,<h1> should check $wgUser->isAllowed( 'createaccount' ) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20115 (10jidanni) [10:06:34] <wikibugs> 03(mod) check if really can create an account, before advertising to do so - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19186 (10jidanni) [10:09:01] <Simetrical> werdna, floats, inline. Or try to hack around IE6/7 (maybe you can ignore Fx2 at this point?). Depends. There's no perfect replacement. [10:09:50] <werdna> http://wiki.werdn.us/test/view/Talk:Main_Page [10:10:00] <werdna> What do you suggest I do with that search box and search order thing at the top? [10:10:05] <Simetrical> If there were some way to do inline-block without actually using display: inline-block, there wouldn't be much point in it, would there? :) [10:10:08] *Simetrical looks [10:10:15] <werdna> They both contain forms, it's invalid to put a block element inside an inline element [10:10:27] <Simetrical> It's not invalid, it will just break out. [10:10:56] <Simetrical> <span>XYZ <span style="display:block">ABC</span> foo bar</span> <-- Totally valid. [10:11:22] <Simetrical> It will add anonymous blocks around the inline parts, IIRC. [10:12:09] <Simetrical> You should be able to do the search box with just floats. [10:12:34] <Simetrical> That might behave a little oddly if it wraps, at worst. [10:12:42] <Simetrical> But probably not too much, since these are basically fixed-height. [10:12:57] <Simetrical> Inline-block is mostly useful if things are variable-height and you want them to form nice lines regardless. [10:13:05] <Simetrical> At least in my experience. [10:13:07] <werdna> An ugh on floating [10:13:34] <werdna> CSS is annoying [10:13:40] <Splarka> use tables ^_^ [10:13:43] <Simetrical> No, lack of good CSS support in browsers is annoying. [10:13:44] *Splarka hide [10:13:57] <Simetrical> Convince Brion to let us drop IE6/7 support and things will be much better. [10:14:02] <Simetrical> Preferably IE8 as well. :P [10:14:09] <Splarka> and IE5? [10:14:14] <Simetrical> That goes without saying. [10:14:18] <wikibugs> 03(mod) check if really can create an account, before advertising to do so - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19186 (10alex.emsenhuber) [10:14:34] <Splarka> there are varying levels of "support" [10:14:54] <Splarka> obviously JS is expected to fail in very old browsers, like IE5--, and wikipedia.org is expected to fail completely in IE2-- [10:15:11] <OuKB> why not display a friendly reminder to upgrade to users with a pre-historic browser, like some major sites already do? [10:15:21] <werdna> You mean IE<5 and IE<2 [10:15:22] <Splarka> but IE8 isn't old enough to completely break form submission, as it does with JS enabled and jquery on mwsuggest, it is just old enough to have no JS support [10:15:25] <werdna> IE5-- doesn't work [10:15:37] <Splarka> er Opera8 [10:15:47] <werdna> If anything, you mean IE--5, which is IE4 [10:15:50] <Simetrical> OuKB, most users using ancient browsers are unable to upgrade. [10:15:53] <Splarka> so when you say "drop IE6/7" what do you mean/ [10:16:11] <Splarka> werdna: and yet you knew what I meant, go be a semantichole in your own time ^_^ [10:16:50] <Splarka> do you mean: absolutely no support (site won't load or be useable), "ugly" support (IE5 now), no JS support (IE5 again), or "mostly works" (IE6ish, Opera 8) [10:17:07] <Simetrical> I wasn't serious about dropping IE6/7 support, sadly. [10:17:26] <Simetrical> Our lives would be a lot easier if "ugly" support were acceptable for them. [10:17:40] <Simetrical> But it's not, really. More like "looks okay but missing some nonessential features if necessary". [10:17:45] <Splarka> heh, a {display:block} was fun in IE5 for a few days [10:18:13] <Splarka> http://www.memedepot.com/uploads/0/207_not_sure_if_serious.jpg [10:19:00] <Splarka> hmm, so if the fancy JS doesn't work, it should fall back to at least work and not look horrible? [10:19:12] <werdna> Simetrical: floats totally mess that top toolbar up [10:19:23] <Simetrical> O RLY? [10:19:24] <werdna> (just replaced display: inline-block with float: left) [10:19:27] <Simetrical> ur doin it wrong. [10:19:27] <werdna> YA RLY [10:19:28] <Splarka> like CSS/JS dropdown menus should just default to expanded for non-supporting browsers.. [10:19:40] <Simetrical> You need to make sure everything is floating and clearing that needs to be floating and clearing. [10:19:46] <werdna> helpful [10:19:51] <Splarka> heh [10:20:44] <werdna> Simetrical: why can't I say "This is a block, but I want it to be displayed without the line breaks" [10:21:03] <Simetrical> You can, it's called "display: inline-block". [10:21:17] <Splarka> or <img> ^_^ [10:21:29] <Simetrical> Or table. [10:21:35] <Simetrical> Hmm. [10:21:46] <Splarka> so, is table undeprecated for HTML5 for layout? [10:22:05] <Simetrical> No. [10:22:21] <Splarka> heh, still delusional [10:22:27] <Simetrical> werdna, you have a form instead a span already, by the way. [10:22:40] <Simetrical> lqt-talkpage-search [10:22:42] <Simetrical> Doesn't validate. [10:22:49] <werdna> inside you mean [10:22:52] <werdna> yeah I just fixed that [10:22:55] <Simetrical> Er, yes. [10:23:04] <werdna> now it just looks stupid [10:23:59] <Simetrical> Set a fixed height if you're using floats. [10:24:04] <werdna> seriously? [10:24:07] <Simetrical> Yes. [10:24:18] <werdna> Isn't there some saner way to do this? [10:24:21] <Simetrical> inline-block aligns them inline, so it handles vertical alignment for you. [10:24:25] <Simetrical> Yes, it's called inline-block. [10:24:29] <Simetrical> Didn't we discuss that already? :) [10:24:45] <Simetrical> You could test in IE6/7 and see if it looks acceptable. [10:24:46] <werdna> and you told me not to use it [10:25:05] <Simetrical> As far as I can see, it will display on multiple lines, since it will just be treated as display: block. [10:25:08] <Simetrical> Same in Firefox 2. [10:25:12] <Splarka> 1.sanity 2.fancy 3.mediawiki, pick 2 [10:25:16] <Simetrical> I haven't actually *tested* or anything, obviously. [10:25:18] <wikibugs> 03(mod) check if really can create an account, before advertising to do so - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19186 (10jidanni) [10:26:06] <Simetrical> Maybe you're lucky and I'm wrong. :) [10:29:00] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Special:UserLogin's title on Special:SpecialPages should not say "create account" if the user cannot create an account - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19186 summary; +comment (10alex.emsenhuber) [10:32:01] *werdna doesn't have IE [10:32:09] <werdna> I'll just see when I get to wikimania or something [10:33:28] <Simetrical> You're on Mac or Linux? [10:33:56] <Simetrical> ies4linux works okay for basic rendering in IE6. [10:34:00] <Simetrical> It tends to crash a lot, though. [10:34:45] <p858snake> ie5 for linux >.> [10:34:58] <p858snake> seven works in apprently [10:35:04] <p858snake> *in wine [10:35:22] <werdna> Mac. [10:35:29] <Simetrical> Yeah, in IE6 it just renders on three lines. [10:35:32] <CIA-70> 03werdna * r55407 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/ (classes/View.php lqt.css lqt.js pages/TalkpageView.php): Implement on-hover menu, includes a big re-tooling of the HTML/JS/CSS for the toolbar [10:35:33] <Simetrical> Not too terrible, actually. [10:35:36] <werdna> oh well [10:35:55] <Simetrical> p858snake, last I heard IE7 on Linux was very experimental and not really usable. [10:36:05] <Splarka> add a float in IEfixes? X_X [10:36:06] <Simetrical> I have a Windows machine here with IE7, I think. [10:36:13] *Simetrical switches monitors [10:36:32] <p858snake> Simetrical: not the linux clone one, i'm referring to the proper windows version in wine [10:36:49] <Simetrical> Oh, really? [10:36:54] <Simetrical> Wait, what? [10:37:05] <Simetrical> I thought IE is too tightly integrated with Windows to just be installed in Wine. [10:37:50] <Simetrical> IE7 is the same, it renders on three lines. [10:37:55] <Simetrical> Probably acceptable. [10:38:21] <Simetrical> Just keep it in mind for the future and be sure to test whether it looks okay. [10:38:22] <p858snake> its been a seperate thing since the lawsuit, although this is what i've heard though the grapevine so it might not actually work [10:38:29] <Simetrical> You could test in Firefox 2, that should give the same results. [10:38:45] <Simetrical> display: inline-block actually does work in IE, just only on elements that are naturally inline. [10:38:59] <Simetrical> p858snake, not separate enough AFAIK. [10:39:24] <Simetrical> http://www.tatanka.com.br/ies4linux/page/Main_Page [10:39:50] <Simetrical> ie7 support is labeled as beta. [10:39:50] <werdna> hmm, new interface works okay, but it chops off the bottom of the icons [10:39:53] <werdna> http://wiki.werdn.us/test/view/Talk:Main_Page [10:39:55] <werdna> have a look [10:40:05] <Simetrical> Given how unstable the non-beta part of ies4linux is, that worries me. :) [10:40:18] <werdna> also, that little arrow needs to be at the bottom [10:40:22] <Simetrical> What am I looking for? [10:40:50] <werdna> the toolbar that appears when you mouse over a post [10:41:43] <Simetrical> Oh, bleh. [10:41:53] <Simetrical> That seems gratuitously dynamic. [10:42:04] <Simetrical> You won't see the reply button at all unless your mouse is in the right place. [10:42:27] <Simetrical> It doesn't save much of any space, either. You could just have it next to the date, there's plenty of free space there on most posts. [10:43:42] <werdna> Well, it was Trevor's idea. We're just mocking stuff up [10:43:54] <werdna> I think it's a bit weird [10:44:15] <werdna> Other alternative is to give it 50% transparency usually and have it appear when you mouse over [10:44:22] <Simetrical> Didn't one of the people in one of the usability studies say one reason they liked Wikipedia is because it didn't flash and jump around and stuff? [10:44:29] <Simetrical> Why not just make it appear all the time? [10:45:14] <Splarka> *cough*, that's a reason I like it... *takes jQuery's animations out back behind the woodshed* [10:46:20] <werdna> Simetrical: the idea is to declutter [10:46:53] <Simetrical> At the expense of having things jumping around all the time. [10:47:57] <Splarka> http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/8394/ie5lqt.gif [10:47:58] <Simetrical> Having three or four little buttons isn't very cluttered. [10:49:35] <werdna> Splarka: trippy [10:50:14] <Simetrical> I really wish I could see some of this usability data that's being collected. Is there any detailed summary that's been made public? I didn't find much on the usability wiki when I last looked (but I didn't look very hard). [10:50:20] <werdna> Simetrical: well, it's just a mockup. I don't like it that much, will see what other people think [10:50:31] <Simetrical> k. :) [11:04:38] *Splarka has a treat for werdna if this works [11:07:24] <werdna> Splarka: if what works? [11:07:35] <Splarka> http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/3442/ie2alqt.gif [11:07:46] <Splarka> had to save it as a local file, since HOSTS header doesn't work [11:08:21] <werdna> haha [11:08:44] *Splarka pages down [11:08:44] <Simetrical> Where do you even get working IE2 these days? [11:09:00] <Reedy> wtf [11:09:04] <Splarka> had it on a CD, and am running an old Win95 box that seems to run it fine [11:09:07] <Reedy> Someone needs shooting for that [11:09:12] <Splarka> http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/3482/ie2blqt.gif [11:09:40] *Splarka shuts it down before it gets scared [11:10:12] <CIA-70> 03ialex * r55409 10/trunk/extensions/FlaggedRevs/FlaggedRevs.class.php: [11:10:12] <CIA-70> Pass revision ID to Parser::parse() since the result will be stored in parser cache and causes empty {{REVISIONID}}, {{REVISIONTIMESTAMP}} set to current timestamp [11:10:12] <CIA-70> Some sample result at http://test.wikipedia.org/wiki/FlaggedRevsRevisionID?action=purge [11:11:00] <Simetrical> Are we going to switch to edit links next to the section names anytime soon? [11:11:07] <Simetrical> (non-floated, I mean) [11:11:22] <werdna> Well, there's already a bunch of links there [11:11:34] <werdna> I want to put them into a menu, and then add a reply link to the right of that [11:11:48] <Simetrical> I meant for articles, not LQT, actually. [11:12:07] <werdna> ah :) [11:12:14] *Simetrical was just reading someone confused about WP:BUNCH on WP:VPT, again [11:15:08] <Simetrical> Speaking of which, I just wanted to reply to a thread there, but realized it was pointless since I'd never bother checking for replies, since I can only watch the whole page. :) [11:15:10] <Simetrical> Go LQT! [11:15:18] <Splarka> Simetrical: so just do eet (tm) [11:15:53] <Splarka> is there any way to adjust the html to allow it to float either way? I think it'd work with just the <span> above the <h#> text [11:16:14] <Splarka> heh [11:16:22] <Splarka> Simetrical: I made the mistake of asking for help there once >_< [11:16:32] <Splarka> so I watched it... [11:16:37] <Splarka> http://toolserver.org/~daniel/WikiSense/Contributors.php?wikilang=en&wikifam=.wikipedia.org&grouped=on&page=Wikipedia%3AVillage+pump+%28technical%29 [11:17:10] <Splarka> you're on the top 10 as well I see [11:17:26] <Simetrical> Yeah, I used to be active there. [11:21:16] <werdna> Simetrical: Actually, you can watch individual threads. [11:21:27] <Simetrical> Not on enwiki at the moment. [11:21:30] <werdna> Simetrical: And you get email notification and a new messages prompt for replies [11:21:36] <werdna> oh right, you meant on enwiki :) [11:21:43] <Simetrical> I assume enotif will be disabled on most WMF wikis, sadly. [11:21:52] <werdna> I hope not, but probably yeah [11:22:00] <werdna> maybe we can try to get it resurrected [11:22:13] <werdna> it's not *that* hard. [11:22:30] <Simetrical> 2000 e-mails being sent out on every edit to a contentious article is the major concern, I assume. [11:22:44] <werdna> Everybody else can do it [11:22:46] <werdna> we should be able to [11:25:06] <CIA-70> 03werdna * r55410 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/ (lqt.css lqt.js): Instead of completely hiding the toolbar when not moused over, give it some transparency. [11:25:11] <werdna> Simetrical: A lot of the inspiration for the LQT interface is coming from wave [12:16:18] <Guest34196> hi guys.. i`m trying to configure mediawiki to get groups and users belong that from active directory.. but it does not work... so i`m getting authentication with my AD user, but i need to use groups from AD too. [12:17:22] <Guest34196> i don`t know what is missing.. can you help me? [12:17:43] <Belegnar> hello [12:17:44] <Belegnar> may anybody help me with RecentChanges [12:17:44] <Belegnar> there is no diffs here http://zilant.konvent.ru/wiki/index.php?title=Special:RecentChanges&feed=rss [12:17:44] <Belegnar> how can i get diffs in the page? [12:17:44] <Belegnar> MW 1.15.1 [12:27:21] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Allow uploading of Blender 3D or COLLADA files to Wikimedia Commons - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1790 (10barney_holmes) [12:39:14] <TheCainer> hi, you've got {{#language:LANGCODE}}, is there also something similar for the countryname? [12:45:32] <Squidy> Does anybody here use mediawiki + Active Directory? [12:47:38] <flyingparchment> Squidy: there's usually someone on the mediawiki-enterprise mailing list if no one here can help [12:48:55] <Squidy> flyingparchment: ok [12:50:46] <kevindanko> Hello [12:50:56] <kevindanko> Do i need two seperate hosts to install Lucene Search extension? [12:51:06] <kevindanko> Can I install it in a shared hosting enviroment? [12:51:45] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) Images on secure pages should be secure as well - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20335 enhancement; Normal; Wikimedia: General/Unknown; (bmearns) [12:55:09] <CIA-70> 03werdna * r55411 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Delete replies to a top-level thread when deleting it. [13:03:23] <Evet> is it possible to change mediawiki theme? [13:04:03] <kevindanko> yes [13:04:10] <OuKB> !skins [13:04:10] --mwbot-- Overview: <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Skins>. Skin usage: <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Skins>. Gallery of CSS styles: <http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Gallery_of_user_styles>. Writing your own: <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Skinning> [13:04:21] <Evet> thank you [13:36:54] <wikibugs> 14(DUP) Images on secure pages should be secure as well - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20335 +comment (10hartman) [13:36:57] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Provide SSL/HTTPS interface to upload.wikimedia.org and use it for SSL-served pages - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16822 +comment (10hartman) [14:04:30] <Besuglov> I'am asking for help with my installation of mediawiki. Is it enough to set $wgNamespaceAliases in localsettings.php to create Alias? It seems it doesn't work. [14:09:46] <G_SabinoMullane> HEAD seems to be using json_decode by default, which requires php 5.2. Should that be our new minimum, or is there some workaround? [14:15:25] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Please enable variant ShortURLs for Chinese Wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19019 (10shinjiman) [14:16:57] <Platonides> I suppose you could have an earlier version with pecl json extension [14:20:54] <G_SabinoMullane> Platonides: Yeah, I'm working on that, but the upgrader should probably detect the lack of it, and we should revisit our minimum requirements. [14:20:55] <Platonides> there's an alternative version used by the api [14:21:09] *G_SabinoMullane tries to puzzle out how to install the json pecl tarball [14:21:41] <Platonides> http://www.php.net/manual/install.pecl.php [14:25:19] <G_SabinoMullane> Hm...no pecl available on this version, nor phpize. Got pear though. [14:26:18] <Platonides> where did you get php from? [14:26:29] <Platonides> it may be easier to install a newer php [14:26:30] <G_SabinoMullane> centos default install [14:26:44] <Platonides> pecl could be on a different package [14:26:47] <G_SabinoMullane> May take this to #php [14:26:54] <G_SabinoMullane> yum search pecl shows nada [14:27:19] <Platonides> is it really failing without json_decode? [14:27:33] <G_SabinoMullane> Yep: [14:27:42] <G_SabinoMullane> PHP Fatal error: Call to undefined function json_decode() in /var/www/html/bucardo.org/mwp3/js2/mwEmbed/php/jsAutoloadLocalClasses.php on line 23 [14:27:55] <Platonides> try disabling the mwEmbed piece [14:28:38] <Platonides> there's another usage at ForeignAPIRepo but it'd only be used with foreignrepos, which aren't common [14:28:47] <G_SabinoMullane> How do I do that? [14:29:14] <Platonides> I think there's some way to do it [14:29:20] <Platonides> but don't really know.. [14:29:26] <G_SabinoMullane> :) [14:30:16] <Platonides> $wgEnableScriptMinify = false; $wgEnableScriptLocalization = false; ? [14:30:52] <G_SabinoMullane> Nope [14:31:19] <G_SabinoMullane> I'd rather focus on forcing json in. [14:34:44] <Platonides> comment require_once("$IP/js2/mwEmbed/php/jsAutoloadLocalClasses.php"); on includes/Autoloader.php [14:35:25] <Platonides> without $wgEnableJS2system set you shouldn't need it [14:35:28] <G_SabinoMullane> Okay, got phpize installed now, proceeding with configuring json pecl package [14:36:23] <CIA-70> 03shinjiman * r55412 10/trunk/phase3/languages/messages/MessagesZh_tw.php: *(bug 17742) Fixes inconsistent special page aliases for the Taiwanese language. [14:36:32] <wikibugs> 03(mod) zh-tw page names use many synonyms for URLs, e.g., <a href=BIG>LARGE</a> - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17742 +comment (10shinjiman) [14:39:09] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) Don't assume json availability - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20336 major; Normal; MediaWiki: General/Unknown; (Platonides) [14:39:49] <Platonides> that's your bug, G_SabinoMullane [14:40:01] <G_SabinoMullane> Thanks [14:40:53] <Platonides> good think you catched that [14:41:39] <G_SabinoMullane> Yep, nothing like running stuff on bleeding edge. :) Now to test against Postgres HEAD... [14:42:41] <Platonides> in this case, it was running bleeding edge mediawiki with old php 5 :) [14:42:58] <G_SabinoMullane> Yeah. CentOS is pretty stale with some things. [14:43:25] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Create Portal namespace of Bengali wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20314 (10jayantanth) [14:46:28] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Don't assume json availability - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20336 +comment (10roan.kattouw) [14:47:41] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) Oversight mailing list for the Simple English Wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20337 enhancement; Normal; Wikimedia: Mailing lists; (evula) [14:48:09] <Platonides> G_SabinoMullane, Roan posted a workaround at https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20336#c1 [14:48:31] <Platonides> in case you didn't get the extension yet :P [14:51:39] <G_SabinoMullane> Platonides: Got the extension installed, thanks. [14:58:15] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Oversight mailing list for the Simple English Wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20337 (10p858snake) [15:09:32] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Oversight mailing list for the Simple English Wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20337 (10evula) [15:09:48] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Don't assume json availability - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20336 +comment (10greg) [15:12:00] <gpled> anyone seen docs on how to move a wiki to another server? [15:13:59] <TheCainer> hi, you've got {{#language:LANGCODE}}, is there also something similar for the countryname? [15:14:02] <TheCainer> so for example: {{#country:uk}} would return United Kingdom (but that one doesn't work :p) [15:16:03] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Add checkboxes for revision deletion on Special:Contributions, Special:DeletedContributions, Special:Undelete, and Special:Log - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20189 summary; +comment (10mike.lifeguard) [15:18:22] <Mike_lifeguard> TheCainer: no, and I doubt that'd be added [15:18:48] <TheCainer> bummer [15:20:40] <Duesentrieb_> not to core [15:20:45] <Duesentrieb_> as an extension, why not? [15:20:47] <Duesentrieb_> would be trivial [15:39:45] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Ability to preview summary in "Upload file" page - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2537 +comment (10dale) [15:52:50] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Ability to preview vector/re-rendered images in Special:Upload "warning" interstitial. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16437 (10dale) [15:53:17] <CIA-70> 03greg * r55413 10/trunk/extensions/CentralNotice/SpecialCentralNotice.php: Fix some minor space vs. tabs issues. [15:55:10] <CIA-70> 03greg * r55414 10/trunk/extensions/CentralNotice/SpecialCentralNotice.php: Use the correct vars for not_start and not_end in the update. [16:00:18] <CIA-70> 03philip * r55415 10/trunk/phase3/languages/ (LanguageConverter.php classes/LanguageZh.php): [16:00:18] <CIA-70> 1. Revert my revision r55371. Since it may override logged user's settings. [16:00:18] <CIA-70> 2. Patch for situations that some wikis like zhwikisource may disabled some language variants. We should treat these disabled variants unacceptable in LanguageConverter. [16:06:02] <CIA-70> 03greg * r55416 10/trunk/extensions/CentralNotice/SpecialCentralNotice.php: Use properly formatted timestamp versions when building list of notices. [16:26:39] <svip> Hm. [16:26:46] <svip> What file handles diffs? [16:30:20] <svip> I am looking for whatever revision that fixes or ruined the diffs. [16:31:26] <Simetrical> svip, includes/DifferenceEngine.php [16:31:31] <Simetrical> Unless that lives in a subdirectory now. [16:33:39] <svip> O_O' [16:42:54] <Mount_Wiki> hi, i have a question. I customized a lot of the existing skins and language files, if i update, these will be gone i supporse? [16:43:39] <Mount_Wiki> is copying the php files enough? or are there a lot of DB modifications between 1.12 and 1.15 [16:44:24] <OuKB> !upgrading [16:44:24] --mwbot-- http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Upgrading [16:45:28] <OuKB> Mount_Wiki, if you want your messages to survive upgrades, edit them MediaWiki: namespace, not in language files [16:46:45] <OuKB> if you want to tweak existing skins, you'd better fork them under another name [16:47:26] <Mount_Wiki> ok, that might solve some problems idd [16:47:50] <OuKB> alternatively, create a patch, upgrade, apply patch [16:48:11] <Mount_Wiki> yeah, well the problem is that i have no shell access on my hosting [16:48:26] <Mount_Wiki> so i am forced to go through the webbased installation upgrade thing [16:48:31] <Mount_Wiki> and i am not liking that a lot [16:48:44] <Mount_Wiki> i;d rather prefer to just copy some php files [16:49:08] <Mount_Wiki> but i am afraid that there are some DB scheme changes between 1.12 and 1.15 [16:50:33] <OuKB> yes of course [16:52:22] <OuKB> http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Upgrading#Alternative_1:_phpShell [16:52:55] <Mount_Wiki> I have no shell access to my cheapass hosting, only ftp [16:53:03] <flyingparchment> what don't you like about the installer? [16:53:04] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) PDF Version - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20338 enhancement; Normal; MediaWiki: Export/Import; (jayantanth) [16:53:25] <Reedy> The installer wont reset everything.. [16:53:39] <Mount_Wiki> i know, but i cannot reverse anything if something goes wrong [16:53:44] <Mount_Wiki> i customized a lot [16:53:48] <Mount_Wiki> and a lot of plugins etc [16:54:18] <Mount_Wiki> imagine something goes wrong, and with no shell access, i could be stuck with a broken DB [16:54:23] <Mount_Wiki> and no way to fix i [16:54:40] <OuKB> have you seen my phpShell link? [16:54:42] <wikibugs> 03(mod) PDF Version - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20338 (10jayantanth) [16:54:50] <Mount_Wiki> yes, reading about it [16:56:05] <Mount_Wiki> btw, remember guys, one.com baaad hosting for wikis... [16:57:00] <OuKB> wikis need at least VPS to run reasonably (memcached etc) [16:57:42] <flyingparchment> you don't need memcached, any PHP cache works fine for a single server [16:58:19] <Mount_Wiki> well, mem is capped at 24MB on one.com, semantics plugin crashes a lot on queries... [16:58:31] <Mount_Wiki> cannot upload images bigger than 1600px wide [16:58:37] <Mount_Wiki> bad thumbnail creation [16:58:46] <Mount_Wiki> not so fun at all [16:58:54] <OuKB> by the way, why are there LocalisationCache queries being made from an unrelated API call? [16:59:26] <JDW> Hi [17:02:26] <JDW> Please let me ask a question about mediawiki security. I've just got hacked on my server (debian) and I know the attacker pass trough one of my website. I have some phpbb and wikimedia on it. I'm wondering if a previous vulnerability discovered in mediawiki allowed crackers to write in the /tmp folder ? [17:04:46] <CIA-70> 03greg * r55417 10/trunk/extensions/CentralNotice/CentralNotice.db.php: Use databases concept of a timestamp, not MW's [17:05:09] <jlhenry> Hi all [17:06:34] <jlhenry> I do not understand why the messages translations does not appear in our wiki. I wrote text for http://base.ekopedia.org/MediaWiki:Recentchangestext/fr (French) and http://base.ekopedia.org/MediaWiki:Recentchangestext (English). When I go in recentchanges, only english is used: http://base.ekopedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:RecentChanges&uselang=fr&action=purge [17:06:53] <jlhenry> Any idea? [17:06:56] <CIA-70> 03greg * r55418 10/trunk/extensions/CentralNotice/CentralNotice.pg.psql: Postgres version of the schema. [17:07:51] <G_SabinoMullane> JDW: Seems unlikely. What version was it? [17:07:53] <^demon> jlhenry: recentchangestext is only used in the content language (assuming english in your case) [17:09:24] <JDW> G_SabinoMullane 1.10 [17:09:53] <jlhenry> http://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:RecentChanges&uselang=fr Appear in French, http://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:RecentChanges&uselang=en in English, http://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:RecentChanges&uselang=it in Italian [17:10:45] <^demon> jlhenry: I dunno then [17:10:46] <G_SabinoMullane> JDW: *shrug* I'd be far more inclined to blame phpBB, their code is a lot worse. [17:10:50] <jlhenry> ^demon, Our installation is in English yes [17:11:38] <OuKB> jlhenry, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:RecentChanges?uselang=sq [17:12:34] <OuKB> everything but recentchangestext [17:12:35] <jlhenry> OuKB, I do not speak about the user interface, but the messages that are translated. [17:12:58] <JDW> G_SabinoMullane It's my point of view too but i prefer to look everywere [17:13:16] <jlhenry> OuKB, then how do you explain that it is working for "commons" as describe above? [17:13:50] <OuKB> commons is a multi-language wiki... don't know which settings control that [17:19:24] <OuKB> jlhenry, http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:$wgForceUIMsgAsContentMsg [17:31:46] <svip> Hello, brion-netbook and brion. [17:32:31] <brion-netbook> howdy [17:33:02] <svip> What's fresh? [17:35:27] <jlhenry> OuKB, I seems that you found it! :) [17:35:42] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Please enable variant ShortURLs for Chinese Wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19019 (10PhiLiP.NPC) [17:36:22] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) Allow using the pipe trick in log reasons - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20339 normal; Normal; MediaWiki: General/Unknown; (mike.lifeguard) [17:37:40] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Job queue estimate often woefully inaccurate; need a better strategy - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9518 +comment (10mike.lifeguard) [17:37:51] <Reedy> ^random numbers [17:39:44] <atglenn> :-D [17:40:20] <Reedy> Or [17:41:37] <Reedy> Its > 0 and < infinite [17:41:55] <jlhenry> Strange, $wgForceUIMsgAsContentMsg = array( 'mainpage', 'recentchanges-url' ); seems not to work. [17:43:35] <Rich_Morin> Is there a way to get a list of the tags that are being used for disambiguation on WP? [17:44:05] <Rich_Morin> eg, Foo_(bar) [17:44:54] <Reedy> Nope [17:44:59] <Reedy> Manual of Style, maybe [17:45:08] <Reedy> but thats only guidelines.. [17:46:45] <Rich_Morin> I want to disambiguate YARD (a Ruby documentation tool), as: YARD_(software) [17:47:25] <anderbill> Permissions Q: upgraded successfully from 1.11.1 to 1.15.1. Which files should not be world-readable? [17:48:56] <jlhenry> I have created MediaWiki:Recentchangestext & MediaWiki:Recentchangestext/fr and added $wgForceUIMsgAsContentMsg = array( 'mainpage', 'recentchanges-url' ); but it is not printing French message when using http://base.ekopedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:RecentChanges&uselang=fr&action=purge [17:48:59] <jlhenry> Any idea? [17:51:39] <CIA-70> 03werdna * r55419 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/ (lqt.css lqt.js): Revert r55410, apparently they like this one better :)) [17:53:39] <Platonides> jlhenry, if you created MediaWiki:Recentchangestext/fr, 'Recentchangestext' should be in $wgForceUIMsgAsContentMsg, not only 'recentchanges-url' [17:56:03] <jlhenry> Platonides, thanks but still not working. [17:56:14] <jlhenry> I have even tried this: $wgForceUIMsgAsContentMsg = array( 'mainpage', 'recentchanges-url', 'recentchanges', 'Special:RecentChanges', 'MediaWiki:Recentchangestext' ); [17:56:53] <jlhenry> I mean: $wgForceUIMsgAsContentMsg = array( 'mainpage', 'recentchanges-url', 'recentchanges', 'Special:RecentChanges', 'MediaWiki:Recentchangestext', 'Recentchangestext' ); [18:01:05] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) API loads unneeded things from LocalisationCache - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20340 enhancement; Normal; MediaWiki: API; (maxsem.wiki) [18:06:16] <jlhenry> Platonides, ... finaly I found my mistake ... A ",". [18:06:28] <jlhenry> I should write this: [18:06:29] <jlhenry> $wgForceUIMsgAsContentMsg = array( 'mainpage', 'recentchangestext', ); [18:06:31] <jlhenry> and not this: [18:06:33] <jlhenry> $wgForceUIMsgAsContentMsg = array( 'mainpage', 'recentchangestext' ); [18:06:42] <jlhenry> Thanks everyone! [18:07:47] <OuKB> o_0 [18:11:30] <CIA-70> 03brion * r55420 10/trunk/phase3/includes/ (Article.php LinkCache.php Title.php): [18:11:30] <CIA-70> Fix for wgArticleId being exported to JavaScript as a string instead of integer. :P [18:11:30] <CIA-70> Throw around some intval()s on page id, length data coming out of database into Title and Article objects and the link cache... blast PHP's soft typing! [18:34:53] <CIA-70> 03tparscal * r55421 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/UsabilityInitiative.hooks.php: Added support for outputting global javascript variables to the browser in a unified way. [18:42:20] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Today's Featured Article Date Problem - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18738 (10kingjpk) [18:46:27] <RickZilla> How can I insert the contents from a section on one page into a section on another page? [18:47:38] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Today's Featured Article Date Problem - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18738 +comment (10Platonides) [18:51:55] <mgrabovsky> !e Labeled Section Transclusion | RickZilla [18:51:55] --mwbot-- RickZilla: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Labeled [18:52:03] <mgrabovsky> !e Labeled_Section_Transclusion | RickZilla [18:52:03] --mwbot-- RickZilla: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Labeled_Section_Transclusion [18:52:36] <RickZilla> mgrabovsky: Thanks for the links, I'll check those out. [18:52:49] <mgrabovsky> RickZilla: just the second one [18:52:56] <mgrabovsky> RickZilla: the first is broken [18:53:04] <RickZilla> Ok, thanks for the heads up [18:53:45] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Enable Collection on Bengali Wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20338 +shell; summary; +comment (10innocentkiller) [18:55:28] <ekimmargni> hm, it should probably urlencode that :) [18:55:30] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) Crediting authors of OpenStreetMap maps - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20341 enhancement; Normal; MediaWiki extensions: Maps; (aude.wiki) [18:55:43] <RickZilla> Ah, it's an extension, I thought it was syntax that was readily available...like including an entire page in a section of another page [18:56:15] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Don't assume json availability - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20336 +comment (10innocentkiller) [18:58:47] <CIA-70> 03werdna * r55422 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/ (classes/View.php lqt.css lqt.js): [18:58:47] <CIA-70> Per Trevor and Brion: [18:58:47] <CIA-70> * Show the menu on hovering over the down arrow, hide it when leaving the toolbar. [18:58:47] <CIA-70> * Fix problem with icon display (change lqt-command-icon to just using the a, which now is display: block. [18:59:11] <mgrabovsky> RickZilla: that functionality is not available in core AFAIK [19:06:18] <wikibugs> 03(FIXED) Today's Featured Article Date Problem - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18738 +comment (10kingjpk) [19:06:56] <RickZilla> mgrabovsky: Thanks again, good info to know. [19:08:35] <CIA-70> 03werdna * r55423 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/lqt.js: Drop fade-out time to 20ms [19:09:35] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Relative URIs in interwiki links table causes failed redirects - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18664 (10brion) [19:09:38] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) Support for protocol-relative URLs - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20342 enhancement; Normal; MediaWiki: General/Unknown; (brion) [19:09:41] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Relative URIs in interwiki links table break interwiki transclusion - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19270 (10brion) [19:11:55] <CIA-70> 03werdna * r55424 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/lqt.js: Focus the textbox automatically when adding the edit form [19:22:37] <RickZilla> Is there a recommended extension that improves the editing toolbar in MediWiki? [19:25:16] <OuKB> RickZilla: UsabilityInitiative [19:25:50] <RickZilla> Just google that for the link? [19:32:19] <Simetrical> Wow, you can get IPv6 working by just sudo apt-get install miredo. [19:32:25] <Simetrical> That's pretty awesome. [19:32:40] <Simetrical> Even with no ISP support. [19:32:54] <flyingparchment> shouldn't need to install anything just to use 6to4 [19:33:16] <Simetrical> It's teredo, actually. [19:33:19] <Simetrical> Apparently. [19:34:03] *Simetrical leaves it installed to see what happens [19:34:19] <Simetrical> My machine is now apparently using IPv6 whenever available. [19:34:28] <Simetrical> Does any major site serve both A and AAAA records? [19:34:31] *flyingparchment is just glad to have an isp that does native v6 [19:34:59] <flyingparchment> Simetrical: google, but only to approved ISPs - probably not teredo [19:38:31] <brion-lunch> wacky [19:38:39] <brion-lunch> Simetrical: bugzilla.wikimedia.org does! ;) [19:39:23] <Simetrical> Heh, indeed. [19:39:35] <Simetrical> It's asking me to log in again, presumably since I'm coming from a different IP address. :) [19:42:23] <wikibugs> 03(FIXED) Some pages won't open on Russian Wikinews - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20320 +comment (10Ruslik00) [19:46:51] <flyingparchment> tbh, if i had to use teredo, i'd just not use v6 [19:49:29] <Simetrical> There's no actual reason for me to use IPv6. But I saw a Slashdot post saying you could enable it with sudo apt-get install miredo, so I thought I'd try it just for fun. [19:50:52] <CIA-70> 03nimishg * r55425 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/ClickTracking/ (8 files): [19:50:52] <CIA-70> JS click tracking! [19:50:52] <CIA-70> - Extension to track user clicks [19:50:52] <CIA-70> - table to track user daily contributions [19:53:49] <CIA-70> 03nimishg * r55426 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/js/plugins/jquery.wikiEditor.toolbar.js: click tracking enabled for toolbar [19:54:06] <brion> whee [19:54:26] <Pinky> zomg Big Brother [20:13:28] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Set custom upload URL for Bengali Wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19418 +comment (10jayantanth) [20:15:38] <CIA-70> 03raymond * r55427 10/trunk/extensions/Translate/groups/ (MediaWikiExtensions.php mediawiki-defines.txt): Follow-up r55425: Add clicktracking to translatewiki [20:15:49] <CIA-70> 03tparscal * r55428 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/ClickTracking/ (3 files): Changed name of token variable. [20:16:20] <Simetrical> Looks like svn.wikimedia.org also uses IPv6. :) [20:18:04] <wikibugs> 03(mod) OOM on getting metadata for some OGG files (metadata reading hits memory_limit) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19476 summary (10brion) [20:18:33] <CIA-70> 03ialex * r55429 10/trunk/phase3/ (RELEASE-NOTES languages/Language.php): * (bug 20296) Fixed a PHP warning in Parser::preSaveTransform() in PHP 5.3: Parameter 1 was expected to be a reference but value given when unstubbing $wgContLang [20:19:00] <wikibugs> 03(FIXED) Language::getMagic() expected to be a reference - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20296 +comment (10alex.emsenhuber) [20:28:24] <CIA-70> 03ashley * r55430 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/ClickTracking/ (7 files): [20:28:24] <CIA-70> follow-up to r55425: [20:28:24] <CIA-70> *convert spaces to tabs [20:28:24] <CIA-70> *tweak doxygen comments [20:28:24] <CIA-70> *coding style tweaks [20:39:06] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55431 10/trunk/phase3/includes/Html.php: Don't escape >" in tag contents, no point [20:39:29] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55432 10/trunk/phase3/includes/Html.php: Correct outdated comments [20:39:49] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55433 10/trunk/phase3/ (3 files in 3 dirs): [20:39:49] <CIA-70> Switch from Xml:: to Html:: in a few places [20:39:49] <CIA-70> These should all theoretically be covered by the parser tests. All [20:39:49] <CIA-70> tests pass, the only change needed was to account for less overescaping [20:39:49] <CIA-70> in Html::expandAttributes(). There's no reason to escape <>' in [20:39:52] <CIA-70> "-quoted attributes, unless I'm mistaken and have just added some XSS. [20:44:38] <Techjar> hello [20:45:30] <Techjar> :P [20:45:43] <Techjar> omigod [20:45:59] <Techjar> bye [20:48:17] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) Set up parallel automated parser test run on PostgreSQL, SQLite backends for CodeReview output - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20343 enhancement; Normal; Wikimedia: General/Unknown; (brion) [20:50:49] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55434 10/trunk/phase3/includes/Html.php: [20:50:49] <CIA-70> Move validation logic from input() to rawElement() [20:50:49] <CIA-70> This way callers of rawElement() or element() will also get correct [20:50:49] <CIA-70> behavior. [21:02:43] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) when printing, monobook does not include rtl.css corrections. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20344 normal; Normal; MediaWiki: User interface; (hartman) [21:02:52] <wikibugs> 03(mod) RTL/bidirectional issues (tracking) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=745 (10hartman) [21:03:07] <wikibugs> 03(mod) when printing, monobook does not include rtl.css corrections. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20344 (10hartman) [21:06:23] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55435 10/trunk/phase3/includes/ (Html.php specials/SpecialResetpass.php): (log message trimmed) [21:06:23] <CIA-70> Only require necessary fields in Special:ResetPass [21:06:23] <CIA-70> This fixes r54567. That made the password fields on Special:ResetPass [21:06:23] <CIA-70> always required, but in fact the current password should never be [21:06:25] <CIA-70> required (existing users always might have empty passwords), and the new [21:06:27] <CIA-70> password is only required if $wgMinimalPasswordLength > 0. [21:06:29] <wikibugs> 03(mod) when printing, monobook does not include rtl.css corrections. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20344 +comment (10brion) [21:06:29] <CIA-70> This commit also permits passing array( 'required' ) to [21:06:42] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55436 10/trunk/phase3/includes/specials/SpecialResetpass.php: Don't output useless value="" [21:07:18] <thedj> brion: not sure if this is just with the "printable" version, or with printing in general btw.... [21:07:21] <thedj> i'll check. [21:07:37] <brion> printable version should print the same as regular ver :) [21:07:52] <brion> it just switches in the print stylesheets on screen [21:08:12] <brion> Any vegans need to specify dietary requirements for http://wikimania2009.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimania_Codeathon ? [21:10:12] <CIA-70> 03siebrand * r55437 10/trunk/phase3/languages/messages/ (18 files): Localisation extension for core messages from translatewiki.net (2009-08-21 20:59 UTC) [21:12:36] <wikibugs> 03(mod) when printing, monobook does not include rtl.css corrections. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20344 (10hartman) [21:13:59] <acgt> Anyone know the status of Process Format for smw? [21:18:10] <CIA-70> 03siebrand * r55438 10/trunk/phase3/languages/messages/ (11 files): Localisation updates for core magic words from translatewiki.net [21:25:23] <CIA-70> 03siebrand * r55439 10/trunk/phase3/languages/messages/ (8 files): Localisation updates for special page aliases from translatewiki.net [21:26:48] <CIA-70> 03brion * r55440 10/trunk/phase3/includes/WebRequest.php: No need to store the value of the magic quotes check here; just use a local var for clarity. [21:29:06] <CIA-70> 03siebrand * r55441 10/trunk/extensions/ (128 files in 109 dirs): Localisation updates for extension messages from translatewiki.net (2009-08-21 20:59 UTC) [21:30:07] <thedj> siebrand: is there a way i can easily do a call for attention on a translation ? [21:30:38] <CIA-70> 03ashley * r55442 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/SimpleSearch/SimpleSearch.hooks.php: SimpleSearch: remove unused globals and initialize the global that is used [21:31:02] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Bad paging links in Special:Category - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19293 +comment (10alex.emsenhuber) [21:32:12] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Bad paging links in category pages - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19293 summary; +comment (10alex.emsenhuber) [21:33:18] <Simetrical> ARGH. [21:33:26] <Simetrical> WHY IS THE + OPERATOR FOR ARRAYS IN PHP SO FREAKING BROKEN? [21:34:32] <brion> haha [21:34:36] <brion> welcome to php hell [21:34:56] <brion> sometimes you want + [21:35:00] <brion> sometimes you want array_merge [21:35:05] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55443 10/trunk/phase3/includes/Html.php: Omit useless value="" in Html::input() [21:35:11] <brion> sometimes you can't figure out what the hell you want and have to do it yourself [21:35:32] <Simetrical> + should just work like array_merge(). [21:35:43] <Simetrical> Better yet, we shouldn't have one unified array type that's meant to work like everything. [21:35:47] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55444 10/trunk/phase3/includes/templates/Userlogin.php: [21:35:47] <CIA-70> Use Html::input() for login form [21:35:47] <CIA-70> This fixes some invalid HTML output in r54567, and also makes the output [21:35:47] <CIA-70> look more consistent and prettier. [21:35:49] <Simetrical> Although admittedly, it's sometimes nice that it's ordered. [21:36:05] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55445 10/trunk/phase3/includes/templates/Userlogin.php: Autofocus password, not name, if name is prefilled [21:36:28] <Simetrical> Why does account creation default to the name of the currently logged-in user? That seems kind of silly. [21:36:37] <Simetrical> Or, well, wherever it gets the name from. [21:37:00] <Simetrical> I think it gets it from cookies even if you're not logged in? [21:37:01] *Simetrical tries [21:37:15] <Simetrical> Seems so. [21:39:51] <CIA-70> 03nimishg * r55446 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/ClickTracking/ (ApiClickTracking.php ClickTracking.hooks.php): Make the user_daily_contribs table behave properly [21:40:05] <^demon> Simetrical: That entire thing needs refactoring. [21:40:11] <Simetrical> ^demon, it's awful. [21:40:13] <Simetrical> Like Monobook. [21:40:21] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55447 10/trunk/phase3/ (RELEASE-NOTES includes/templates/Userlogin.php): [21:40:21] <CIA-70> Don't prefill new account name, and autofocus [21:40:21] <CIA-70> It's kind of silly to prefill the name of the account to be created from [21:40:21] <CIA-70> cookies . . . presumably that account already exists. :) [21:40:21] <Simetrical> Some crazy "template"-based monstrosity. [21:40:34] *Simetrical looks for other forms to prefocus. [21:40:38] <Simetrical> Special:Search! [21:41:51] <Simetrical> . . . name isn't a required attribute for inputs? o_O [21:41:52] *Simetrical reads spec [21:42:35] <Simetrical> Oh, I see, that makes sense for JS buttons? [21:45:52] <^demon> siebrand: I saw your comment about "Must-try" :p [21:46:49] <CIA-70> 03siebrand * r55448 10/trunk/phase3/languages/messages/ (7 files): Localisation updates for namespaces from translatewiki.net [21:49:30] <siebrand> ^demon: yeah. No idea what to do with such a category... Don't all devs think *their* extension rocks, is awasome, da bomb, and must be in the "Must-try" category? [21:50:07] <^demon> It's absurd, IMHO. [21:50:26] <^demon> He started making it when the Industrialization crap started. [21:51:21] <flyingparchment> what is this? [21:51:44] <CIA-70> 03brion * r55449 10/trunk/ (7 files in 7 dirs): [21:51:44] <CIA-70> Cleaning up some old PHP 4 object-reference usage in some edit filtering hooks. [21:51:44] <CIA-70> There was a mix of uses of the reference and non-uses of the reference. :) [21:51:44] <CIA-70> Reverts r53714 and fixes it from the other end by cleaning up the uses to not expect references. [21:51:53] <^demon> flyingparchment: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Category_talk:Must-try_extensions [21:51:57] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Special:WantedCategories refresh date updates but contents does not get updated - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19969 (10malafaya) [21:54:26] *roberthl wonders why two of his extensions are in there. [21:54:32] <roberthl> They aren't even very good. [21:54:40] <roberthl> :/ [21:55:06] <^demon> Nor is his config guide. [21:55:29] <siebrand> ^demon: so we remove it? [21:55:30] <roberthl> can we just bin it? [21:55:33] <siebrand> indeed. [21:55:39] *siebrand is binning. [21:57:03] <^demon> Don't forget the subcat: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Category:Corporate_Must-have_extensions [21:57:09] <chasep_work> I have certain text (being generated by a custom parser function) that I have showing on all the pages in the User namespace. Right now I'm doing it by inserting the text via the EditPage::attemptSave hook, and I remove it via the EditPage::showEditForm:fields hook. This way its always at the top of the page and the user can't modify it. Is there a better way to just automatically include... [21:57:11] <chasep_work> ...some thing in a page? I couldn't find any hooks just for displaying like that [21:57:41] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55450 10/trunk/phase3/includes/ (Html.php specials/SpecialSearch.php): [21:57:41] <CIA-70> Autofocus Special:Search box [21:57:41] <CIA-70> Also generally clean up the code around there: add some line breaks, use [21:57:41] <CIA-70> Html instead of Xml (using new Html::hidden()). [21:58:06] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55451 10/trunk/phase3/includes/Xml.php: [21:58:06] <CIA-70> Make Xml::hidden() a wrapper around Html::hidden() [21:58:06] <CIA-70> HTML-specific stuff should go into the Html class; it doesn't belong in [21:58:06] <CIA-70> Xml. [21:58:22] <rainman-sr> don't we already do that, or did that? [21:58:38] *rainman-sr pokles simetrical [21:58:52] <Simetrical> rainman-sr, well, yes, using JS. I added the HTML 5 attribute. [21:59:10] <Simetrical> So it will work without JS in Opera and recent WebKit (Safari/Chrome). [21:59:18] <Splarka> chasep_work: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Header_Footer ? [21:59:32] <^demon> chasep_work: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Hooks/ArticleViewHeader - that hook might help too [21:59:35] <Simetrical> Eventually we might want to consider removing all this ad hoc JS hackery and make a generic function that autofocuses whatever's autofocusable if the browser doesn't support it natively. [21:59:39] <siebrand> ^demon: that even had another subcat (must have) [21:59:57] <rainman-sr> i see, nice [22:00:24] <brion> Simetrical: did you see my recommendation to ..... do what you just said? ;) [22:00:28] <chasep_work> what part of an article is considered the header? the title that is right below the tabs? [22:00:31] <Simetrical> brion, yep, I replied to it. [22:00:35] <brion> yay :D [22:01:05] <Simetrical> I don't think it's worth the effort unless $wgHtml5 is always true. [22:01:07] <chasep_work> if so, that hook might work [22:01:14] <Simetrical> Because if it's not always true, then we can't depend on the autofocus attribute being present. [22:01:19] <^demon> siebrand: His work on mw.org has been more annoying than helpful. [22:01:20] <Simetrical> So the script might not work. [22:01:29] <CIA-70> 03brion * r55452 10/trunk/phase3/includes/diff/DifferenceEngine.php: [22:01:29] <CIA-70> Revert r53710 "* Allow suppressing "line 1" from the diffs, which can get quite annoying with many diffs" [22:01:29] <CIA-70> Use of static variable here means that running multiple diffs during one request may mess things up. It should rather check if it's been added in $wgOut already. [22:01:30] <Simetrical> So we couldn't really replace the existing ad hoc JS focusing stuff. [22:02:04] <brion> Simetrical: well, we could stick autofocus in a class if not in html5 mode, and have the js check for either [22:02:11] <brion> though... that might be insane. ;) dunno [22:02:12] <Simetrical> Ugh. [22:02:32] <brion> stupid validation mania :) [22:03:39] <Splarka> <!DOCTYPE codesoup STFU-validator> [22:04:06] <brion> :) [22:04:41] <Splarka> html5 = autofocus, !html5 = tabindex="1" ? [22:05:27] <Splarka> and then have a function for every Special/action page form to apply that to the element most suitable? [22:05:43] <Simetrical> We don't want every tabindex=1 to be autofocused. [22:05:56] <Simetrical> Also, we should omit tabindex=1 if we want tab order to be in document order. [22:07:01] <Splarka> well, no, I mean, reserve tabindex=1 on actions/specials in nonhtml5 mode, to whatever element would be autofocused in html5 [22:07:07] <Splarka> and have the lowest be tabindex=2 otherwise [22:07:35] <vvv> Does tabindex=1 act like autofocus? [22:07:40] <Splarka> (and could even have some JS hint id="mw-autofocus") [22:07:59] <Splarka> vvv: tab tap takesya there [22:08:15] <Simetrical> vvv, no. [22:08:17] <^demon> siebrand: I think it's about time we come to a decision about [[Manual:Industrialization_guide]] [22:08:21] <Simetrical> tabindex=1 requires you to hit tab to focus. [22:08:36] <siebrand> ^demon: not aware of that page. [22:08:46] <siebrand> ^demon: still on janitorial duty. [22:08:46] <Splarka> which I quite like, you can freely scroll the page, or tab to the form which is the main focus of the page [22:09:09] <Splarka> would be great to go to reason on action=delete for example [22:09:33] <^demon> siebrand: When you get done, take a quick peek at it. It's from the same author as the must-have stuff. [22:10:20] <siebrand> ^demon: he obviously has something to say, and it's not all crap, but it has no place in the category system on mediawiki.org. [22:10:34] <siebrand> ^demon: he should blog, keep pages in his user space, or whatever. [22:11:36] <Annemarie> A tracking bug for user renaming seems sensible. [22:11:38] <Annemarie> Any objections? [22:11:51] <werdna> well, tracking bugs are lame [22:12:09] <Annemarie> https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=12969 [22:12:10] <Annemarie> Hmmm. [22:12:34] <Annemarie> This extension doesn't seem too stable. [22:12:46] *siebrand agrees with werdna [22:13:17] <Annemarie> 2007 is the tracking tracking bug, right? [22:13:22] <^demon> Yeah [22:13:36] <^demon> siebrand: Agreed. I just don't really want him in Manual or Help (most of his Help namespace edits were reverted). If he wants to talk about this somewhere that's certainly his prerogative, but it has no place in the official docs. [22:13:46] <Annemarie> Yes, yes it is. [22:13:47] <wikibugs> 14(DUP) "Changes related" has no rollback link - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18251 +comment (10alex.emsenhuber) [22:13:50] <Annemarie> Useful trivia, that. [22:13:53] <wikibugs> 03(mod) PHP Notice: Undfined index: page_latest in //includes/ChangesList.php on line 476 - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20131 +comment (10alex.emsenhuber) [22:14:49] <Splarka> <TheCainer> so for example: {{#country:uk}} would return United Kingdom (but that one doesn't work :p) [22:15:08] <Splarka> TheCainer: #language exists as a convenient way to access the current contents of Names.php, there is no reason to have one for country codes [22:15:29] <Splarka> just make a template for that, {{country|uk}} -> {{#switch:{{{1}}}|uk=United Kingdom|... [22:15:34] <Simetrical> RFC: should we bother specifying explicit widths for text boxes, in general? [22:15:44] <Simetrical> Like size="45" or whatever on inputs. [22:15:48] <Simetrical> I don't really see the point in most cases. [22:16:03] <Annemarie> Text boxes everywhere? [22:16:06] *Splarka sics jidanni on Simmy [22:16:09] <siebrand> ^demon: renamed to user space [22:16:21] <Simetrical> Hmm, the default size is rather narrow, it's true. [22:16:46] <werdna> Simetrical: well, the default size... yeah, right. [22:16:54] <werdna> Sometimes textboxes need to be wider :) [22:17:00] <Annemarie> I don't know what you're talking about when you say text areas. Deletion forms? Move forms? Edit window? [22:17:03] <Simetrical> Maybe we should set a better default size in CSS? [22:17:17] <werdna> you can set a default size in CSS? [22:17:28] <Annemarie> <input> supports style="width:" [22:17:39] <Annemarie> Though I'm sure someone will complain about that. [22:17:45] <^demon> jidanni. [22:18:28] <siebrand> ^demon: *sigh* http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Category:Corporate-friendly_solution [22:18:38] <^demon> siebrand: Already looking at that. [22:18:39] <siebrand> ^demon: he spent hours and hours on this. [22:20:36] <^demon> siebrand: Yeah :-\ [22:20:40] <^demon> I should've stepped in earlier. [22:20:45] *^demon is cleaning links [22:21:34] <siebrand> ^demon: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/User_talk:Al_Maghi#Should.2FMust.2Fand_more [22:22:39] <^demon> siebrand: Very PC, thanks. [22:23:03] <svip> PC? [22:23:08] <siebrand> ^demon: yeah, pc because he obviously has no malicious intent. [22:23:10] <Annemarie> Politically correct. [22:23:13] <svip> EW [22:23:17] *svip pukes [22:23:31] <siebrand> ^demon: don't wanna scare him off, but do want him to be worried :) [22:23:36] <^demon> See, this is why siebrand replied. I would've have been as nice. [22:23:41] <svip> PC is the most common excuse for lessening Freedom of Speech. [22:23:43] <^demon> *wouldn't have [22:23:49] <Annemarie> Entertainment Weekly. [22:23:54] <svip> I cannot believe MediaWiki people would support this. [22:24:05] <^demon> svip: Being politically correct sucks. [22:24:20] <siebrand> honey and vinegar [22:24:20] <svip> ^demon: Exactly! [22:24:44] <svip> But there is nothing wrong with being polite. [22:24:58] <^demon> svip: Like siebrand said, we're not trying to scare the guy off. Just discourage him from forking the entire install guide and present it as "The guide for installing MW in corporate environments" [22:24:58] <svip> And *that* is what siebrand was. [22:25:38] <Splarka> background-color:african-american; [22:25:49] <svip> uuu [22:26:07] <siebrand> interesting header... 'Ren Ways To Destroy a Hard Disk' [22:26:10] <svip> background-*colour*: black; *colour*: white; [22:26:11] <siebrand> ehr, Ten [22:27:15] <flyingparchment> ^demon: oh, is *that* what it was? that guy is rather unable to communicate anything clearly [22:27:41] <^demon> siebrand: Whee bug 15646...."MediaWiki page Manual talk:Industrialization guide has been created by Siebrand" [22:28:04] <^demon> flyingparchment: Yeah [22:28:40] <siebrand> ^demon: ialex got a mail from translatewiki saying I created User:IAlex when I changed his user rights. [22:28:56] <siebrand> (the page) [22:29:17] *siebrand blames Aaron. [22:29:22] <svip> ^demon: Sure that's 15646? Because this bug seems appropriate. [22:30:12] <^demon> 15646 Page creation notification email is sent when a watched page is deleted [22:30:22] <svip> ^demon: Terrible, isn't it? [22:30:28] <Platonides> I think there was a more general version of {{BASEPAGENAME}}? [22:30:38] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55453 10/trunk/phase3/includes/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Use Html::input()/autofocus a bunch more places [22:30:43] <^demon> svip: siebrand deleted my watched page. I got a creation e-mail. That's bug 15646 :) [22:30:44] <Splarka> http://www.mediawiki.org/w/api.php?action=edit&title=User:Siebrand&appendtext=%0A%5B%5BCategory%3ADevelopers+who+hate+industrial+progress%5D%5D [22:30:53] <Simetrical> Hmm. [22:31:01] <Simetrical> Should 'type' and 'value' be required in Html::input()? [22:31:03] <Simetrical> I'm not sure. [22:31:03] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55454 10/trunk/phase3/includes/Html.php: Typo in comment [22:31:16] <Simetrical> The defaults are used pretty commonly when you want to use extra attributes. [22:31:17] <svip> ^demon: What a jerk. Totally wanted to send you an email, but didn't have to courage to do it himself. [22:31:34] <Simetrical> In fact, it seems rare that you ever want to *not* use extra attributes for an input. [22:32:00] <Platonides> Aham, {{#titleparts:{{PAGENAME}}|n}} [22:32:03] <werdna> 22:23 < svip> PC is the most common excuse for lessening Freedom of Speech. [22:32:06] *werdna sighs. [22:32:41] <svip> Splarka: Is there an alternative for appendtext? e.g. adding text at the beginning? [22:32:45] <svip> werdna: You know it to be true! [22:32:47] <Splarka> prependtext [22:32:50] <werdna> it's not about "Freedom of speech", it's about not offending people. You have the right to offend people, for that exact reason. [22:33:00] <werdna> It's just not very polite. [22:33:04] <Splarka> svip, see http://www.mediawiki.org/w/api.php look for action=edit [22:33:06] <Simetrical> Well, in some places you don't. [22:33:14] <Simetrical> Some places ban, for instance, certain types of hate speech per se. [22:33:24] <svip> werdna: Not offending people is usually also being polite. [22:33:25] <TheCainer> Splarka, i only need the country-thingie for one page so far, so i can still manage by just writing the countryname. it was more out of interest to get to know the wiki better that i asked about it :) [22:33:26] <Simetrical> I mean on a governmental level, not even counting private institutions. [22:33:35] <Splarka> faire [22:33:47] <werdna> Simetrical: There's a big wide open space between politically incorrect and inciting violence. [22:33:47] <^demon> Which msg is the page creation e-mail? I can't find it on AllMessages [22:33:56] <Simetrical> werdna, not really. [22:33:57] <Simetrical> Very fuzzy. [22:34:02] <svip> Simetrical: Yes really. [22:34:32] <wikibugs> 04(REOPENED) "Go" search button is ignoring user's custom search namespaces - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11380 (10brion) [22:34:37] <werdna> Simetrical: the crime is not offending people, it's inciting violence [22:34:40] <svip> Simetrical: E.g. Hitler was awesome. Not very PC, I'd say - but where is the violence? [22:34:43] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Ability to attempt match in different namespace - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19862 +comment (10brion) [22:34:45] <wikibugs> 03(mod) "Go" search button is ignoring user's custom search namespaces - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11380 +comment (10brion) [22:34:54] <Splarka> Simetrical: <input /> is perfectly valid in xhtml [22:35:02] <Annemarie> Who said anything about violence? [22:35:10] <svip> Annemarie: werdna did. [22:35:31] <Splarka> (same for html5 it seems too) [22:35:53] <Annemarie> Ah, so he did. [22:35:55] <Annemarie> Silly werdna. [22:35:57] <^demon> Ah 'enotif_body' [22:36:03] <^demon> Silly multi-use message. [22:36:16] <Annemarie> Yeah, getting a creation e-mail for page deletion is rather goofy. :P [22:36:16] <Simetrical> werdna, nonsense. There are plenty of places where hate speech is banned even if it can't be demonstrated that it directly incited violence. [22:36:29] <Annemarie> Swastikas in the UK? [22:36:36] <Simetrical> Hate speech is usually defined to encompass a much broader span of speech than just inciting violence. [22:36:38] <^demon> Annemarie: I'm looking at fixing that now. It's stupid and has 5 dupes. [22:36:47] <Annemarie> Wheeee. :-) [22:37:20] *werdna shrugs. [22:37:27] <Simetrical> werdna, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech_laws_in_Australia#Federal The Act makes it “unlawful for a person to do an act, otherwise than in private, if the act is reasonably likely, in all the circumstances, to offend, insult, humiliate or intimidate another person or a group of people; and the act is done because of the race, colour or national or ethnic origin of the other person, or of some or all of the people in the group.[1] [22:37:27] <Simetrical> ” [22:37:38] <Simetrical> Nothing about inciting violence. [22:37:39] <svip> werdna: Like dening the Holocaust. [22:37:43] <Simetrical> Simple restriction of offensive speech. [22:37:56] <Simetrical> Look at Germany's restriction of anything even vaguely Nazi-related, too. [22:37:56] <Simetrical> Etc. [22:38:07] <svip> Denying the Holocaust is just another way of saying "I don't believe Germans are *that* efficient". [22:38:12] <svip> Jerks, everybody knows they are. [22:38:21] <Simetrical> Laws against hate speech are probably the single biggest challenge to free speech in the West today. [22:38:25] <Splarka> hey now, all the extermination camps were in poland [22:38:34] <svip> Splarka: ... run by Germans. [22:38:35] <Simetrical> Thankfully America has a strong constitution to protect us from laws like that. [22:38:39] <werdna> Simetrical: It depends on how expansive they are. [22:38:48] <svip> Simetrical: <_< >_> Yes... [22:38:49] <Simetrical> Sure. In some places they're not bad. [22:38:56] <werdna> Also, I imagine there's SIGNIFICANT selective enforcement. [22:39:03] <Simetrical> Which makes it worse. [22:39:24] <werdna> I would say internet filtering is a bigger problem with free speech. [22:39:25] <Simetrical> Selective enforcement = you get to arrest the people who are saying offensive and unpopular things while not touching the people saying offensive but politically correct things. [22:39:32] <newrkv> how do you change the color of links to pages that havent been created yet? [22:39:36] <Splarka> selective enforcement is fascism, you can bust anyone on any crimes they may have committed, simply because you don't like them [22:39:37] <Simetrical> newrkv, use CSS. [22:39:46] <werdna> Splarka: That's an exaggeration. [22:39:50] <Simetrical> Internet filtering is an issue too, but I don't think it's as big. Nobody's going to jail over it, after all. [22:39:51] <newrkv> which one do i change [22:39:55] <Simetrical> newrkv, a.new [22:39:58] <Simetrical> Or just .new. [22:40:01] <flyingparchment> werdna: no it's not [22:40:06] <werdna> It's a violation of the rule of law, for sure. [22:40:06] <newrkv> thanks [22:40:17] <flyingparchment> werdna: over here, the police can basically arrest anyone they like by making up 'suspcious' of something or other [22:40:18] <werdna> But it isn't fascism, although it can certainly enable fascism. [22:40:31] <svip> I miss the Second World War. [22:40:32] <newrkv> which page do i apply it to again? [22:40:47] <werdna> flyingparchment: yeah, UK is getting nastily overpoliced :( [22:40:48] <Simetrical> newrkv, add to MediaWiki:Common.css: .new { color: purple; } [22:40:49] <Simetrical> Or whatever. [22:41:13] <Simetrical> flyingparchment, police can always arrest whoever they like, the question is whether they can bring charges. [22:41:17] <svip> Simetrical: Purple?! I think you mean "European". [22:41:29] <Simetrical> I mean, theoretically you can sue them for false arrest or whatever it's called, but good luck. [22:41:47] <svip> Good luck? [22:42:03] <svip> I thought the police force and the justice system was separate. [22:42:04] <Splarka> by "you can bust anyone" I mean arrest, charge, and often convict, or at the very least, horribly inconvenience and reputationally destroy [22:42:16] <Simetrical> Well, if you have to prove that the arrest was wrongful beyond a reasonable doubt, that's pretty hard. [22:42:20] <svip> The latter is apparently extremely easy today. [22:42:24] <CIA-70> 03brion * r55456 10/trunk/phase3/ (3 files in 3 dirs): [22:42:24] <CIA-70> Revert r53600 "Add $wgSecondaryGoNamespace, used if an exact match is not found when pressing go - will try to find a match in a different namespace before performing a search." [22:42:24] <CIA-70> Revert r53618 "* Replace $wgSecondaryGoNamespace with $wgSecondaryGoNamespaces (taking an array of integers instead of just an integer), per code review of r53600." [22:42:25] <CIA-70> Revert r53672 "* Add release note for r53618." [22:42:26] <Simetrical> I mean, they just have to claim you were disturbing the peace or something. [22:42:27] <CIA-70> Per bug 11380 this should probably be using the default search namespaces or the user's search namespaces; an additional config array seems unnecessary. [22:42:27] <Splarka> pretty hard at the federal level too [22:42:34] <werdna> Simetrical: it's balance of probabilities. [22:42:35] <Simetrical> Your word against theirs, you can't convict them of anything on that. [22:42:46] <Simetrical> werdna, for civil suits, I guess so. [22:42:49] <werdna> Because it's a civil action afaik [22:42:55] <werdna> http://gizmodo.com/5303089/mccain-wants-predators-to-provide-wi+fi-for-iranians [22:43:11] <Simetrical> That's still also unreliable, though. I mean, it's a matter of who the jury believes more. [22:43:23] <Simetrical> Unless you have clear evidence somehow that they had no reason to arrest you, which is unlikely. [22:43:34] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Ability to attempt match in different namespace - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19862 +comment (10brion) [22:43:41] <Simetrical> But they have to release you very soon if they don't file charges, so that's the more important bit, really. [22:43:46] <Simetrical> And developed nations are pretty good on that. [22:44:17] <^demon> Annemarie: Ok, I've got a good idea on how to go about doing this. [22:44:26] <Annemarie> :-) [22:44:47] <Splarka> Simetrical: the spooky part is the federal level, where if they want to charge you, they just need a sympathetic judge (and will keep trying till they find one) [22:44:57] <Simetrical> What do you mean? [22:44:58] <Splarka> http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2009/07/21/heritage-house-law/ [22:45:12] <Simetrical> You need an indictment, technically, but that's usually a formality. [22:45:15] <werdna> 22:43 < Simetrical> But they have to release you very soon if they don't file charges, so that's the more important bit, really. [22:45:18] <werdna> Not in a lot of places [22:45:20] <Simetrical> But they won't bother charging you if they have no case. [22:45:33] <werdna> in Australia you can be held without charge for 14 days if you're suspected of terrorism [22:45:43] <Simetrical> Okay, so depends on what you mean by "very soon". [22:45:52] <werdna> they have to convince a judge every 3 days, but even so [22:46:01] <Simetrical> In America I don't think there's a hard time limit. [22:46:04] <Simetrical> It's case by case. [22:46:32] <Simetrical> Splarka, come on, everyone is guilty of crimes anyway. Have you jaywalked lately? [22:46:41] <svip> Oi [22:46:45] <Splarka> Simetrical: per my fascism argument earlier [22:46:58] <^demon> Simetrical: Does anyone else in the world actually have such an absurd law as jaywalking? [22:47:02] <svip> Jaywalking is illegal? [22:47:19] <Splarka> if you're guilty of a federal crime (as almost everyone is, technically), and someine in the government doesn't like your attitude, watch out! party like it's 1984 [22:47:20] <Simetrical> ^demon, . . . what? You're not allowed to cross the street against the light anywhere. I mean, that's what the light is *for*. [22:47:21] <svip> I know in