[00:06:14] Annemarie: apparently it can't be configured [00:06:18] which is a load of garbage [00:08:42] ? [00:09:47] In "includes/specials/SpecialBooksources.php" private function showList() there is a line: [00:09:48] $title = Title::makeTitleSafe( NS_PROJECT, wfMsgForContent( 'booksources' ) ); # Show list in content language [00:09:49] MikaelLindmark: As far as I can tell, the only way to change the list of pages displayed is by editing the php file [00:10:02] that changes the title [00:10:07] is that what you want to do? [00:11:42] no. I want to replace the 4 lines of with 40+ lines of search options (like "Find this book through Google, Find this book in the Swedish Royal Library catalogue " etc) [00:12:04] right, then you need to go to MessagesEn.php [00:12:12] go to $bookstoreList [00:12:14] and do that [00:12:18] so far as I can tell that is the only way [00:12:21] ah. OK. [00:12:36] there is one thing [00:14:37] MikaelLindmark: go to MediaWiki:Booksources-text [00:14:40] try editing that [00:14:42] see what happens [00:14:47] I wonder if it might disable the defaults [00:14:52] and then you could just add links to it [00:16:37] Prodego:ah [00:17:52] Prodego:If you see at http://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special%3ABookSources&isbn=12345678 it is a wikipage, not a list in $bookstoreList [00:20:45] MikaelLindmark: that is from Project:Book sources [00:20:59] I don't know who designed this mess [00:21:39] http://www.ndwiki.org/wiki/NDWiki:Book_sources [00:21:41] that page [00:21:51] delete the change you already made to mediawiki:booksources [00:22:07] Prodego:But that what pops up when you look for an ISBN. [00:22:14] Prodego:ok [00:24:07] Prodego:"MediaWiki:Booksources" is untouched. [00:25:04] MikaelLindmark: should have a space [00:25:07] Book sources [00:26:28] Prodego:Ah. The namespace should be NDWiki ("the project"), nor MediaWiki [00:26:40] I think, possibly [00:26:43] Prodego:I'll move the page. [00:26:48] this ISBN stuff seems very non-standard [00:28:37] Prodego:THANKS! It works now: http://www.ndwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Special%3ABookSources&isbn=123123123 [00:29:07] MikaelLindmark: you're welcome I'm glad I could figure that out! :) [00:29:21] MikaelLindmark: just make sure to unlearn that, because every other message is in the mediawiki namespace [00:29:55] Prodego:LOL! [00:32:56] MikaelLindmark: yea, I have no idea why that is designed that way [00:33:02] I'm glad we could figure it out though [00:34:19] Prodego:Thanks alot! I'm going to bed now! :-D [00:35:45] hello, I have a question: I have a template like this: {{#switch: {{PAGENAME}}|{{Languages}}=it's not english|it's english}} and {{Languages}} contains: ES|FR|IT only but this keeps giving me "it's english" even if the pagename is "ES", what the trouble? I've tried putting a {{!}} instead of | in {{Languages}} but no luck. Anyone can help? [00:37:39] right now I'm using {{#switch: {{PAGENAME}}|ES|FR|IT=it's not english|it's english}} but since I'm using this kindof switch in many templates when languages change I'd like to change just one place [00:39:39] that is I'd like to keep a list of languages in a {{Languages}} template and update only that one each time [00:51:00] mindrones: that = sign should perhaps be a | [00:51:20] and are you sure you want a switch [00:51:26] or am I misunderstanding what you are doing [00:51:42] Prodego thx for answering, trying now [00:52:59] Prodego no it doesn't work, I'll let you see it on the wiki itself, a moment [00:53:06] ah thanks :) [00:53:09] link would be good [00:53:42] Prodego http://wiki.blender.org/index.php?title=Template:UM/navigator [00:53:55] you see a list of languages in there [00:54:29] in blender's wiki, manual pages are liek Doc:FR/Manual/blabla [00:54:33] like* [00:55:05] I take the first piece (FR) so I know it's a french page [00:55:33] ok [00:55:45] and in that case I put that little Inprogress bar, like here http://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Doc:FR/Manual/Interface/Panels [00:56:48] problem is that I