[00:50:26] damn, broke Lua again somehow [02:56:20] Is there anyway to include a literal question mark (?) or equals sign (=) in a link via wiki Markup? I'm depending heavily on the fact that I can do so. [02:58:24] They continue to become encoded, so if I wanted to link to Special:Test?type=4, it tries to link to a page literally named Special:Test%3Ftype%3D4 [05:35:58] Hi, i dwonload the media wiki and want to run this on a server. but i have problem [05:36:04] please help me [05:36:53] what is the problem? [05:37:11] could you please remot eand see the prole, [05:37:13] could you please remot eand see the prolem [05:37:15] ? [05:37:31] i confused realy:( [05:37:55] what have you done so far? [05:38:50] i just download the mediawiki and unzip the file and find the path of index.php and use this link in ie [05:38:55] but bothing happened [05:39:05] i downlaod PHP and SQL server also [05:39:08] but nothing [05:39:14] please help me [05:41:00] you need to configure these programs to work together; it's not enough to just install them [05:41:15] nothing happened? [05:41:44] you're using windows, right? [05:41:52] yes [05:41:59] i use windows 7 [05:42:10] please remote and i can show you [05:42:20] have you tried following these instructions? https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Running_MediaWiki_on_Windows [05:42:47] i used the instruction in your webiste [05:42:59] the first setp is to run index.php in ie [05:43:05] but it is not working [05:43:37] no, that's not the first step [05:43:51] there's a video of someone configuring mediawiki on windows here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FkSfC1GLOc0 [05:45:55] i folowded the ways in video [05:45:58] but i can not [05:46:04] please i send you my user and pass [05:46:12] in teamviewer [05:46:15] please connect [05:46:16] ok? [05:46:39] no, sorry. i'd rather not. [05:46:46] why? [05:46:53] but it is too force for us [05:46:59] please help me find the way [05:49:33] where are you? [07:24:50] hi [07:25:15] i have trying to install the wiki [07:25:28] dering the installaton [07:25:33] show error [07:25:38] DB connection failed [07:25:51] i use XCAMP softwrae to run MYSQL [07:25:56] what should i do now? [07:27:34] DB Connection error [07:36:14] why no answer [07:44:30] i face DB connection error? [07:44:43] Hi. A thumbnail did not generate properly due to an ImageMagick issue. I fixed the issue, but it seems that my wiki is not attempting to regenerate the thumbnail. Is there a cache or something I can clear? [07:45:04] what?? [07:46:07] i do not understand? [07:47:56] DB connection error, what do it mean? [07:52:03] action=purge, yes [07:52:33] action=purge??? [07:52:38] i do not see these [07:54:14] Can Revision::newFromid() return deleted page revisions ? [08:00:06] sasan: no idea what's XCAMP in this context but you should probably ask them how to setup the DB, it's a requirement for MediaWiki [08:04:06] hi [08:04:23] i have problem with DB connections [08:08:16] !ask | sasan [08:08:16] sasan: Please feel free to ask your question: if anybody who knows the answer is around, they will surely reply. Don't ask for help or for attention before actually asking your question, that's just a waste of time – both yours and everybody else's. :) [08:09:11] sasan: Where are you installing? What is the exact error message text? [08:09:43] DB connection [08:09:46] fails [08:09:54] i do not how to use it [08:10:38] how can i send photo to you? [08:12:02] sasan: I do not want any photos from you. [08:12:41] DB connestion error, access denied. i used XAMPP software for running SQL [08:12:50] it need user name and pass [08:13:05] each i set, DB connection error shows [08:13:10] understand what i mean? [08:24:04] find my problem? [08:24:53] DB connestion error, access denied. i used XAMPP software for running SQL, it need user name and pass [08:25:00] where i should enter my user and pass [08:25:01] ? [08:30:29] sasan: Following these instructions, at what point does the error show: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Running_MediaWiki_on_Windows [08:30:55] connection to database [08:31:03] in istalling the wiki [08:31:44] sasan: What line is that in the Manual:Running_MediaWiki_on_Windows ? [08:33:27] tale: when i setup the wekidi [08:33:47] in thrid page it need the data of SQL, like user name and password [08:33:57] how can i find out that? [08:34:13] sasan: So, in reality you have not done the installation following the instructions in that manual? [08:34:13] each i entered, show me error in connecting to database [08:34:48] i folowed the instruction, belive in me [08:34:55] i use