Denmark that absurd jaywalking is illegal. [22:47:26] <svip> But usual jaywalking is not. [22:47:29] <Simetrical> Splarka, same for state and local . . . [22:47:35] <Simetrical> Hmm. [22:47:36] <newrkv> that didnt work [22:47:45] <Splarka> jaywalking isn't generally criminal [22:47:48] <newrkv> i added that code to the css file, and it still stays the same color [22:47:48] <werdna> Simetrical: It's stupid to put it into law. [22:47:50] <Simetrical> newrkv, try: .new { color: purple !important; } [22:47:57] <svip> ^demon: By absurd, I mean walking strange places on the street during traffic. [22:48:01] <^demon> Splarka: And it's quite possibly the least-enforced law :) [22:48:01] <Simetrical> newrkv, also try Shift-Reload to clear your cache. [22:48:04] <svip> ^demon: You know -- being an idiot [22:48:05] <werdna> Selective enforcement works in some cases, and doesn't work in others. [22:48:13] <Simetrical> werdna, well, not if you're disrupting traffic. [22:48:14] <werdna> One case it doesn't work is with free speech, I agree there. [22:48:18] <^demon> svip: Well strange jaywalking should be illegal. But jaywalking shouldn't, that's absurd. [22:48:30] <newrkv> that did it! [22:48:31] <Simetrical> It shouldn't be illegal to cross against the light when there are no cars in sight. [22:48:31] <newrkv> great, thanks [22:48:32] <Splarka> selective enforcement works for non-criminal offenses, littering, jaywalking, possession of drugs (where it is decriminalized but still illegal) [22:48:41] <^demon> Simetrical: Exactly! [22:48:45] <svip> ^demon: I never thought it was. But I do believe that using a national flag incorrectly should be a federal offence. [22:48:53] <Simetrical> But if you're getting in someone's way, it's fair to have a modest fine for that. [22:49:01] <Simetrical> svip, it no longer is in the US. [22:49:05] <svip> WHAT [22:49:06] <Simetrical> Used to be, but got thrown out by the courts. [22:49:11] <svip> Simetrical: OUTRAGOUS [22:49:19] <^demon> Then again, I also think red lights should be treated as 4-way stops late at night when there's no traffic. [22:49:32] <svip> Simetrical: At least my country still have the Royal Law of Flag Law. [22:49:53] <werdna> svip: Why should we punish people who mistreat a flag? [22:49:54] <svip> Simetrical: In Denmark you may *not* fly a Danish flag at night. If there are foreign flags as well, the Danish flag must *always* be higher than the others. [22:49:57] <werdna> What purpose does it serve? [22:50:05] <Simetrical> ^demon, they should have awesome AI or something that detects where all the cars are and magically turns them off if there are few enough vehicles. [22:50:15] <svip> werdna: Every purpose. It's tradition. [22:50:18] <Splarka> werdna: flag-bashing chromophobes! [22:50:21] <^demon> svip: Same here. Flying at night requires lights to keep it illuminated though. [22:50:31] <Splarka> flags have a right to exist like everyone else [22:50:31] <^demon> Simetrical: Minority Report. [22:50:32] <werdna> svip: "Every purpose" does not answer my question. [22:50:33] <svip> ^demon: Flying at night is flying for the devil. [22:50:43] <Simetrical> ^demon, kind of, except without the arresting part. [22:50:44] <werdna> You're just hand-waving and saying that purposes exist, without actually naming any. [22:50:56] <svip> werdna: Then I would undermine my own case. [22:51:04] <svip> werdna: There are no other purposes than tradition. [22:51:13] <svip> Also, we don't punish anyone for not flying flags correctly. [22:51:13] <Simetrical> Well, I don't object to tradition. [22:51:16] <svip> We just do it correctly. [22:51:26] <Simetrical> But free speech is typically more important to me. [22:51:33] <Simetrical> Depends, though. [22:51:34] <CIA-70> 03brion * r55457 10/trunk/phase3/ (RELEASE-NOTES maintenance/deleteRevision.php): [22:51:34] <CIA-70> Partial revert of r53641 "* (bug 19857) maintenance/deleteRevision.php on last revision no longer breaks target page" [22:51:34] <CIA-70> Unindexed query would scan entire page table. [22:51:37] <werdna> I'm with Simetrical on that :) [22:51:40] <werdna> for a change. [22:51:48] <svip> werdna: Since the Danish flag is the oldest state flag in the world, we ought to treat it with some respect! [22:51:50] <Simetrical> What, even the "typically" and "depends"? [22:51:58] <Simetrical> svip, how old is it? [22:52:13] <svip> Simetrical: Around 1200. [22:52:15] <wikibugs> 04(REOPENED) maintenance/deleteRevision.php on last revision breaks targeted page - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19857 +comment (10brion) [22:52:22] <Splarka> "oh yah, well sweden has the largest collection of captured battle flags!" [22:52:35] <werdna> France has the largest collection of white flags. [22:52:36] *werdna ducks. [22:52:40] <werdna> Stereotypes are fun@! [22:52:42] <Simetrical> I was about to make a crack like that. [22:52:44] <svip> O: [22:53:03] <svip> werdna: Unfair. When you are fighting Germans, you know you are going to loose. [22:53:22] <Splarka> hey, lets aim this convo back on topic [22:53:38] <svip> Splarka: What? Flags? [22:53:41] <Splarka> why does the US government release stuff under public domain implicitly, but other governments do not? [22:53:41] <werdna> nevarrr [22:53:45] <chasep_work> is there a way to prevent pages from being cached for only certain namespaces? [22:53:50] <werdna> chasep_work: no [22:53:59] <Simetrical> Splarka, because the US is awesomer. [22:54:07] <Splarka> is the Queen hoping all those polaroids of the sky the UK astronomers take will come in handy for her scrapbook? [22:54:14] <werdna> chasep_work: why do you not want that? [22:54:28] *werdna pulls stroopwafels from cupboards [22:54:44] <svip> Splarka: Not technically true -- governments elsewhere do release public domain stuff, they just don't call it that. It's tricky. [22:55:05] <svip> Splarka: The additional reason is that European privacy laws are a lot stricter than American privacy laws. [22:55:07] <Splarka> svip: by other governments I mean ones that matter, like the UK [22:55:11] *Splarka stereotypes too [22:55:14] <svip> Splarka: Jerk [22:55:17] <svip> ;-; [22:55:37] <Splarka> aww *gives svip a whole canned ham* [22:55:37] *werdna goes back to looking up ferry timetables [22:55:50] <werdna> Simetrical: You should come to Europe, if for no other reason than to be impressed by the railway system. [22:55:51] <Simetrical> Privacy is for sissies, like Europeans. [22:55:52] <Splarka> chasep_work: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:NoCache [22:56:04] <Simetrical> werdna, bah, it can't be better than the NYC railway system. [22:56:11] <Simetrical> It might go further, but why would I want to leave NYC? [22:56:14] <Splarka> you could have a hook add that to the rendered text (not actual source) of all pages in a namespace, or soemthing [22:56:23] <chasep_work> werdna: i'm using ArticleAfterFetchContent to insert predefined text into a page. Problem is, that method doesn't get called for a cached page. If I edit the page, after I save it, it caches it [22:56:32] <svip> Simetrical: Oh yeah. Let's not complain when your government is warrentless wiretapping your phone, kay? [22:56:37] *svip puts on sunglasses. [22:56:40] <svip> Being American is awesome. [22:56:40] <Simetrical> svip, sure thing. [22:56:43] <werdna> Simetrical: Just the engineering interest :) [22:56:50] <Simetrical> I don't mind, they won't find anything interesting. [22:56:56] <svip> Simetrical: Sure...? [22:57:01] <Simetrical> Pretty sure, yeah. [22:57:06] <svip> Simetrical: Did you ever consider what I planted in your car? [22:57:07] <werdna> chasep_work: You probably want a different hook [22:57:11] <Simetrical> svip, I don't own a car. [22:57:11] <werdna> try ArticleView or something [22:57:15] <svip> Simetrical: Exactly... [22:57:16] <Simetrical> I live in NYC, why would I need a car? [22:57:19] <Simetrical> . . . [22:57:24] *svip nods... [22:57:26] <flyingparchment> the UK train system has sucked since the conservatives privatised it [22:57:30] <chasep_work> werdna: any ideas which one? [22:57:47] <svip> flyingparchment: The French railway system has owned since the French started focusing on it. [22:57:59] <svip> The Danish is quite good as well. [22:58:04] <werdna> flyingparchment: Well, compared to US and AU intercity services, the UK train system is brilliant. [22:58:09] <svip> Though - often delayed. [22:58:21] <svip> werdna: What about the Swiss train system? That's *never* late. [22:58:22] <werdna> The only other one I've tried is the Italian trains, which were pretty good [22:58:33] <flyingparchment> werdna: they maintain the minimum level of service necessary to stop the government taking it back [22:59:18] <werdna> flyingparchment: It leaves much to be desired, but by and large I get around London and the places around there without too much trouble. [22:59:28] <werdna> Mind you, most of my experience with National Rail is going to airports [22:59:29] <flyingparchment> london is different [22:59:51] <werdna> ah yes, they assume that you're always going either to or from London [23:00:04] <flyingparchment> TfL can run a good service in all of london and still make money, because the entire region is busy [23:00:16] <flyingparchment> private enterprise outside london won't spend money on service to non-profitable regions [23:00:17] <werdna> prices are pretty nasty, though [23:00:38] <werdna> although I come from Sydney [23:00:58] <Simetrical> The brilliance of replacing public monopolies with private monopolies! [23:01:02] <Simetrical> . . . seriously, what's the point? [23:01:10] <flyingparchment> it's not even a monopoly [23:01:15] <Splarka> less budget waffling [23:01:17] <werdna> where we pay A$2.40 for a 40-minute trip into the city (about 1 pound, for a 20-30 mile trip) [23:01:19] <flyingparchment> except in london, oddly enough, where it actually works [23:02:10] <werdna> In return, we get half-hourly frequencies at off-peak times [23:02:33] <werdna> and slow trains. [23:02:53] <werdna> and our government would rather give everybody $1000 than spend the money building high-speed intercity rail. [23:03:59] <Splarka> Simetrical: reminds me of http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2871/is-nasa-the-only-federal-agency-that-makes-a-profit [23:04:16] <Simetrical> Somehow I'm unsurprised that you also read the Straight Dope. [23:04:22] <Simetrical> Masses of useless trivia, seems right up your alley. [23:05:46] <svip> :[ [23:06:09] <svip> Blah, where is GreenReaper... My solution to the Apache problems I am having are not pretty. [23:06:17] <svip> I currently have a cronjob that restarts Apache every hour. [23:06:27] *Simetrical wonders why he's making silly posts about Html when there are so many features to add and bugs to fix [23:06:33] <Simetrical> Okay, it's 7:06, I really have to go. [23:06:37] *Splarka feels vaguely insulted by that [23:06:37] *Simetrical goes poof [23:17:39] <CIA-70> 03tparscal * r55458 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/ (4 files in 3 dirs): [23:17:39] <CIA-70> Changes the logic introduced in r55269 so that unknown browsers are assumed to [23:17:39] <CIA-70> work properly. Also moved the definition of which browsers are supported to a [23:17:39] <CIA-70> globally accessible location so that developers have some options for testing [23:17:39] <CIA-70> things in unsuported browsers. [23:21:21] <Reedy> Am i right in thinking theres a bot that will do importing of help pages? [23:21:28] <Reedy> (to custom wikis) [23:21:32] <Reedy> Rather than export/import [23:21:34] <Splarka> oh come on, srsly? /trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/ClickTracking/ .. can't wait to see that on en.wp X_X [23:22:07] <Reedy> !help [23:22:07] --mwbot-- Hi! I'm mwbot, a bot that was quickly whipped up by Daniel Cannon (AmiDaniel) to help out around #mediawiki. Some quick help is at < http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Mwbot >, you can find all my source code at < http://amidaniel.com/viewvc/trunk/MWBot/?root=svn >. A dump is now available at < http://toolserver.org/~amidaniel/botbrain.html > [23:22:09] <Reedy> not that one [23:22:11] <Reedy> bah [23:22:30] <Reedy> http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Copying [23:24:03] <chasep_work> my last question for today: is there any sort of dynamic page that lists everything within a certain namespace? [23:24:15] <Splarka> !copying is The "Help:" namespace on mediawiki.org is available for copying. See < http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Copying >. [23:24:15] --mwbot-- Successfully added keyword: copying [23:24:49] <Splarka> chasep_work: Special:Allpages and Special:Prefixindex [23:25:05] <Reedy> having admin rights on the wiki would be so much easier [23:25:34] <^demon> Wait, turkeys got swine flu? [23:25:39] <^demon> So now we have Swine-Avian flu? [23:25:41] *^demon explodes [23:25:42] <chasep_work> thankyou [23:25:49] <Splarka> heh ^demon, I just had a bad idea (not related to your flu) [23:26:11] <Splarka> those silly "redirects here: WP:FOO" on en.wp, could have similar on mw.org for bot aliases [23:26:19] <Splarka> like [!copying] in a floating div on http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Copying [23:26:50] <^demon> Splarka: Yay do it. [23:26:57] <Splarka> and an autogenerated !e for extensions and !wg for configs [23:27:14] <Splarka> ^demon the problem is, it would be bad to have it in Help: namespace [23:27:27] <^demon> We'll only put it on Manual pages then. [23:27:31] <^demon> Or anything not in Help. [23:27:49] <^demon> And make it auto-cat into [[Category:Mwbot_linked]], too :) [23:28:18] <Splarka> hmm, well that'd be silly for Extensions for example [23:29:17] <^demon> Well, I wouldn't put !e Foo on every extension page. [23:29:47] <^demon> Or !man Bar on every manual page. Just pages that are linked directly from a specific !bang. [23:29:50] <^demon> Like !shorturl [23:30:05] <Splarka> hmm [23:33:50] <Splarka> -->{{#ifeq:{{NAMESPACE}}|{{ns:102}}|{{col sep}} colspan="2" style="text-align:center;" {{!}} '''bot macro:''' <tt>!e {{PAGENAME}}</tt>}} [23:33:52] <CIA-70> 03demon * r55459 10/trunk/phase3/ (5 files in 3 dirs): (bug 15646) Page creation notification email is sent when a watched page is deleted [23:33:53] <Splarka> but it would be so easy [23:34:17] <wikibugs> 03(FIXED) Page creation notification email is sent when a watched page is deleted - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=15646 +comment (10innocentkiller) [23:34:20] <^demon> \o. [23:36:52] <CIA-70> 03nimishg * r55460 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/ClickTracking/ (4 files): We decided to have 3 levels of granularity instead of just recording user contributions per 6 month period. We get to sift through the data later and figure out which one (if any) was the most useful [23:38:30] <p858snake> Splarka: wouldn't the privacy policy forbid them using anything like that anyway [23:38:46] <p858snake> in ref to the click tracking [23:46:12] <Splarka> p858snake: OMG why do you hate usability! [23:46:25] <p858snake> because it's evil \o/ [23:48:14] <p858snake> it makes it easier for the less intelligent to do stuff <.< [23:57:24] <wikibugs> 03(mod) PDF prints don't join Arabic letters properly - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19830 +comment (10hartman) [23:58:50] <Splarka> p858snake: amen

[00:00:14] <^demon|away> Simetrical: Come again? [00:00:32] ^demon, http://docs.python.org/library/optparse.html [00:01:38] <^demon> Simetrical: Quite possibly. Is there some standard PHP library for it? [00:02:00] No, because PHP is a terrible language. [00:02:40] <^demon> Lame. [00:03:57] <^demon> I should probably make a class and move that stuff to it. Just pass it $argv and have it do the rest. [00:10:10] brion: Required viewing for all our senior IT managers. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ukytqe9pwDM. (FOSDEM 2009 MediaWiki) [00:10:31] :) [00:13:31] no the "like a boss" video is the required video >.> [00:13:31] *jdpond Starting a gov project to clone Brion - Microsoft is delighted. [00:13:32] biological clones are inefficient, requiring growth and training... and not as useful as one might think... if brion had (has?) a twin brother, would he be in to MediaWiki as much? better to dump his brain into an AI [00:14:12] mostly it is his training and loyalty we need copies of, and dependency on sustenance for encouragement to work, but we can program in dependencies for dutch pastries [00:14:36] 03(mod) Attach source files to uploaded images - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17012 (10brion) [00:14:44] 03(mod) Add IT, XM, MOD, and S3M to $wgFileExtensions[] - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20330 +comment (10brion) [00:15:00] pfft we just need SkyPHP/Skynet and it will write itself >.> [00:15:56] Splarka: that's why I'm making all managers watch it - not about the tool, about the culture that makes the tool effective. Try training former cobol programmers to develop collaborative cultures. [00:16:09] 03(mod) Create Portuguese unblock-pt-l list - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20329 +comment (10brion) [00:16:59] *Emufarmers pets verne.freenode.net. [00:17:08] 03(mod) Add IT, XM, MOD, and S3M to $wgFileExtensions[] - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20330 (10mike.lifeguard) [00:17:23] Emufarmers: what a giveaway [00:21:35] 14(INVALID) Cannot login to a page with bad revision timestamps - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20328 +comment (10brion) [00:22:44] 03(mod) Attach source files to uploaded images - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17012 +comment (10mike.lifeguard) [00:25:16] 03(mod) Option to strip some metadata on upload - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20326 (10brion) [00:31:48] 03(mod) Attach source files to uploaded images - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17012 (10brion) [00:31:51] 03(mod) Uploading different types of files (text files: *.mol, *.pdb) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5535 (10brion) [00:31:54] 03(mod) Allow uploading of Blender 3D or COLLADA files to Wikimedia Commons - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1790 (10brion) [00:32:25] 03(mod) Option to strip some metadata on upload - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20326 +comment (10brion) [00:32:28] 03(mod) Ability to preview vector/re-rendered images in Special:Upload "warning" interstitial. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16437 (10brion) [00:32:48] hm, someone is better at searching then me! :D [00:33:07] brion is a wizard [00:33:28] RIP fetchInterwiki.pl [00:33:47] Could fix this "bug" with no impact on performance - anybody interested? https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18684 [00:34:56] https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/attachment.cgi?id=6403 [00:35:05] <^demon> I'm not sure we should add those to the default list. Rather, we should fix bug 18426 [00:35:43] 03(mod) Enable dng uploads on Commons - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19153 +comment (10brion) [00:35:49] Which should be easy enough [00:36:05] 03(mod) Allow uploading of Blender 3D or COLLADA files to Wikimedia Commons - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1790 +comment (10mike.lifeguard) [00:36:09] <^demon> Ewww, I remember that msft office patch [00:36:45] ^demon: definitely better solution is to have customizable mime.types [00:37:10] <^demon> Yes :) [00:37:55] 03(mod) Set local time for vec.wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20322 (10brion) [00:38:05] 03(mod) Enable 2 aliases for vec.wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20324 (10brion) [00:38:05] especially in light of the Fed Court ruling on the imbedded XML of .docx & ilk. [00:38:11] ^demon: I'm surprised you didn't kill fetchInterwiki.pl when you were cleaning up maintenance [00:38:38] jdpond: what's that? [00:38:51] 03(mod) Changing SITENAME of ckbWiki - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20295 (10brion) [00:38:53] <^demon> MrZ-man: I couldn't decide on it. It still works, it was just massively obsolete :P [00:40:15] Emufarmers: http://fcw.com/blogs/insider/2009/08/microsoft-word-court-injunction-i4i.aspx?s=fcwdaily_190809 [00:40:54] <^demon> jdpond: I read that as word-count-injunction [00:40:55] <^demon> :p [00:41:06] 03(mod) Give bureaucrats the ability to remove sysop and bureaucrat rights at simplewiki - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20271 (10brion) [00:42:02] ^demon: http://tinyurl.com/lhytxf [00:49:21] 03(mod) strategywiki, usabilitywiki domains not in auto-login list for SUL - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20251 summary; +comment (10brion) [00:53:10] 03(FIXED) Create Portuguese unblock-pt-l list - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20329 +comment (10fvassard) [00:54:00] 03(mod) Wikimedia setup interfering with API maxage and smaxage parameters - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=14402 +comment (10brion) [00:55:48] Anyone got lockdown extension experience? [00:56:13] !ask | Nuro [00:56:13] --mwbot-- Nuro: Don't say "I have a question", or ask "Is anyone around?" or "Can anyone help?". Just ask the question, and someone will help you if they can. See also: !gethelp [00:56:26] hehe [00:56:30] ok... to be more specific [00:56:55] How do I set an entire namespace, usng the lockdown extension, to forbit all except bureaucrats, from reading/writing/moving? [00:57:06] I have a custom defined namespace called "Mine" [00:57:12] as well as "Mine_talk" [00:59:02] $wgNamespacePermissionLockdown[NS_MINE]['read'] = array('bureaucrat'); [01:00:17] <^demon> Where's CIA? [01:00:25] <^demon> Did it not rejoin after the netsplit? [01:04:18] Is there a reason one would not be able to search for a particular two word phrase while you can search perfectly well for another 2 word phrase [01:05:13] Emufarmers: Thanks, I'll give it a shot [01:05:38] Nuro: I just took that from the extension page. You should read it. [01:07:51] does anyone know [01:07:54] for example [01:08:21] API AcceptQuest will turn up results but but API GetInstanceInfo does not [01:08:36] they both are exact matches for articles [01:10:57] http://www.wowwiki.com/index.php?title=Special%3ASearch&search=API+AcceptQuest&ns0=1&ns14=1&fulltext=Search ----- http://www.wowwiki.com/API_AcceptQuest [01:10:58] http://www.wowwiki.com/index.php?title=Special%3ASearch&search=API+GetInstanceInfo&ns0=1&ns14=1&fulltext=Search ----- http://www.wowwiki.com/API_GetInstanceInfo [01:12:06] Anyone? Anyone? Bueller? [01:12:11] 03(RESOLVED) Closure of nl.wikinews.org - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20323 +comment (10cbrown1023) [01:12:13] Complain to Wikia [01:12:15] 03(mod) Closure dutch Wikinews - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20325 +comment (10cbrown1023) [01:12:24] Emufarmers: its mediawiki, not wikia [01:12:48] wikia has no customizations to Special:Search [01:13:03] MWSearch doesn't count as a customization? [01:13:58] that doesn't belong to Wikia [01:14:09] it was written by brion and some other lady [01:15:02] Well, gee, I guess you'd better demand your money back on it :) [01:15:22] So you're saying MWSearch is the problem? [01:15:36] if its not related to Wikia, the support belongs here ;) [01:16:14] No, not necessarily, but that would be an obvious place to look. That, and the hundreds of hacks Wikia has in place. And the fact that it's running an old version. [01:17:31] How often dot hey update their search index? [01:18:58] that'd be a question i don't have immediate access to [01:19:10] Sounds like a Wikia question :D [01:23:17] Otherwise, it'd probably be a rainman-sr question, since he wrote (or at least maintains) Lucene-search [01:54:06] How do i create a page in a certain namespace, specifically a custom one named "Mine"? [01:55:15] http://whatever.com/w/index.php?title=Mine:Page&action=create [01:55:26] or do a search for it, then click the redlink [01:57:15] OK. I created a page like that. So either