo"> properly
[05:54:52] <Splarka>	Nikerabbit: go ahead and do it, shouldn't be a regression
[06:02:08] <Splarka>	hmm, that's odd, still has borders, but I've used geshi on other wikis and they vanish, maybe WMF is haunted
[06:02:46] <Splarka>	does WMF have the enclose default to "pre" ?
[06:03:28] <Splarka>	of course, using line numbers removes it... and that can be added back with the new mw-geshi class <3
[06:14:27] <CIA-58>	03thomasv * r52347 10/trunk/extensions/ProofreadPage/proofread.js: no longer needed
[06:21:07] <Nikerabbit>	Splarka: is it updated yet?
[06:21:37] <Splarka>	Nikerabbit: yah
[06:22:02] <Splarka>	Nikerabbit: http://test.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foo
[06:22:43] <Splarka>	still odd, the: <div dir="ltr" class="mw-geshi" style="text-align: left;"><pre class="source-javascript">
[06:23:21] <Nikerabbit>	hmm
[06:23:27] <Nikerabbit>	but is geshi updated?
[06:23:34] <Splarka>	oh, that I dunno ^_^
[06:23:50] <TimStarling>	not yet
[06:23:51] *Splarka 	rereads, sees tim just updated the extension
[06:23:53] <Nikerabbit>	the code does something different with old geshi, because it doesn't support xhtml-compliant pre or something
[06:24:05] <Annemarie>	You can't do <source style="">, right?
[06:24:16] <Annemarie>	That always annoyed me a bit.
[06:24:45] <Splarka>	iirc, in the old geshi, "lines" would create multiple <pre> so you'd need like .source-javascript li, .source-javascript pre {line-height: normal; border: 0px none white;}
[06:25:01] <Splarka>	but in the new one, not sure...
[06:25:32] <Splarka>	Annemarie: well, no, but now you can target it with mw-geshi
[06:25:45] <Annemarie>	That's not the same.
[06:25:46] <Annemarie>	:-(
[06:25:58] <Splarka>	heh, so bug tim
[06:26:08] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) Google search connects to invalid links - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19374 enhancement; Normal; MediaWiki: Database; (ed)
[06:26:59] <Splarka>	meanwhile: http://www.fark.com/cgi/comments.pl?viewmode=1&startid=0&cpp=1&tt=voteresults&IDLink=4456891
[06:27:34] <TimStarling>	is this something you're bugging me about before or after I update GeSHi?
[06:27:55] <Annemarie>	It's a feature request for the <source> tag. So prolly after.
[06:42:40] <Splarka>	yep, there went the borders...
[06:42:42] <Splarka>	http://test.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foo
[06:43:46] <Splarka>	this means on enclose="pre" the class="lang source-lang" got moved from the <pre> to the <div>
[06:43:57] <Splarka>	meaning that all pre get the border murdered, heh
[06:44:08] <CIA-58>	03raymond * r52348 10/trunk/extensions/Translate/aliases.txt: Follow-up r52343: Add alias file to translatewiki
[06:45:41] <Splarka>	but /\'/ works in lang="javascript" <3
[06:57:01] *Duesentrieb 	tips his hat to brion for the level-headed analysis of the pikiwiki brouhaha
[06:57:46] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) Upgrade to the latest version of GeSHi (1.0.8) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10967  +comment (10tstarling)
[06:59:44] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) html generated by GeSHi SyntaxHighlight <source> does not have a consistent class. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16324  (10herd)
[06:59:51] <Splarka>	works: http://test.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foo (purge -> http://test.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=MediaWiki:Monobook.css&usemsgcache=yes&ctype=text%2Fcss&smaxage=2678400&action=raw&maxage=2678400 )
[07:01:56] <lch>	is there some maintenance script which dumps out all the article names, like Special:Allpages does?
[07:02:34] <Annemarie>	api.php?
[07:04:34] <Duesentrieb>	lch: mysql yourwikidatabasenamehere -e "SELECT page_namespace, page_title FROM page"
[07:04:42] <Duesentrieb>	you may need to sully -u username -p
[07:04:51] <Duesentrieb>	*supply
[07:05:17] <lch>	thanks
[07:18:36] <CIA-58>	03purodha * r52349 10/trunk/extensions/Translate/check-blacklist.php: Exceoptions added for extionsions: Babel, Category Tree, and Social Profile - User Gifts
[07:39:20] <Splarka>	TimStarling, just a quick poke if you wanna see what things are like in a world without borders: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:SyntaxHighlight_GeSHi#Showcases
[07:41:01] <CIA-58>	03purodha * r52350 10/trunk/extensions/MetavidWiki/languages/MV_Messages.php: Added missing space to message.
[08:05:44] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Allow display of dates according to date formatting preferences without links - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=15715  +comment (10MacGyverMagic)
[08:41:00] <BOT_KSW>	hi
[08:41:02] <BOT_KSW>	i need help
[08:41:04] <BOT_KSW>	someone here?
[08:41:37] <Splarka>	!ask | BOT_KSW
[08:41:37] --mwbot--	BOT_KSW: Don't say "I have a question", or ask "Is anyone around?" or "Can anyone help?". Just ask the question, and someone will help you if they can. See also: !gethelp
[08:42:48] <BOT_KSW>	i want to add "infobox", but i can't find the correct syntax for this on mediawiki
[08:45:30] <urbanvampire__>	About images: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Image_table says img_minor_mime is varchar(32), maintenance/tables.sql and describe image both say it's varbinary, is there something wrong with my installation (1.13.5) ?
[08:46:33] <TimStarling>	we didn't do DB patches for those changes
[08:46:49] <TimStarling>	because they're not critical
[08:47:13] <urbanvampire__>	besides that, 32 characters is too small for "vnd.oasis.opendocument.spreadsheet", can I simply alter the column to varbinary(64) without breaking my wiki?
[08:47:26] <domas>	you can, I guess ;) 
[08:48:16] <urbanvampire__>	OK, I'll give it a try ... after dumping the table .... just in case :)
[08:48:45] <domas>	well
[08:48:49] <domas>	you can always set it back :)
[08:50:17] <urbanvampire__>	I've seen a lot of things happen so I always backup before changing anything :)
[08:52:20] <urbanvampire__>	Where can I file that "column too small" problem as a feature request for future versions of mediawiki? For those using OpenOffice, entries in the mim type database were also missing
[08:54:19] <Duesentrieb>	urbanvampire__: all requests go to bugzilla
[08:55:25] <BOT_KSW>	i want to add "infobox", but i can't find the correct syntax for this on mediawiki
[09:36:03] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) can't open page - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19375 enhancement; Normal; Wikimedia: Downloads; (rowland.crouch)
[09:50:17] <Splarka>	!details | wikibugs
[09:50:17] --mwbot--	wikibugs: Please give us details when reporting a problem. <http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/8871/problem1a.gif>
[10:01:46] <CIA-58>	03daniel * r52351 10/trunk/WikiWord/WikiWordIntegrator/ (9 files in 3 dirs): docbook
[10:07:03] <wikibugs>	14(INVALID) can't open page - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19375  +comment (10agarrett)
[10:10:59] <wikibugs>	14(DUP) The <pre>/<div> tag around GeSHi-highlighted code does not have a class "source" - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11274  +comment (10Ms2ger)
[10:11:03] <wikibugs>	03(mod) html generated by GeSHi SyntaxHighlight <source> does not have a consistent class. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16324  +comment (10Ms2ger)
[10:15:34] <CIA-58>	03daniel * r52352 10/trunk/WikiWord/WikiWordIntegrator/src/test/java/de/brightbyte/wikiword/integrator/ (7 files): test value splitter
[10:44:08] <Hemebond>	Is it possible to nest preformatted text in a list using regular Wikitext markup?
[10:54:55] <lch>	I forgot, how do I make a TOC which doesn't number its sections, again?
[10:55:35] <Splarka>	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Common.css
[10:55:54] <Splarka>	/* When <div class="nonumtoc"> is used on the table of contents,
[10:55:54] <Splarka>	   the ToC will display without numbers */
[10:55:59] <Splarka>	and the stuff below it
[10:57:19] <lch>	ah yes, thanks
[10:58:20] <Twittery>	I installed mediawiki on my localhost but when I try to go to the extensions http://localhost/mediawiki/extensions/ I het the error message
[10:58:25] <Twittery>	You don't have permission to access /mediawiki/extensions/ on this server.
[10:58:36] <Twittery>	What should I do
[10:58:53] <lch>	nothing, that's perfect
[10:58:56] <ialex>	why would you need to go on the extensions dir?
[10:59:08] <Twittery>	To install an extension
[10:59:25] <ialex>	no
[10:59:34] <ialex>	edit LocalSettings.php
[10:59:39] <CIA-58>	03purodha * r52353 10/trunk/extensions/Translate/check-blacklist.php: (r52349) typo corrected.
[11:00:12] <Twittery>	k
[11:25:40] <Twittery>	Hey installed checkuser extension accoriding to the guide but where should I add  *include_once('extensions/CheckUser/CheckUser.php');*  in the LocalSettings.php 
[11:25:57] <OverlordQ>	at the bottom is a good spot
[11:26:43] <Twittery>	nut I get this error
[11:26:46] <Twittery>	Warning: include_once(extensions/CheckUser/CheckUser.php) [function.include-once]: failed to open stream: No such file or directory in /etc/mediawiki/LocalSettings.php on line 138
[11:27:53] <Twittery>	Any ideas
[11:33:14] <Raymond_afk>	Twittery: check the path to your extension dir
[11:34:42] <Twittery>	Ah I think I got it now . There was some trouble with the directory
[11:34:49] <Twittery>	Sorry my mistake
[11:38:49] <John>	Hi all, is this where the dev's are at?
[11:39:23] <Guest62939>	Becouse I need some help ^^'
[11:39:33] <CIA-58>	03ialex * r52354 10/trunk/extensions/FCKeditor/ (FCKeditorParser.body.php FCKeditorParserWrapper.body.php): fix E_STRICT caused by recent modifications in Parser
[11:40:01] <ialex>	Guest62939: if you have a question, just ask it ;)
[11:41:16] <Guest62939>	Alright ^^ I managed to hide the edit button from anonymous users but preferably, I want only administrators to be able to edit pages (ie, just me), rather then all users - can this be done? if so, how?
[11:41:41] <Madness>	You need to edit the preferences for the anonymous group.
[11:42:38] <Guest62939>	I have added '$wgGroupPermissions['*']['edit'] = false;' and that works properly, however when I tried to tweak it a little to apply to Users, it still says only Users can edit it ($wgGroupPermissions['Users']['edit'] = false;)
[11:44:22] <ialex>	'user' not 'Users'
[11:44:32] <Guest62939>	hmm
[11:45:42] <Guest62939>	Excellent! Thankyou very much!
[11:46:50] <Guest62939>	How do I make a new group and permit editing? ie; root or admin - becouse appearently my account was stated as User xD
[11:47:45] <Splarka>	to create a new group, give it a right
[11:47:47] <ialex>	$wgGroupPermission['whateveryouwant']['edit'] = true;
[11:47:48] <Splarka>	$wgGroupPermissions['editors']['edit'] = true;
[11:47:54] <ialex>	:)
[11:48:04] <Splarka>	and then stick people in the group with Special:Userrights
[11:48:23] <Guest62939>	nhm
[11:50:28] <Guest62939>	Splendid! Thanks a ton, both of you xD
[11:51:23] <Guest62939>	Time to get back to filling it up with dataz then, see ya!
[11:51:24] <Hemebond>	Am I correct in my conclusion that nesting a block of pre-formatted test inside a list is impossible with regular wikitext?
[11:55:29] <Splarka>	Hemebond: pretty much yah. though you can do one line...:
[11:55:30] <Splarka>	*foo
[11:55:30] <Splarka>	*<pre>pre!</pre>
[11:55:30] <Splarka>	*Bar
[11:55:53] <Hemebond>	Ah, but with line-breaks in the <pre></pre> element?
[11:56:04] <Hemebond>	Oh.
[11:56:05] <Splarka>	nein!
[11:56:14] <Hemebond>	Didn't read your first sentence properly.
[11:56:19] <Hemebond>	Pants.
[11:56:49] <Splarka>	compare for example: http://p.defau.lt/?OYmoWzxbF1pxtdxTpEtwdA
[11:56:59] <Splarka>	you get: 1. 2. 1.   -- 1. 2. 3.
[11:57:36] <Hemebond>	Yeah, that's what my tests showed.
[11:57:56] <Hemebond>	I was hoping for some nice little trick to prevent me having to resort to HTML markup.