XAMPP software [08:35:56] sasan: The user name and password were set up during the installation of MySQL, or you need to create database user and set a password. Nobody here can know what passwords are in you db installation. [08:37:43] i use XAMPP software, how could i find out its user name and pass word. nothing want me to enter when installing XAMPP software [08:40:23] sasan: Since you have not used that Manual, how about following this: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Installing_MediaWiki_on_XAMPP [08:49:27] tale: please see [08:49:28] phpMyAdmin tried to connect to the MySQL server, and the server rejected the connection. You should check the host, username and password in your configuration and make sure that they correspond to the information given by the administrator of the MySQL server. [08:49:48] this error occur when i press PHP admin regarding to your manual [08:50:21] sasan: sounds like a problem with you setup of mysql or phpmyadmin. you should do what the error message suggests [08:50:22] sasan: Did you write down the username and password you created? [08:50:25] this has nothing to do with mediawiki [08:50:48] i do not created any user and pass [08:50:55] there is nothing about it [08:50:59] in your manual [08:51:06] sasan: Yes there is. [08:51:14] where? [08:51:18] could you show me? [08:52:02] sasan: "Click Add a new user" [08:52:29] tale: in order to do that, you need to have phpmyadmin to be connected to the db. using a user name and password (the root user, probably) [08:52:49] but susan sais phpmyadmin doesn't have the right credentials. [08:52:52] yes, i can not connect to it [08:53:23] i can not connect it. if i press PHP admin [08:53:44] sasan: try "root" as the user name, and no password (leave the field blank). if that doesn ot work, google for instructions for setting/resetting the mysql root password [08:54:18] in where i should enter the user name and password? [08:54:26] PHPadmin? [08:54:34] yes [08:54:50] but it show error when i press it [08:54:53] nothing shown [08:55:37] if i could send you photo, i will show you the error? [08:56:09] btw, 1 h ago: 10.00 < Nemo_bis> sasan: no idea what's XCAMP in this context but you should probably ask them how to setup the DB, it's a requirement for MediaWiki [08:56:42] ask who?? [08:57:17] sasan: lean about setting up mysql and phpmyadmin. xampp should make this simple. this has nothing to do with mediawiki, so this is not the best place to ask questions. #mysql may be better. [08:58:12] Ok, thanks:-) [08:58:13] sasan: or XCAMP? whoever/whatever that is. [08:59:11] sasan: whoever produces this XCAMP thing, they probably have a website or IRC channel or mailing list [08:59:43] i downlaod from the link your manual suggest me [08:59:50] i use that link to downlaod it [09:00:56] now who could i connect the supports XAMPP [09:00:57] ? [09:05:49] MySQL has webchat channel? [09:05:56] or XCMPP?? [09:14:03] i reinstall it [09:14:07] but same problem [09:15:17] You were already told the channel "#mysql may be better." [09:30:38] why no body answer me:( [09:35:17] i have problem with XCMPP software for running media wiki [09:35:24] i do not kno what should i do? [09:35:48] sasan: https://www.apachefriends.org/community.html [09:39:26] it has IRC channel i should talk to them, it need their confirmation [09:45:46] Hello there! [09:46:12] I'm writing an extensions which makes use of mArticleID [09:46:18] But this always returns -1 [09:46:21] Is this normal? [09:54:52] hi [09:55:01] i can not connect to XCMPP [09:56:19] they do not answer me [09:57:52] sasan_: You have connected to the channel. But is your software XAMPP or XCMPP or something else? [09:58:30] XCMPP [09:58:38] my software is XCMPP [09:58:46] i conenct to their channel [10:00:07] tale: where are you? [10:00:20] tale: I am right here. [10:01:37] sasan_: If what you have installed really is XCMPP, then the #Apachefriends channel is a wrong place. That is for XAMPP. [10:03:03] sorry it is AMPP [10:03:24] so sorry it is AMPP [10:04:06] let me know theXAMPP [10:04:51] tale: please tell me [10:08:33] sasan_: You have to install MySQL in such a way that you know what usernames and passwords the installation creates. [10:09:04] sasan_: But that is not a Mediawiki problem, you should not continue asking about that on this channel. [10:12:14] but you before worked with that [10:12:29] you may know it [10:14:55] does some mediawiki sysop here? [10:18:47] Ok i'm a sysop in Chinese wikipedia and found someone post an advertisement on MediaWiki [10:19:11] [[万达电影乐园]] [10:20:25] Just use {{delete}} next time [10:20:40] THX [10:21:46] Well... I