my namespace doesn't exist, and I did something wrong there, or Lockdown Extension is broken. It's showing up when I'm logged out when it should be read only for bureaucrats. [01:58:19] Go to Special:RecentChanges; does it appear in the namespace selector there? [02:01:43] Not sure what the namespace selector should look like [02:02:11] it is a drop down selecty-thingy [02:03:33] Doh found the problem, I think. [02:03:46] Crashed earlier while I was editing and forget a require_once. Thanks, Mike_lifeguard. [02:59:12] Any recent modifications on what handles diffs? [02:59:18] I keep getting segfaults on that one. [03:07:52] *Splarka looks at his bugs... "show us where the bad dev touched you" [03:13:32] what's with the stupid user pages today on mw org? [03:14:58] User:Darshanah2 -> "I am a good painiter you are a good [doctor]...." [03:14:59] :S [03:15:08] User:Dragonwingsva -> "Dragonwings" [03:15:09] http://theinfosphere.org/index.php?title=Andrew&curid=9332&diff=49343&oldid=49342 [03:15:18] The error.log says PHP segfaulted. [03:15:29] User:Shilparao -> "fjljdslkgfkds;kg;kpdsg;sd,ljJOSDGK;DS, SHILPA SHE IS A BEAUTIFUL GIRL" [03:15:50] User talk:Drisyakrishnan -> "deshpande foundation Drishya DFP Non profits:" [03:15:51] X_X [03:17:58] *Splarka goes 1984 on them [03:43:21] 03straussd * r55405 10/civicrm/trunk/sites/all/modules/civicrm/ (398 files in 95 dirs): CiviCRM 2.2.8 [04:45:02] 03philip * r55406 10/trunk/phase3/maintenance/parserTests.txt: Add and modify parser test for new language converter rules. [05:05:48] I installed mediawiki on ubuntu using aptitude, but when I open http:/localhost/mediawiki I get a download...intially I thught php was't parsing, but I just tested with phpinfo() and it worked [05:07:28] I've also added the alias mediawiki in /etc/mediawiki1.10/apache.conf [05:07:37] so wht can be the problem? [05:11:12] probably the package :) [05:11:23] I tried it once, and immediately scrapped it [05:11:56] erm, actually, that sounds like apache acting up [05:12:01] but I have no idea how to fix that [05:12:06] Mike_lifeguard: oh...is it possible?...this is on ubuntu hardy... [05:21:30] rags: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/How_to_Install_MediaWiki_on_Ubuntu http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Running_MediaWiki_on_Ubuntu http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Installing_MediaWiki_on_Ubuntu_7.10_via_GUI_and_Synaptic [05:23:18] p858snake: Yes...thx...But I followed the same...aptitude to install apache2,mysql-server,php5 and media-wiki...then remove the comment on the alias in /etc/mediawiki1.10/apache.conf... [05:24:01] But when I open localhost/mediawiki, it comes up as a download, indicating tht php is not parsing... [05:24:24] but on the same server I have a test doc which gives me the otput for phpinfo() [05:28:16] doesn't make sense...how can a package fail... [05:33:59] Question for anyone involved with the semantic results format extension: any idea where the 'process format' can be found? [05:34:06] It's apparently experimental, but can't be found on svn [06:41:36] hello, gota question that i cant find the answer to... im wondering if liquidthreads is planned to be added into core? [06:41:52] Need some help [06:43:10] Needhelp1, given that it's currently unstable I'm going to say that it will not happen any time soon. But I can't imagine them not adding the system some time later unless something better comes out. [06:44:28] i wish mediawikis developmental process was more stream streamlined and involved the community more [06:44:36] *streamlined [06:46:30] Sooo....I still need a bit of help....got this error that....happens only when I use something that involves accessing hook.php and it is always close to or on the exact line..this has NEVER happened to me. In fact this is the same setup I have used countless times. So I'm completely at loss to what is happening. Anyway care to give me an answer to the error? [06:48:16] This would be the error Warning: Parameter 1 to incEditCount() expected to be a reference, value given in *****\w\includes\Hooks.php on line 132 (* added to censor where it leads to) [06:48:36] Only happens when I go to confirm an edit [06:49:27] That is what it looks like in Localhost. http://pastebin.com/d1c6ce438 Help would be very very much appreciated [06:58:43] So after no help from anyone here, the error is coming from this require_once("$IP/extensions/SocialProfile/UserStats/EditCount.php"); // Necessary edit counter [07:00:20] have you recently updated anything or is this a fresh install? [07:00:31] Fresh install [07:00:42] I even went as far as to use Mediawiki 1.16WMF [07:01:00] Which should work given that it comes with the most recent version of the software I have chosen to use. [07:01:09] is the version of the extenstion compaitable with the version of mediawiki [07:01:16] Came packaged. [07:01:36] and its generally recomended against using anything execpt stable (1.15.1) [07:02:44] I generally use only the trunks and this error started in 1.15.1 [07:03:00] And then seemed to extend even after I wiped the site clean and did a fresh. [07:05:29] This is note a personal wiki, it's for a friend. So I didn't use a trunk to begin with. I started using 1.15.1 then got snapshots of the 1.15.x versions of the extensions and used them. So after I put in SocialProfile..which works like 100% of the time it started giving me that error. Then it gave me that error with the Confirmedit and reCaptcha extensions. Anything that access the hook.php... [07:05:31] ...fails on that line, I've tried removing it only to get obviously bad results. [07:05:45] 1.15.1 (stable) plus http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:ExtensionDistributor/SocialProfile the 1.15.x version should work together, and i see no notes around saying otherwise [07:06:13] ....yeah I started with that...which is when the issue started..heck I hadn't even started editing at that time. [07:06:39] i'm also not that much of a expert with extensions so you should probably wait for someone else [07:07:40] I asked Dantman earlier....but no reply...how again can I tell when some one is idle? [07:08:42] basically you just have to keep popping in at random times or asking if anyone is around [07:10:16] Oddly enough, this is the very first time this has ever happened to me. This is the EXACT same setup I do for every install of the software..heck it's so basic I have a basic skeleton of it laying around with a readme. [07:15:12] what site could i use to hire someone familiar with mediawiki to install Lucene-search on a few sites? [07:16:24] try having a look at the mwuser forums [07:16:46] !support [07:16:46] --mwbot-- If we are unable to answer your query there are alternate avenues you can take to get support. There is a support mailing list , support desk on MediaWiki.org and unofficial forums . [07:16:47] thanks, will do [07:18:28] Hey, p858snake, what do you make of this? http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension_talk:ConfirmEdit#Locale_setup_problem Got it from here http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension_talk:ConfirmEdit#.22warning_First_argumented_is_expected_to_be_a_valid_callback....22 [07:18:38] Looks similar. [07:58:21] 03(NEW) Localization corrections and additions of Estonian Wikimedia projects - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20332 normal; Normal; Wikimedia: General/Unknown; (meepurk) [08:10:45] 03(mod) Localization corrections and additions of Estonian Wikimedia projects - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20332 +shell (10raimond.spekking) [08:12:06] hmmm thinking about cloning ^^ bug [08:15:51] 03(NEW) Timeline/Eventline need l10n - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20333 enhancement; Normal; MediaWiki extensions: SemanticResultFormats; (mail) [08:29:23] 03(mod) Admin not admitted, where admin right required? - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20235 +comment (10alex.emsenhuber) [08:38:59] 03(NEW) Create Author, Portal, Page and Index namespaces for vi.wikisource - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20334 enhancement; Normal; Wikimedia: Site requests; (vinhtantran) [08:40:49] 03(mod) Create Author, Portal, Page and Index namespaces for vi.wikisource - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20334 +shell (10alex.emsenhuber) [08:45:19] 03(mod) check if really can create an account, before advertising to do so - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19186 +comment (10alex.emsenhuber) [09:46:12] I'd like to report a sort of style bug [09:46:41] and what would this bug be? [09:46:55] when you have ab and remove b the changes window highlights a_b_ instead of a_b_ [09:47:03] text between _ is red [09:47:17] Simetrical: I've been using inline-block extensively, what do I do instead? [10:03:37] 03(mod) Special:UserLogin ,<h1> should check $wgUser->isAllowed( 'createaccount' ) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20115 (10jidanni) [10:06:34] <wikibugs> 03(mod) check if really can create an account, before advertising to do so - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19186 (10jidanni) [10:09:01] <Simetrical> werdna, floats, inline. Or try to hack around IE6/7 (maybe you can ignore Fx2 at this point?). Depends. There's no perfect replacement. [10:09:50] <werdna> http://wiki.werdn.us/test/view/Talk:Main_Page [10:10:00] <werdna> What do you suggest I do with that search box and search order thing at the top? [10:10:05] <Simetrical> If there were some way to do inline-block without actually using display: inline-block, there wouldn't be much point in it, would there? :) [10:10:08] *Simetrical looks [10:10:15] <werdna> They both contain forms, it's invalid to put a block element inside an inline element [10:10:27] <Simetrical> It's not invalid, it will just break out. [10:10:56] <Simetrical> <span>XYZ <span style="display:block">ABC</span> foo bar</span> <-- Totally valid. [10:11:22] <Simetrical> It will add anonymous blocks around the inline parts, IIRC. [10:12:09] <Simetrical> You should be able to do the search box with just floats. [10:12:34] <Simetrical> That might behave a little oddly if it wraps, at worst. [10:12:42] <Simetrical> But probably not too much, since these are basically fixed-height. [10:12:57] <Simetrical> Inline-block is mostly useful if things are variable-height and you want them to form nice lines regardless. [10:13:05] <Simetrical> At least in my experience. [10:13:07] <werdna> An ugh on floating [10:13:34] <werdna> CSS is annoying [10:13:40] <Splarka> use tables ^_^ [10:13:43] <Simetrical> No, lack of good CSS support in browsers is annoying. [10:13:44] *Splarka hide [10:13:57] <Simetrical> Convince Brion to let us drop IE6/7 support and things will be much better. [10:14:02] <Simetrical> Preferably IE8 as well. :P [10:14:09] <Splarka> and IE5? [10:14:14] <Simetrical> That goes without saying. [10:14:18] <wikibugs> 03(mod) check if really can create an account, before advertising to do so - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19186 (10alex.emsenhuber) [10:14:34] <Splarka> there are varying levels of "support" [10:14:54] <Splarka> obviously JS is expected to fail in very old browsers, like IE5--, and wikipedia.org is expected to fail completely in IE2-- [10:15:11] <OuKB> why not display a friendly reminder to upgrade to users with a pre-historic browser, like some major sites already do? [10:15:21] <werdna> You mean IE<5 and IE<2 [10:15:22] <Splarka> but IE8 isn't old enough to completely break form submission, as it does with JS enabled and jquery on mwsuggest, it is just old enough to have no JS support [10:15:25] <werdna> IE5-- doesn't work [10:15:37] <Splarka> er Opera8 [10:15:47] <werdna> If anything, you mean IE--5, which is IE4 [10:15:50] <Simetrical> OuKB, most users using ancient browsers are unable to upgrade. [10:15:53] <Splarka> so when you say "drop IE6/7" what do you mean/ [10:16:11] <Splarka> werdna: and yet you knew what I meant, go be a semantichole in your own time ^_^ [10:16:50] <Splarka> do you mean: absolutely no support (site won't load or be useable), "ugly" support (IE5 now), no JS support (IE5 again), or "mostly works" (IE6ish, Opera 8) [10:17:07] <Simetrical> I wasn't serious about dropping IE6/7 support, sadly. [10:17:26] <Simetrical> Our lives would be a lot easier if "ugly" support were acceptable for them. [10:17:40] <Simetrical> But it's not, really. More like "looks okay but missing some nonessential features if necessary". [10:17:45] <Splarka> heh, a {display:block} was fun in IE5 for a few days [10:18:13] <Splarka> http://www.memedepot.com/uploads/0/207_not_sure_if_serious.jpg [10:19:00] <Splarka> hmm, so if the fancy JS doesn't work, it should fall back to at least work and not look horrible? [10:19:12] <werdna> Simetrical: floats totally mess that top toolbar up [10:19:23] <Simetrical> O RLY? [10:19:24] <werdna> (just replaced display: inline-block with float: left) [10:19:27] <Simetrical> ur doin it wrong. [10:19:27] <werdna> YA RLY [10:19:28] <Splarka> like CSS/JS dropdown menus should just default to expanded for non-supporting browsers.. [10:19:40] <Simetrical> You need to make sure everything is floating and clearing that needs to be floating and clearing. [10:19:46] <werdna> helpful [10:19:51] <Splarka> heh [10:20:44] <werdna> Simetrical: why can't I say "This is a block, but I want it to be displayed without the line breaks" [10:21:03] <Simetrical> You can, it's called "display: inline-block". [10:21:17] <Splarka> or <img> ^_^ [10:21:29] <Simetrical> Or table. [10:21:35] <Simetrical> Hmm. [10:21:46] <Splarka> so, is table undeprecated for HTML5 for layout? [10:22:05] <Simetrical> No. [10:22:21] <Splarka> heh, still delusional [10:22:27] <Simetrical> werdna, you have a form instead a span already, by the way. [10:22:40] <Simetrical> lqt-talkpage-search [10:22:42] <Simetrical> Doesn't validate. [10:22:49] <werdna> inside you mean [10:22:52] <werdna> yeah I just fixed that [10:22:55] <Simetrical> Er, yes. [10:23:04] <werdna> now it just looks stupid [10:23:59] <Simetrical> Set a fixed height if you're using floats. [10:24:04] <werdna> seriously? [10:24:07] <Simetrical> Yes. [10:24:18] <werdna> Isn't there some saner way to do this? [10:24:21] <Simetrical> inline-block aligns them inline, so it handles vertical alignment for you. [10:24:25] <Simetrical> Yes, it's called inline-block. [10:24:29] <Simetrical> Didn't we discuss that already? :) [10:24:45] <Simetrical> You could test in IE6/7 and see if it looks acceptable. [10:24:46] <werdna> and you told me not to use it [10:25:05] <Simetrical> As far as I can see, it will display on multiple lines, since it will just be treated as display: block. [10:25:08] <Simetrical> Same in Firefox 2. [10:25:12] <Splarka> 1.sanity 2.fancy 3.mediawiki, pick 2 [10:25:16] <Simetrical> I haven't actually *tested* or anything, obviously. [10:25:18] <wikibugs> 03(mod) check if really can create an account, before advertising to do so - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19186 (10jidanni) [10:26:06] <Simetrical> Maybe you're lucky and I'm wrong. :) [10:29:00] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Special:UserLogin's title on Special:SpecialPages should not say "create account" if the user cannot create an account - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19186 summary; +comment (10alex.emsenhuber) [10:32:01] *werdna doesn't have IE [10:32:09] <werdna> I'll just see when I get to wikimania or something [10:33:28] <Simetrical> You're on Mac or Linux? [10:33:56] <Simetrical> ies4linux works okay for basic rendering in IE6. [10:34:00] <Simetrical> It tends to crash a lot, though. [10:34:45] <p858snake> ie5 for linux >.> [10:34:58] <p858snake> seven works in apprently [10:35:04] <p858snake> *in wine [10:35:22] <werdna> Mac. [10:35:29] <Simetrical> Yeah, in IE6 it just renders on three lines. [10:35:32] <CIA-70> 03werdna * r55407 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/ (classes/View.php lqt.css lqt.js pages/TalkpageView.php): Implement on-hover menu, includes a big re-tooling of the HTML/JS/CSS for the toolbar [10:35:33] <Simetrical> Not too terrible, actually. [10:35:36] <werdna> oh well [10:35:55] <Simetrical> p858snake, last I heard IE7 on Linux was very experimental and not really usable. [10:36:05] <Splarka> add a float in IEfixes? X_X [10:36:06] <Simetrical> I have a Windows machine here with IE7, I think. [10:36:13] *Simetrical switches monitors [10:36:32] <p858snake> Simetrical: not the linux clone one, i'm referring to the proper windows version in wine [10:36:49] <Simetrical> Oh, really? [10:36:54] <Simetrical> Wait, what? [10:37:05] <Simetrical> I thought IE is too tightly integrated with Windows to just be installed in Wine. [10:37:50] <Simetrical> IE7 is the same, it renders on three lines. [10:37:55] <Simetrical> Probably acceptable. [10:38:21] <Simetrical> Just keep it in mind for the future and be sure to test whether it looks okay. [10:38:22] <p858snake> its been a seperate thing since the lawsuit, although this is what i've heard though the grapevine so it might not actually work [10:38:29] <Simetrical> You could test in Firefox 2, that should give the same results. [10:38:45] <Simetrical> display: inline-block actually does work in IE, just only on elements that are naturally inline. [10:38:59] <Simetrical> p858snake, not separate enough AFAIK. [10:39:24] <Simetrical> http://www.tatanka.com.br/ies4linux/page/Main_Page [10:39:50] <Simetrical> ie7 support is labeled as beta. [10:39:50] <werdna> hmm, new interface works okay, but it chops off the bottom of the icons [10:39:53] <werdna> http://wiki.werdn.us/test/view/Talk:Main_Page [10:39:55] <werdna> have a look [10:40:05] <Simetrical> Given how unstable the non-beta part of ies4linux is, that worries me. :) [10:40:18] <werdna> also, that little arrow needs to be at the bottom [10:40:22] <Simetrical> What am I looking for? [10:40:50] <werdna> the toolbar that appears when you mouse over a post [10:41:43] <Simetrical> Oh, bleh. [10:41:53] <Simetrical> That seems gratuitously dynamic. [10:42:04] <Simetrical> You won't see the reply button at all unless your mouse is in the right place. [10:42:27] <Simetrical> It doesn't save much of any space, either. You could just have it next to the date, there's plenty of free space there on most posts. [10:43:42] <werdna> Well, it was Trevor's idea. We're just mocking stuff up [10:43:54] <werdna> I think it's a bit weird [10:44:15] <werdna> Other alternative is to give it 50% transparency usually and have it appear when you mouse over [10:44:22] <Simetrical> Didn't one of the people in one of the usability studies say one reason they liked Wikipedia is because it didn't flash and jump around and stuff? [10:44:29] <Simetrical> Why not just make it appear all the time? [10:45:14] <Splarka> *cough*, that's a reason I like it... *takes jQuery's animations out back behind the woodshed* [10:46:20] <werdna> Simetrical: the idea is to declutter [10:46:53] <Simetrical> At the expense of having things jumping around all the time. [10:47:57] <Splarka> http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/8394/ie5lqt.gif [10:47:58] <Simetrical> Having three or four little buttons isn't very cluttered. [10:49:35] <werdna> Splarka: trippy [10:50:14] <Simetrical> I really wish I could see some of this usability data that's being collected. Is there any detailed summary that's been made public? I didn't find much on the usability wiki when I last looked (but I didn't look very hard). [10:50:20] <werdna> Simetrical: well, it's just a mockup. I don't like it that much, will see what other people think [10:50:31] <Simetrical> k. :) [11:04:38] *Splarka has a treat for werdna if this works [11:07:24] <werdna> Splarka: if what works? [11:07:35] <Splarka> http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/3442/ie2alqt.gif [11:07:46] <Splarka> had to save it as a local file, since HOSTS header doesn't work [11:08:21] <werdna> haha [11:08:44] *Splarka pages down [11:08:44] <Simetrical> Where do you even get working IE2 these days? [11:09:00] <Reedy> wtf [11:09:04] <Splarka> had it on a CD, and am running an old Win95 box that seems to run it fine [11:09:07] <Reedy> Someone needs shooting for that [11:09:12] <Splarka> http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/3482/ie2blqt.gif [11:09:40] *Splarka shuts it down before it gets scared [11:10:12] <CIA-70> 03ialex * r55409 10/trunk/extensions/FlaggedRevs/FlaggedRevs.class.php: [11:10:12] <CIA-70> Pass revision ID to Parser::parse() since the result will be stored in parser cache and causes empty {{REVISIONID}}, {{REVISIONTIMESTAMP}} set to current timestamp [11:10:12] <CIA-70> Some sample result at http://test.wikipedia.org/wiki/FlaggedRevsRevisionID?action=purge [11:11:00] <Simetrical> Are we going to switch to edit links next to the section names anytime soon? [11:11:07] <Simetrical> (non-floated, I mean) [11:11:22] <werdna> Well, there's already a bunch of links there [11:11:34] <werdna> I want to put them into a menu, and then add a reply link to the right of that [11:11:48] <Simetrical> I meant for articles, not LQT, actually. [11:12:07] <werdna> ah :) [11:12:14] *Simetrical was just reading someone confused about WP:BUNCH on WP:VPT, again [11:15:08] <Simetrical> Speaking of which, I just wanted to reply to a thread there, but realized it was pointless since I'd never bother checking for replies, since I can only watch the whole page. :) [11:15:10] <Simetrical> Go LQT! [11:15:18] <Splarka> Simetrical: so just do eet (tm) [11:15:53] <Splarka> is there any way to adjust the html to allow it to float either way? I think it'd work with just the <span> above the <h#> text [11:16:14] <Splarka> heh [11:16:22] <Splarka> Simetrical: I made the mistake of asking for help there once >_< [11:16:32] <Splarka> so I watched it... [11:16:37] <Splarka> http://toolserver.org/~daniel/WikiSense/Contributors.php?wikilang=en&wikifam=.wikipedia.org&grouped=on&page=Wikipedia%3AVillage+pump+%28technical%29 [11:17:10] <Splarka> you're on the top 10 as well I see [11:17:26] <Simetrical> Yeah, I used to be active there. [11:21:16] <werdna> Simetrical: Actually, you can watch individual threads. [11:21:27] <Simetrical> Not on enwiki at the moment. [11:21:30] <werdna> Simetrical: And you get email notification and a new messages prompt for replies [11:21:36] <werdna> oh right, you meant on enwiki :) [11:21:43] <Simetrical> I assume enotif will be disabled on most WMF wikis, sadly. [11:21:52] <werdna> I hope not, but probably yeah [11:22:00] <werdna> maybe we can try to get it resurrected [11:22:13] <werdna> it's not *that* hard. [11:22:30] <Simetrical> 2000 e-mails being sent out on every edit to a contentious article is the major concern, I assume. [11:22:44] <werdna> Everybody else can do it [11:22:46] <werdna> we should be able to [11:25:06] <CIA-70> 03werdna * r55410 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/ (lqt.css lqt.js): Instead of completely hiding the toolbar when not moused over, give it some transparency. [11:25:11] <werdna> Simetrical: A lot of the inspiration for the LQT interface is coming from wave [12:16:18] <Guest34196> hi guys.. i`m trying to configure mediawiki to get groups and users belong that from active directory.. but it does not work... so i`m getting authentication with my AD user, but i need to use groups from AD too. [12:17:22] <Guest34196> i don`t know what is missing.. can you help me? [12:17:43] <Belegnar> hello [12:17:44] <Belegnar> may anybody help me with RecentChanges [12:17:44] <Belegnar> there is no diffs here http://zilant.konvent.ru/wiki/index.php?title=Special:RecentChanges&feed=rss [12:17:44] <Belegnar> how can i get diffs in the page? [12:17:44] <Belegnar> MW 1.15.1 [12:27:21] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Allow uploading of Blender 3D or COLLADA files to Wikimedia Commons - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1790 (10barney_holmes) [12:39:14] <TheCainer> hi, you've got {{#language:LANGCODE}}, is there also something similar for the countryname? [12:45:32] <Squidy> Does