[11:59:07] <Hemebond>	Oh well. I guess I will have to fall back on HTML markup after all; at least until the parser is fixed.
[12:17:53] <CIA-58>	03siebrand * r52356 10/trunk/extensions/ConfirmAccount/ConfirmAccount.i18n.php: Remove duplication for PLURAL in 'confirmaccount-newrequests'
[12:24:29] <localjoost>	Hi, is there an (preferably) easy way to have mediawiki use a third party user system? 
[12:24:41] <flyingparchment>	yes, write an authplugin
[12:25:01] <localjoost>	thx, i know what to look for now :D
[12:35:34] <Duesentrieb>	!auth
[12:35:34] --mwbot--	http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/AuthPlugin
[12:35:54] <localjoost>	that's what I'm reading now :) thx
[12:40:41] <CIA-58>	03aude * r52355 10/trunk/extensions/SlippyMap/SlippyMap.hooks.php: static functions
[12:50:33] <Multichil>	What's a good way to get a static html version of a wiki page?
[12:51:19] <Duesentrieb>	Multichil: action=render?
[12:51:24] <werdna>	how does one create a drop-down menu in a backwards-compatible way?
[12:51:27] <werdna>	(in HTML/CSS?)
[12:51:42] <Duesentrieb>	werdna: afaik there is no reliable way
[12:51:45] <werdna>	ugh
[12:53:21] <Multichil>	Duesentrieb : Hmm, that looks ok. Looks like i only have to add some html header and body stuff :)
[12:53:57] <Multichil>	You don't happen to know how to get rid of the edit links? ;-)
[12:54:19] <Duesentrieb>	hide them with css.
[12:54:57] <flyingparchment>	werdna: you can do it in IE7+ and most other browsers, i think
[12:55:03] <flyingparchment>	werdna: for IE6 you can add javascript to make it work
[12:55:13] <flyingparchment>	werdna: for non-CSS browser, it'll just appear as a <ul>
[12:55:23] <flyingparchment>	but for IE6 without JS, it won't work
[12:59:01] <werdna>	flyingparchment: or I could just ignore IE6
[12:59:09] <werdna>	so long as it gracefully falls back, there shouldn't be a problem
[12:59:15] <flyingparchment>	as i said, it doesn't
[12:59:35] <flyingparchment>	you can only do it in IE6 with JS, so if JS is turned off, it won't work at all
[12:59:48] <werdna>	yeah, but it might fall back to just showing the list items
[12:59:50] <werdna>	which is okay
[12:59:52] <flyingparchment>	no, it won't
[13:00:10] <flyingparchment>	(unless someone found a new method since the last time i looked at this)
[13:00:13] <werdna>	ah, damn
[13:00:19] <werdna>	oh yeah, I see what you mean
[13:00:22] <Duesentrieb>	Multichil: have a look at http://toolserver.org/~daniel/rawview/rawview.php/duesenstuff/web/wikirip.php
[13:00:23] <werdna>	bleargh
[13:00:47] <Duesentrieb>	Multichil: it generates the toolserver homepage from a wiki page: http://tools.wikimedia.de/
[13:16:04] <zocky>	hey, lch, did profiling help any?
[13:17:22] <lch>	not wonders given my hardware but it helped validate some of my suspicions, yes, thanks :)
[13:17:37] <lch>	I'm going to restructure a bit
[13:23:53] <zocky>	lch, what often helps with slow templates (though not as much as it used to) is splitting them and doing {{template {{{1}}}|...}} instead of e.g. {{#switch:{{{1}}}|...|...|...}}
[13:25:06] <lch>	really? templating is faster than parser functions?
[13:26:13] <zocky>	not by itself, but sometimes you can avoid parsing and evaluating a big template many times, and parse and evaluate a few small templates many times
[13:27:15] <zocky>	that used to be much more efficient back when parser functions really worked like functions, i.e. when all the arguments were evaluated first no matter what
[13:27:31] <lch>	ic, so that's why the Infobox template is done the way it is... I thought that this by-row approach was countereffective
[13:27:53] <zocky>	who knows, it's possible that it is in the current parser
[13:29:44] <zocky>	lch, all the templates get parsed and cached, so calling them again is much less expensive than calling them the first time
[13:31:40] <spvensko>	is there anyway to see the PHP behind extensions? I am interested in utilizing the input box extension to run different programs
[13:31:56] <lch>	makes sense
[13:32:56] <zocky>	spvensko, the extensions that are used on WMF projects, including input box, are in the svn repository, so you can download them and/all browse them online
[13:37:31] <spvensko>	if i wanted to include a button on a certain wiki page as someone without administrative privledges would i be able to use PHP for this?
[13:37:49] <flyingparchment>	no, you need server access to run php
[13:37:54] <flyingparchment>	otherwise it'd be incredibly insecure
[13:38:04] <spvensko>	i see
[13:42:48] <spvensko>	seems like adding custom buttons requires admin access no matter what...
[13:42:52] <spvensko>	is this correct?
[13:43:40] <werdna>	of course
[13:43:44] <werdna>	that's the point.
[13:44:03] <werdna>	of course, it depends on what you want the button to do
[13:44:43] <spvensko>	i seem to be having issues just adding an input box that doesn't invoke anything
[13:45:05] <spvensko>	the end goal is to have an input box with takes input to serve as an argument for a cgi script run on the server
[13:45:22] <werdna>	write your own extension
[13:50:32] <Duesentrieb>	spvensko: or just use an extension for injecting html
[13:50:35] <Duesentrieb>	!htmlets
[13:50:35] --mwbot--	For allowing any and all HTML, see <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:%24wgRawHtml>. This is of course VERY DANGEROUS. Safer options include <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:HTMLets>, <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:RawMsg> and <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:SecureHTML>.
[13:54:17] <zocky>	i use a function {{#html:tag|attr=|...}} which works only if saved on a mediawiki page, which is sort-of-OK
[13:54:43] <zocky>	it allows you to control what html can get inserted, as long as you do it really carefully
[13:57:18] <Madness>	Which is useful for <thead><tbody><tfoot> that are unsupported for no good reason :P
[14:02:46] <lch>	hmm, how do I center a <gallery> ?
[14:05:27] <lch>	nvm
[14:08:05] <DrHalan>	hey, is mediawiki using any plain files to store data? or can i just whipe the whole folder when upgradeing? 
[14:10:53] <OverlordQ>	is there a benefit of thead? besides css?
[14:17:57] <CIA-58>	03daniel * r52357 10/trunk/WikiWord/WikiWordIntegrator/src/main/java/de/brightbyte/wikiword/integrator/ (10 files): sql scripting
[14:18:38] <Subfader>	On OutputPage.php: what exactly does $protected means? Cos I want to add an if clause so when a page is protected then a normal user can't view the source, only sysops who can edit the protected page.
[14:19:22] <TimStarling>	DrHalan: it uses files in the images directory to store images, so you can't just wipe it
[14:19:28] <Subfader>	when i add an if clause with $protected it removes the source view for unprotected pages as well.
[14:19:53] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Set article autopatrol for user group rollbackers on svwiki. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16319  +comment (10leo_wallentin)
[14:19:57] <TimStarling>	is there a problem with our upgrade docs?
[14:20:06] <ialex>	Subfader: You mean OutputPage::readOnlyPage()
[14:20:08] <ialex>	?
[14:20:22] <DrHalan>	TimStarling: is there maybe a backup scirpt or so? because my installation doesn't work properly anymore (i get random black pages) and i wanna whipe it completly
[14:20:29] <Subfader>	that's where i tested i guess
[14:20:36] <TimStarling>	ialex: I think he just means the whole 1000 lines of code
[14:20:46] <Duesentrieb>	!backup | DrHalan
[14:20:46] --mwbot--	DrHalan: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Backing_up_a_wiki
[14:20:51] <TimStarling>	;)
[14:21:47] <TimStarling>	DrHalan: completely black?
[14:21:55] <Subfader>	http://dpaste.org/RTUH/ inside readOnlyPage()
[14:22:20] <DrHalan>	TimStarling: sorry blank -> phperror
[14:22:31] <Subfader>	thought it doesn't matter if I ask what $protected exactly checks but keep making fun of me ;)
[14:22:32] <TimStarling>	what is the error message?
[14:23:27] <DrHalan>	nothing just a white page
[14:23:37] <TimStarling>	you said it was a PHP error didn't you?
[14:23:49] <DrHalan>	"Random Page" works but clicking a link doesn't
[14:24:03] <DrHalan>	yeah i read somewhere that blank pages come from fatal errors in php
[14:24:31] <TimStarling>	they can come from many things
[14:24:46] <TimStarling>	do you have access to an error log of some kind?
[14:24:55] <TimStarling>	maybe via cpanel?
[14:25:36] <DrHalan>	don't think so it just a webspace
[14:25:54] <TimStarling>	what's the provider?
[14:26:48] <DrHalan>	alfahosting (german)
[14:27:20] <Subfader>	so $protected does not check if a page is protected but if teh DB is in read only mode?
[14:29:42] <TimStarling>	what does "Eigener ADMIN Bereich" mean?
[14:30:00] <forcer>	"private/own admin area"
[14:30:06] <DrHalan>	yeah
[14:30:35] <wikibugs>	04(REOPENED) createAndPromote error on bad password - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19157  +comment (10Emufarmers)
[14:30:36] <DrHalan>	but its just for ftp access and stuff
[14:33:14] <TimStarling>	they don't give you much in their visitenkarte plan do they?
[14:34:37] <TimStarling>	only PHP 4, they give you PHP 5 if you pay more money
[14:35:41] <DrHalan>	TimStarling: nah ive both here in the standart package
[14:38:16] <TimStarling>	so you must have a thing called "Eigene PHP-Einstellungen"
[14:38:50] <TimStarling>	does that allow you to set display_errors to 1?
[14:44:13] <CIA-58>	03werdna * r52359 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/ (classes/LqtView.php lqt.css): Phase 2 of visual refresh: Mimic comment threads by taking the "nested boxes" approach, rather than ugly indentation
[14:46:44] <DrHalan>	TimStarling: sorry i don't have any more  time just wanted to thank you :)
[14:47:35] <OverlordQ>	is there an idiots guide to when the various wfMsg variants should be used?
[14:50:49] <TimStarling>	don't think so
[14:51:08] <TimStarling>	just use addWikiMsg(), you can't go far wrong with that
[14:52:05] <TimStarling>	morning brion
[14:52:31] <brion>	evenin tim
[14:53:39] <OverlordQ>	nah, it's not for that, it's for getting a message when throwing an exception
[14:54:31] <TimStarling>	exceptions don't use messages
[14:56:25] <OverlordQ>	Ah, teach me to look at examples in code :-/
[14:57:24] <TimStarling>	exceptions are just for internal use
[14:57:41] <TimStarling>	you should use addWikiMsg() for errors intended for the user
[14:58:35] <brion>	when an exception hits the end user, it's because we were too lazy to make a good recovery and user-friendly error message
[15:01:00] <Subfader>	so how would I correctly disable the source view for protected pages? OutputPage::readOnlyPage() is correct I guess. But how to include isProtected( 'edit' ) in my if clause?
[15:01:00] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Allow display of dates according to date formatting preferences without links - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=15715  (10ashtongj)
[15:01:11] <OverlordQ>	well was mainly looking at bug #19157 was going to stubmit a patch, and isValidPassword is already throwing a PasswordException
[15:01:21] <OverlordQ>	using a message
[15:02:07] <ialex>	these exceptions are catched
[15:04:48] <Subfader>	if($protected = true) doesn't work since it blocks soure view also for non-protected pages :(
[15:08:27] <Duesentrieb>	Subfader: = is an assignment. you *make* $protected true.
[15:08:36] <ialex>	if($protected = true) will *always* be true
[15:08:47] <ialex>	yeah
[15:08:50] <Duesentrieb>	Subfader: use == for camparison. but it's useless for a check anyway. just use if ($protected)...
[15:09:51] <Subfader>	if($protected): same. hidden also for unprotected pages
[15:10:50] <Subfader>	because of readOnlyPage( $source = null, $protected = false,... ? 
[15:11:57] <Subfader>	http://dpaste.org/FwO9/ Line 36, 55
[15:15:36] <Guest53318>	Hey all, quick question: Is it possible to have coloured text on my wiki pages? (as in, highlight keywords I find important red)
[15:15:53] <ialex>	<font color="red">...</font>
[15:16:03] <Madness>	Gh.
[15:16:05] <Guest53318>	Cheers once more Ialex :)
[15:16:06] <Madness>	<font>
[15:16:16] <werdna>	brion: tell me what you think: http://wiki.werdn.us/test/view/Talk:Main_Page
[15:16:32] <Madness>	<span style="color:red"> is slightly better.