have this list of langs all over in templates and when one new language is started I have to update all over the templates with a new language code, like adding a |KO [00:56:49] so you want it to say it's english if it is english [00:56:56] and otherwise say it's not english [00:57:01] yes, basically [00:57:18] then [00:57:27] I'd liek to "store" the list of langs in a template and include that list in a switch when I need it [00:57:44] {{#ifeq:{{PAGENAME}}|EN| it's not english | it's not english }} [00:57:55] you shouldn't use a switch if you only have 2 options [00:58:04] no I have many [00:58:19] the only options are 'is english' and 'is not english' [00:58:24] from what I understand? [00:58:26] That's not really true. [00:58:36] You can put #if's inside the branches. [00:58:39] because the langs can be many [00:58:48] Oh, I think I misread. [00:59:11] so it is "if langs is one of these many do this, else do that" [00:59:26] Annemarie thx anyway :) [01:00:06] mindrones: so what is the overall goal? [01:00:06] {{#ifeq:{{#switch:{{lc:{{PAGENAME}}}}|en|fr=yes}}|yes|do X|else do Y}} [01:00:09] Something like that. [01:00:30] annemarie trying [01:01:33] Prodego I have many templates with this: {{#switch: {{#titleparts:{{PAGENAME}}|1|1}} |AR|BR|CA|CZ|DE|DK|ES|FA|FI|FR|ID|IT|KR|NL|PL|PT|RO|RU|SR|SV|UK|ZH=DO A |DO B }} [01:02:02] Prodego and I wish I could do this: {{#switch: {{#titleparts:{{PAGENAME}}|1|1}} |{{Languages}}=DO A |DO B }} [01:02:24] with {{Languages}} containing AR|BR|CA|CZ|DE|DK|ES|FA|FI|FR|ID|IT|KR|NL|PL|PT|RO|RU|SR|SV|UK|ZH [01:02:34] so I update only {{Languages}} [01:02:49] instead of updating them all over each time [01:03:24] DO A and DO B are pseudo code [01:03:50] Have you looked at the languages template on MW.org? [01:04:25] Emufarmers not yet, I had these to manage and just looking at the fist thing to reduce maintenance :) [01:04:45] I know they use langlinks but I don't know how to use those [01:05:51] We'll just wait for Splarka; he'll know what to do. o: [01:07:23] :) yes he helped me other times too :) [01:07:41] mindrones: did you create template:! ? [01:07:46] yes [01:07:57] it contains a | only, right? [01:11:25] Annemarie thx, the problem is I'd like to put those 2 en|fr in a template, because I have to put them in many templates [01:13:23] The language definitions? [01:13:29] You can put the {{#switch: in a template. [01:16:08] Annemarie the switch is always different, apart for the arguments (the languages and the titleparts parser function) [01:17:04] you mean I can put the switch in a template and provide the results X and Y as variables? [01:17:13] that would be interesting indeed [01:17:53] How is it determined? [01:18:30] I have pages like Doc:FR/Manual/blabla, so title parts serves to get the FR [01:19:08] then if it is a FR I do things with that FR, like giving the index page, which is always Doc:FR/Manual and so [01:23:41] hey guys.. I'm suffering a little confusion in regards to the license agreements for the mediawiki software... are these relevant to the content that ends up being added to the wiki, or just for the mediawiki code? [01:23:55] Just the code [01:24:41] It does ask you to select a license when installing, and that *is* for the content. [01:24:51] The code itself is under the GPL. [01:24:52] yeah, that's the phase I am referring to [01:26:01] You can change it afterwards, of course - but obviously there might be issues if you started using the wiki under one license and then tried to change to another. :-) [01:26:49] Mmm, yeah [01:27:06] Having an issue turning the license details into laymans terms for myself [01:28:06] I'd suggest trying http://creativecommons.org/choose/ [01:28:22] You select the features you want and it tells you what one you should have. [01:28:58] Of course, if you want a different license then you can just add that manually - select the standard "copyrighted" option for now and then you can set the license text and link in LocalSettings.php later. [01:29:02] (by setting a couple of variables) [01:30:17] so it /is/ possible to have a copyrighted