anybody here use mediawiki + Active Directory? [12:47:38] <flyingparchment> Squidy: there's usually someone on the mediawiki-enterprise mailing list if no one here can help [12:48:55] <Squidy> flyingparchment: ok [12:50:46] <kevindanko> Hello [12:50:56] <kevindanko> Do i need two seperate hosts to install Lucene Search extension? [12:51:06] <kevindanko> Can I install it in a shared hosting enviroment? [12:51:45] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) Images on secure pages should be secure as well - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20335 enhancement; Normal; Wikimedia: General/Unknown; (bmearns) [12:55:09] <CIA-70> 03werdna * r55411 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Delete replies to a top-level thread when deleting it. [13:03:23] <Evet> is it possible to change mediawiki theme? [13:04:03] <kevindanko> yes [13:04:10] <OuKB> !skins [13:04:10] --mwbot-- Overview: <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Skins>. Skin usage: <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Skins>. Gallery of CSS styles: <http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Gallery_of_user_styles>. Writing your own: <http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Skinning> [13:04:21] <Evet> thank you [13:36:54] <wikibugs> 14(DUP) Images on secure pages should be secure as well - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20335 +comment (10hartman) [13:36:57] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Provide SSL/HTTPS interface to upload.wikimedia.org and use it for SSL-served pages - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16822 +comment (10hartman) [14:04:30] <Besuglov> I'am asking for help with my installation of mediawiki. Is it enough to set $wgNamespaceAliases in localsettings.php to create Alias? It seems it doesn't work. [14:09:46] <G_SabinoMullane> HEAD seems to be using json_decode by default, which requires php 5.2. Should that be our new minimum, or is there some workaround? [14:15:25] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Please enable variant ShortURLs for Chinese Wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19019 (10shinjiman) [14:16:57] <Platonides> I suppose you could have an earlier version with pecl json extension [14:20:54] <G_SabinoMullane> Platonides: Yeah, I'm working on that, but the upgrader should probably detect the lack of it, and we should revisit our minimum requirements. [14:20:55] <Platonides> there's an alternative version used by the api [14:21:09] *G_SabinoMullane tries to puzzle out how to install the json pecl tarball [14:21:41] <Platonides> http://www.php.net/manual/install.pecl.php [14:25:19] <G_SabinoMullane> Hm...no pecl available on this version, nor phpize. Got pear though. [14:26:18] <Platonides> where did you get php from? [14:26:29] <Platonides> it may be easier to install a newer php [14:26:30] <G_SabinoMullane> centos default install [14:26:44] <Platonides> pecl could be on a different package [14:26:47] <G_SabinoMullane> May take this to #php [14:26:54] <G_SabinoMullane> yum search pecl shows nada [14:27:19] <Platonides> is it really failing without json_decode? [14:27:33] <G_SabinoMullane> Yep: [14:27:42] <G_SabinoMullane> PHP Fatal error: Call to undefined function json_decode() in /var/www/html/bucardo.org/mwp3/js2/mwEmbed/php/jsAutoloadLocalClasses.php on line 23 [14:27:55] <Platonides> try disabling the mwEmbed piece [14:28:38] <Platonides> there's another usage at ForeignAPIRepo but it'd only be used with foreignrepos, which aren't common [14:28:47] <G_SabinoMullane> How do I do that? [14:29:14] <Platonides> I think there's some way to do it [14:29:20] <Platonides> but don't really know.. [14:29:26] <G_SabinoMullane> :) [14:30:16] <Platonides> $wgEnableScriptMinify = false; $wgEnableScriptLocalization = false; ? [14:30:52] <G_SabinoMullane> Nope [14:31:19] <G_SabinoMullane> I'd rather focus on forcing json in. [14:34:44] <Platonides> comment require_once("$IP/js2/mwEmbed/php/jsAutoloadLocalClasses.php"); on includes/Autoloader.php [14:35:25] <Platonides> without $wgEnableJS2system set you shouldn't need it [14:35:28] <G_SabinoMullane> Okay, got phpize installed now, proceeding with configuring json pecl package [14:36:23] <CIA-70> 03shinjiman * r55412 10/trunk/phase3/languages/messages/MessagesZh_tw.php: *(bug 17742) Fixes inconsistent special page aliases for the Taiwanese language. [14:36:32] <wikibugs> 03(mod) zh-tw page names use many synonyms for URLs, e.g., <a href=BIG>LARGE</a> - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17742 +comment (10shinjiman) [14:39:09] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) Don't assume json availability - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20336 major; Normal; MediaWiki: General/Unknown; (Platonides) [14:39:49] <Platonides> that's your bug, G_SabinoMullane [14:40:01] <G_SabinoMullane> Thanks [14:40:53] <Platonides> good think you catched that [14:41:39] <G_SabinoMullane> Yep, nothing like running stuff on bleeding edge. :) Now to test against Postgres HEAD... [14:42:41] <Platonides> in this case, it was running bleeding edge mediawiki with old php 5 :) [14:42:58] <G_SabinoMullane> Yeah. CentOS is pretty stale with some things. [14:43:25] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Create Portal namespace of Bengali wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20314 (10jayantanth) [14:46:28] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Don't assume json availability - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20336 +comment (10roan.kattouw) [14:47:41] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) Oversight mailing list for the Simple English Wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20337 enhancement; Normal; Wikimedia: Mailing lists; (evula) [14:48:09] <Platonides> G_SabinoMullane, Roan posted a workaround at https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20336#c1 [14:48:31] <Platonides> in case you didn't get the extension yet :P [14:51:39] <G_SabinoMullane> Platonides: Got the extension installed, thanks. [14:58:15] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Oversight mailing list for the Simple English Wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20337 (10p858snake) [15:09:32] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Oversight mailing list for the Simple English Wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20337 (10evula) [15:09:48] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Don't assume json availability - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20336 +comment (10greg) [15:12:00] <gpled> anyone seen docs on how to move a wiki to another server? [15:13:59] <TheCainer> hi, you've got {{#language:LANGCODE}}, is there also something similar for the countryname? [15:14:02] <TheCainer> so for example: {{#country:uk}} would return United Kingdom (but that one doesn't work :p) [15:16:03] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Add checkboxes for revision deletion on Special:Contributions, Special:DeletedContributions, Special:Undelete, and Special:Log - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20189 summary; +comment (10mike.lifeguard) [15:18:22] <Mike_lifeguard> TheCainer: no, and I doubt that'd be added [15:18:48] <TheCainer> bummer [15:20:40] <Duesentrieb_> not to core [15:20:45] <Duesentrieb_> as an extension, why not? [15:20:47] <Duesentrieb_> would be trivial [15:39:45] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Ability to preview summary in "Upload file" page - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2537 +comment (10dale) [15:52:50] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Ability to preview vector/re-rendered images in Special:Upload "warning" interstitial. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16437 (10dale) [15:53:17] <CIA-70> 03greg * r55413 10/trunk/extensions/CentralNotice/SpecialCentralNotice.php: Fix some minor space vs. tabs issues. [15:55:10] <CIA-70> 03greg * r55414 10/trunk/extensions/CentralNotice/SpecialCentralNotice.php: Use the correct vars for not_start and not_end in the update. [16:00:18] <CIA-70> 03philip * r55415 10/trunk/phase3/languages/ (LanguageConverter.php classes/LanguageZh.php): [16:00:18] <CIA-70> 1. Revert my revision r55371. Since it may override logged user's settings. [16:00:18] <CIA-70> 2. Patch for situations that some wikis like zhwikisource may disabled some language variants. We should treat these disabled variants unacceptable in LanguageConverter. [16:06:02] <CIA-70> 03greg * r55416 10/trunk/extensions/CentralNotice/SpecialCentralNotice.php: Use properly formatted timestamp versions when building list of notices. [16:26:39] <svip> Hm. [16:26:46] <svip> What file handles diffs? [16:30:20] <svip> I am looking for whatever revision that fixes or ruined the diffs. [16:31:26] <Simetrical> svip, includes/DifferenceEngine.php [16:31:31] <Simetrical> Unless that lives in a subdirectory now. [16:33:39] <svip> O_O' [16:42:54] <Mount_Wiki> hi, i have a question. I customized a lot of the existing skins and language files, if i update, these will be gone i supporse? [16:43:39] <Mount_Wiki> is copying the php files enough? or are there a lot of DB modifications between 1.12 and 1.15 [16:44:24] <OuKB> !upgrading [16:44:24] --mwbot-- http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Upgrading [16:45:28] <OuKB> Mount_Wiki, if you want your messages to survive upgrades, edit them MediaWiki: namespace, not in language files [16:46:45] <OuKB> if you want to tweak existing skins, you'd better fork them under another name [16:47:26] <Mount_Wiki> ok, that might solve some problems idd [16:47:50] <OuKB> alternatively, create a patch, upgrade, apply patch [16:48:11] <Mount_Wiki> yeah, well the problem is that i have no shell access on my hosting [16:48:26] <Mount_Wiki> so i am forced to go through the webbased installation upgrade thing [16:48:31] <Mount_Wiki> and i am not liking that a lot [16:48:44] <Mount_Wiki> i;d rather prefer to just copy some php files [16:49:08] <Mount_Wiki> but i am afraid that there are some DB scheme changes between 1.12 and 1.15 [16:50:33] <OuKB> yes of course [16:52:22] <OuKB> http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Upgrading#Alternative_1:_phpShell [16:52:55] <Mount_Wiki> I have no shell access to my cheapass hosting, only ftp [16:53:03] <flyingparchment> what don't you like about the installer? [16:53:04] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) PDF Version - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20338 enhancement; Normal; MediaWiki: Export/Import; (jayantanth) [16:53:25] <Reedy> The installer wont reset everything.. [16:53:39] <Mount_Wiki> i know, but i cannot reverse anything if something goes wrong [16:53:44] <Mount_Wiki> i customized a lot [16:53:48] <Mount_Wiki> and a lot of plugins etc [16:54:18] <Mount_Wiki> imagine something goes wrong, and with no shell access, i could be stuck with a broken DB [16:54:23] <Mount_Wiki> and no way to fix i [16:54:40] <OuKB> have you seen my phpShell link? [16:54:42] <wikibugs> 03(mod) PDF Version - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20338 (10jayantanth) [16:54:50] <Mount_Wiki> yes, reading about it [16:56:05] <Mount_Wiki> btw, remember guys, one.com baaad hosting for wikis... [16:57:00] <OuKB> wikis need at least VPS to run reasonably (memcached etc) [16:57:42] <flyingparchment> you don't need memcached, any PHP cache works fine for a single server [16:58:19] <Mount_Wiki> well, mem is capped at 24MB on one.com, semantics plugin crashes a lot on queries... [16:58:31] <Mount_Wiki> cannot upload images bigger than 1600px wide [16:58:37] <Mount_Wiki> bad thumbnail creation [16:58:46] <Mount_Wiki> not so fun at all [16:58:54] <OuKB> by the way, why are there LocalisationCache queries being made from an unrelated API call? [16:59:26] <JDW> Hi [17:02:26] <JDW> Please let me ask a question about mediawiki security. I've just got hacked on my server (debian) and I know the attacker pass trough one of my website. I have some phpbb and wikimedia on it. I'm wondering if a previous vulnerability discovered in mediawiki allowed crackers to write in the /tmp folder ? [17:04:46] <CIA-70> 03greg * r55417 10/trunk/extensions/CentralNotice/CentralNotice.db.php: Use databases concept of a timestamp, not MW's [17:05:09] <jlhenry> Hi all [17:06:34] <jlhenry> I do not understand why the messages translations does not appear in our wiki. I wrote text for http://base.ekopedia.org/MediaWiki:Recentchangestext/fr (French) and http://base.ekopedia.org/MediaWiki:Recentchangestext (English). When I go in recentchanges, only english is used: http://base.ekopedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:RecentChanges&uselang=fr&action=purge [17:06:53] <jlhenry> Any idea? [17:06:56] <CIA-70> 03greg * r55418 10/trunk/extensions/CentralNotice/CentralNotice.pg.psql: Postgres version of the schema. [17:07:51] <G_SabinoMullane> JDW: Seems unlikely. What version was it? [17:07:53] <^demon> jlhenry: recentchangestext is only used in the content language (assuming english in your case) [17:09:24] <JDW> G_SabinoMullane 1.10 [17:09:53] <jlhenry> http://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:RecentChanges&uselang=fr Appear in French, http://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:RecentChanges&uselang=en in English, http://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:RecentChanges&uselang=it in Italian [17:10:45] <^demon> jlhenry: I dunno then [17:10:46] <G_SabinoMullane> JDW: *shrug* I'd be far more inclined to blame phpBB, their code is a lot worse. [17:10:50] <jlhenry> ^demon, Our installation is in English yes [17:11:38] <OuKB> jlhenry, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:RecentChanges?uselang=sq [17:12:34] <OuKB> everything but recentchangestext [17:12:35] <jlhenry> OuKB, I do not speak about the user interface, but the messages that are translated. [17:12:58] <JDW> G_SabinoMullane It's my point of view too but i prefer to look everywere [17:13:16] <jlhenry> OuKB, then how do you explain that it is working for "commons" as describe above? [17:13:50] <OuKB> commons is a multi-language wiki... don't know which settings control that [17:19:24] <OuKB> jlhenry, http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:$wgForceUIMsgAsContentMsg [17:31:46] <svip> Hello, brion-netbook and brion. [17:32:31] <brion-netbook> howdy [17:33:02] <svip> What's fresh? [17:35:27] <jlhenry> OuKB, I seems that you found it! :) [17:35:42] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Please enable variant ShortURLs for Chinese Wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19019 (10PhiLiP.NPC) [17:36:22] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) Allow using the pipe trick in log reasons - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20339 normal; Normal; MediaWiki: General/Unknown; (mike.lifeguard) [17:37:40] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Job queue estimate often woefully inaccurate; need a better strategy - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9518 +comment (10mike.lifeguard) [17:37:51] <Reedy> ^random numbers [17:39:44] <atglenn> :-D [17:40:20] <Reedy> Or [17:41:37] <Reedy> Its > 0 and < infinite [17:41:55] <jlhenry> Strange, $wgForceUIMsgAsContentMsg = array( 'mainpage', 'recentchanges-url' ); seems not to work. [17:43:35] <Rich_Morin> Is there a way to get a list of the tags that are being used for disambiguation on WP? [17:44:05] <Rich_Morin> eg, Foo_(bar) [17:44:54] <Reedy> Nope [17:44:59] <Reedy> Manual of Style, maybe [17:45:08] <Reedy> but thats only guidelines.. [17:46:45] <Rich_Morin> I want to disambiguate YARD (a Ruby documentation tool), as: YARD_(software) [17:47:25] <anderbill> Permissions Q: upgraded successfully from 1.11.1 to 1.15.1. Which files should not be world-readable? [17:48:56] <jlhenry> I have created MediaWiki:Recentchangestext & MediaWiki:Recentchangestext/fr and added $wgForceUIMsgAsContentMsg = array( 'mainpage', 'recentchanges-url' ); but it is not printing French message when using http://base.ekopedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:RecentChanges&uselang=fr&action=purge [17:48:59] <jlhenry> Any idea? [17:51:39] <CIA-70> 03werdna * r55419 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/ (lqt.css lqt.js): Revert r55410, apparently they like this one better :)) [17:53:39] <Platonides> jlhenry, if you created MediaWiki:Recentchangestext/fr, 'Recentchangestext' should be in $wgForceUIMsgAsContentMsg, not only 'recentchanges-url' [17:56:03] <jlhenry> Platonides, thanks but still not working. [17:56:14] <jlhenry> I have even tried this: $wgForceUIMsgAsContentMsg = array( 'mainpage', 'recentchanges-url', 'recentchanges', 'Special:RecentChanges', 'MediaWiki:Recentchangestext' ); [17:56:53] <jlhenry> I mean: $wgForceUIMsgAsContentMsg = array( 'mainpage', 'recentchanges-url', 'recentchanges', 'Special:RecentChanges', 'MediaWiki:Recentchangestext', 'Recentchangestext' ); [18:01:05] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) API loads unneeded things from LocalisationCache - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20340 enhancement; Normal; MediaWiki: API; (maxsem.wiki) [18:06:16] <jlhenry> Platonides, ... finaly I found my mistake ... A ",". [18:06:28] <jlhenry> I should write this: [18:06:29] <jlhenry> $wgForceUIMsgAsContentMsg = array( 'mainpage', 'recentchangestext', ); [18:06:31] <jlhenry> and not this: [18:06:33] <jlhenry> $wgForceUIMsgAsContentMsg = array( 'mainpage', 'recentchangestext' ); [18:06:42] <jlhenry> Thanks everyone! [18:07:47] <OuKB> o_0 [18:11:30] <CIA-70> 03brion * r55420 10/trunk/phase3/includes/ (Article.php LinkCache.php Title.php): [18:11:30] <CIA-70> Fix for wgArticleId being exported to JavaScript as a string instead of integer. :P [18:11:30] <CIA-70> Throw around some intval()s on page id, length data coming out of database into Title and Article objects and the link cache... blast PHP's soft typing! [18:34:53] <CIA-70> 03tparscal * r55421 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/UsabilityInitiative.hooks.php: Added support for outputting global javascript variables to the browser in a unified way. [18:42:20] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Today's Featured Article Date Problem - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18738 (10kingjpk) [18:46:27] <RickZilla> How can I insert the contents from a section on one page into a section on another page? [18:47:38] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Today's Featured Article Date Problem - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18738 +comment (10Platonides) [18:51:55] <mgrabovsky> !e Labeled Section Transclusion | RickZilla [18:51:55] --mwbot-- RickZilla: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Labeled [18:52:03] <mgrabovsky> !e Labeled_Section_Transclusion | RickZilla [18:52:03] --mwbot-- RickZilla: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Labeled_Section_Transclusion [18:52:36] <RickZilla> mgrabovsky: Thanks for the links, I'll check those out. [18:52:49] <mgrabovsky> RickZilla: just the second one [18:52:56] <mgrabovsky> RickZilla: the first is broken [18:53:04] <RickZilla> Ok, thanks for the heads up [18:53:45] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Enable Collection on Bengali Wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20338 +shell; summary; +comment (10innocentkiller) [18:55:28] <ekimmargni> hm, it should probably urlencode that :) [18:55:30] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) Crediting authors of OpenStreetMap maps - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20341 enhancement; Normal; MediaWiki extensions: Maps; (aude.wiki) [18:55:43] <RickZilla> Ah, it's an extension, I thought it was syntax that was readily available...like including an entire page in a section of another page [18:56:15] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Don't assume json availability - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20336 +comment (10innocentkiller) [18:58:47] <CIA-70> 03werdna * r55422 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/ (classes/View.php lqt.css lqt.js): [18:58:47] <CIA-70> Per Trevor and Brion: [18:58:47] <CIA-70> * Show the menu on hovering over the down arrow, hide it when leaving the toolbar. [18:58:47] <CIA-70> * Fix problem with icon display (change lqt-command-icon to just using the a, which now is display: block. [18:59:11] <mgrabovsky> RickZilla: that functionality is not available in core AFAIK [19:06:18] <wikibugs> 03(FIXED) Today's Featured Article Date Problem - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18738 +comment (10kingjpk) [19:06:56] <RickZilla> mgrabovsky: Thanks again, good info to know. [19:08:35] <CIA-70> 03werdna * r55423 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/lqt.js: Drop fade-out time to 20ms [19:09:35] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Relative URIs in interwiki links table causes failed redirects - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18664 (10brion) [19:09:38] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) Support for protocol-relative URLs - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20342 enhancement; Normal; MediaWiki: General/Unknown; (brion) [19:09:41] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Relative URIs in interwiki links table break interwiki transclusion - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19270 (10brion) [19:11:55] <CIA-70> 03werdna * r55424 10/trunk/extensions/LiquidThreads/lqt.js: Focus the textbox automatically when adding the edit form [19:22:37] <RickZilla> Is there a recommended extension that improves the editing toolbar in MediWiki? [19:25:16] <OuKB> RickZilla: UsabilityInitiative [19:25:50] <RickZilla> Just google that for the link? [19:32:19] <Simetrical> Wow, you can get IPv6 working by just sudo apt-get install miredo. [19:32:25] <Simetrical> That's pretty awesome. [19:32:40] <Simetrical> Even with no ISP support. [19:32:54] <flyingparchment> shouldn't need to install anything just to use 6to4 [19:33:16] <Simetrical> It's teredo, actually. [19:33:19] <Simetrical> Apparently. [19:34:03] *Simetrical leaves it installed to see what happens [19:34:19] <Simetrical> My machine is now apparently using IPv6 whenever available. [19:34:28] <Simetrical> Does any major site serve both A and AAAA records? [19:34:31] *flyingparchment is just glad to have an isp that does native v6 [19:34:59] <flyingparchment> Simetrical: google, but only to approved ISPs - probably not teredo [19:38:31] <brion-lunch> wacky [19:38:39] <brion-lunch> Simetrical: bugzilla.wikimedia.org does! ;) [19:39:23] <Simetrical> Heh, indeed. [19:39:35] <Simetrical> It's asking me to log in again, presumably since I'm coming from a different IP address. :) [19:42:23] <wikibugs> 03(FIXED) Some pages won't open on Russian Wikinews - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20320 +comment (10Ruslik00) [19:46:51] <flyingparchment> tbh, if i had to use teredo, i'd just not use v6 [19:49:29] <Simetrical> There's no actual reason for me to use IPv6. But I saw a Slashdot post saying you could enable it with sudo apt-get install miredo, so I thought I'd try it just for fun. [19:50:52] <CIA-70> 03nimishg * r55425 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/ClickTracking/ (8 files): [19:50:52] <CIA-70> JS click tracking! [19:50:52] <CIA-70> - Extension to track user clicks [19:50:52] <CIA-70> - table to track user daily contributions [19:53:49] <CIA-70> 03nimishg * r55426 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/js/plugins/jquery.wikiEditor.toolbar.js: click tracking enabled for toolbar [19:54:06] <brion> whee [19:54:26] <Pinky> zomg Big Brother [20:13:28] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Set custom upload URL for Bengali Wikipedia - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19418 +comment (10jayantanth) [20:15:38] <CIA-70> 03raymond * r55427 10/trunk/extensions/Translate/groups/ (MediaWikiExtensions.php mediawiki-defines.txt): Follow-up r55425: Add clicktracking to translatewiki [20:15:49] <CIA-70> 03tparscal * r55428 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/ClickTracking/ (3 files): Changed name of token variable. [20:16:20] <Simetrical> Looks like svn.wikimedia.org also uses IPv6. :) [20:18:04] <wikibugs> 03(mod) OOM on getting metadata for some OGG files (metadata reading hits memory_limit) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19476 summary (10brion) [20:18:33] <CIA-70> 03ialex * r55429 10/trunk/phase3/ (RELEASE-NOTES languages/Language.php): * (bug 20296) Fixed a PHP warning in Parser::preSaveTransform() in PHP 5.3: Parameter 1 was expected to be a reference but value given when unstubbing $wgContLang [20:19:00] <wikibugs> 03(FIXED) Language::getMagic() expected to be a reference - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20296 +comment (10alex.emsenhuber) [20:28:24] <CIA-70> 03ashley * r55430 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/ClickTracking/ (7 files): [20:28:24] <CIA-70> follow-up to r55425: [20:28:24] <CIA-70> *convert spaces to tabs [20:28:24] <CIA-70> *tweak doxygen comments [20:28:24] <CIA-70> *coding style tweaks [20:39:06] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55431 10/trunk/phase3/includes/Html.php: Don't escape >" in tag contents, no point [20:39:29] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55432 10/trunk/phase3/includes/Html.php: Correct outdated comments [20:39:49] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55433 10/trunk/phase3/ (3 files in 3 dirs): [20:39:49] <CIA-70> Switch from Xml:: to Html:: in a few places [20:39:49] <CIA-70> These should all theoretically be covered by the parser tests. All [20:39:49] <CIA-70> tests pass, the only change needed was to account for less overescaping [20:39:49] <CIA-70> in Html::expandAttributes(). There's no reason to escape <>' in [20:39:52] <CIA-70> "-quoted attributes, unless I'm mistaken and have just added some XSS. [20:44:38] <Techjar> hello [20:45:30] <Techjar> :P [20:45:43] <Techjar> omigod [20:45:59] <Techjar> bye [20:48:17] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) Set up parallel automated parser test run on PostgreSQL, SQLite backends for CodeReview output - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20343 enhancement; Normal; Wikimedia: General/Unknown; (brion) [20:50:49] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55434 10/trunk/phase3/includes/Html.php: [20:50:49] <CIA-70> Move validation logic from input() to rawElement() [20:50:49] <CIA-70> This way callers of rawElement() or element() will also get correct [20:50:49] <CIA-70> behavior. [21:02:43] <wikibugs> 03(NEW) when printing, monobook does not include rtl.css corrections. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20344 normal; Normal; MediaWiki: User interface; (hartman) [21:02:52] <wikibugs> 03(mod) RTL/bidirectional issues (tracking) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=745 (10hartman) [21:03:07] <wikibugs> 03(mod) when printing, monobook does not include rtl.css corrections. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20344 (10hartman) [21:06:23] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55435 10/trunk/phase3/includes/ (Html.php specials/SpecialResetpass.php): (log message trimmed) [21:06:23] <CIA-70> Only require necessary fields in Special:ResetPass [21:06:23] <CIA-70> This fixes r54567. That made the password fields on Special:ResetPass [21:06:23] <CIA-70> always required, but in fact the current password should never be [21:06:25] <CIA-70> required (existing users always might have empty passwords), and the new [21:06:27] <CIA-70> password is only required if $wgMinimalPasswordLength > 0. [21:06:29] <wikibugs> 03(mod) when printing, monobook does not include rtl.css corrections. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20344 +comment (10brion) [21:06:29] <CIA-70> This commit also permits passing array( 'required' ) to [21:06:42] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55436 10/trunk/phase3/includes/specials/SpecialResetpass.php: Don't output useless value="" [21:07:18] <thedj> brion: not sure if this is just with the "printable" version, or with printing in general btw.... [21:07:21] <thedj> i'll check. [21:07:37] <brion> printable version should print the same as regular ver :) [21:07:52] <brion> it just switches in the print stylesheets on screen [21:08:12] <brion> Any vegans need to specify dietary requirements for http://wikimania2009.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimania_Codeathon ? [21:10:12] <CIA-70> 03siebrand * r55437 10/trunk/phase3/languages/messages/ (18 files): Localisation extension for core messages from translatewiki.net (2009-08-21 20:59 UTC) [21:12:36] <wikibugs> 03(mod) when printing, monobook does not include rtl.css corrections. - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20344 (10hartman) [21:13:59] <acgt> Anyone know the status of Process Format for smw? [21:18:10] <CIA-70> 03siebrand * r55438 10/trunk/phase3/languages/messages/ (11 files): Localisation updates for core magic words from translatewiki.net [21:25:23] <CIA-70> 03siebrand * r55439 10/trunk/phase3/languages/messages/ (8 files): Localisation updates for special page aliases from translatewiki.net [21:26:48] <CIA-70> 03brion * r55440 10/trunk/phase3/includes/WebRequest.php: No need to store the value of the magic quotes check here; just use a local var for clarity. [21:29:06] <CIA-70> 03siebrand * r55441 10/trunk/extensions/ (128 files in 109 dirs): Localisation updates for extension messages from translatewiki.net (2009-08-21 20:59 UTC) [21:30:07] <thedj> siebrand: is there a way i can easily do a call for attention on a translation ? [21:30:38] <CIA-70> 03ashley * r55442 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/SimpleSearch/SimpleSearch.hooks.php: SimpleSearch: remove unused globals and initialize the global that is used [21:31:02] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Bad paging links in Special:Category - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19293 +comment (10alex.emsenhuber) [21:32:12] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Bad paging links in category pages - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19293 summary; +comment (10alex.emsenhuber) [21:33:18] <Simetrical> ARGH. [21:33:26] <Simetrical> WHY IS THE + OPERATOR FOR ARRAYS IN PHP SO FREAKING BROKEN? [21:34:32] <brion> haha [21:34:36] <brion> welcome to php hell [21:34:56] <brion> sometimes you want + [21:35:00] <brion> sometimes you want array_merge [21:35:05] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55443 10/trunk/phase3/includes/Html.php: Omit useless value="" in Html::input() [21:35:11] <brion> sometimes you can't figure out what the hell you want and have to do it yourself [21:35:32] <Simetrical> + should just work like array_merge(). [21:35:43] <Simetrical> Better yet, we shouldn't have one unified array type that's meant to work like everything. [21:35:47] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55444 10/trunk/phase3/includes/templates/Userlogin.php: [21:35:47] <CIA-70> Use Html::input() for login form [21:35:47] <CIA-70> This fixes some invalid HTML output in r54567, and also makes the output [21:35:47] <CIA-70> look more consistent and prettier. [21:35:49] <Simetrical> Although admittedly, it's sometimes nice that it's ordered. [21:36:05] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55445 10/trunk/phase3/includes/templates/Userlogin.php: Autofocus password, not name, if name is prefilled [21:36:28] <Simetrical> Why does account creation default to the name of the currently logged-in user? That seems kind of silly. [21:36:37] <Simetrical> Or, well, wherever it gets the name from. [21:37:00] <Simetrical> I think it gets it from cookies even if you're not logged in? [21:37:01] *Simetrical tries [21:37:15] <Simetrical> Seems so. [21:39:51] <CIA-70> 03nimishg * r55446 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/ClickTracking/ (ApiClickTracking.php ClickTracking.hooks.php): Make the user_daily_contribs table behave properly [21:40:05] <^demon> Simetrical: That entire thing needs refactoring. [21:40:11] <Simetrical> ^demon, it's awful. [21:40:13] <Simetrical> Like Monobook. [21:40:21] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55447 10/trunk/phase3/ (RELEASE-NOTES includes/templates/Userlogin.php): [21:40:21] <CIA-70> Don't prefill new account name, and autofocus [21:40:21] <CIA-70> It's kind of silly to prefill the name of the account to be created from [21:40:21] <CIA-70> cookies . . . presumably that account already exists. :) [21:40:21] <Simetrical> Some crazy "template"-based monstrosity. [21:40:34] *Simetrical looks for other forms to prefocus. [21:40:38] <Simetrical> Special:Search! [21:41:51] <Simetrical> . . . name isn't a required attribute for inputs? o_O [21:41:52] *Simetrical reads spec [21:42:35] <Simetrical> Oh, I see, that makes sense for JS buttons? [21:45:52] <^demon> siebrand: I saw your comment about "Must-try" :p [21:46:49] <CIA-70> 03siebrand * r55448 10/trunk/phase3/languages/messages/ (7 files): Localisation updates for namespaces from translatewiki.net [21:49:30] <siebrand> ^demon: yeah. No idea what to do with such a category... Don't all devs think *their* extension rocks, is awasome, da bomb, and must be in the "Must-try" category? [21:50:07] <^demon> It's absurd, IMHO. [21:50:26] <^demon> He started making it when the Industrialization crap started. [21:51:21] <flyingparchment> what is this? [21:51:44] <CIA-70> 03brion * r55449 10/trunk/ (7 files in 7 dirs): [21:51:44] <CIA-70> Cleaning up some old PHP 4 object-reference usage in some edit filtering hooks. [21:51:44] <CIA-70> There was a mix of uses of the reference and non-uses of the reference. :) [21:51:44] <CIA-70> Reverts r53714 and fixes it from the other end by cleaning up the uses to not expect references. [21:51:53] <^demon> flyingparchment: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Category_talk:Must-try_extensions [21:51:57] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Special:WantedCategories refresh date updates but contents does not get updated - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19969 (10malafaya) [21:54:26] *roberthl wonders why two of his extensions are in there. [21:54:32] <roberthl> They aren't even very good. [21:54:40] <roberthl> :/ [21:55:06] <^demon> Nor is his config guide. [21:55:29] <siebrand> ^demon: so we remove it? [21:55:30] <roberthl> can we just bin it? [21:55:33] <siebrand> indeed. [21:55:39] *siebrand is binning. [21:57:03] <^demon> Don't forget the subcat: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Category:Corporate_Must-have_extensions [21:57:09] <chasep_work> I have certain text (being generated by a custom parser function) that I have showing on all the pages in the User namespace. Right now I'm doing it by inserting the text via the EditPage::attemptSave hook, and I remove it via the EditPage::showEditForm:fields hook. This way its always at the top of the page and the user can't modify it. Is there a better way to just automatically include... [21:57:11] <chasep_work> ...some thing in a page? I couldn't find any hooks just for displaying like that [21:57:41] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55450 10/trunk/phase3/includes/ (Html.php specials/SpecialSearch.php): [21:57:41] <CIA-70> Autofocus Special:Search box [21:57:41] <CIA-70> Also generally clean up the code around there: add some line breaks, use [21:57:41] <CIA-70> Html instead of Xml (using new Html::hidden()). [21:58:06] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55451 10/trunk/phase3/includes/Xml.php: [21:58:06] <CIA-70> Make Xml::hidden() a wrapper around Html::hidden() [21:58:06] <CIA-70> HTML-specific stuff should go into the Html class; it doesn't belong in [21:58:06] <CIA-70> Xml. [21:58:22] <rainman-sr> don't we already do that, or did that? [21:58:38] *rainman-sr pokles simetrical [21:58:52] <Simetrical> rainman-sr, well, yes, using JS. I added the HTML 5 attribute. [21:59:10] <Simetrical> So it will work without JS in Opera and recent WebKit (Safari/Chrome). [21:59:18] <Splarka> chasep_work: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Header_Footer ? [21:59:32] <^demon> chasep_work: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Hooks/ArticleViewHeader - that hook might help too [21:59:35] <Simetrical> Eventually we might want to consider removing all this ad hoc JS hackery and make a generic function that autofocuses whatever's autofocusable if the browser doesn't support it natively. [21:59:39] <siebrand> ^demon: that even had another subcat (must have) [21:59:57] <rainman-sr> i see, nice [22:00:24] <brion> Simetrical: did you see my recommendation to ..... do what you just said? ;) [22:00:28] <chasep_work> what part of an article is considered the header? the title that is right below the tabs? [22:00:31] <Simetrical> brion, yep, I replied to it. [22:00:35] <brion> yay :D [22:01:05] <Simetrical> I don't think it's worth the effort unless $wgHtml5 is always true. [22:01:07] <chasep_work> if so, that hook might work [22:01:14] <Simetrical> Because if it's not always true, then we can't depend on the autofocus attribute being present. [22:01:19] <^demon> siebrand: His work on mw.org has been more annoying than helpful. [22:01:20] <Simetrical> So the script might not work. [22:01:29] <CIA-70> 03brion * r55452 10/trunk/phase3/includes/diff/DifferenceEngine.php: [22:01:29] <CIA-70> Revert r53710 "* Allow suppressing "line 1" from the diffs, which can get quite annoying with many diffs" [22:01:29] <CIA-70> Use of static variable here means that running multiple diffs during one request may mess things up. It should rather check if it's been added in $wgOut already. [22:01:30] <Simetrical> So we couldn't really replace the existing ad hoc JS focusing stuff. [22:02:04] <brion> Simetrical: well, we could stick autofocus in a class if not in html5 mode, and have the js check for either [22:02:11] <brion> though... that might be insane. ;) dunno [22:02:12] <Simetrical> Ugh. [22:02:32] <brion> stupid validation mania :) [22:03:39] <Splarka> <!DOCTYPE codesoup STFU-validator> [22:04:06] <brion> :) [22:04:41] <Splarka> html5 = autofocus, !html5 = tabindex="1" ? [22:05:27] <Splarka> and then have a function for every Special/action page form to apply that to the element most suitable? [22:05:43] <Simetrical> We don't want every tabindex=1 to be autofocused. [22:05:56] <Simetrical> Also, we should omit tabindex=1 if we want tab order to be in document order. [22:07:01] <Splarka> well, no, I mean, reserve tabindex=1 on actions/specials in nonhtml5 mode, to whatever element would be autofocused in html5 [22:07:07] <Splarka> and have the lowest be tabindex=2 otherwise [22:07:35] <vvv> Does tabindex=1 act like autofocus? [22:07:40] <Splarka> (and could even have some JS hint id="mw-autofocus") [22:07:59] <Splarka> vvv: tab tap takesya there [22:08:15] <Simetrical> vvv, no. [22:08:17] <^demon> siebrand: I think it's about time we come to a decision about [[Manual:Industrialization_guide]] [22:08:21] <Simetrical> tabindex=1 requires you to hit tab to focus. [22:08:36] <siebrand> ^demon: not aware of that page. [22:08:46] <siebrand> ^demon: still on janitorial duty. [22:08:46] <Splarka> which I quite like, you can freely scroll the page, or tab to the form which is the main focus of the page [22:09:09] <Splarka> would be great to go to reason on action=delete for example [22:09:33] <^demon> siebrand: When you get done, take a quick peek at it. It's from the same author as the must-have stuff. [22:10:20] <siebrand> ^demon: he obviously has something to say, and it's not all crap, but it has no place in the category system on mediawiki.org. [22:10:34] <siebrand> ^demon: he should blog, keep pages in his user space, or whatever. [22:11:36] <Annemarie> A tracking bug for user renaming seems sensible. [22:11:38] <Annemarie> Any objections? [22:11:51] <werdna> well, tracking bugs are lame [22:12:09] <Annemarie> https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=12969 [22:12:10] <Annemarie> Hmmm. [22:12:34] <Annemarie> This extension doesn't seem too stable. [22:12:46] *siebrand agrees with werdna [22:13:17] <Annemarie> 2007 is the tracking tracking bug, right? [22:13:22] <^demon> Yeah [22:13:36] <^demon> siebrand: Agreed. I just don't really want him in Manual or Help (most of his Help namespace edits were reverted). If he wants to talk about this somewhere that's certainly his prerogative, but it has no place in the official docs. [22:13:46] <Annemarie> Yes, yes it is. [22:13:47] <wikibugs> 14(DUP) "Changes related" has no rollback link - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18251 +comment (10alex.emsenhuber) [22:13:50] <Annemarie> Useful trivia, that. [22:13:53] <wikibugs> 03(mod) PHP Notice: Undfined index: page_latest in //includes/ChangesList.php on line 476 - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20131 +comment (10alex.emsenhuber) [22:14:49] <Splarka> <TheCainer> so for example: {{#country:uk}} would return United Kingdom (but that one doesn't work :p) [22:15:08] <Splarka> TheCainer: #language exists as a convenient way to access the current contents of Names.php, there is no reason to have one for country codes [22:15:29] <Splarka> just make a template for that, {{country|uk}} -> {{#switch:{{{1}}}|uk=United Kingdom|... [22:15:34] <Simetrical> RFC: should we bother specifying explicit widths for text boxes, in general? [22:15:44] <Simetrical> Like size="45" or whatever on inputs. [22:15:48] <Simetrical> I don't really see the point in most cases. [22:16:03] <Annemarie> Text boxes everywhere? [22:16:06] *Splarka sics jidanni on Simmy [22:16:09] <siebrand> ^demon: renamed to user space [22:16:21] <Simetrical> Hmm, the default size is rather narrow, it's true. [22:16:46] <werdna> Simetrical: well, the default size... yeah, right. [22:16:54] <werdna> Sometimes textboxes need to be wider :) [22:17:00] <Annemarie> I don't know what you're talking about when you say text areas. Deletion forms? Move forms? Edit window? [22:17:03] <Simetrical> Maybe we should set a better default size in CSS? [22:17:17] <werdna> you can set a default size in CSS? [22:17:28] <Annemarie> <input> supports style="width:" [22:17:39] <Annemarie> Though I'm sure someone will complain about that. [22:17:45] <^demon> jidanni. [22:18:28] <siebrand> ^demon: *sigh* http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Category:Corporate-friendly_solution [22:18:38] <^demon> siebrand: Already looking at that. [22:18:39] <siebrand> ^demon: he spent hours and hours on this. [22:20:36] <^demon> siebrand: Yeah :-\ [22:20:40] <^demon> I should've stepped in earlier. [22:20:45] *^demon is cleaning links [22:21:34] <siebrand> ^demon: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/User_talk:Al_Maghi#Should.2FMust.2Fand_more [22:22:39] <^demon> siebrand: Very PC, thanks. [22:23:03] <svip> PC? [22:23:08] <siebrand> ^demon: yeah, pc because he obviously has no malicious intent. [22:23:10] <Annemarie> Politically correct. [22:23:13] <svip> EW [22:23:17] *svip pukes [22:23:31] <siebrand> ^demon: don't wanna scare him off, but do want him to be worried :) [22:23:36] <^demon> See, this is why siebrand replied. I would've have been as nice. [22:23:41] <svip> PC is the most common excuse for lessening Freedom of Speech. [22:23:43] <^demon> *wouldn't have [22:23:49] <Annemarie> Entertainment Weekly. [22:23:54] <svip> I cannot believe MediaWiki people would support this. [22:24:05] <^demon> svip: Being politically correct sucks. [22:24:20] <siebrand> honey and vinegar [22:24:20] <svip> ^demon: Exactly! [22:24:44] <svip> But there is nothing wrong with being polite. [22:24:58] <^demon> svip: Like siebrand said, we're not trying to scare the guy off. Just discourage him from forking the entire install guide and present it as "The guide for installing MW in corporate environments" [22:24:58] <svip> And *that* is what siebrand was. [22:25:38] <Splarka> background-color:african-american; [22:25:49] <svip> uuu [22:26:07] <siebrand> interesting header... 'Ren Ways To Destroy a Hard Disk' [22:26:10] <svip> background-*colour*: black; *colour*: white; [22:26:11] <siebrand> ehr, Ten [22:27:15] <flyingparchment> ^demon: oh, is *that* what it was? that guy is rather unable to communicate anything clearly [22:27:41] <^demon> siebrand: Whee bug 15646...."MediaWiki page Manual talk:Industrialization guide has been created by Siebrand" [22:28:04] <^demon> flyingparchment: Yeah [22:28:40] <siebrand> ^demon: ialex got a mail from translatewiki saying I created User:IAlex when I changed his user rights. [22:28:56] <siebrand> (the page) [22:29:17] *siebrand blames Aaron. [22:29:22] <svip> ^demon: Sure that's 15646? Because this bug seems appropriate. [22:30:12] <^demon> 15646 Page creation notification email is sent when a watched page is deleted [22:30:22] <svip> ^demon: Terrible, isn't it? [22:30:28] <Platonides> I think there was a more general version of {{BASEPAGENAME}}? [22:30:38] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55453 10/trunk/phase3/includes/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Use Html::input()/autofocus a bunch more places [22:30:43] <^demon> svip: siebrand deleted my watched page. I got a creation e-mail. That's bug 15646 :) [22:30:44] <Splarka> http://www.mediawiki.org/w/api.php?action=edit&title=User:Siebrand&appendtext=%0A%5B%5BCategory%3ADevelopers+who+hate+industrial+progress%5D%5D [22:30:53] <Simetrical> Hmm. [22:31:01] <Simetrical> Should 'type' and 'value' be required in Html::input()? [22:31:03] <Simetrical> I'm not sure. [22:31:03] <CIA-70> 03simetrical * r55454 10/trunk/phase3/includes/Html.php: Typo in comment [22:31:16] <Simetrical> The defaults are used pretty commonly when you want to use extra attributes. [22:31:17] <svip> ^demon: What a jerk. Totally wanted to send you an email, but didn't have to courage to do it himself. [22:31:34] <Simetrical> In fact, it seems rare that you ever want to *not* use extra attributes for an input. [22:32:00] <Platonides> Aham, {{#titleparts:{{PAGENAME}}|n}} [22:32:03] <werdna> 22:23 < svip> PC is the most common excuse for lessening Freedom of Speech. [22:32:06] *werdna sighs. [22:32:41] <svip> Splarka: Is there an alternative for appendtext? e.g. adding text at the beginning? [22:32:45] <svip> werdna: You know it to be true! [22:32:47] <Splarka> prependtext [22:32:50] <werdna> it's not about "Freedom of speech", it's about not offending people. You have the right to offend people, for that exact reason. [22:33:00] <werdna> It's just not very polite. [22:33:04] <Splarka> svip, see http://www.mediawiki.org/w/api.php look for action=edit [22:33:06] <Simetrical> Well, in some places you don't. [22:33:14] <Simetrical> Some places ban, for instance, certain types of hate speech per se. [22:33:24] <svip> werdna: Not offending people is usually also being polite. [22:33:25] <TheCainer> Splarka, i only need the country-thingie for one page so far, so i can still manage by just writing the countryname. it was more out of interest to get to know the wiki better that i asked about it :) [22:33:26] <Simetrical> I mean on a governmental level, not even counting private institutions. [22:33:35] <Splarka> faire [22:33:47] <werdna> Simetrical: There's a big wide open space between politically incorrect and inciting violence. [22:33:47] <^demon> Which msg is the page creation e-mail? I can't find it on AllMessages [22:33:56] <Simetrical> werdna, not really. [22:33:57] <Simetrical> Very fuzzy. [22:34:02] <svip> Simetrical: Yes really. [22:34:32] <wikibugs> 04(REOPENED) "Go" search button is ignoring user's custom search namespaces - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11380 (10brion) [22:34:37] <werdna> Simetrical: the crime is not offending people, it's inciting violence [22:34:40] <svip> Simetrical: E.g. Hitler was awesome. Not very PC, I'd say - but where is the violence? [22:34:43] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Ability to attempt match in different namespace - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19862 +comment (10brion) [22:34:45] <wikibugs> 03(mod) "Go" search button is ignoring user's custom search namespaces - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11380 +comment (10brion) [22:34:54] <Splarka> Simetrical: <input /> is perfectly valid in xhtml [22:35:02] <Annemarie> Who said anything about violence? [22:35:10] <svip> Annemarie: werdna did. [22:35:31] <Splarka> (same for html5 it seems too) [22:35:53] <Annemarie> Ah, so he did. [22:35:55] <Annemarie> Silly werdna. [22:35:57] <^demon> Ah 'enotif_body' [22:36:03] <^demon> Silly multi-use message. [22:36:16] <Annemarie> Yeah, getting a creation e-mail for page deletion is rather goofy. :P [22:36:16] <Simetrical> werdna, nonsense. There are plenty of places where hate speech is banned even if it can't be demonstrated that it directly incited violence. [22:36:29] <Annemarie> Swastikas in the UK? [22:36:36] <Simetrical> Hate speech is usually defined to encompass a much broader span of speech than just inciting violence. [22:36:38] <^demon> Annemarie: I'm looking at fixing that now. It's stupid and has 5 dupes. [22:36:47] <Annemarie> Wheeee. :-) [22:37:20] *werdna shrugs. [22:37:27] <Simetrical> werdna, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech_laws_in_Australia#Federal The Act makes it “unlawful for a person to do an act, otherwise than in private, if the act is reasonably likely, in all the circumstances, to offend, insult, humiliate or intimidate another person or a group of people; and the act is done because of the race, colour or national or ethnic origin of the other person, or of some or all of the people in the group.