[15:16:33] <werdna>	I'm gonna show Parul when she gets in
[15:18:16] <Guest53318>	hmm, don't see a real difference Madness O.o
[15:19:19] <brion>	werdna: nom nom
[15:19:34] <werdna>	brion: better than before? :)
[15:19:56] <Guest53318>	Next question xD I've seen it on some forums that give their text like... hmm... [||R|||E|||D||]   so black background behind their red text if you get what I mean
[15:19:57] <brion>	yes much :D
[15:20:05] <werdna>	brion: any thoughts? :)
[15:20:08] <brion>	werdna: when making a reply, after submit i got sent to this url: http://wiki.werdn.us/test/view/Talk:Main_Page#lqt_thread_87#lqt_thread_93
[15:20:16] <brion>	double fragment IDs don't seem to work :D
[15:20:19] <Guest53318>	Is that possible on wiki pages aswell?
[15:20:22] <OverlordQ>	werdna: make the new message notice go away :P
[15:20:35] <brion>	werdna: probably want a style on the <blockquote>s
[15:20:38] <werdna>	brion: funny that.
[15:20:42] <Subfader>	I wonder if anyone ever writes summaries??
[15:20:44] <werdna>	sure.
[15:21:04] <brion>	part of me wants the reply button to be on the right, but i'm not sure
[15:21:15] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) Search leads to "Wiki does not exist" page - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19376 enhancement; Normal; Wikimedia: Site requests; (spuerhund)
[15:21:18] <werdna>	brion: I'm also gonna make it paged and have threads drop off the bottom instead of being archived.
[15:21:18] <Guest53318>	Could you help me again Ialex? xD
[15:21:29] <Subfader>	just ask
[15:21:29] <werdna>	reply on the right didn't work when I did it
[15:21:39] <lch>	hey, that thing looks cool
[15:21:41] <werdna>	it was confusing.
[15:21:44] <brion>	werdna: it's also unclear as an end user that the summary field won't be displayed anywhere but the history, which will probably rarely/never get looked at
[15:21:44] <lch>	forums in Wiki
[15:21:47] <Guest53318>	I've popped my question a few lines above Subfader :)
[15:21:54] <werdna>	brion: in theory it's supposed to appear at the top.
[15:21:59] <werdna>	if it ain't, I broke something :)
[15:22:08] <brion>	in threadest discussion, the summary is probably only relevant for further edits
[15:22:22] <brion>	hmm if it shows at the top is it the summary from the first edit, or the latest?
[15:22:36] <brion>	http://wiki.werdn.us/test/view/Talk:Main_Page#lqt_thread_93 <- shows no summary except on history
[15:22:40] <Guest53318>	How can I make certain pieces of text have a black background? ie:  [||R|||E|||D||]
[15:23:01] <TimStarling>	this new localisation cache is superficially working now
[15:23:32] <brion>	werdna: i'd also consider making a more immediately clickable permalink link... maybe at the left next to the author/date
[15:23:33] <TimStarling>	that is, it doesn't instantly break my wiki, it's just the more subtle bugs left now
[15:23:44] <lch>	Guest53318, CSS on a span element
[15:23:50] <werdna>	brion: yeah, makes sense.
[15:24:16] <werdna>	brion: summary for the whole thread is supposed to appear just below the <h2>
[15:24:27] <brion>	and when i pop back to the context page in the subtitle link (eg from http://wiki.werdn.us/test/view/Thread:Things_that_rock_%283%29 ) i probably should end up with a fragment ID so i'm at the same message, now in context?
[15:24:35] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) Add user namespace to robots.txt - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19377 enhancement; Normal; Wikimedia: Site requests; (jackdt)
[15:24:42] <werdna>	brion: yep, can do that.
[15:25:33] <brion>	werdna: i don't get what the 'summary for the whole thread' would be?
[15:25:41] <werdna>	brion: oh you're talking about edit summaries.
[15:25:50] <brion>	yes, the things with "Summary:" next to them
[15:25:54] <Subfader>	I'm going mad about if($protected) :(
[15:25:54] <werdna>	brion: I'm talking about summarising threads.
[15:26:11] <werdna>	brion: http://wiki.werdn.us/test/view/Talk:Main_Page#lqt_thread_39
[15:26:21] <brion>	how does one do that?
[15:26:23] <werdna>	needs to be outside the lqt_post
[15:26:30] <werdna>	you click "write a summary" and write one.
[15:26:35] <brion>	i have no such link
[15:26:56] <werdna>	hmm, there's other breakage in those links
[15:26:58] <brion>	what perms do i need maybe?
[15:27:07] <werdna>	brion: let me check...
[15:27:10] <brion>	aha there's one: "There have been no changes to this discussion for at least 14 days. If it is concluded, you may want to write a summary."
[15:27:20] <brion>	is it possible to archive a thread before then?
[15:27:23] <Nikerabbit>	evening
[15:27:44] <brion>	http://wiki.werdn.us/test/view/Thread:Lalal_;_;_;_%281%29 <- this just links to itself, there's no place to write anything
[15:28:23] <werdna>	brion: yeah as I said the links seem to be broken :(
[15:28:26] <TimStarling>	the profiler output is uglier than I remember it...
[15:28:27] <werdna>	need to fix that :D
[15:28:56] <werdna>	15:27 < brion> is it possible to archive a thread before then?
[15:29:03] <werdna>	My idea is that it just drops off the bottom
[15:29:07] <mdaly>	just updated to 1.15.0 and get "urlencode() expects parameter 1 to be string, object given in /data/web/wiki.demo.h2web.com/www/includes/GlobalFunctions.php on line 1198"; using PHP 5.1.6
[15:29:21] <werdna>	but we could add 'Summarize' to the menu on the side of the header.
[15:29:30] <TimStarling>	didn't it used to fit on a screen without horizontal scrolling?
[15:29:49] <Nikerabbit>	mdaly: can you dig out the caller?
[15:30:11] <mdaly>	nikerabbit: not sure how to do that
[15:30:28] <werdna>	TimStarling: depends on the screen :P
[15:31:30] <TimStarling>	I can fit it in one window, it just goes off the edge of my laptop screen and on to my external screen
[15:31:45] <mdaly>	nikerabbit: this line appears on the top rendered page
[15:32:07] <TimStarling>	174 columns
[15:35:14] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) Can't Enter a New Editor Assistance Request - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19378 normal; Normal; Wikimedia: General/Unknown; (thepainguy)
[15:35:21] <Nikerabbit>	Added: trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/icons/reply.png mimetype anything?
[15:40:34] <wikibugs>	14(INVALID) Add user namespace to robots.txt - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19377  +comment (10Emufarmers)
[15:42:01] <mdaly>	nikerabbit: the log only shows that error; it does not show the caller; is there a place to find the info or an extension that I could install to get call info? debug won't do it, right?
[15:43:16] <vvv>	<b>Notice</b>:  Undefined variable: hideVal in <b>/wikis/phase3/includes/LogEventsList.php</b> on line <b>115</b><br />
[15:43:39] <Annemarie>	LiquidThread URLs seem a bit frightening.
[15:43:44] <werdna>	hmm?
[15:44:21] <Annemarie>	http://wiki.werdn.us/test/scripts/index.php?title=Talk:Main_Page&lqt_method=reply&lqt_operand=85#lqt_thread_85
[15:44:41] <Annemarie>	Just looks kinda scary. I guess it's really not.
[15:45:27] <Afterthought>	Hello, anyone knows how to gets visitor stats on wiki? I'm using wikia. Thanks.
[15:46:47] <Emufarmers>	Afterthought: talk to Wikia; they've got an IRC channel here too.
[15:47:08] <Afterthought>	ah didn't know that. Thanks Emufarmers!
[15:48:29] <Annemarie>	Indenting the first comment is a bit strange.
[15:52:38] <ITrace>	Does anybody have a link to a how to on setting up a MediaWiki? I'm looking for something that will tell me some best practices in creating the pages and dealing with the navigation.
[15:54:47] <Emufarmers>	ITrace: you'll need to be a little more specific.  MediaWiki.org is full of information on setting up MediaWiki; what particular aspect of creating pages or deailng with navigation is giving you trouble?
[15:58:18] <ITrace>	Emufarmers: Well, I'm kind of at the beginning. I've installed MediaWiki, I've created an outline of my content, and I'm ready to start uploading and creating pages. What I want to know is: Is there a "best practice" for how pages are laid out, or how the navigation is set up. MediaWiki just seems like a giant right now and I don't know how to start.
[15:59:03] <Mike_lifeguard>	it really depends what you're trying to do
[15:59:19] <Mike_lifeguard>	so maybe tell us what your content is and/or how it is structured
[16:00:07] <Emufarmers>	http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Project:Help could offer some guidance; otherwise, there's always the time-tested strategy of copying navboxes and the like from other wikis
[16:00:58] <OverlordQ>	copying templates and code from wp is like playing minesweeper, never know which one is going to explode on ya
[16:01:03] <mdaly>	nikerabbet: does it matter that the urlencode error only happens on "my preferences" pages?
[16:01:15] <Emufarmers>	OverlordQ: I didn't say from Wikipedia :D
[16:01:37] <Subfader>	in OutputPage.php how would check if the page is protected or not? in readOnlyPage() I'm trying with if($protected) but it always returns false/true
[16:05:04] <Emufarmers>	werdna, what's the 0:0:0:FFFF stuff?
[16:05:47] <vvv>	Emufarmers: IP address?
[16:05:55] <jcw>	Is there some reason a [[{{FULLPAGENAME}}|Foo]] link would display as bold, but not as a href?  http://www.tinymicros.com/wiki/Tumbler_Timer#Architectural_Overview in the last sentence isn't forming a link.  It is generating <strong class="selflink">User Interface</strong> for HTML.
[16:06:43] <Emufarmers>	vvv: well, the part after it, sure...
[16:07:02] <vvv>	Emufarmers: it's IPv6
[16:07:09] <Emufarmers>	vvv: oh
[16:07:19] <chuck>	jcw: if you make a link to the same page, it will not create an anchor, it'll just be bold
[16:07:21] <OverlordQ>	it's IPv4 mapped to IPv6 for IPv4 only devices
[16:07:24] <Emufarmers>	That's how IPv6 represents IPv4 IPS?
[16:07:39] <jcw>	Bah.  Is there a way to create a link on the same page?  
[16:08:11] <Subfader>	jcw: it turns bold cos it's a link to the page you view
[16:08:33] <Subfader>	that's why it's not linked too :)
[16:08:41] <jcw>	That's not helpful (the behavior), since I basically want them to be able to jump back to a previous section via that link.
[16:09:08] <Emufarmers>	jcw: [[#Foo]] works
[16:09:11] <Alphos>	[[#section|foo]] would be fine
[16:09:15] <faceface>	tytytyty
[16:09:56] <Alphos>	F5 works fine too :D
[16:10:21] <jcw>	Excellent.  Thanks Emufarmers and Alphos
[16:10:39] <Alphos>	you're welcome :)
[16:10:50] <Emufarmers>	np
[16:12:07] <Subfader>	so can anybody help me out with my prob? I think $protected is completely not what I need should use.
[16:12:56] <Subfader>	surely sth like $this->mTitle->isProtected( 'edit' ) is correct? but I get non-object erros. hrr
[16:13:06] <jcw>	I've had a personal website up in one form or another for at least 10 years now.  Switching to mediawiki has been the best one yet.  It's not PERFECT (from the perspective of controlling the display format), but being able to easily ad pages, using Lucene to search, and everything else, it's the best solution so far.  And it generally suits my way of thinking.
[16:13:39] <werdna>	Emufarmers: ignore it, it's an IPv6 bug unrelated to LiquidThreads
[16:14:15] <Emufarmers>	jcw: should we add you to our testimonials? :)
[16:14:44] <vvv>	werdna: http://img524.imageshack.us/img524/8175/lqtbug1.png
[16:14:44] <jcw>	Sure!  As long as we add how helpful the people in #mediawiki are, too.
[16:14:48] <werdna>	eugh, how do I prevent wrapping in a particular div?
[16:14:49] <ITrace>	Is there a list of what all of the tags are? For instance what does this mean: [[MediaWiki]]
[16:14:50] <Emufarmers>	:3
[16:14:52] <vvv>	(FF 3)
[16:14:54] <flyingparchment>	speaking of ipv6
[16:15:10] <flyingparchment>	someone else noticed mediawiki's totally retarded conversion from ipv4-mapped addresses into ::ffff:12:23:34:56
[16:15:19] <flyingparchment>	that's completely non-standard and wrong, and we shouldn't do it
[16:15:26] <chuck>	heh
[16:16:20] <Nikerabbit>	why should it map to anything
[16:16:21] <jcw>	Is there an English site up anywhere that shows LQT in action?  