wiki? [01:30:54] 03(mod) Activate abuse filter on itwiki - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19772 (10webmelos) [01:32:01] Well all stuff is copyrighted. [01:32:28] The issue is that users own the copyright so they have to license it to at least you in order for you to be able to distribute it on the wiki. [01:32:44] The question is what other rights, if any, do they give to you or to anyone else. [01:33:45] (They really have to be able to modify that work and redistribute that modification too, at least on that site.) [01:34:29] so a wiki is full of copyrights and nobody owns anything other than what they wrote? [01:34:59] Yep, pretty much. [01:35:33] But since they have licensed it by submitting it to the wiki, others can nevertheless use it, either just there or perhaps elsewhere depending on the license. [01:35:52] And again depending on the license, those people may be required to allow others to do the same if they want to reuse the content.. [01:37:03] hrm [01:37:05] That's what CC-BY-SA does - it requires attribution - so you have to say at least where it comes from - and also requires other people to let you copy it as well. [01:37:34] 03emufarmers * r55075 10/trunk/extensions/CheckUser/checkuser.js: Add hyphen and space as delimiters (by request). [01:37:41] so the best I can do to keep the content from ending up elsewhere would be to go with the "Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial-No Derivative Works 3.0 United States License" ? [01:38:35] NC! Eeebil! [01:38:43] :( [01:38:54] it's a very niche wiki - for the upcoming starcraft 2 game :) [01:39:10] I think the best way to keep the content from ending up elsewhere would be not to license it at all, right, GreenReaper? [01:39:23] hahah [01:39:35] Right, or at least not under any Creative Commons license. [01:39:53] the wikimedia installation process isn't exactly offering us anything outside of CC options it seems [01:40:04] Well that's screwed up. [01:40:15] It doesn't have a "standard copyright license" option? [01:40:18] nope [01:40:24] Uh [01:40:33] i'll upload the screenshot of the options [01:40:55] "No license metadata" [01:41:10] right, but then what do I do after since I can't copyright? [01:41:16] :-| [01:41:17] do I actually have options outside of the CCs? [01:41:52] Well, it's up to you then, as I mentioned above. You can say whatever you want on your own site. [01:42:20] Legally you need some basis for people contributing to one another's work, that's why licenses exist for user-submitted content - on most sites which allow them. [01:42:40] It doesn't have to be a CC license, though. They're just commonly used. [01:43:03] meatball never had a license [01:43:13] Understand that people may be less willing to to contribute to a site which is not willing to let them take the collected contributions elsewhere. [01:43:19] Sunir said licenses and copyright were a distraction from the community nature of a wiki [01:43:32] and that if someone wants to remove their text, they should be allowed to [01:43:35] hm, but I can't throw a copyright on something if someone else wrote it? Or can it just be setup that a person agrees to submit that to us and our ownership when they edit the w/iki? [01:43:44] and sunir is still stuck with a crappy text-based display and fifteen edits a week. :-) [01:44:05] and you're saying that's because of the lack of a license? [01:44:07] I love some of Meatball's content but it's not gone anywhere. [01:44:52] No. And I don't actually fault the lack of having specified a license to start with, although the continued lack of having done so is a potential legal issue in my mind. [01:45:13] Pretty sure they ended up discussing/arguing about a license after the fact anyway [01:45:27] forums don't have licenses [01:45:38] blogs don't have licenses on their comments [01:45:46] Actually most of them do when you sign up. [01:45:57] Forums don't let you edit other people's comments, generally [01:46:05] (except for moderators) [01:46:08] yeah but it's still user submitted [01:46:17] The limited license