[1] [22:37:27] <Simetrical> ” [22:37:38] <Simetrical> Nothing about inciting violence. [22:37:39] <svip> werdna: Like dening the Holocaust. [22:37:43] <Simetrical> Simple restriction of offensive speech. [22:37:56] <Simetrical> Look at Germany's restriction of anything even vaguely Nazi-related, too. [22:37:56] <Simetrical> Etc. [22:38:07] <svip> Denying the Holocaust is just another way of saying "I don't believe Germans are *that* efficient". [22:38:12] <svip> Jerks, everybody knows they are. [22:38:21] <Simetrical> Laws against hate speech are probably the single biggest challenge to free speech in the West today. [22:38:25] <Splarka> hey now, all the extermination camps were in poland [22:38:34] <svip> Splarka: ... run by Germans. [22:38:35] <Simetrical> Thankfully America has a strong constitution to protect us from laws like that. [22:38:39] <werdna> Simetrical: It depends on how expansive they are. [22:38:48] <svip> Simetrical: <_< >_> Yes... [22:38:49] <Simetrical> Sure. In some places they're not bad. [22:38:56] <werdna> Also, I imagine there's SIGNIFICANT selective enforcement. [22:39:03] <Simetrical> Which makes it worse. [22:39:24] <werdna> I would say internet filtering is a bigger problem with free speech. [22:39:25] <Simetrical> Selective enforcement = you get to arrest the people who are saying offensive and unpopular things while not touching the people saying offensive but politically correct things. [22:39:32] <newrkv> how do you change the color of links to pages that havent been created yet? [22:39:36] <Splarka> selective enforcement is fascism, you can bust anyone on any crimes they may have committed, simply because you don't like them [22:39:37] <Simetrical> newrkv, use CSS. [22:39:46] <werdna> Splarka: That's an exaggeration. [22:39:50] <Simetrical> Internet filtering is an issue too, but I don't think it's as big. Nobody's going to jail over it, after all. [22:39:51] <newrkv> which one do i change [22:39:55] <Simetrical> newrkv, a.new [22:39:58] <Simetrical> Or just .new. [22:40:01] <flyingparchment> werdna: no it's not [22:40:06] <werdna> It's a violation of the rule of law, for sure. [22:40:06] <newrkv> thanks [22:40:17] <flyingparchment> werdna: over here, the police can basically arrest anyone they like by making up 'suspcious' of something or other [22:40:18] <werdna> But it isn't fascism, although it can certainly enable fascism. [22:40:31] <svip> I miss the Second World War. [22:40:32] <newrkv> which page do i apply it to again? [22:40:47] <werdna> flyingparchment: yeah, UK is getting nastily overpoliced :( [22:40:48] <Simetrical> newrkv, add to MediaWiki:Common.css: .new { color: purple; } [22:40:49] <Simetrical> Or whatever. [22:41:13] <Simetrical> flyingparchment, police can always arrest whoever they like, the question is whether they can bring charges. [22:41:17] <svip> Simetrical: Purple?! I think you mean "European". [22:41:29] <Simetrical> I mean, theoretically you can sue them for false arrest or whatever it's called, but good luck. [22:41:47] <svip> Good luck? [22:42:03] <svip> I thought the police force and the justice system was separate. [22:42:04] <Splarka> by "you can bust anyone" I mean arrest, charge, and often convict, or at the very least, horribly inconvenience and reputationally destroy [22:42:16] <Simetrical> Well, if you have to prove that the arrest was wrongful beyond a reasonable doubt, that's pretty hard. [22:42:20] <svip> The latter is apparently extremely easy today. [22:42:24] <CIA-70> 03brion * r55456 10/trunk/phase3/ (3 files in 3 dirs): [22:42:24] <CIA-70> Revert r53600 "Add $wgSecondaryGoNamespace, used if an exact match is not found when pressing go - will try to find a match in a different namespace before performing a search." [22:42:24] <CIA-70> Revert r53618 "* Replace $wgSecondaryGoNamespace with $wgSecondaryGoNamespaces (taking an array of integers instead of just an integer), per code review of r53600." [22:42:25] <CIA-70> Revert r53672 "* Add release note for r53618." [22:42:26] <Simetrical> I mean, they just have to claim you were disturbing the peace or something. [22:42:27] <CIA-70> Per bug 11380 this should probably be using the default search namespaces or the user's search namespaces; an additional config array seems unnecessary. [22:42:27] <Splarka> pretty hard at the federal level too [22:42:34] <werdna> Simetrical: it's balance of probabilities. [22:42:35] <Simetrical> Your word against theirs, you can't convict them of anything on that. [22:42:46] <Simetrical> werdna, for civil suits, I guess so. [22:42:49] <werdna> Because it's a civil action afaik [22:42:55] <werdna> http://gizmodo.com/5303089/mccain-wants-predators-to-provide-wi+fi-for-iranians [22:43:11] <Simetrical> That's still also unreliable, though. I mean, it's a matter of who the jury believes more. [22:43:23] <Simetrical> Unless you have clear evidence somehow that they had no reason to arrest you, which is unlikely. [22:43:34] <wikibugs> 03(mod) Ability to attempt match in different namespace - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19862 +comment (10brion) [22:43:41] <Simetrical> But they have to release you very soon if they don't file charges, so that's the more important bit, really. [22:43:46] <Simetrical> And developed nations are pretty good on that. [22:44:17] <^demon> Annemarie: Ok, I've got a good idea on how to go about doing this. [22:44:26] <Annemarie> :-) [22:44:47] <Splarka> Simetrical: the spooky part is the federal level, where if they want to charge you, they just need a sympathetic judge (and will keep trying till they find one) [22:44:57] <Simetrical> What do you mean? [22:44:58] <Splarka> http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2009/07/21/heritage-house-law/ [22:45:12] <Simetrical> You need an indictment, technically, but that's usually a formality. [22:45:15] <werdna> 22:43 < Simetrical> But they have to release you very soon if they don't file charges, so that's the more important bit, really. [22:45:18] <werdna> Not in a lot of places [22:45:20] <Simetrical> But they won't bother charging you if they have no case. [22:45:33] <werdna> in Australia you can be held without charge for 14 days if you're suspected of terrorism [22:45:43] <Simetrical> Okay, so depends on what you mean by "very soon". [22:45:52] <werdna> they have to convince a judge every 3 days, but even so [22:46:01] <Simetrical> In America I don't think there's a hard time limit. [22:46:04] <Simetrical> It's case by case. [22:46:32] <Simetrical> Splarka, come on, everyone is guilty of crimes anyway. Have you jaywalked lately? [22:46:41] <svip> Oi [22:46:45] <Splarka> Simetrical: per my fascism argument earlier [22:46:58] <^demon> Simetrical: Does anyone else in the world actually have such an absurd law as jaywalking? [22:47:02] <svip> Jaywalking is illegal? [22:47:19] <Splarka> if you're guilty of a federal crime (as almost everyone is, technically), and someine in the government doesn't like your attitude, watch out! party like it's 1984 [22:47:20] <Simetrical> ^demon, . . . what? You're not allowed to cross the street against the light anywhere. I mean, that's what the light is *for*. [22:47:21] <svip> I know in Denmark that absurd jaywalking is illegal. [22:47:26] <svip> But usual jaywalking is not. [22:47:29] <Simetrical> Splarka, same for state and local . . . [22:47:35] <Simetrical> Hmm. [22:47:36] <newrkv> that didnt work [22:47:45] <Splarka> jaywalking isn't generally criminal [22:47:48] <newrkv> i added that code to the css file, and it still stays the same color [22:47:48] <werdna> Simetrical: It's stupid to put it into law. [22:47:50] <Simetrical> newrkv, try: .new { color: purple !important; } [22:47:57] <svip> ^demon: By absurd, I mean walking strange places on the street during traffic. [22:48:01] <^demon> Splarka: And it's quite possibly the least-enforced law :) [22:48:01] <Simetrical> newrkv, also try Shift-Reload to clear your cache. [22:48:04] <svip> ^demon: You know -- being an idiot [22:48:05] <werdna> Selective enforcement works in some cases, and doesn't work in others. [22:48:13] <Simetrical> werdna, well, not if you're disrupting traffic. [22:48:14] <werdna> One case it doesn't work is with free speech, I agree there. [22:48:18] <^demon> svip: Well strange jaywalking should be illegal. But jaywalking shouldn't, that's absurd. [22:48:30] <newrkv> that did it! [22:48:31] <Simetrical> It shouldn't be illegal to cross against the light when there are no cars in sight. [22:48:31] <newrkv> great, thanks [22:48:32] <Splarka> selective enforcement works for non-criminal offenses, littering, jaywalking, possession of drugs (where it is decriminalized but still illegal) [22:48:41] <^demon> Simetrical: Exactly! [22:48:45] <svip> ^demon: I never thought it was. But I do believe that using a national flag incorrectly should be a federal offence. [22:48:53] <Simetrical> But if you're getting in someone's way, it's fair to have a modest fine for that. [22:49:01] <Simetrical> svip, it no longer is in the US. [22:49:05] <svip> WHAT [22:49:06] <Simetrical> Used to be, but got thrown out by the courts. [22:49:11] <svip> Simetrical: OUTRAGOUS [22:49:19] <^demon> Then again, I also think red lights should be treated as 4-way stops late at night when there's no traffic. [22:49:32] <svip> Simetrical: At least my country still have the Royal Law of Flag Law. [22:49:53] <werdna> svip: Why should we punish people who mistreat a flag? [22:49:54] <svip> Simetrical: In Denmark you may *not* fly a Danish flag at night. If there are foreign flags as well, the Danish flag must *always* be higher than the others. [22:49:57] <werdna> What purpose does it serve? [22:50:05] <Simetrical> ^demon, they should have awesome AI or something that detects where all the cars are and magically turns them off if there are few enough vehicles. [22:50:15] <svip> werdna: Every purpose. It's tradition. [22:50:18] <Splarka> werdna: flag-bashing chromophobes! [22:50:21] <^demon> svip: Same here. Flying at night requires lights to keep it illuminated though. [22:50:31] <Splarka> flags have a right to exist like everyone else [22:50:31] <^demon> Simetrical: Minority Report. [22:50:32] <werdna> svip: "Every purpose" does not answer my question. [22:50:33] <svip> ^demon: Flying at night is flying for the devil. [22:50:43] <Simetrical> ^demon, kind of, except without the arresting part. [22:50:44] <werdna> You're just hand-waving and saying that purposes exist, without actually naming any. [22:50:56] <svip> werdna: Then I would undermine my own case. [22:51:04] <svip> werdna: There are no other purposes than tradition. [22:51:13] <svip> Also, we don't punish anyone for not flying flags correctly. [22:51:13] <Simetrical> Well, I don't object to tradition. [22:51:16] <svip> We just do it correctly. [22:51:26] <Simetrical> But free speech is typically more important to me. [22:51:33] <Simetrical> Depends, though. [22:51:34] <CIA-70> 03brion * r55457 10/trunk/phase3/ (RELEASE-NOTES maintenance/deleteRevision.php): [22:51:34] <CIA-70> Partial revert of r53641 "* (bug 19857) maintenance/deleteRevision.php on last revision no longer breaks target page" [22:51:34] <CIA-70> Unindexed query would scan entire page table. [22:51:37] <werdna> I'm with Simetrical on that :) [22:51:40] <werdna> for a change. [22:51:48] <svip> werdna: Since the Danish flag is the oldest state flag in the world, we ought to treat it with some respect! [22:51:50] <Simetrical> What, even the "typically" and "depends"? [22:51:58] <Simetrical> svip, how old is it? [22:52:13] <svip> Simetrical: Around 1200. [22:52:15] <wikibugs> 04(REOPENED) maintenance/deleteRevision.php on last revision breaks targeted page - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19857 +comment (10brion) [22:52:22] <Splarka> "oh yah, well sweden has the largest collection of captured battle flags!" [22:52:35] <werdna> France has the largest collection of white flags. [22:52:36] *werdna ducks. [22:52:40] <werdna> Stereotypes are fun@! [22:52:42] <Simetrical> I was about to make a crack like that. [22:52:44] <svip> O: [22:53:03] <svip> werdna: Unfair. When you are fighting Germans, you know you are going to loose. [22:53:22] <Splarka> hey, lets aim this convo back on topic [22:53:38] <svip> Splarka: What? Flags? [22:53:41] <Splarka> why does the US government release stuff under public domain implicitly, but other governments do not? [22:53:41] <werdna> nevarrr [22:53:45] <chasep_work> is there a way to prevent pages from being cached for only certain namespaces? [22:53:50] <werdna> chasep_work: no [22:53:59] <Simetrical> Splarka, because the US is awesomer. [22:54:07] <Splarka> is the Queen hoping all those polaroids of the sky the UK astronomers take will come in handy for her scrapbook? [22:54:14] <werdna> chasep_work: why do you not want that? [22:54:28] *werdna pulls stroopwafels from cupboards [22:54:44] <svip> Splarka: Not technically true -- governments elsewhere do release public domain stuff, they just don't call it that. It's tricky. [22:55:05] <svip> Splarka: The additional reason is that European privacy laws are a lot stricter than American privacy laws. [22:55:07] <Splarka> svip: by other governments I mean ones that matter, like the UK [22:55:11] *Splarka stereotypes too [22:55:14] <svip> Splarka: Jerk [22:55:17] <svip> ;-; [22:55:37] <Splarka> aww *gives svip a whole canned ham* [22:55:37] *werdna goes back to looking up ferry timetables [22:55:50] <werdna> Simetrical: You should come to Europe, if for no other reason than to be impressed by the railway system. [22:55:51] <Simetrical> Privacy is for sissies, like Europeans. [22:55:52] <Splarka> chasep_work: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:NoCache [22:56:04] <Simetrical> werdna, bah, it can't be better than the NYC railway system. [22:56:11] <Simetrical> It might go further, but why would I want to leave NYC? [22:56:14] <Splarka> you could have a hook add that to the rendered text (not actual source) of all pages in a namespace, or soemthing [22:56:23] <chasep_work> werdna: i'm using ArticleAfterFetchContent to insert predefined text into a page. Problem is, that method doesn't get called for a cached page. If I edit the page, after I save it, it caches it [22:56:32] <svip> Simetrical: Oh yeah. Let's not complain when your government is warrentless wiretapping your phone, kay? [22:56:37] *svip puts on sunglasses. [22:56:40] <svip> Being American is awesome. [22:56:40] <Simetrical> svip, sure thing. [22:56:43] <werdna> Simetrical: Just the engineering interest :) [22:56:50] <Simetrical> I don't mind, they won't find anything interesting. [22:56:56] <svip> Simetrical: Sure...? [22:57:01] <Simetrical> Pretty sure, yeah. [22:57:06] <svip> Simetrical: Did you ever consider what I planted in your car? [22:57:07] <werdna> chasep_work: You probably want a different hook [22:57:11] <Simetrical> svip, I don't own a car. [22:57:11] <werdna> try ArticleView or something [22:57:15] <svip> Simetrical: Exactly... [22:57:16] <Simetrical> I live in NYC, why would I need a car? [22:57:19] <Simetrical> . . . [22:57:24] *svip nods... [22:57:26] <flyingparchment> the UK train system has sucked since the conservatives privatised it [22:57:30] <chasep_work> werdna: any ideas which one? [22:57:47] <svip> flyingparchment: The French railway system has owned since the French started focusing on it. [22:57:59] <svip> The Danish is quite good as well. [22:58:04] <werdna> flyingparchment: Well, compared to US and AU intercity services, the UK train system is brilliant. [22:58:09] <svip> Though - often delayed. [22:58:21] <svip> werdna: What about the Swiss train system? That's *never* late. [22:58:22] <werdna> The only other one I've tried is the Italian trains, which were pretty good [22:58:33] <flyingparchment> werdna: they maintain the minimum level of service necessary to stop the government taking it back [22:59:18] <werdna> flyingparchment: It leaves much to be desired, but by and large I get around London and the places around there without too much trouble. [22:59:28] <werdna> Mind you, most of my experience with National Rail is going to airports [22:59:29] <flyingparchment> london is different [22:59:51] <werdna> ah yes, they assume that you're always going either to or from London [23:00:04] <flyingparchment> TfL can run a good service in all of london and still make money, because the entire region is busy [23:00:16] <flyingparchment> private enterprise outside london won't spend money on service to non-profitable regions [23:00:17] <werdna> prices are pretty nasty, though [23:00:38] <werdna> although I come from Sydney [23:00:58] <Simetrical> The brilliance of replacing public monopolies with private monopolies! [23:01:02] <Simetrical> . . . seriously, what's the point? [23:01:10] <flyingparchment> it's not even a monopoly [23:01:15] <Splarka> less budget waffling [23:01:17] <werdna> where we pay A$2.40 for a 40-minute trip into the city (about 1 pound, for a 20-30 mile trip) [23:01:19] <flyingparchment> except in london, oddly enough, where it actually works [23:02:10] <werdna> In return, we get half-hourly frequencies at off-peak times [23:02:33] <werdna> and slow trains. [23:02:53] <werdna> and our government would rather give everybody $1000 than spend the money building high-speed intercity rail. [23:03:59] <Splarka> Simetrical: reminds me of http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2871/is-nasa-the-only-federal-agency-that-makes-a-profit [23:04:16] <Simetrical> Somehow I'm unsurprised that you also read the Straight Dope. [23:04:22] <Simetrical> Masses of useless trivia, seems right up your alley. [23:05:46] <svip> :[ [23:06:09] <svip> Blah, where is GreenReaper... My solution to the Apache problems I am having are not pretty. [23:06:17] <svip> I currently have a cronjob that restarts Apache every hour. [23:06:27] *Simetrical wonders why he's making silly posts about Html when there are so many features to add and bugs to fix [23:06:33] <Simetrical> Okay, it's 7:06, I really have to go. [23:06:37] *Splarka feels vaguely insulted by that [23:06:37] *Simetrical goes poof [23:17:39] <CIA-70> 03tparscal * r55458 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/ (4 files in 3 dirs): [23:17:39] <CIA-70> Changes the logic introduced in r55269 so that unknown browsers are assumed to [23:17:39] <CIA-70> work properly. Also moved the definition of which browsers are supported to a [23:17:39] <CIA-70> globally accessible location so that developers have some options for testing [23:17:39] <CIA-70> things in unsuported browsers. [23:21:21] <Reedy> Am i right in thinking theres a bot that will do importing of help pages? [23:21:28] <Reedy> (to custom wikis) [23:21:32] <Reedy> Rather than export/import [23:21:34] <Splarka> oh come on, srsly? /trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/ClickTracking/ .. can't wait to see that on en.wp X_X [23:22:07] <Reedy> !help [23:22:07] --mwbot-- Hi! I'm mwbot, a bot that was quickly whipped up by Daniel Cannon (AmiDaniel) to help out around #mediawiki. Some quick help is at < http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Mwbot >, you can find all my source code at < http://amidaniel.com/viewvc/trunk/MWBot/?root=svn >. A dump is now available at < http://toolserver.org/~amidaniel/botbrain.html > [23:22:09] <Reedy> not that one [23:22:11] <Reedy> bah [23:22:30] <Reedy> http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Copying [23:24:03] <chasep_work> my last question for today: is there any sort of dynamic page that lists everything within a certain namespace? [23:24:15] <Splarka> !copying is The "Help:" namespace on mediawiki.org is available for copying. See < http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Copying >. [23:24:15] --mwbot-- Successfully added keyword: copying [23:24:49] <Splarka> chasep_work: Special:Allpages and Special:Prefixindex [23:25:05] <Reedy> having admin rights on the wiki would be so much easier [23:25:34] <^demon> Wait, turkeys got swine flu? [23:25:39] <^demon> So now we have Swine-Avian flu? [23:25:41] *^demon explodes [23:25:42] <chasep_work> thankyou [23:25:49] <Splarka> heh ^demon, I just had a bad idea (not related to your flu) [23:26:11] <Splarka> those silly "redirects here: WP:FOO" on en.wp, could have similar on mw.org for bot aliases [23:26:19] <Splarka> like [!copying] in a floating div on http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Copying [23:26:50] <^demon> Splarka: Yay do it. [23:26:57] <Splarka> and an autogenerated !e for extensions and !wg for configs [23:27:14] <Splarka> ^demon the problem is, it would be bad to have it in Help: namespace [23:27:27] <^demon> We'll only put it on Manual pages then. [23:27:31] <^demon> Or anything not in Help. [23:27:49] <^demon> And make it auto-cat into [[Category:Mwbot_linked]], too :) [23:28:18] <Splarka> hmm, well that'd be silly for Extensions for example [23:29:17] <^demon> Well, I wouldn't put !e Foo on every extension page. [23:29:47] <^demon> Or !man Bar on every manual page. Just pages that are linked directly from a specific !bang. [23:29:50] <^demon> Like !shorturl [23:30:05] <Splarka> hmm [23:33:50] <Splarka> -->{{#ifeq:{{NAMESPACE}}|{{ns:102}}|{{col sep}} colspan="2" style="text-align:center;" {{!}} '''bot macro:''' <tt>!e {{PAGENAME}}</tt>}} [23:33:52] <CIA-70> 03demon * r55459 10/trunk/phase3/ (5 files in 3 dirs): (bug 15646) Page creation notification email is sent when a watched page is deleted [23:33:53] <Splarka> but it would be so easy [23:34:17] <wikibugs> 03(FIXED) Page creation notification email is sent when a watched page is deleted - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=15646 +comment (10innocentkiller) [23:34:20] <^demon> \o. [23:36:52] <CIA-70> 03nimishg * r55460 10/trunk/extensions/UsabilityInitiative/ClickTracking/ (4 files): We decided to have 3 levels of granularity instead of just recording user contributions per 6 month period. We get to sift through the data later and figure out which one (if any) was the most useful [23:38:30] <p858snake> Splarka: wouldn't the privacy policy forbid them using anything like that anyway [23:38:46] <p858snake> in ref to the click tracking [23:46:12] <Splarka> p858snake: OMG why do you hate usability! [23:46:25] <p858snake> because it's evil \o/ [23:48:14] <p858snake> it makes it easier for the less intelligent to do stuff <.< [23:57:24] <wikibugs> 03(mod) PDF prints don't join Arabic letters properly - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19830 +comment (10hartman) [23:58:50] <Splarka> p858snake: amen