[16:16:36] <chuck>	werdna's test wiki
[16:17:00] <OverlordQ>	I thought ::ffff:... was for ipv4-mapped addresses
[16:17:17] <flyingparchment>	::ffff:12.23.45.67 is for ipv4-mapped addresses
[16:17:22] <jcw>	chuck, got a URL?  
[16:17:22] <Emufarmers>	ITrace: [[anything]] is the internal link syntax
[16:17:24] <Alphos>	ITrace this means a link to the page "MediaWiki" on your wiki
[16:17:26] <flyingparchment>	or ::ffff:1234:5678 (in hex)
[16:17:35] <flyingparchment>	::ffff:12:34:56:78 is just wrong
[16:17:44] <flyingparchment>	what we should do is just convert it to a normal ipv4 address
[16:17:44] *Emufarmers 	has his sniper scope targeted on Alphos today
[16:17:52] <Alphos>	there's a rather complete manual on http://mediawiki.org
[16:18:01] <OverlordQ>	oh, it uses colons?
[16:18:05] <flyingparchment>	yes
[16:18:06] <OverlordQ>	yea, that is retarded
[16:18:06] *Alphos 	trout-shoots at Emufarmers :p
[16:18:33] <chuck>	jcw: i think it's something like wiki.werdn.us/test/ or something like that
[16:18:48] <OverlordQ>	http://wiki.werdn.us/test/view/Main_Page
[16:19:40] <vvv>	werdna: why does it show "edited by other users" when the only user to edit message was its author?
[16:20:21] <werdna>	vvv: show me.
[16:20:21] <TimStarling>	to give you some idea of the performance characteristics of a messages-in-CDB system: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/User:Tim_Starling/LC_timings
[16:20:32] <TimStarling>	this is with WikimediaMessages enabled
[16:20:34] <CIA-58>	03werdna * r52360 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/ (4 files in 3 dirs): (log message trimmed)
[16:20:34] <CIA-58>	LiquidThreads stuff:
[16:20:34] <CIA-58>	* Fix bug in thread causing all threads to have a thread_ancestor of 0, making the software think it was a top-level thread.
[16:20:34] <CIA-58>	* Add backwards-compatibility code, recursively follows thread_parent until it gets to thread_parent=0 to deduce the correct thread_ancestor.
[16:20:37] <CIA-58>	* Break permalink link out from Actions drop-down to beside the Actions text.
[16:20:39] <CIA-58>	* Fix backlinks from thread permalinks to include anchors to where you were, making it a nice context link.
[16:20:41] <CIA-58>	* Change another instance of hard-coded HTML into generated HTML.
[16:21:24] <TimStarling>	obviously it's slower per message and much faster to start up, that was the idea
[16:21:33] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Enable StringFunctions on WMF wikis - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6455  +comment (10thinboy00)
[16:21:38] <TimStarling>	the key finding is the faster startup is definitely a win
[16:21:40] <werdna>	TimStarling: 20% improvement is nice.
[16:21:45] <TimStarling>	in terms of overall throughput
[16:21:53] <chuck>	TimStarling: nice
[16:21:56] <Annemarie>	How much time is a millisecond worth fighting for?
[16:22:14] <werdna>	a millisecond of what?
[16:22:30] <Annemarie>	Processing time, I suppose.
[16:22:43] <werdna>	a millisecond of CPU time or wait time? Per edit, view, logged-in edit?
[16:22:45] <Annemarie>	That's what's being measured, right?
[16:22:59] <werdna>	logged-in view*
[16:23:17] <Annemarie>	werdna: Using whatever metric used to create LC_timings. ;-)
[16:23:28] <flyingparchment>	if you can serve a page in 1 second, 0.1 second is a large gain
[16:23:28] <TimStarling>	it's wait time, it's within a millisecond or so with ab
[16:23:46] <werdna>	Annemarie: if you read the page, you'd see that values are for different profiles
[16:23:47] <Annemarie>	My question is really what the value of saving milliseconds is. 
[16:24:11] <flyingparchment>	werdna: Annemarie's point is that saving is worthless unless you can measure it in seconds, not ms
[16:24:13] <Annemarie>	werdna: That doesn't seem too relevant here.
[16:24:32] <TimStarling>	the watchlist and edit page were logged in, the page view and 304 were logged out
[16:24:44] <TimStarling>	just using a -H parameter to ab to log in
[16:24:49] <Annemarie>	Well, I'm wondering if it takes a developer X hours of time to shave off Y seconds, do the benefits outweigh the costs?
[16:25:04] <Annemarie>	Just a general curiosity.
[16:25:04] <werdna>	Annemarie: it depends on what you're shaving time off
[16:25:14] <Annemarie>	Right.
[16:25:19] <Annemarie>	:-)
[16:25:26] <werdna>	if you shave CPU time from page views, it's worth more than saving network wait time from edits.
[16:25:40] <TimStarling>	do you really want an answer or are you just wasting my time by trolling?
[16:25:58] <vvv>	werdna: http://wiki.werdn.us/test/view/Talk:Main_Page#lqt_thread_95 and http://wiki.werdn.us/test/history/Thread:Test_(1)
[16:26:14] <TimStarling>	I mean, I almost doubled the speed of a 304
[16:26:28] <Annemarie>	Not trolling at all.
[16:26:31] <TimStarling>	you can't hope for a better optimisation project than that
[16:26:59] <TimStarling>	the gains are really huge
[16:27:04] <Annemarie>	Nice. :-)
[16:27:23] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) Set project namespace of Portuguese Wikibooks to "Wikilivros" - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19364  +comment (10rhalsell)
[16:27:28] <TimStarling>	that said, it's not about X developer hours for Y milliseconds per request
[16:27:38] <TimStarling>	the issue at present is that I don't want to enable any more extensions
[16:27:53] <TimStarling>	because every time we add an extension, it adds startup overhead
[16:27:53] <werdna>	vvv: that's a bit odd.
[16:27:55] <Annemarie>	Because of the extra message load?
[16:28:04] <Annemarie>	Or other factors too?
[16:28:37] <TimStarling>	because of localisation
[16:28:55] <TimStarling>	so I'm designing a more scalable system for localisation which will allow us to enable as many extension as we want
[16:29:09] <Dantman>	TimStarling, wishing PHP had something like Rack or WSGI so you could run MW as a long-living app inser-request?
[16:29:46] <flyingparchment>	it does, domas already modified MW to have a built-in HTTP server
[16:29:54] <flyingparchment>	with persistant state across requests
[16:30:00] <TimStarling>	true, but the answer is not really
[16:30:20] *Annemarie 	nods. I think I see the relevance of 304 response time now.
[16:30:25] <Emufarmers>	I don't suppose this will also make Special:Allmessages faster, or is that a separate issue?
[16:30:28] <TimStarling>	a lot of the issues are the same even if you have persistent serves
[16:30:32] <TimStarling>	*servers
[16:30:34] <Annemarie>	Emufarmers: Pagination.
[16:30:41] <TimStarling>	I'm not sure if it would be simpler to get these performance gains
[16:30:47] <Annemarie>	AllMessages is slow 'cause it's just a lot of data.
[16:30:59] <Annemarie>	All at once.
[16:31:06] <TimStarling>	Special:Allmessages just needs a pager and a search interface
[16:31:17] <flyingparchment>	TimStarling: isn't the issue loading messages?  if you could just load messages once at server startup..
[16:31:27] <flyingparchment>	you don't even need to work for the performance gain, it just happens by default
[16:31:38] <TimStarling>	flyingparchment: and then restart the server every time a message changes?
[16:31:46] <flyingparchment>	every time you redeploy the application, yes
[16:31:55] <flyingparchment>	if it's just editing an MW page, you just replace it in the cache
[16:32:03] <chuck>	speaking of which, is the patch that someone added to add a pager to that integrated in yet?
[16:32:44] <Annemarie>	chuck: I don't think so.
[16:32:46] <TimStarling>	right, so in your scheme, each time you deploy, you have to restart all the servers
[16:32:58] <flyingparchment>	scap would restart each server, yes
[16:33:05] <TimStarling>	and in my scheme, each time you redeploy, you rebuild the CDB files and push them out along with the code
[16:33:21] <TimStarling>	either way you have to deal with cache invalidation, the issues are very similar
[16:33:28] <flyingparchment>	and your schema is still slower, because you have to re-load the messages which are used on each request anyway
[16:33:42] <flyingparchment>	it's not your fault though, PHP just sucks that way
[16:33:45] <TimStarling>	yeah and your scheme uses a technology which doesn't exist
[16:33:53] <TimStarling>	i.e. persistent PHP servlets
[16:33:54] <flyingparchment>	uh yeah, java totally hasn't existed for the last 15 years
[16:34:02] <TimStarling>	hehe
[16:34:08] *werdna 	volunteers flyingparchment for the porting effort
[16:34:19] <werdna>	actually Kelly Martin ported a lot of MediaWiki to Java.
[16:34:25] <flyingparchment>	werdna: i would consider it, but i know it would never replace MW
[16:34:28] <TimStarling>	well, you know if I were to rewrite MediaWiki, I'd do it in Java
[16:34:32] <flyingparchment>	werdna: too much intertia
[16:34:54] <werdna>	I'd have to learn java if you did that :P
[16:34:55] <TimStarling>	and you probably also know that I'd have to be batshit insane to start a project of that size for no good reason
[16:35:38] <OverlordQ>	staring at the parset guts hasn't made you that insane yet?
[16:35:41] <OverlordQ>	*parser
[16:36:34] <TimStarling>	last time I counted, MW had 1.2 million lines of code
[16:36:40] <TimStarling>	including extensions
[16:36:56] <werdna>	Core is about 300k, I think
[16:37:09] <chuck>	all the more reason to write it - better, faster, stronger (and leaner!) :P
[16:37:11] <chuck>	*re
[16:37:15] <TimStarling>	I don't think Kelly Martin actually did port the majority of that to java
[16:37:41] <werdna>	andrew-macbook:phase3 andrew$ find . -name '*.php' | egrep -v 'Messages.*\.php' | xargs cat | wc -l 206461
[16:38:19] <werdna>	206k for code, excluding i18n
[16:39:02] <Dantman>	instead of per-request*
[16:39:02] <Dantman>	((annoying laptop keyboard ignoring my keystrokes))
[16:39:05] <TimStarling>	about Special:AllMessages: it will actually be the slowest of any application with the new localisation cache
[16:39:18] <TimStarling>	the old scheme was to preload all messages on every request
[16:39:27] <TimStarling>	Special:Allmessages is the only application where that really pays off
[16:39:41] <chuck>	.-.
[16:39:47] <Emufarmers>	:v
[16:40:04] <Emufarmers>	chuck: link to the bug that patch is on?
[16:40:13] <Subfader>	gotta try again, sorry. I want to disable source view for protected pages (and not for normal pages). I would change readOnlyPage() in OutputPage.php, right? But $protected always returns true. How to set up an if clause in that case?
[16:40:18] <Nikerabbit>	fortunately for me special:translate does pagination :o
[16:40:25] <TimStarling>	:※
[16:40:34] <chuck>	Emufarmers: https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16497
[16:40:55] <Nikerabbit>	U+203B REFERENCE MARK
[16:41:44] <TimStarling>	I thought everyone was inventing nonsensical smileys, I just wanted to join in
[16:42:20] <Nikerabbit>	are you refering to :o ?
[16:42:34] <mdaly>	nikerabbit: took a bit of thinking (thanks for patience) but I think I have the call-stack...
[16:42:37] <Emufarmers>	:v, I think
[16:42:38] <mdaly>	GlobalFunctions.php:1198 > Title.php:787 wfArrayToCGI() > Title.php:881 Title->getLocalURL()
[16:42:41] <mdaly>	Do you need more?
[16:42:43] <TimStarling>	no, that kind of makes sense, I was talking about .-. and :v
[16:43:00] <Nikerabbit>	oh.. I didn't even pay attention :D
[16:43:24] <werdna>	poor TimStarling.
[16:43:37] <werdna>	While the other children are inventing smileys, he just wants to join in.
[16:43:39] <Annemarie>	"big nose" and "upside down" are sorta emotions if you don't think about it too much.
[16:43:41] <TimStarling>	☺
[16:43:41] <mdaly>	same as patience sometimes 
[16:43:42] <Emufarmers>	I assume .-. is like -.-; only the guy is apparently upside down.