don't know there has the same template like zhwp... [10:24:22] {{delete}} redirects to the local templace in all Wikimedia projects since 2008 or earlier [10:27:27] THX [10:50:43] hello [10:51:09] hi [10:52:25] do you know of any mediawiki extension that allows for searching the content of pdf dcuments word and other common document formats ? [11:00:03] How do i redirect to a page like index.php?title=x&action=y&...... ? [11:48:57] hi, I'm the webmaster of a MediaWiki installation, but my user account has no sysop privileges, I think [11:49:09] my account was created by the former wiki creator [11:49:16] but I have access to all the wiki files [11:49:26] can you access the database? [11:49:36] I was trying to edit MediaWiki:Licenses but it says the page is protected and I can only view the source [11:49:41] yes, I can access the database [11:49:50] so I would like to make myself a sysop [11:49:54] !createandpromote [11:49:54] To recreate the admin user, run "php maintenance/createAndPromote.php" on the command line. [11:50:07] oh, I have no command-line though [11:50:08] You can use that script to grant an existing user sysop [11:50:16] I have MySQL access and can use FTP [11:52:39] I see a wiki_user_groups table, with "ug_user" 1, 1, 2, 3; respectively "ug_group" bureaucrat, sysop, sysop, sysop [11:52:55] and a wiki_user_rights with ur_user and ur_rights [11:53:02] Right [11:53:08] not sure what to do though [11:53:11] What version of mediawiki? [11:53:16] the users_rights table is old [11:53:34] Like, it only existed in 1.4 [11:53:43] But you want to add a row to user_groups with userid of your user and 'sysop' [11:54:02] thanks, I'll do the latter [11:54:44] INSERT INTO `wiki_user_groups` VALUES ('6', 'sysop'); [11:54:51] I have user_id 6 [11:55:15] norbert, please check your MediaWiki version [11:55:23] where can I check it? [11:55:29] I was looking for it after Reedy asked [11:55:39] Special:Version [11:55:45] or includes/DefaultSettings.php [11:55:56] 1.19.1 [11:56:08] I should probably update, right? :D [11:56:18] norbert, you need 1.19.17 [11:56:31] what for? [11:56:40] I mean, I can run the query I just mentioned to get sysop access, right? [11:56:49] Um, what about not having your wiki compromised? [11:56:54] right [11:57:23] so much work, just want to edit the wiki, sorry for being lazy; I will update it today [11:58:36] But yes, you can just run the query [12:04:12] Sometimes I think people would take updating more seriously if I demonstrated public, fixed vulnerabilities on their wiki. [12:04:24] But that could be risky, so ... [12:05:09] personally, I do take it very seriously, as I wrote I'll update it today, but the problem I think is mostly that updating webbased applications tends to be annoying work [12:05:24] I'm also a phpBB admin and it can be a real pain to update that thing, with the permissions and whatnot [12:05:46] so many things I could be doing that are more enjoyable :) [12:06:24] It shouldn't be too bad... [12:06:35] Krenair: well, you just need to pick something that's non destructive... :P [12:07:08] Granted, we don't have many major things like SQL injection so dropping page isn't an option [12:08:40] Yeah, well we still have things like XSS caused by the input of any random user [12:10:35] e.g. https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=63251 https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53320 [12:10:47] the default thumbsize (2) is very small IMO, just 180px; even when I use 5 (300px) it's probably smaller than Wikipedia has? [12:12:27] anyways, things are really coming along now that I've enabled (image) uploading [12:12:36] makes things a lot more pleasant to look at with images here and there [12:14:39] so, is there any way I can get all Wikipedia templates with a single press of a button ;) like Template:Non-free web screenshot [12:14:57] because I feel like adding all the dozens of templates I'm used to working with [12:15:25] even cite web seems to be empty? [12:15:42] auch, gotta have that [12:16:11] Krenair: will updating give me the cite web template? [12:16:19] No [12:16:21] norbert, a lot of them depend on extensions like ParserFunctions and Scribunto [12:16:24] The template is well, a template [12:16:25] o.O [12:16:30] !export [12:16:30] To export pages from a wiki, navigate to Special:Export on the wiki, type in the names of the pages to export, and hit "export". See for an example of this form. See also: !import [12:16:40] Even export won't help you there [12:17:07] so... allowing people to add citations to this new MediaWiki, how much work is that going to be? [12:17:33] should I start with