allows the site owner at least to display the content [01:47:15] if you write on a wiki, there's an implied license that you're allowed to show it on the wiki [01:47:19] Not all of them do. I would say there is an implied license there. But implied licenses are very limited, and wikis take the use of other people's work a long way, and that is why they tend to have an explicit license nowadqays. [01:47:47] no graffiti artist has ever sued for copyright infringement after someone looks at their wall [01:48:05] . . . what? [01:48:33] there are situations where copyright just doesn't come up [01:48:34] More pertinent: has one sued if someone else copied it and added their tag to it? [01:49:43] Looking at it is not copying to the extent that we're talking about. There is a very very limited license there that is implied by posting - that people have to be able to download it to their computers to look at it. [01:50:17] if it's on a wiki then there's an implied license that others may edit it [01:50:19] and most large companies are uncomfortable even with that, so they have it in their licenses [01:50:51] that's all you really need to have a wiki, reading and editing [01:51:03] redistribution might be nice, but it's not essential to the functioning of a wiki [01:51:28] It's possible, but it is something that would have to be decided on a case by case basis in a court of law. There would have to be a finding that there was such an implied license. [01:51:38] If it ever came up in court. [01:51:59] This conversation makes me want to smash something [01:52:10] The point of an explicit license is to remove that uncertainty. And given all the crap Wikimedia has had I can quite understand why they (for example) would want one. :-) [01:52:31] wikimedia has redistribution as a goal [01:52:39] meatball does not [01:52:42] That's another good reason. [01:52:54] and Luminette's wiki might not either [01:54:06] TimStarling: is there any reason for the # vim: syn=php [01:54:06] ?> [01:54:07] The trouble is, an implied license works fine right up to the point where it is actually needed - when someone goes to court to say you have violated their copyright. [01:54:14] at the end of dumpHTML.inc? [01:54:32] In some cases that may never happen. But why risk it? [01:54:59] Emufarmers: to set the syntax type to PHP obviously [01:55:14] so I have a main site already under copyright and with a TOS highlighting that content is not to be taken outside of the site - can I not just set it up so that anyone who wants to edit the wiki signs away their rights to the content? And upon their agreement, they are given access to editing - is this not functional? [01:55:26] Well, I meant more the ?> [01:56:12] Somebody was complaining about "headers already sent" errors, so I was wondering whether I could take it out [01:56:29] GreenReaper: to avoid a legalistic atmosphere and endless handwringing arguments about license choice [01:57:05] You can certainly state that as the conditions of your site, and it is quite likely that nobody will argue with it. Although "signs away" is tricky - is there a copyright transfer? Or are they just granting you a non-exclusive license? [01:57:13] (two very different things) [01:57:38] well, theoretically i would specify whichever i need to [01:57:57] It didn't stop there being handwringing about license choice, though, as far as I can see. :-) [01:57:57] i suppose a full transfer [01:57:58] Emufarmers: yes you can take it out [01:58:16] yay. [01:58:18] 03(mod) New 'wikilists-l' list for discussion of mailing list issues, blocks, etc. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20209 +comment (10stvrtg) [01:58:53] uh oh [01:59:54] Luminette: I think honestly you are in trouble if you want that because it has to be "in writing" (under US law, anyway). I'm not sure a "clickthrough" works there. [02:00:05] jesus [02:00:21] that's a bit ridiculous [02:00:28] Well, what you want is a bit ridiiculous, too. [02:00:34] 03emufarmers * r55076 10/trunk/extensions/DumpHTML/dumpHTML.inc: Remove ?