[16:44:08] <chuck>	heh
[16:44:16] <Emufarmers>	:v is sort of a worried grimace.
[16:44:20] <Emufarmers>	In my expert opinion
[16:44:27] <Nikerabbit>	mdaly: humm is that stack to which direction?
[16:45:01] <mdaly>	GlobalFunctions called by Title:787 called by title:881
[16:45:31] <Nikerabbit>	so something is calling Title->getLocalURL(foo) with bad foo?
[16:46:07] <mdaly>	Title->getLinkUrl() at Linker.php:247 I'm guessing
[16:46:18] <jcw>	So if |- is used to break table rows, and | is used to start a new row, why shouldn't a new row be able to be started with |- ?
[16:47:21] <Nikerabbit>	 why do you suspect that?
[16:47:23] <vvv>	werdna: is it really necessary to display message content in recent changes?
[16:48:51] <mdaly>	That's the next call in the list; do you want the whole list (didn't include the whole thing because it's a little long)
[16:49:24] <Nikerabbit>	sure, but not in the channel
[16:49:43] <CIA-58>	03brion * r52361 10/trunk/ (6 files in 4 dirs): (log message trimmed)
[16:49:43] <CIA-58>	Prepping for site default overrides of copyright/TOS statements for Wikimedia
[16:49:43] <CIA-58>	sites with updated CC-BY-SA license... Messages now available in
[16:49:43] <CIA-58>	WikimediaMessages extension for localization:
[16:49:43] <CIA-58>	* wikimedia-copyright - page footer
[16:49:43] <CIA-58>	* wikimedia-copyrightwarning - edit page, above summary/save button
[16:49:47] <CIA-58>	* wikimedia-editpage-tos-summary - edit page, below summary/save button & above edittools
[16:50:44] <werdna>	vvv: well, I didn't do it, but I think it's kinda cool
[16:50:50] <werdna>	it's quite nice IMO
[16:50:57] <werdna>	we might pare it down, but for the moment I like it
[16:51:01] <vvv>	werdna: imagine that the post is 50 Kb
[16:51:12] <werdna>	well, it's truncated.
[16:51:48] <Dantman>	TimStarling, what if you had a persistent application, a language optimized to be even faster than PHP, and the ability to do async code and offload things to other threads?
[16:51:54] <vvv>	Imagine what would happend if we added truncated diffs to RC
[16:52:15] <werdna>	vvv: they'd get cut off, because you can't truncate a diff, and if you do it occasionally makes no sense.
[16:52:24] <Nikerabbit>	Dantman: and a time machine
[16:52:25] <werdna>	s/you can't/it's difficult to/
[16:52:42] <werdna>	vvv: However, a discussion is TOTALLY DIFFERENT from a diff.
[16:53:11] <TimStarling>	Dantman: I think I have all those things, except that persistent application is not the one I want to work on
[16:53:16] <TimStarling>	I'm mostly interested in MediaWiki
[16:54:37] *Dantman 	is dying to write a wiki engine in server-side javascript, with all the troublesome parts of MediaWiki in his memory
[16:55:17] <Nikerabbit>	hmm
[16:55:24] <Nikerabbit>	recent changes with diffs would be awesome
[16:55:37] <Dantman>	RSS? ;)
[16:55:41] <vvv>	werdna: I don't think RC patrollers will want to read those extracts
[16:55:46] <Nikerabbit>	in browser
[16:55:51] <werdna>	vvv: *shrug*
[16:55:58] <werdna>	we'll see what people think
[16:56:03] <werdna>	I personally think it's a great idea
[16:56:08] <werdna>	it'd be cool if we could do it for more things
[16:56:29] <chuck>	Dantman: so do it :P i
[16:56:38] <chuck>	*i'm interesting in seeing what that would look like
[16:57:27] <Dantman>	chuck, personally I want to wait till I'm into implementation of my MonkeyScript project because quite frankly I'm not interested in programming without a full string, array, etc... stdlib and a good environment
[16:57:46] <Dantman>	chuck, have you taken a look at WebWorkers?
[16:59:42] <chuck>	no, i haven't
[17:00:02] <TC-nbigelow>	what would the be the php script to find all the pages of a namespace?
[17:00:26] <lch>	TC-nbigelow, Special:Allpages
[17:02:18] <CIA-58>	03raymond * r52362 10/trunk/phase3/maintenance/language/ (messageTypes.inc messages.inc): Follow-up r52361: Add new message to maintenance file and set it to ignore for translatewiki
[17:03:59] <CIA-58>	03werdna * r52363 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/classes/LqtView.php: Wrap the summary correctly
[17:04:27] <TC-nbigelow>	lch: I was talking more about making a special page that generates a list of pages in a specific namespace using php, how would i do this?
[17:05:35] <lch>	that's exactly what Special:Allpages does?
[17:05:57] <lch>	do you want to just get the list of articles?
[17:06:21] <TC-nbigelow>	yeah, but how would i access with php?
[17:06:57] <CIA-58>	03siebrand * r52364 10/trunk/phase3/languages/messages/MessagesEn.php: Rebuild MessagesEn.php
[17:07:23] <lch>	SELECT page_title FROM page WHERE page_namespace = x
[17:08:17] <Dantman>	chuck, they look quite interesting... In essense they're threads for JavaScript... there are no mutexes or any troublesome "What am I supposed to do if a different thread modifies this variable while I'm using it?" problems to deal with because they use different script contexts
[17:08:36] <TC-nbigelow>	cool yeah i could probably figure that out from there
[17:09:34] <CIA-58>	03werdna * r52365 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/ (classes/LqtView.php i18n/Lqt.i18n.php): Fix summarize link, and add a Summarize link to the Actions menu
[17:10:35] <chuck>	How do I change the title of a wiki? (As in, the <title> title)
[17:11:39] <Dantman>	chuck, O_o... MediaWiki:Pagetitle?
[17:13:09] <chuck>	thanks :P
[17:15:17] <chuck>	What's the best way to make modifications to MediaWiki code (like, the monobook skin)? Just make the changes and fix the conflicts while upgrading?
[17:16:09] <Dantman>	chuck, avoid it as much as you can, if it's worth it try copying code to create a new skin, fall back to resolving conflicts while updating
[17:16:37] <Dantman>	+Use hooks whereever possible
[17:17:00] <Dantman>	((mmm... now if I could only monkeypatch things that are broken))
[17:17:45] <chuck>	I don't think there are hooks to do what I need to do, but I'll look
[17:20:44] <TheOracle23>	I have an idea
[17:21:12] <TheOracle23>	for MediaWiki:Clearyourcache, the default should have an added part for Google Chrome.
[17:21:28] <TheOracle23>	I have already found the information;
[17:21:32] <TheOracle23>	'''Google Chrome:''' ''Ctrl+F5'' or ''Shift-F5''.
[17:21:33] <TheOracle23>	^_^
[17:21:52] <TheOracle23>	er,
[17:21:53] <TheOracle23>	'''Google Chrome:''' ''Ctrl-F5'' or ''Shift-F5''.
[17:23:15] <TheOracle23>	I wasn't sure where else to tell you guys
[17:23:35] <Dantman>	bugzilla?
[17:23:43] <TheOracle23>	Oh, ofc!
[17:23:49] *TheOracle23 	slaps himself
[17:24:31] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) When moving pages from user namespace to article namespace, flag automatically - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19379 enhancement; Normal; MediaWiki extensions: FlaggedRevs; (pbirken)
[17:24:35] *vvv 	understood why his MW setup was so slow at editing
[17:24:42] <CIA-58>	03werdna * r52366 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/ (classes/LqtView.php i18n/Lqt.i18n.php): Fix summarize links again, and add an intro so people know what they are doing when they click Summarize
[17:24:57] <TheOracle23>	what component should it be under you think?
[17:24:58] <vvv>	Any ideas why meta spam blacklist is in SpamBlacklist config by default?
[17:26:18] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Upgrade to the latest version of GeSHi (1.0.8) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10967  (10brion)
[17:26:57] <TheOracle23>	dantman?
[17:27:23] <Dantman>	I don't remember what components there are
[17:27:34] <chuck>	TheOracle23: i18n probably
[17:27:53] <AVRS>	Hi.
[17:27:54] <TheOracle23>	no such one
[17:28:12] <AVRS>	Isn’t it supposed to be impossible to upload files in non-free formats onto Wikimedia Commons? [[commons:File:IC, the rescue, SLC 3.jpg]]
[17:28:18] <Dantman|Work>	I thought we put everything under a generic "MediaWiki" component
[17:28:32] <chuck>	TheOracle23: yes there is
[17:28:33] <TheOracle23>	Thats the product Dantman
[17:28:36] <AVRS>	That file has the type video/mp4 and it is recognized as such.
[17:28:37] <chuck>	"Internationalisation"
[17:28:43] <TheOracle23>	Ah
[17:28:47] <TheOracle23>	ty
[17:29:02] <TheOracle23>	was hiding in there
[17:29:48] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) Add Cache Flush Instructions for GC - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19380 enhancement; Normal; MediaWiki: Internationalization; (seth)
[17:29:56] <TheOracle23>	^_^
[17:34:23] <TheOracle23>	Aegis? From MoD? O_o
[17:35:00] <CIA-58>	03werdna * r52367 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/lqt.css: Only indent subthreads
[17:38:22] <wikibugs>	04(REOPENED) Set project namespace of Portuguese Wikibooks to "Wikilivros" - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19364  +comment (10heldergeovane)
[17:39:25] <CIA-58>	03werdna * r52368 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/classes/LqtThread.php: Fix detection of different users for EDITED_BY_OTHERS
[17:41:57] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Upgrade to the latest version of GeSHi (1.0.8) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10967  (10innocentkiller)
[17:45:19] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Add Cache Flush Instructions for Chrome - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19380  summary; +comment (10brion)
[17:52:25] <wikibugs>	03(mod) updateSearchIndex has MySQLisms - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19372  +comment (10innocentkiller)
[17:52:27] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Add Cache Flush Instructions for Chrome - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19380  (10brion)
[17:56:14] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Upgrade to the latest version of GeSHi (1.0.8) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10967  (10stevend811)
[17:57:55] <OverlordQ>	^demon: I blame shoddy mysql docu :P
[18:00:55] <^demon>	overlordq: hehe
[18:02:38] <^demon>	overlordq: but otherwise youre right, that code needs cleanup
[18:04:55] <TC-nbigelow>	is there an easy way to do mysql queries for a php special page?
[18:05:24] <OverlordQ>	I read it as checking if such a lock exists from a LOCK TABLES ... AS fancy_name, then calling GET_LOCK('fancy_name')
[18:05:34] <Guest25158>	how do i export all images? can i simply do "tar --exclude=images/thumb --exclude=images/math --exclude=images/tmp -cvf images.tar images" and put this images.tar publicly?
[18:10:47] <^demon>	overlordq: im poking at it.
[18:10:53] <^demon>	patches welcome <3
[18:11:22] <OverlordQ>	heh
[18:12:26] <Nikerabbit>	does someone have rel1_15 checked out so that he han commit?
[18:12:29] <OverlordQ>	I made one for 19157 but it changes messages :-/
[18:13:59] <Nikerabbit>	TC-nbigelow: yes, look around how it is done elsewhere
[18:14:09] <Nikerabbit>	but don't look those which use raw sql queries
[18:14:13] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) Convert user.gif in Monobook to PNG format; crush other PNGs - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19381 enhancement; Normal; MediaWiki: User interface; (greenreaper)
[18:15:49] <Nikerabbit>	noone?
[18:16:47] <^demon>	nikerabbit: dont have rel1_15 checked out atm :\
[18:17:03] <brion>	starting to slap together a page on... http://wikimania2009.wikimedia.org/wiki/Hacking_Days
[18:17:50] <wikibugs>	03(mod) createAndPromote error on bad password - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19157  (10overlordq)
[18:18:48] <Nikerabbit>	:o
[18:18:59] <Nikerabbit>	I'm waiting for wikimania 2010
[18:19:05] *OverlordQ 	really needs to find an IDE
[18:19:12] <^demon>	overlordq: maybe a lockTables() method along with the current lock() (which only gets a named lock)
[18:19:14] <TC-nbigelow>	I looked for ways to accesss mysql via php in mediawiki but i can't find anything besides the mysql_connet method
[18:19:43] <OverlordQ>	^demon: yea
[18:20:05] <^demon>	tc-nbigelow: use wfGetDB() to get a proper database adapter.
[18:20:13] <OverlordQ>	!man Database_access
[18:20:13] --mwbot--	http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Database_access
[18:20:31] <TC-nbigelow>	thanks you
[18:20:55] <^demon>	you shouldnt need to manually mysql_connect() ever.