a basic Wikipedia fork maybe? [12:17:45] man, never knew it was this complicated [12:18:52] or should I try to copy-paste the cite web template and then see what it relies on and keep adding stuff? that might work, maybe? [12:20:39] also, without access to Apache, could I easily remove the "index.php?title=" portion (maybe changes to .htaccess)? [12:21:13] hm, never mind that last question, I need to start with the citations [12:21:58] there's a page or two dedicated to doing things like that on mediawiki.org [12:22:22] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Short_URL [12:28:47] norbert: use [[Special:Export]] and [[Special:Import]] for templates [12:35:31] hm... I first tried the short URL by hand and got a 404 page, then tried the "MediaWiki ShortURL Builder" (which is awesome to have) but still get a 404 Not Found [12:35:43] I picked "I don't have root access, please use .htaccess files." [12:36:02] pretty sure I changed LocalSettings.php and .htaccess correctly, and both at the correct location [12:36:26] I also think the RewriteEngine can be enabled [12:37:11] it forwards from /w/index.php?title=Main_Page to /wiki/Main_Page so that's correct [12:39:33] when I put it in the .htaccess at ./ it forwards even the main website and not just /w/* stuff to the wiki/ [12:39:57] *abort abort* :) [12:40:50] alright, got it to work [12:40:53] that wasn't so bad [12:42:55] p858snake|l: why special export and import; to preserve the history? [12:59:23] norbert: it can grab the additonal templates you need [12:59:36] p858snake|l: ah, nice [13:01:07] hello [13:01:31] how can i have a index page of my articles? like a contents page [13:01:33] do i need an extension? [13:02:46] Cadmi: you mean a list of all pages? (if you do, check Special:AllPages) [13:03:47] for Wikipedia, for example, this would be http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Allpages [13:06:09] aha, let me see [13:06:24] i just installed a wiki to manage the knowledge of my small company [13:06:32] so i want to create articles and look for them when i need [13:06:49] so i think having an index, or contents index would be nice to find what i wrote in the past [13:09:41] norbert something like this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portal:Contents/Lists#Culture_and_the_arts [13:10:08] that has been created by hand, I think [13:10:14] ops [13:10:36] the url you gave me shows me a search bar [13:10:46] i need something as an index of contents [13:10:50] or navigation menu [13:11:00] yes, create it by hand [13:11:21] so every time i add a new article i have to add it in the index also? [13:11:35] you could add categories to your articles [13:11:40] then you can automate things [13:11:40] yep [13:11:43] mmm [13:12:27] how many articles do you plan to create? [13:12:51] if it's less than, say, 100, I would definitely say just do it by hand and add each new article to a custom index that you can style and order as you please [13:13:01] yep, less than 100 [13:13:14] mmm [13:13:18] ok, i will do in this way [13:13:25] thank you :) [13:21:09] jackmcbarn: any chance you could help me with https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension_talk:Scribunto#attempt_to_call_upvalue_.27navbar.27_.28a_nil_value.29_45214 if you have time? [13:21:37] jackmcbarn: no rush though [13:28:55] Hey everyone! [13:29:27] I just got a call from my ISP. Turns out one of my wikis got infested by spambots. I need help. [13:30:21] Xzenu: see https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Combating_spam [13:30:45] thanks [13:30:49] unfortunately cleaning up existing spam is really really hard (although bots can help with that) [13:34:47] I'd like to save the whole thing with CAPTCHA for later... how do I disable new account registration entirely? [13:35:24] And is there any easy way to ban all accounts that has been registered since a certaon date? [13:36:40] $wgGroupPermissions['*']['createaccount'] = false [13:37:03] and not that I know of, but if you have a backup of your database you could upload that, effectively wiping every change that happened after the backup date [13:37:27] I have no idea of how to make a backup. :-( [13:37:37] Thanks for the string... what page do I out it in? [13:37:55] LocalSettings.php [13:37:56] LocalSettings.php [13:38:07] where every other configuration bit goes :) [13:38:33] thanks. I'm still new to mediawiki. I mean, I did install it some months ago, but I haven't worked much with it since. [13:39:04] * Skizzerz needs to head off, but good luck with your issue. The mediawiki.org site contains a lot of useful information, and if any bit of it