> [02:00:45] You're saying that people can post stuff to the wiki that you run and they then have no rights over that work. [02:00:50] i'm going to assume that that is just your opinion, rooted in unending "sharing is caring" mentality? [02:00:57] they can't post it elsewhere, because you own the copyright. [02:01:01] the wiki is a feature on a site that is for a business [02:01:09] the wiki wouldn't exist if not for this purpose [02:01:31] No, I'm saying there is a difference between "nonexclusive license" and "transfer of copyright/exclusive license", in law. [02:01:52] and that the latter is more significant and therefore has a higher legal requirement of documentation. [02:02:03] You know, like you'd be expected to sign a contract if you were doing a work for hire. [02:02:09] hrm [02:02:22] i'll have to look into what a nonexlusive license entails [02:02:37] *Emufarmers wonders what business site is served by a Stacraft 2 wiki [02:02:41] all I want is for the content to be protected from duplication / republishing elsewhere [02:02:57] www.starcraftmethod.com we're not live yet [02:02:58] :) [02:03:15] Pretty [02:03:29] http://sc2pod.com/wiki/Main_Page zomgcompetition [02:03:33] http://www.copyright.gov/title17/92chap2.html has a bunch of stuff if you're interested [02:04:04] certainly, I appreciate the link and your time/effort here greatly [02:04:09] Or you could just talk to a lawyer :D [02:04:25] lol [02:04:27] Yeah. This is why people normally go for premade/boilerplate licenses. [02:05:59] what headachery o: [02:06:42] You might also want to look at http://www.usemod.com/cgi-bin/mb.pl?WikiCopyright and http://www.usemod.com/cgi-bin/mb.pl?GodKingCopyright [02:07:02] *Emufarmers gags GreenReaper and throws him in a dungeon [02:07:21] mk [02:07:30] *GreenReaper edits Emufarmers' actions. [02:07:35] o: [02:07:38] so... sites that have user submitted articles etc [02:07:42] but hold the copyright for that stuff [02:07:50] About.com? [02:07:50] how is that any different from this? [02:08:03] ehh, think of the premium content sites like some of the popular poker ones etc [02:08:15] where top poker players are payed to write for them but the content is exclusive to that site [02:08:35] Or...About.com? [02:09:03] And that's fine, but it's a work for hire. Those people are given consideration. [02:09:19] how is the wiki any different? [02:09:34] Well, exchanging money has a way of making things more legal [02:09:48] more legally effective, I should say [02:09:49] so if we pay people to edit the wiki, it's much clearer [02:10:58] would this depend on amounts at all? Could we just pay a person a penny and then give them access to work on the wiki for us? [02:11:37] Don't know: see my previous comments about seeing a lawyer :-) [02:12:10] You can make whatever you want into a work for hire, with a transfer of copyright ownership, but you need to write something that says that specifically, as I would not consider it to be implied. [02:13:01] An employee's patents are traditionally transferred to their employer in return for a dollar. (Some companies are more generous). [02:15:18] mm [02:16:01] A written document might protect you, too. For example, what if someone copies from Wikipedia, or another site? Something to think about when you allow user-submitted content. [02:17:31] I understand that you're just doing it for your company, but you should understand that you're basically hiring another employee with multiple personality disorder to write stuff on your website, and there needs to be a framework in place for that. Which is where licenses come in. [02:18:25] Anyway, it's definitely time for me to license myself some BBQ pork. AFK. :-) [02:18:28] lmao [02:18:32] thanks for everything, take care [02:31:11] 03(NEW) ~~~~ is replaced with value, inside of a NOWIKI, inside of INCLUDEONLY - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20248 normal; Normal; MediaWiki: General/Unknown; (c.stafford) [02:36:16] *AaronSchulz reads http://www.factcheck.org/2009/08/seven-falsehoods-about-health-care/ [02:37:25] that site is good at refuting all the goebbelsian sophistry [02:37:59] *Emufarmers whips AaronSchulz: stop broadening your perspective and get back to coding! [02:43:00] Emufarmers: you might need to use a whip to force people around here >.