[18:21:53] <OverlordQ>	anybody use any new-fangled IDE's for mw munging or just a text editor?
[18:22:27] <^demon>	overlordq: ew on patch :\ is there no nicer way?
[18:24:23] <OverlordQ>	told ya it was horrible :) Besides bastardizing the message even further, I dunno. since isValidPassword doesn't descriminate between the two failure cases
[18:25:05] <^demon>	blah.
[18:25:18] <Nikerabbit>	OverlordQ: adding more horrible on top of horrible :E?
[18:25:23] <^demon>	true on success, msg string on failure?
[18:26:53] <OverlordQ>	*shrug* then there's the runhooks call that who knows what evil users return from there :)
[18:27:28] *^demon 	stabs
[18:33:39] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Transfer of Mot�: lemmata from wa.wiki to wa.wikt - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17547  (10rhalsell)
[18:34:33] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Add Cache Flush Instructions for Chrome - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19380  (10seth)
[18:35:45] <AzaToth>	anyone überintelligent with generic html processing ans JS internals?
[18:36:01] <Nikerabbit>	ugga
[18:36:14] <AzaToth>	hehe
[18:36:37] <AzaToth>	was thinking about our hellish importScript thingi
[18:37:13] <AzaToth>	was thikning if it might be posssible to add an onload event to the newly created script tag
[18:38:13] <AzaToth>	and why is there allways 1000 million extension to be updated when I do an svn up :(
[18:38:23] <Nikerabbit>	localisation updates
[18:39:29] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) Visual refresh on footers - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19336  (10agarrett)
[18:39:29] <AzaToth>	onle locale is enough!!!!
[18:39:32] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) LQT indent style needs to be refreshed - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19338  (10agarrett)
[18:39:39] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) Subtitle link in "a fragment of a discussion" doesn't work properly - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19341  (10agarrett)
[18:39:41] <Nikerabbit>	onle? :o
[18:40:01] <Nikerabbit>	Raymond_ or Simetrical here?
[18:51:44] <kibble>	it's possible to set an edit summary through a url, right?
[18:52:54] <kibble>	it should be &wpSummary... but I don't think that's working :-(
[18:58:57] <CIA-58>	03dale * r52369 10/branches/new-upload/phase3/ (3 files in 3 dirs): fixed token in resultURL for firefogg uploads
[19:03:49] <lhridley>	hi all!  Question:  Has the development team for MediaWiki looked at using a template engine, such as Smarty, for the user interfaces?  Just curious.
[19:04:07] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Set project namespace of Portuguese Wikibooks to "Wikilivros" - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19364  (10heldergeovane)
[19:04:28] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) Transfer of Mot�: lemmata from wa.wiki to wa.wikt - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17547  +comment (10rhalsell)
[19:08:04] <CIA-58>	03ialex * r52370 10/trunk/extensions/CentralAuth/CentralAuthHooks.php: (bug 19265) Insert global user account status after editcount if registration date is not set
[19:08:23] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) The order of basic information in Special:Preferences messed up when registration time can not be obtained - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19265  +comment (10alex.emsenhuber)
[19:08:50] <Nikerabbit>	ialex: o can you help :o
[19:10:21] <ialex>	lhridley: Extension:Widgets uses Smarty
[19:10:24] <ialex>	!e Widgets
[19:10:24] --mwbot--	http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Widgets
[19:10:36] <Nikerabbit>	ialex: do you have 1_15?
[19:10:42] <ialex>	Nikerabbit: yes
[19:11:19] <Nikerabbit>	ialex: SpecialPreferences:817 needs ->getPrefixedText()
[19:13:32] <OverlordQ>	i just love folders that refuse to delete
[19:13:54] <ialex>	sudo rm -rf
[19:14:24] <Nikerabbit>	dd...
[19:14:38] <lhridley>	Thanks ialex....has anyone looked at using Smarty for the standard interfaces in MediaWiki, do you know?
[19:14:40] <scoobyrico>	you forgot the / 
[19:14:56] <ialex>	lhridley: no
[19:15:25] <Nikerabbit>	ialex: can you fix that? :o
[19:15:46] <ialex>	Nikerabbit: on it!
[19:16:06] <Nikerabbit>	thanks!
[19:16:16] <lhridley>	ialex:  Thanks!  Do you know if there's a reason?  I'm asking only b/c I'm using Smarty for the first time on another project right now, and I like what I see so far.
[19:16:36] <ialex>	Nikerabbit: seems to not be needed
[19:16:53] <Nikerabbit>	ialex: why not?
[19:17:10] <ialex>	Nikerabbit: the links is the same
[19:17:11] <Nikerabbit>	it if doesn't spew errors for you, you don't have the ugly php version
[19:17:11] <henna>	ialex: sure that it just wasn't thought about at the time?
[19:17:18] <henna>	(regarding smarty)
[19:17:27] <Nikerabbit>	which doesn't do object->string conversion automatically
[19:18:16] <Dantman|Work>	lhridley, performance... raw PHP is always faster than a template engine
[19:19:04] <lhridley>	Dantman:  Thanks for the response.  On the performance issue, even with the caching that Smarty does?
[19:20:11] <Dantman|Work>	Ya, it still has to do the work compiling it, various other things, fetching the template, and the cached php it generates isn't always the most optimum way to do something
[19:20:26] <Dantman|Work>	Skins are also a bit of a low priority
[19:21:08] <ialex>	Nikerabbit: done
[19:21:09] <CIA-58>	03ialex * r52371 10/branches/REL1_15/phase3/includes/specials/SpecialPreferences.php: use getPrefixedText() to not trigger object->text conversion
[19:21:27] <Nikerabbit>	well, *to* trigger :D
[19:21:37] <lhridley>	Dantman:  I understand completely about the priority thing on the Skins.  After using Smarty for the first time on another project, it just got me noodling on things.  Thanks for the input!
[19:21:41] <Nikerabbit>	otherwise fine :)
[19:21:44] <lch>	I have an image here which my wiki doesn't want to resize for some reason... any ideas as to why?
[19:21:51] <lch>	http://dom3.servegame.com/wiki/File:Matryx_Guides_Dominions_3_Newbie_Game_Update_013_5500_009_06.jpg
[19:22:17] <ialex>	Nikerabbit: hmm?
[19:22:39] <toofer>	I'm trying to import a dump of my mediawiki database with this command: importDump.php file.xml
[19:23:07] <toofer>	Is that the right syntax?
[19:23:23] <Nikerabbit>	ialex: error was: urlencode() expects parameter 1 to be string, object given
[19:24:00] <toofer>	I'm actually running: php maintenance/importDump.php file.xml. It seems stalled on my prompt as if the script is waiting for input or something.
[19:24:10] <OverlordQ>	lch: have thumbnailing enabled?
[19:24:19] <lch>	all other images work
[19:24:24] <lch>	only that one doesn't
[19:24:36] <lch>	I tried re-uploading the same image, doesn't change anything
[19:24:46] <toofer>	Ich: where is the link where you are thumbnailing it?
[19:24:49] <lch>	file/directory permissions are okay
[19:24:58] <lch>	http://dom3.servegame.com/wiki/User:Matryx/Guides/Dominions_3_Newbie_Game/Update_013
[19:25:08] <lch>	search for text "The Mind Lord"
[19:26:32] <toofer>	Ich: You don't say to resize the image from what I see: Here is what you have:
[19:26:32] <toofer>	[[Image:Matryx_Guides_Dominions_3_Newbie_Game_Update_013_5500_009_06.jpg|frame|left|The Mind Lord]]
[19:26:46] <OverlordQ>	what isn't it resizing? they're all really effing big
[19:26:57] <toofer>	Ich: You should add a pixel size in there somewhere to fix that.
[19:27:09] <lch>	well, I don't want to resize it, just display it
[19:27:13] <saper>	lch: did you every program anything related to the Forth programming language?
[19:27:24] <lch>	saper, nope
[19:27:33] <lch>	for some reason the Wiki gives it the "display: none" attribute
[19:27:43] <lch>	which is why it isn't displaying
[19:27:55] <toofer>	Ich: the image is displaying for me.
[19:28:07] <OverlordQ>	doesn't for me, pic shows up
[19:28:59] <lch>	huh
[19:29:15] <lch>	maybe spam filter on my side? :P
[19:29:26] <lch>	ayup
[19:29:28] <lch>	thanks
[19:29:35] <toofer>	Ich: Your original question about an image that is not resizing. You don't specify a size, or use the "thumb" option to resize the image. The image seems to be displaying for me.
[19:30:28] <toofer>	btw, that command php command I ran seems to be working now. Just took it a bit to run I guess.
[19:31:01] <lch>	as I said, AdBlock+ blocked it for me
[19:31:19] <lch>	the problem was client-side, thanks for the help
[19:32:35] <OverlordQ>	importDump can be painfully slow
[19:43:15] <CIA-58>	03ialex * r52372 10/trunk/extensions/OnlineStatus/OnlineStatus.php: same as r52370, insert after editcount if registration date is not set
[19:45:36] <kibble>	ialex, any ideas? :-) <kibble> it's possible to set an edit summary through a url, right?
[19:49:11] <ialex>	will see
[19:50:56] <ialex>	kibble: action=edit&summary=default%20summary
[19:51:21] <kibble>	oooh, it works
[19:51:24] *kibble 	embrasse ialex 
[19:51:34] <ialex>	:D
[19:51:38] <ialex>	no problem
[19:52:13] <wikibugs>	03(mod) formatnum works wrong in german - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18957  (10brion)
[19:53:25] <toofer>	I'm trying to merge two wikis together that have been maintained separately until now. When I run the importDump.php script to import my XML dump I don't seem to get all the articles. I'm just running: importDump.php dump.xml
[19:59:41] <Nikerabbit>	argh
[20:00:11] <wikibugs>	03(mod) formatnum works wrong in german - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18957  (10brion)
[20:02:52] <work|dana>	is there a conflict between mediawiki and apache virtualhosts?
[20:04:03] <work|dana>	i see in the default mediawiki.conf the second comment says "this does not work properly with virtual hosts, but i thought that was in reference to aliasing /mediawiki to /var/lib/mediawiki
[20:11:39] <CIA-58>	03dale * r52373 10/branches/new-upload/phase3/js2/mwEmbed/ (3 files in 3 dirs): improved archive.org timed Text example
[20:11:43] <OverlordQ>	default what now?
[20:17:45] <Schroeder>	holy crap, the US is about to beat Spain
[20:17:51] <Schroeder>	I don't really care about soccer, but this is impressive
[20:18:35] <LauraHale>	I know. :D
[20:18:37] <LauraHale>	It is awesome.
[20:20:47] <work|dana>	OverlordQ: maybe mediawiki from ubuntu repos is just set up very strange, but there is a /etc/apache2/conf.d/mediawiki.conf that is there out of the box
[20:22:40] <OverlordQ>	mediawiki works fine with vhosts
[20:24:22] <work|dana>	OverlordQ: thanks, i wanted to make sure i wasn't just spinning my wheels trying to make this work
[20:29:20] <caliberate>	Any template experts in here?
[20:34:06] <Subfader>	just post your problem
[20:34:52] <caliberate>	I'm trying to substitute a template that uses #vardefine
[20:34:54] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Transfer of Mot�: lemmata from wa.wiki to wa.wikt - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17547  (10spacebirdy)
[20:36:03] <caliberate>	basically I'm trying to combine inputs from one template, and substitute a different one based on that combination
[20:36:25] <caliberate>	but when I subst it, it says {{#var:varname}} instead of the actual number
[20:36:35] <caliberate>	I've tried subst:#var which didn't work either
[20:41:07] <almaghi>	could an administrator of mediawiki.org delete http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/User:Al_Maghi/monobook.js
[20:46:17] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) Wasteful tabs, newlines in global variables script - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19382 enhancement; Normal; MediaWiki: Page rendering; (greenreaper)
[20:47:13] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Wasteful tabs, newlines in global variables script - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19382  15enhancement->minor; normal->low;  +easy +patch (10greenreaper)
[20:47:41] <Nikerabbit>	oh no
[20:47:44] <Nikerabbit>	21 bytes!
[20:50:19] <OverlordQ>	think of the tubes
[20:51:51] <prefrontal>	i need a space at the beginning of the output of an {{#if}}...stupid broken system!
[20:52:10] <CIA-58>	03tparscal * r52374 10/trunk/phase3/skins/ (23 files in 3 dirs): Massive improvements towards IE6 compatibility, but not quite back to normal yet - and more testing needs to happen on other browsers as well.