confuses you, feel free to ask here [13:39:13] Thanks. [13:39:37] Hmm, can I edit LocalSettings.php directly on the site, or do I have to do it in a text editor and then re-upload it? [13:41:57] some FTP clients can edit it [13:42:08] right click and select edit [13:43:37] you may also have SSH access to your machine, then you could SSH connect to a remote command line and use an editor like vim to edit it [13:43:58] but that may be complicated if it's all new to you [13:46:51] yeah, I have no idea what SSH even is. [13:48:04] it allows you to securely execute commands on another computer or transfer files to that other computer [13:49:02] like you have a DOS C:\ prompt in front of you, but it's not on your own computer but on the remote computer [13:49:39] but just try to right click LocalSettings.php when you connected with an FTP client [13:49:48] if it's a sweet client, you should be able to just edit it remotely [13:51:47] OMG it takes so long to upload the new MediaWiki software [13:52:04] 6% complete, 01:29:13 est. time remaining. (File 425 of 6372) [13:54:28] now it's even 01:42:01 [13:54:41] I can't possibly make backups of this in the future without shooting myself in the face [13:54:50] I guess I'll only be downloading the images/ dir and the database [14:04:26] The FTP doesn't work, and I can't reach my ISP. Is there any way I can disable registration or enable captcha without using the FTP? I'm pretty sure I have ConfirmEdit installed, as it was included in the mediawiki package I downloaded. Can I somehow enable it without editing the localsettings.php? [14:05:22] Also, is it possible to change the settings so that new accounts can be registred, but not by users? I'd prefer to be able to make accounts for my friends and such. [14:10:00] Xzenu: if you have no shell access and not FTP, I don't think there is a way to change any setting. there is no web UI for changin settings. [14:10:56] Xzenu: as to your second question: you can restrict the creatuser right to admins. but you'll need to edit the LocalSettings.php file, just like for any other setting. [14:17:26] Okay, thanks [14:30:38] Hmm... I have managed to upload LocalSettings.php now... But when I add the following line... [14:30:39] $wgGroupPermissions['*']['createaccount'] = false [14:30:51] ...the wiki freezes, the pages become blank. [14:32:23] I added the line in DreamWeaver. Once I removed the line an duploaded the file again, the wiki worked again. So the problem is either with the line itself or with where I placed it. I placed it at the bottom of the document. [14:33:20] Right below the lines "# End of automatically generated settings. [14:33:20] # Add more configuration options below." [14:42:19] Problem solved! Registration of accounts has now been disabled, so I can start cleaning up the spam. [15:13:52] That's very wiki :P [15:14:19] Xzenu: to avoid spam, https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:ConfirmEdit#QuestyCaptcha is enough [15:14:39] if you want to keep account creation disabled, remember to instal ConfirmAccount extension [15:24:11] how can I purge Special:ActiveUsers? ?action=purge doesn't seem to do anything [15:30:53] wmat: On your own wiki? [15:32:44] uploaded the new MediaWiki software, added the old LocalSettings.php, but now get "A database query error has occurred. This may indicate a bug in the software." when going to /mw-config/ ... [15:33:08] I have no remote ssh access [15:33:08] Reedy: well, it's not mine, but I'm the admin [15:33:49] Reedy: I'm seeing 30-100 edits/day but those Users are not showing up in the Active Users list [15:33:55] It's cached [15:33:59] Which I guess is the reason [15:34:02] right [15:34:16] i thought ?action=purge would clear it? [15:34:18] Nope [15:34:21] Not for Special pages [15:34:25] ah [15:34:39] maintenance script then? [15:35:24] wmat: re your question from earlier, you updated Module:Navbox but not Module:Navbar [15:35:25] * wmat looks at clearCacheStats perhaps [15:35:31] updateSpecialPages.php --only=Activeusers [15:35:33] I think [15:35:50] jackmcbarn: thx, let me try that now [15:39:07] jackmcbarn: that fixed it, thanks again [15:39:11] np [15:53:19] !debug [15:53:19] For information on debugging (including viewing errors), see http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:How_to_debug . A list of related configuration variables is at https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Configuration_settings#Debug.2Flogging [16:01:25] !ask [16:01:25] Please feel free to ask your question: if anybody who knows the answer is around, they will surely reply. Don't ask for help or for attention