> [02:44:00] 03(NEW) Logo change for pih.wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20249 enhancement; Normal; Wikimedia: Site requests; (mike_wazhere) [02:46:59] p858snake: I don't think that would work. All the developers in here clearly love pain, since they use PHP. [02:48:00] PHP painful? hardly [02:51:25] Which version of MediaWiki should I be running on my wikis? (an SVN version) [02:59:24] /mediawiki/tags/REL1_15_1/phase3 [03:12:44] 03aaron * r55077 10/trunk/extensions/CodeReview/CodeReview.php: Default $wgWikiSVN to false to keep this generic (note this doesn't work WMF anymore either) [03:15:34] TimStarling: Have there been any huge schema changes since that release and recent reviewed revisions? [03:16:08] 03(FIXED) CodeReview wrongly marks revs as live due to wmf-development branch - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19788 +comment (10JSchulz_4587) [03:18:32] there hasn't been any huge schema changes since 1.5 [03:19:37] so by all means, use the development version, just don't blame me when it deletes your wiki [03:30:19] 03aaron * r55078 10/trunk/extensions/CodeReview/backend/DiffHighlighter.php: html fix, may help bug 18987 [03:30:31] 03(mod) Layout bug in IE7 with header of 'Code-references' - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18987 (10JSchulz_4587) [03:39:23] Hi! I don't know to use PdfExport dompdf extension. I had installed her, but it don't show at sidebar. [03:41:37] [01:05:51] We'll just wait for Splarka; he'll know what to do. o: [03:41:41] heh [03:41:43] [01:02:02] Prodego and I wish I could do this: {{#switch: {{#titleparts:{{PAGENAME}}|1|1}} |{{Languages}}=DO A |DO B }} [03:42:03] so you can't do that, because you can't transclude the pipe character like that, it is covered and therefor escaped [03:42:18] as in, a transcluded pipe there is not a delimiter [03:45:33] 03tstarling * r55079 10/trunk/phase3/includes/ (8 files in 2 dirs): (log message trimmed) [03:45:33] * Converted BagOStuff.php from the style of memcached-client.php to the standard [03:45:33] MediaWiki style, including camel case, using protected visibility instead of [03:45:33] initial underscore, abstract functions instead of stubs, stylize.php. [03:45:33] * In SqlBagOStuff, ignore errors due to a read-only database, per my comments on CR r42796. Same for LocalisationCache. [03:45:37] * Merged SqlBagOStuff and MediaWikiBagOStuff, that proved to be an awkward and unnecessary generalisation. Use the standard quoting wrapper functions instead of $db->query(). [03:45:40] * Implemented atomic incr() and decr() functions for SqlBagOStuff. [03:46:46] *AaronSchulz checks if the code is readable now [03:48:21] wow, it is [03:50:10] 03tstarling * r55080 10/trunk/extensions/CentralAuth/CentralAuthHooks.php: Fix SQL error when the database is in read-only mode. Don't attempt to invalidate the user cache. [03:54:20] damn, I smell a dupe [03:54:34] *Splarka battles advanced search [04:05:10] 03(mod) Enable FlaggedRevs Patrolling Configuration on Arabic Wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19332 (10JSchulz_4587) [04:05:45] 03(FIXED) Enable FlaggedRevs Patrolling Configuration on Arabic Wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19332 +comment (10JSchulz_4587) [04:06:26] 14(DUP) ~~~~ is replaced with value, inside of a NOWIKI, inside of INCLUDEONLY - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20248 +comment (10herd) [04:06:28] 03(mod) Nowiki tags and tilde signatures in templates - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=93 +comment (10herd) [04:06:50] 03(mod) Add 'autoeditor' group and remove 'autopromote' on Ukrainian Wiktionary - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18590 +comment (10JSchulz_4587) [04:07:47] 03(mod) tilde signatures inside nowiki tags sometimes get expanded (~~~~) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=93 summary (10herd) [04:10:57] 03(mod) Add 'autoeditor' group and remove 'autopromote' on Ukrainian Wiktionary - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18590 (10JSchulz_4587) [04:16:08] 03(NEW) User group 'globalconfirmed' - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20250 normal; Normal; Wikimedia: General/Unknown; (liangent) [04:17:28] 03(mod) Add 'autoeditor' group and remove 'autopromote' on Russian Wikiquote - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18594 +comment (10JSchulz_4587) [04:20:06] 03(NEW) AutoLogin on strategywiki, usabilitywiki, etc. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20251 normal; Normal; Wikimedia: General/Unknown; (liangent) [04:23:57] 03(mod) target user name is wrapped by - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20093 (10liangent) [04:27:26] Is there any way to have text in a template that gets included in a page that the template is used in, but not included in a page that the template-using page gets transclude into? [04:29:48] [[Page]] contains {{foo}}, [[Template:Foo]] contains: Foo{{bar}}, [[Template:Bar]] contains this only shows on foo [04:31:03] hi BradLee [04:31:39] hey Pinky, fancy seeing you here [04:31:44] yeah :p [04:32:09] i'm not stalking you. honest... :) [04:32:31] the noinclude won't trigger on the initial template inclusion? Huh, interesting, thanks. [04:32:36] [[Page]] contains {{foo}}, [[Template:Foo]] contains: Foo {{bar}}, [[Template:Bar]] contains {{#ifeq:{{NAMESPACE}}|Template|this only shows in template namespace}} [04:32:45] (another method) [04:33:09] oh, I see [04:33:15] depends on your requirements [04:33:23] that there, makes a Template's template, so to speak [04:34:03] the issue that brings this up for me is semantic properties that I want to set in a template that does other stuff (because it also gets the information that we want to put in semantic properties), but these properties wouldn't make sense on another page that might transclude the first page [04:35:08] ahh, just wrap that in on the template itself, it'll only show on the template (same method is used to categorize templates) [04:35:36] we want the properties on the page that includes the template though -- not the page transclusion. And the page transclusion needs to show other parts of the template. [04:35:45] is there even a way to do this without two separate templates? [04:35:47] most templates should have a block for examples, documentation, etc [04:36:06] hmm, sort of [04:36:21] Like, {{template|arg1|arg2}} -- arg1 and arg2 are used for displaying purposes in the template (it's an infobox), but they are also used to set semantic properties [04:36:47] well, you can reuse {{{1}}} in the template as you want [04:36:50] I might not be explaining this very well, I apologize [04:37:06] so it could set a row display, and set a semantic property, at the same time [04:37:17] I understand, and that's what I'm doing -- but what is also happening is that when the page in question that has these properties gets transcluded, the page its transcluded into gets the properties too. That's what we don't want. [04:37:39] that sounds odd [04:37:47] are you transcluding non-templates into other pages? [04:37:48] [[Page1]] contains [[:Page2]], [[Page2]] contains {{foo}}, [[Template:Foo]] sets the properties [04:37:53] yes [04:38:05] {{:Page2}} rather, sorry [04:38:13] ahh, you can't use the same template for that then, really [04:38:25] Alas :( it seemed like such an elegant solution at the time, too [04:38:30] hmm [04:38:39] unless you did something hacky like... [04:38:55] Well, I'm always up for hacky [04:38:59] {{template|page={{subst:FULLPAGENAME}}|arg1|arg2|...