[20:52:22] <prefrontal>	"i bet he put that there on accident, let me delete it for him just in case!"
[20:52:45] <Nikerabbit>	and it magically fixes itself if you keep insulting it
[20:52:59] <prefrontal>	one day, i can only hope..
[20:53:19] <Nikerabbit>	well, it was a worth a try...
[20:59:03] <ttf>	hi all - what's the closest calender extension to the google calender?
[20:59:14] <ttf>	I'm looking for a calender with JS support
[20:59:44] <ttf>	like in - you click on a certain date, a popup occurs where you can details, etc.
[21:00:11] <ttf>	a very important thing I'm looking for are categories
[21:06:51] <Simetrical>	prefrontal, &#32;?
[21:13:28] <wikibugs>	03(mod) OpenID 0.9 release meta-bug - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19349  (10sergey.chernyshev)
[21:13:45] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) Different OpenID URLs returned by Yahoo! to Login and Convert - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19383 major; Normal; MediaWiki extensions: OpenID; (sergey.chernyshev)
[21:14:16] <chuck>	ttf: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Calendar
[21:14:19] <chuck>	lots of choices
[21:14:24] <chuck>	with screenshots and descriptions
[21:14:38] <ttf>	chuck: checked that - there's no demo though
[21:15:00] <ttf>	so you can't see if i has the JS functionality I am looking for
[21:19:14] <GreenReaper>	Can't *you* see if it has the JS functionality you are looking for? The code is right there. :-)
[21:19:40] <chuck>	indeed
[21:19:44] <chuck>	this one looks really really nice: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Calendar_(Kenyu73)
[21:20:22] <chuck>	wow that person's extensions rock
[21:27:45] <ttf>	k - thanks all..
[21:34:02] <prefrontal>	honestly, is the parser function syntax not insane? does anyone believe that?
[21:34:26] <prefrontal>	if the url or doi parameters were supplied, check to see if the http prefix was supplied. if not, supply it
[21:34:27] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Wasteful tabs, newlines in global variables script - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19382  (10brion)
[21:34:28] <prefrontal>	{{#if:{{#pos:{{#if:{{{4}}}|[{{{4}}}|{{#if:{{{5}}}|[{{{5}}}}}}}|http|}}|{{#if:{{{4}}}|[{{{4}}}|{{#if:{{{5}}}|[{{{5}}}}}}}|http://dx.doi.org/{{#if:{{{4}}}|[{{{4}}}|{{#if:{{{5}}}|[{{{5}}}}}}}}}
[21:36:19] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Wasteful tabs, newlines in global variables script - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19382  +comment (10brion)
[21:41:30] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) wikibugs reports resolver instead of commeter on comments to resolved bug? - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19384 enhancement; Normal; Wikimedia: wikibugs IRC bot; (brion)
[21:42:02] <Simetrical>	"Typing in text areas is becoming more commonplace" https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=167951#c23
[21:42:06] <Simetrical>	Um really?
[21:43:18] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Enable StringFunctions on WMF wikis - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6455  (10Simetrical+wikibugs)
[21:43:54] <CIA-58>	03tparscal * r52375 10/trunk/phase3/skins/vector/main.css: RTL fixes. RTL in IE6 is still a disaster.
[21:44:52] <CIA-58>	03tparscal * r52376 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/EditToolbar/ (5 files in 2 dirs): Toolbar is laying out mostly correctly in IE6, but still only works intermitently, and Images need to be converted to 8bit with an #f3f3f3 matte.
[21:45:50] <prefrontal>	StringFunctions on the wiki would be a disaster
[21:45:54] <prefrontal>	thank god Tim is sane
[21:46:05] <prefrontal>	i would prefer to write in assembly
[21:46:39] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Set project namespace of Portuguese Wikibooks to "Wikilivros" - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19364  (10Simetrical+wikibugs)
[21:46:54] <brion>	Simetrical: it's people using all those web 2.0 sites :)
[21:47:10] <brion>	mail clients are dying in favor of webmail
[21:47:18] <brion>	(or twitter or facebok or wikis)
[21:47:19] <Simetrical>	brion, maybe.  I <3 editable textareas in Chrome.
[21:47:29] <brion>	who types in word these days? :)
[21:47:51] <Simetrical>	I now use it as my primary browser, despite the fact that I have to use Firefox for bookmarks and plugins (mainly Flash), because those don't work in Linux Chromium yet.
[21:48:13] <CIA-58>	03tparscal * r52377 10/trunk/phase3/skins/vector/csshover.htc: Added IE only behavior for hover effect
[21:48:14] <brion>	heh
[21:48:45] <brion>	i like my dev tools and foxmarks syncing too much to leave for funky browsers
[21:48:47] <brion>	firefox ftw
[21:49:05] <Simetrical>	Chrome's built-in dev tools seem as good as Firebug.
[21:49:18] <Simetrical>	No clue what Foxmarks is, though.
[21:49:32] <brion>	xmarks now, they rebranded. :P bookmark syncing service
[21:49:53] <Simetrical>	But seriously, Chrome is *fast* compared to Firefox.  I mean, not even necessarily page loading, just interface responsiveness.
[21:50:00] <brion>	they also have other crap i don't use like site suggestion
[21:50:16] <Simetrical>	They have a dedicated interface thread and it's not allowed to make any blocking system calls unless they're guaranteed to be really short.
[21:50:24] <brion>	i've never really noticed *shrug*
[21:50:43] <Simetrical>	It's probably worse on Linux.  Everyone seems to agree Firefox is slower on Linux than Windows.
[21:50:43] <vvv>	Simetrical: isn't Chrome still Windows-only?
[21:51:00] <Simetrical>	vvv, it's been usable on Mac/Linux for a month or two now.
[21:51:14] <Simetrical>	By this point it doesn't crash or anything, mostly.  It's just missing chunks of functionality.
[21:51:27] <Simetrical>	Like bookmarks.  And plug-ins (not to be confused with extensions, srsly).
[21:51:51] <GreenReaper>	brion: Even across all the cached pages in squids? You could probably save a whole squid. :-)
[21:51:52] <Simetrical>	And printing, complex text, complex tag dragging, and Gears support.
[21:52:00] <Simetrical>	Save the squids!
[21:52:06] <Simetrical>	They're less personable than whales, though.
[21:52:09] <vvv>	And it isn't so memory-hungry like Opera
[21:52:57] <Simetrical>	Slashdot recently claimed that Chrome used like 1G of memory if you used it for a while.
[21:53:08] <Simetrical>	Of course, that was because the guy who wrote the test just added up the memory used by each process.
[21:53:26] <GreenReaper>	Honestly I see a huge amount of cuttable junk in the output. Random comments like "Head Scripts". The PP limit report. The parser cache key. (who outside dev needs to know that?!)
[21:53:30] <Simetrical>	. . . honestly, the stated figures probably aren't accurate for any other browser either.
[21:53:36] <Simetrical>	GreenReaper, people reporting bugs.
[21:53:39] <vvv>	Simetrical: they has a nice textarea scaling feature
[21:53:48] <Simetrical>	vvv, yeah, WebKit allows resizable textareas.
[21:54:00] <GreenReaper>	Then we should have a mode of MediaWiki which outputs them.
[21:54:04] <Simetrical>	Mike Beltzner just marked it blocking 3.6, so Firefox will have it then too, probably.
[21:54:06] <GreenReaper>	$wgDeveloperMode
[21:54:17] <Simetrical>	Doesn't help bug reporters.
[21:54:24] <Simetrical>	Bug reporters are often users, not admins.
[21:54:34] <Simetrical>	You could have a URL param, though.
[21:54:36] <Simetrical>	If it were an issue.
[21:54:45] <GreenReaper>	"end of the left (by default at least) column"
[21:54:51] <GreenReaper>	in every page
[21:55:22] <GreenReaper>	It just angers up my blood. :-)
[21:55:41] <TheOracle23>	Guys
[21:55:46] <TheOracle23>	Vandalism? http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Suck_that_cock
[21:55:47] <MrZ-man>	why stop there, why not just eliminate every linebreak, space, and tab that isn't part of the actual text
[21:55:53] <GreenReaper>	I agree.
[21:55:56] <TheOracle23>	It was originally Download
[21:56:17] <TheOracle23>	was moved and has profanity init now :/
[21:56:41] <GreenReaper>	The system is optimized for the very, very few users who are also looking at the source. I think this is a bad idea.
[21:56:41] <TheOracle23>	would cleanup but can't edit or move for some reason
[21:57:46] <TheOracle23>	ty "Mr. Z-Man"
[21:58:07] <GreenReaper>	msn.com has the right idea.
[21:58:21] <GreenReaper>	as much as I'm not a fan of MS
[21:58:37] <TheOracle23>	you should really protect Download as admin only
[21:58:40] <Simetrical>	Yeah, I was about to get out the torch and pitchfork there.
[21:59:20] <Simetrical>	TheOracle23, probably not a problem for it to stay autoconfirmed.  It's admin-only for moves now, anyway.
[21:59:26] <brion>	GreenReaper: i like to think that balancing multiple concerns makes sense
[21:59:28] <TheOracle23>	ok
[21:59:37] <GreenReaper>	I'm just saying, Wikipedia is one of the largest websites in the world. The little things add up. They cost real money.
[21:59:52] <brion>	on the one hand, saving 10 bytes that are going to be dwarfed a thousandfold by the surrounding text
[21:59:57] <Simetrical>	Wikipedia bandwidth usage is how close to zero compared to, say, BitTorrent and YouTube?
[22:00:03] <brion>	on the other hand, actual usefulness
[22:00:13] <brion>	literally a thousandfold, dude
[22:00:18] <brion>	multiple thousandfolds in most cases
[22:00:32] <GreenReaper>	brion: OK, so perhaps we need to look for a way which the usefulness can be preserved while trimming out that thousandth.
[22:00:34] <Simetrical>	brion, you could probably shave off 10% from the HTML by full minification like msn.com seems to do.
[22:00:41] <brion>	making code illegible hurts actual people
[22:00:41] <Simetrical>	After gzip, I mean.
[22:00:42] <Simetrical>	At least 5%.
[22:00:44] <GreenReaper>	because it's not the only thousandth.
[22:00:53] <Simetrical>	THINK OF THE ACTUAL PEOPLE!
[22:01:09] <brion>	if you're going to advocate stripping out some stuff, keep it reasonable.
[22:01:11] <GreenReaper>	Simetrical: That's what I've been doing for the last month or so. So many headers of dubious use.
[22:01:12] <Simetrical>	Part of the problem is that "view source" isn't smart enough to format messy HTML readably.
[22:01:22] <TheOracle23>	you could compress all outgoing content like I do :P
[22:01:47] <Simetrical>	TheOracle23, you mean minify or gzip?  Obviously we do gzip.
[22:01:54] <TheOracle23>	GZip yea
[22:01:59] <TheOracle23>	through apache
[22:02:18] <GreenReaper>	albeit not on wikipedia.org yet. ;-)
[22:02:26] <GreenReaper>	(I know, I know . . .)
[22:02:28] <TheOracle23>	that may be a good idea
[22:02:36] <GreenReaper>	It's done for most things, TheDevilOFFLine.
[22:02:42] <GreenReaper>	* TheOracle23
[22:02:48] <TheOracle23>	O_o
[22:02:56] <GreenReaper>	(tab completion fail)
[22:02:59] <TheOracle23>	ic
[22:03:02] <Simetrical>	TheOracle23, dude, everyone gzips outgoing content.
[22:03:05] <CIA-58>	03simetrical * r52378 10/trunk/phase3/skins/MonoBook.php: Remove useless HTML comment
[22:03:15] <Simetrical>	MediaWiki gzips outgoing HTML pages even without web server support.
[22:03:34] <Simetrical>	GreenReaper, think how many bytes I just saved!
[22:03:50] <GreenReaper>	!r52378
[22:03:50] --mwbot--	I don't know anything about "r52378".
[22:03:57] *GreenReaper 	forgets how to do that.
[22:04:00] <Simetrical>	!r 52378
[22:04:00] --mwbot--	http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:Code/MediaWiki/52378
[22:04:16] <Simetrical>	Probably 40k req/s average, times 86400 s/day, times . . . however many bytes I removed . . .
[22:04:30] <Simetrical>	24?
[22:04:36] <GreenReaper>	minus gzip but still
[22:04:54] <Simetrical>	77 GB a day!
[22:05:12] <Simetrical>	Which is what, 10 seconds' worth of Wikipedia traffic?
[22:05:25] <Simetrical>	Maybe 30 seconds.
[22:05:31] <GreenReaper>	It's less about bandwidth and more about responsiveness for users.