before actually asking your question, that's just a waste of time – both yours and everybody else's. :) [16:13:52] I'm starting mediawiki development - tried to do the vagrant install, but it seems to have stalled overnight while it was git cloning. [16:14:07] is the vagrant install known to be flaky, or should I just try again? [16:14:35] that said, I don't know if git clone manually would be any better. :( [16:17:18] neilk_: I believe the vagrant install does not have those kind of known bugs [16:17:39] ori and bd808 are I think 2 of the people who work on that [16:17:40] sumanah: nm, I think they messed with the network here last night [16:17:44] ah [16:30:18] manybubbles: I suppose you saw http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikitech-l/2014-July/077406.html [Wikitech-l] reviews needed for upcoming query functionality for Wikidata ? [16:57:15] hey fhocutt - happy Tuesday [16:58:18] hey sumanah, how's it going? [16:59:06] fhocutt: medium. You? [16:59:21] sleepy, but otherwise not bad. [16:59:58] yesterday I added a bunch of issues to the issue tracker [17:00:01] yay! [17:00:04] *various issue trackers [17:00:13] further yay! [17:00:17] only have pywikibot left to go [17:01:04] and paired with Glenn to look at MediaWiki::API, and then started filling in the evaluation for that [17:01:38] Rock! [17:01:50] Sort of started reading through MediaWiki::Bot, but it was denser and I decided I was done with code review for the day [17:02:02] nod nod [17:02:41] it has >2000 sloc in one file, argh. About 1/3 is documentation but that's still a LOT of code in one place. [17:04:15] I'm planning to pair with dduvall on Thursday to look over the Ruby library [17:04:40] fhocutt: Great! [17:04:53] fhocutt: so you have some momentum going. Glad to hear of it. Anything blocking your work? [17:05:13] bugzilla is frustrating to use and I don't want to submit duplicate pywikibot bugs [17:05:46] bugzilla is awesome! [17:05:49] * Reedy looks shifty [17:06:15] I've had my first "but we already have those components in the docs, why do you think we should add to our code samples" response [17:06:22] fhocutt: bleh, link? [17:06:43] https://github.com/ianweller/python-simplemediawiki/issues/15#issuecomment-48282228 [17:06:54] fhocutt: (perhaps you've heard or not; Wikimedia is switching from Bugzilla to Phabricator and hope this improves ease of use) [17:07:19] sumanah, I've heard, but I still need to look for duplicate pwb bugs now :) [17:07:24] yeah :) [17:08:53] fhocutt: re https://github.com/ianweller/python-simplemediawiki/issues/15#issuecomment-48282228 - am I right in seeing that there are docs but no sample code demonstrating how to do this? [17:09:00] yes. [17:09:19] ok fhocutt I'll be commenting there [17:09:41] and since new users often rely substantially on sample code, it's useful to not make them hunt for how to do things well. [17:09:43] ty! [17:09:56] yup [17:10:29] yeah, the login/tokens thing is really a "scope of the library" thing, but I feel that if they offer a method for login, examples of how to use it are a good idea [17:12:01] fhocutt: the Phabricator move will not help you (I think) by the end of your internship https://blog.wikimedia.org/2014/06/10/on-our-way-to-phabricator/ [17:12:35] it's useful to learn bugzilla anyway, I can cope. [17:12:39] nod [17:12:50] ok, anything else causing a barrier? [17:13:31] not looking forward to going through allll of MW::Bot, but that can't really be helped. [17:14:12] I sing an energizing song for you [17:14:24] like Battle Hymn of the Code Review or something [17:14:40] I think I'm pretty much set for the next day or two. I'm planning to finish drafting the evaluation/todos for MW::API today or tomorrow [17:14:42] * fhocutt grins [17:14:43] She is trampling out the vintage / where the unit tests are stored [17:14:52] Yay! Cool! [17:15:00] ah great, you started writing it so I don't have to :D [17:15:05] * sumanah laughs aloud [17:16:02] All right! I shall leave you to your work then. Best wishes. [17:16:08] o/ fhocutt [17:16:15] \o sumanah [17:27:53] sumanah: re: Reviews for wikidata - yeah - I'm going to look at them but I don't count as either performance or security review [17:28:13] sure, I just wanted you to know about it [17:29:38] hi rfarrand! so I am planning a Thursday chat as part of our architecture meetings [17:30:05] every thursday or just this coming thursday? [17:30:11] it changes each week [17:30:48] basically, usually we have a meeting as part of https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Architecture_meetings every Wednesday, and we're starting to additionally have one on another