}} [04:39:06] on Page2 [04:39:13] and then in template:foo ... [04:39:24] Aha, yes, that would be an interesting solution... [04:39:29] {{#ifeq:{{{page}}}|{{FULLPAGENAME}}|semantic stuff|no semantic stuff}} [04:39:43] Is FULLPAGENAME an expensive operation? [04:40:02] I don't think it even needs a query, it is always the current page name (even when transcluded) [04:40:14] Excellent then. That should work fine, thanks! [04:40:43] but you need ParserFunctions extension for the ifeq [04:40:55] I mean, I'm already doing incomprehensible parser logic to work around semantic mediawiki bugs, no reason not to add another onto it [04:40:59] Already have that, so no problem. [04:45:34] it would just be awfully convenient if semantic mediawiki interpreted {{#set:property=|}} as an empty property and ignored it instead of errored it [04:46:19] http://p.defau.lt/?7NhikTPdSwy9ZSZqTuhKDg [04:47:03] that is the difference between http://en.wikipedia.org/w/api.php?text=%7B%7BFULLPAGENAME%7D%7D&action=parse&forcetrace=true and http://en.wikipedia.org/w/api.php?text=&action=parse&forcetrace=true [04:47:10] I'm not sure what I'm looking at -- is that a profiler dump? [04:47:40] yah [04:47:56] ah, alright [04:48:02] well, certainly looks inexpensive to me then [04:48:03] 03(mod) Change of way to initialize editToolbarConfiguration structure - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20125 (10liangent) [04:48:43] the hugest chunk seems to be the braceSubstitution which would be active with any other {{}} already [04:54:08] well, looks like it's time for some more botting to add this stuff onto the already-existing pages :p [04:54:46] Tubarao: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Coding_conventions#Assignment_expressions [04:58:38] don't know what I'd do without the wonderful invention of api.php [04:59:32] you'd be installing the query.php extension and whining about it [05:00:52] Pfft. You'd be using strpos and preg_match and liking it! [05:01:35] *Splarka bites green [05:03:30] ... [05:05:00] is it subst or #subst? [05:05:20] hmm, interesting [05:07:14] subst, that replaces {{subst:FULLPAGENAME}} with a copy of the page name left there as a parameter [05:07:35] you have to subst it, or else it will see the displayed page name there on all views, and the hack will be defeated [05:08:00] oh, it's {{subst:FULLPAGENAME}}, not {{subst:{{FULLPAGENAME}}}} [05:08:02] no wonder it wasn't working heh [05:11:38] thanks for the help [05:24:57] 03tstarling * r55081 10/trunk/extensions/timeline/EasyTimeline.pl: Release notes [06:22:56] dear mediawiki developers [06:23:05] we need big warnings when mbstring support doesn't exist [06:23:05] somewhere [06:58:39] *p858snake pokes domas with the bugzilla bug submission page [07:00:13] ??? [07:01:30] none of them around at the moment so no one will see your request for said warning messages [07:06:14] are you sure? [07:10:17] well TimStarling is listed as being here but he last spoke about 3 hours ago [07:12:26] 03(NEW) Support for WAV and AIFF by converting files to FLAC automatically. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20252 enhancement; Normal; Wikimedia: General/Unknown; (cgillingham1) [07:30:49] damn [07:30:51] I need more PR [07:30:52] :) [07:31:40] domas: you need morebots [07:32:20] splarka: did you hear my saga about mbstring? [07:32:43] no need to hear it though [07:32:48] try running mediawiki on machine without mbstring [07:32:49] :)) [07:33:40] yes yes "I need a developer!" [07:33:57] but yeah [07:34:01] I need a developer! [07:34:18] *domas tries to remember how to log in into wikitech as root [07:34:24] *Splarka imagines domas running around Tokyo 20 years from now, with a 35mm non-digital film-type camera screaming that [07:35:02] oh, apparently there's root password [07:35:36] damn, I hate conventional system administration [07:39:21] btw, I locked my wow account [07:39:36] *domas should hear lots of cheers here :) [07:40:45] I NEED A DEVELOPER [07:42:16] splarka: open 'pipedija.laikas.lt' [07:42:23] you will see what attribution I got for mbstring issue debugging :) [07:43:56] hold that thought [07:48:55] 03(NEW) Install Extension:NewUserMessage on strategy wiki - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20253 normal; Normal; MediaWiki extensions: Extensions requests; (pbeaudette) [07:51:18] wrong product says what? [07:52:27] the blender wiki admin got it all wrong :( [07:53:26] heh [07:53:32] strategywiki needs quite some handholding [07:54:29]