[22:05:34] <Simetrical>	. . . but yeah, we could definitely do more front-end optimization.
[22:05:38] <Simetrical>	We kind of suck at that right now.
[22:06:04] <Simetrical>	But the first focus should be merging CSS and JS files, and moving JS to the bottom.
[22:06:29] <Simetrical>	Removing whitespace from the HTML isn't so essential.  :)
[22:07:50] <GreenReaper>	Yeah
[22:08:01] <GreenReaper>	Even I don't do that yet. ;-)
[22:08:04] <GreenReaper>	in most places
[22:08:19] <GreenReaper>	but the head scripts - they're meant to be read by programs anyway, not users.
[22:08:56] <Simetrical>	You mean the JS vars?
[22:08:59] <Simetrical>	We probably have too many of those.
[22:09:03] <Simetrical>	People tend to go overboard adding them.
[22:09:24] <GreenReaper>	If it is possible to have less, that would help too. I mean, the vars are actually harder to compress than whitespace.
[22:11:36] <crouch88>	can someone give me a word for striking out what you have written
[22:11:59] <OverlordQ>	i'd probably go with striking
[22:12:06] <GreenReaper>	Yeah
[22:12:54] <caliberate>	obfuscating
[22:13:03] <GreenReaper>	Simetrical: If you're looking for another comment to eliminate or shorten, the line before "visualClear" is mentioned is a good one. I can see where "start content" and "end content" are useful to some people.
[22:13:38] <Simetrical>	The line before visualClear is mentioned?
[22:14:22] <Simetrical>	You mean the <!-- end content -->?  Eh, I don't know about that one.
[22:15:13] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Wasteful tabs, newlines in global variables script - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19382  (10matthew.britton)
[22:18:54] <GreenReaper>	I mean "end of the left ... column". Could just be "end of left column", if you really want it there.
[22:18:56] <BlackWolf>	how do i know how many "fields" are needed for infoboxdata in the db?
[22:21:08] <Simetrical>	BlackWolf, what?
[22:21:19] <BlackWolf>	i'm trying to install this: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Infobox_Data_Capture#Database_Table_Addition but it keeps asking for "fields" from me, but it doesn't say a shiet of it on that page...
[22:22:29] <BlackWolf>	or is there another look-a-like infobox extension that i could use instead, something that's more similar to the one on wikipedia.org?
[22:24:54] <Simetrical>	Wikipedia doesn't use an extension for infoboxes.
[22:24:57] <Simetrical>	It uses templates.
[22:25:11] <BlackWolf>	hmm ok
[22:25:20] <BlackWolf>	where to get this then?
[22:26:44] <Simetrical>	They're part of the default software.
[22:26:45] <Simetrical>	!templates
[22:26:45] --mwbot--	For more information about templates, see <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Templates>. The most common issues with templates copied from Wikipedia can be fixed by installing ParserFunctions <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Extension:ParserFunctions> and enabling HTML Tidy <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:%24wgUseTidy>
[22:27:03] <Simetrical>	You'll need at least Extension:ParserFunctions, though.
[22:27:23] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Enable StringFunctions on WMF wikis - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6455  (10rohde)
[22:28:33] <Danwe>	hi
[22:28:56] <caliberate>	hi Danwe
[22:29:03] <Danwe>	does anybody here know the extension "Multi Wiki Edit" by Bartek ?api?ski ??
[22:29:26] <Danwe>	Bartek Lapinski
[22:30:10] <Simetrical>	Mostly people here don't know about extensions except those used by Wikimedia, plus a few others.
[22:30:22] <Simetrical>	You'd be best off contacting the author of the specific extension.
[22:33:50] <caliberate>	so how would you use substitution to get the value from {{#var:varname}}?
[22:34:31] <caliberate>	I've tried using {{#expr:{{#var:varname}} +0}} too.
[22:35:04] <Simetrical>	What's {{#var}}?
[22:35:31] <caliberate>	i'm taking two inputs from a template and using {{#vardefine:varname|{{{1}}} + {{{2}}}}}
[22:35:40] <caliberate>	err...
[22:35:51] <caliberate>	with the appropriate {{#expr of course
[22:36:06] <caliberate>	then using {{#var:varname}} to call another template
[22:36:28] <caliberate>	eventually i'd like to just end up with the last template and the actual number in the paramter instead of the variable
[22:36:48] <brion-meeting>	GreenReaper: btw, you can save more bytes by dropping the separate 'var' on each line. :) keeping the newlines this is stilla  win over your initial patch
[22:37:08] <Danwe>	Simetrical: I couldn't find any information about this extension or the author
[22:37:11] <caliberate>	subst:#var doesn't work like subst:#PAGESINCATEGORY or someting
[22:37:15] <GreenReaper>	brion-meeting: So let's do both?
[22:37:26] <Danwe>	only know it's used here: http://fallout.wikia.com/index.php?title=Special:Version
[22:37:26] <GreenReaper>	Double win.
[22:37:32] <Danwe>	perhaps I will write them
[22:37:32] <Simetrical>	caliberate, I have no idea what #var is.  It's not part of the core MediaWiki or ParserFunctions, is it?
[22:37:34] <GreenReaper>	I am not sure if "var" has a special meaning.
[22:37:48] <Simetrical>	Of course it does.
[22:37:57] <Simetrical>	But you can do var foo = 1, bar = 2, ...
[22:38:03] <GreenReaper>	Oh, that's a good idea.
[22:38:05] <Simetrical>	Instead of var foo = 1; var bar = 2; ...
[22:38:07] <GreenReaper>	So let's do that?
[22:38:17] <Danwe>	any problems with #var ? I know the code and made some extensions in the last weeks. perhaps I can help
[22:38:35] <caliberate>	i'm trying to substitute it, Danwe
[22:38:51] <caliberate>	Simetrical: yeah I think it is
[22:38:52] <brion-meeting>	GreenReaper: ;)
[22:38:58] <brion-meeting>	you only need the first var, yes
[22:39:01] <Simetrical>	caliberate, I'm quite sure it's not.
[22:39:09] <caliberate>	:)
[22:39:17] <caliberate>	okay, well I read the usage on MediaWiki.org
[22:39:23] <caliberate>	but I don't know if that means anything
[22:39:32] <Simetrical>	caliberate, there are like four million extensions on mediawiki.org.
[22:39:36] <Simetrical>	Written by God only knows who.
[22:39:37] <Simetrical>	It's a wiki.
[22:39:38] <caliberate>	ahh, okay sorry
[22:39:39] <BlackWolf>	how about editing the Main_page title then, can it be done?
[22:39:49] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Wasteful tabs, newlines in global variables script - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19382  (10greenreaper)
[22:40:17] <caliberate>	well, in general, is there a way to substitute a template which substitutes a template so that you're just left with the second one?
[22:41:10] <BlackWolf>	calibrate: who me?
[22:41:34] <BlackWolf>	sorry caliberate, i'm tierd
[22:41:43] <Danwe>	caliberate: substitute it how?
[22:41:46] <caliberate>	um anyone
[22:41:48] <caliberate>	heh
[22:42:09] <caliberate>	the user will subst a template that has two paramters which are added together to call another template
[22:43:16] <caliberate>	and i can't look at Extension:variablesExtension right now as it's blocked at work for having "sEx" in the title
[22:43:16] <caliberate>	lol
[22:43:41] <BlackWolf>	i hate "Main_page" title and i wish i could change that somehow.. anyone, got an idea how to?
[22:43:45] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Wasteful tabs, var statements in global variables script - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19382  summary; +comment (10greenreaper)
[22:45:57] <Betacommand>	who handles import/export componets?
[22:47:45] <brion-meeting>	Betacommand: those probably will end up in tomaszf's hands
[22:48:50] <Betacommand>	tomaszf: could I get your thoughts on bug 13827
[22:49:37] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Wasteful tabs, var statements in global variables script - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19382  (10brion)
[22:50:26] <wikibugs>	03(NEW) MetaVidWiki: Add GENDER support. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19385 enhancement; Normal; MediaWiki extensions: MetaVidWiki; (bugzilla.wikimedia)
[22:54:14] <BlackWolf>	Bj�rnH: do you know how to edit Main_page title?
[22:57:11] <p858snake>	brion-meeting: when your out of the metting, any progress on bug 16553 (the image-destroying bug one)?
[23:07:57] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Enable StringFunctions on WMF wikis - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6455  (10Simetrical+wikibugs)
[23:11:38] <vvv>	Simetrical: oh, StringFunctions, episode N...
[23:13:29] *^demon 	watches the bug, but doesn't put his name on the cc list
[23:21:41] <vvv>	^demon: so, do you agree with StringFunctions' impact on users sanity?
[23:24:02] <GreenReaper>	Nice. Stripping vars plus tabs plus spaces between varnme = var cuts 61 bytes.
[23:24:35] <^demon>	GreenReaper: I'm looking at the remove-tabs bit of it. Brion's already ok'd it, so I'll apply + commit.
[23:24:55] <^demon>	vvv: I don't have any strong feelings on StringFunctions either way.
[23:25:07] <^demon>	If people want it, cool. If Tim/Brion/whomever says no, whatever.
[23:26:02] <brion-meeting>	p858snake: putting it on my list thx
[23:26:41] <vvv>	Well, I don't personally want templates code to turn into a brainfsck-like mess. But on other hand, many such templates would be replaced with a singe string function
[23:27:33] <Betacommand>	.win 7
[23:27:47] <^demon>	vvv: True.
[23:27:54] <werdna>	vvv: why does your brain need its filesystem checked?
[23:28:35] <CIA-58>	03demon * r52379 10/trunk/phase3/includes/Skin.php: (bug 19382) Remove useless tabs from header variables. Patch by GreenReaper.
[23:28:42] <wikibugs>	03(FIXED) Wasteful tabs, var statements in global variables script - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19382  +comment (10innocentkiller)
[23:29:58] <GreenReaper>	demon: I'm actually going to submit a new patch because brion is correct in saying that removing var improves matters further. Let me get that uploaded
[23:30:01] <vvv>	werdna: once, when I was ~3, my friend crashed into my head with a swing
[23:30:15] <^demon>	GreenReaper: ok.
[23:30:52] <GreenReaper>	Oddly, removing newlines only gains 3 more bytes (which I agree is not really worth it) while removing the spaces before and after the = on each line gains 15.
[23:33:13] <wikibugs>	04(REOPENED) Wasteful tabs, var statements in global variables script - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19382  +comment (10greenreaper)
[23:35:48] <werdna>	vvv: that explains a lot ;)
[23:38:32] <vvv>	werdna: yeah. I met many people. Some of them told me I had Asperger syndrome. Others diagnosed ADHD. Many said that psychiatry sucked :)
[23:40:56] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Wasteful tabs, var statements in global variables script - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19382  +comment (10greenreaper)
[23:41:56] <wikibugs>	03(mod) Localize auto-summaries - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19363  summary; +comment (10innocentkiller)
[23:50:09] <^demon>	GreenReaper: Why switching to commas? Don't see any net benefit here?
[23:51:41] <maiya>	hi there, I'm trying to edit the header information on a mediawiki site - does anyone know where I can find the file to edit the template?  all of the css files are in the template folder, but nowhere to edit the actual html - any ideas where this info is?  thanks!
[23:53:07] <p858snake>	you edit on the actual wiki eg: [[Mediawiki:Monobook.css]]
[23:54:27] <GreenReaper>	^demon: There is a 10 byte difference, gzipped.
[23:55:05] <GreenReaper>	between 'var x=y;\nvar a=b;' vs. 'var x=y,\na=b' 
[23:55:10] <GreenReaper>	(over all the variables)
[23:55:25] <maiya>	hmm, ok, thanks
[23:55:37] <maiya>	there isn't an html or php file to edit the divs and html?
[23:57:19] <GreenReaper>	It is an odd saving, but it is there. You can see if it you try it on a test wiki that uses gzip.
[23:57:38] <maiya>	ok, thanks so much - I would've never found that!
[23:58:01] <Simetrical>	maiya, you can edit skins/MonoBook.php, but that's not advisable.  Your changes will be overwritten on upgrade.
[23:58:09] <Simetrical>	What is it you're trying to accomplish, specifically?
[23:58:16] <Simetrical>	You might want to use a hook instead.
[23:58:35] <maiya>	I want to change the graphics on our header, and I can't do it just through css - need to add some html
[23:58:44] <maiya>	on http://network.dreamfish.com/devwiki/
[23:59:06] <maiya>	I need to just add another div wrapper so I can add a repeating bg image
[23:59:18] <^demon>	GreenReaper: Gotcha, comitting.
[23:59:30] <^demon>	Committing, even.