day of the week as well [17:31:56] rfarrand: there's some unavoidable not-just-logistical work that has to happen and that it's best for me to do [17:32:30] ok [17:32:43] rfarrand: basically I have a handle on the various proposals (Requests for Comment) that people are trying to work on and need other people's feedback on, and I contact them every once in a while to ask "is now/next week/this month a good time?" and they usually need a lot of encouragement and handholding [17:34:09] rfarrand: we used to just have 1 meeting per week and it was, at least at first, meant to be a time when the authors of these proposals asked for them to be approved/vetoed. But it quickly became clear that a lot of the time people just need feedback [17:34:32] "is this generally a good idea? do these designs make sense? what do I need to investigate next?" [17:35:33] rfarrand: so we are trying to do more like 2 per week, maybe one that is more about "can the architects (Brion or Mark Bergsma or Tim) approve this now" and another that's more "show up with drafts and we will give feedback" [17:36:09] that makes sense :D [17:36:43] rfarrand: so this week - I got an okay from Trevor to set up something for Thursday to discuss his work on redo-ing the skin framework. So I'm about to follow https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/User:Sharihareswara_%28WMF%29/rfc_meeting_checklist to set that up. [17:37:17] First I'm choosing a date and time. [17:37:56] how do you choose the best time? [17:37:58] It has to be during Trevor's workday. I'd also like to make it somewhat different from the time of the previous discussion of this topic [17:38:35] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Architecture_meetings/RFC_review_2014-06-20 and http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikitech-l/2014-June/077227.html (linked to from https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Architecture_meetings ) - things happened at 17:30 UTC and 18:00 UTC [17:39:44] rfarrand: those times were ok for Europe (evening), so when planning the next chance for people to talk, I think a few hours later, to make it possible for China & Australia to participate, would be good [17:40:18] how many people normally participate? [17:40:58] rfarrand: between 6 and 20 [17:41:55] rfarrand: but I only make a GCal invite inviting people who (in my totally subjective opinion) are really crucial to have at that discussion. This is why it's often the case that not all 3 architects are at these meetings. They're in Europe, California, and Australia. [17:43:46] So, for instance, for this chat, it's gonna be: Trevor, Jon Robson, Brion, Erik Moeller, Arthur, Tim, Shahyar, Isarra, and several others. And we'll deal with it if some cannot make it, but Trevor absolutely has to be there [17:44:48] and since this is more of a discussion than a decision meeting (I think), it's *ok* if Brion/Tim can't make it, but I hope they both can. Brion usually prefers to have these kinds of meetings on Mon, Wed, or Fri, so I asked him particularly whether we could make an exception and have this on Thursday [17:44:57] (basically since that is slightly better for Trevor to give him more time to prep) [17:46:15] rfarrand: so I am about to set up the GCal invite for Thursday [17:46:34] you know how that takes a little messing-around with the interface so I will be "quiet" here for a moment :) [17:47:10] :) [17:47:48] 3:30pm PT is 8:30am in Sydney and thus bearable [17:49:36] ok rfarrand done - as you can now see on the eng calendar [17:49:47] yup [17:50:19] rfarrand: ok! so now I gotta put up a page about it within https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Architecture_meetings . Doing so now. Copying and pasting most of an old one ;-) [17:56:19] ok rfarrand I made https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Architecture_meetings/RFC_review_2014-07-10 and also I made a sort of rough template as part of https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/User:Sharihareswara_%28WMF%29/rfc_meeting_checklist [17:57:02] so, I've now put up a basic page about the meeting, I've updated the Architecture meetings page and the Requests for Comment page to mention it, and I've set up the GCal invite. But I still need to add it to the meta.wikimedia.org page on office hours [17:57:22] and Project:Calendar on mediawiki.org . And announce it to wikitech-l [17:59:31] sumanah: I have to run because it is 11 [17:59:39] thanks for showing me this much of the process :) [17:59:46] thanks rfarrand [18:01:07] quiddity: hi there! [18:01:20] Hi :) [18:02:09] quiddity: so, https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Requests_for_comment/Inline_diffs - maybe we should start with what you said in your email, which sounded pretty thorough [18:02:32] quiddity: mind if I quote here? [18:03:13] /me checks... No problem. :) [18:03:24] actually quiddity you know what would be great, would be if you pasted your mail to the talkpage of that rfc https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Talk:Requests_for_comment/Inline_diffs [18:04:12] MaxSem: ^ quiddity is potentially interested in shepherding Inline Diffs forward so it can become a beta feature [18:04:48] * MaxSem waves [18:05:01] quiddity: don't know whether you've met Max before? [18:05:42] We've passed each other and waved, onwiki and inoffice. :) [18:07:54] * sumanah waits for quiddity to paste the email or ask me to do it :) [18:08:56] sumanah, MaxSem, pasted (a slightly cleaned version) at https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Talk:Requests_for_comment/Inline_diffs [18:09:01] thanks! [18:09:40] MaxSem: do you/mobile have any particular deadlines or good/bad times to work on or deploy this? [18:09:57] quiddity: Max and #wikimedia-mobile are, as you can tell, far more the experts on this than I am. [18:09:58] nope [18:10:11] just ofeering everyone what we've done [18:10:15] quiddity: there you go - this is a perfect project for ya :) [18:10:22] don't even care if it gets accepted [18:13:58] MaxSem, Apart from the 2.5 suggestions I've added on the talkpage, can you think of any of things that need to be added? And is there any reason this would need to be a BetaFeature - to me it seems like this could just be a simple button-addition... [18:19:27] hmm... [18:28:44] Also, I've emailed you a more discursive/tangential question. We can talk about that in email or IRC, whenever you have time. :) [18:39:12] Is there a way to to use revisiondelete with revisions from different pages? Currently it only selects revisions of one page and discards ther est [18:49:27] Is there a way to to use revisiondelete with revisions from different pages? Currently it only selects revisions of one page and discards the rest [18:49:44] thx quiddity [18:50:34] rohan013: no, you'll have to delete them in two batches [18:52:43] legoktm: Is there a specific reason for this ? [18:53:12] not really, it's just the way the software was designed [18:56:26] Reedy: thanks, updateSpecialPages did the trick [19:03:25] hey folks [19:03:52] I'm trying to add the Infobox software to my MediaWiki [19:04:17] I added the sources of Template:Documentation, Template:Infobox and Template:Infobox software [19:04:22] but I don't think that's enough [19:04:46] I've never created my own templates on Wikipedia, so I'm not sure what to do next (other than Googling and posting here) [19:05:09] !templates [19:05:10] For more information about templates, see . See also: !templateproblems , !wptemplates [19:05:18] !wptemplates [19:05:18] To copy templates from Wikipedia, use Special:Export and check the "Include templates" option to get all the sub-templates, then upload the file with Special:Import on your wiki. You'll also likely have to install the ParserFunctions extension, Scribunto extension and install/enable HTML tidy. You also might need some CSS from Wikipedia's Common.css. You'll also need a lot of... [19:06:07] also, you need to have your wiki licensed as CC-BY-SA [19:08:13] Vulpix: my wiki says "Content is available under GNU Free Documentation License 1.3 or later." is that okay? [19:08:19] probably not, right [19:08:28] it was updated to dual license a while back [19:09:26] wikipedia was GFDL a while ago, maybe it's still compatible, though, but I don't know [19:10:04] Vulpix: unfortunately escape hatch for wikipedia turns out to be extremely specific about the timing ... [19:10:25] +the [19:11:41] enwiki is CC-BY-SA 3.0 and GFDL dual licensed [19:11:48] actually... [19:12:34] Vulpix: hm... it says " Import failed: No handler for model 'Scribunto' registered in $wgContentHandlers " [19:13:21] you'll need to install Scribunto extension [19:13:25] !e Scribunto [19:13:25] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Scribunto [19:14:02] but I have the latest MediaWiki [19:15:14] It's an extension [19:15:16] Not MediaWiki core [19:17:30] Special:Import is only for admins, I hope? :) [19:17:51] it's sweet but we don't want trolls to use it [19:17:51] anyone with the 'import' userright, which is admins yes [19:17:58] ok, cool :) [19:21:26] auch, I added that Scribunto extension, but now it says "Script error Script error" [19:21:48] maybe I need to import the XML again? [19:21:48] click on the "Script error" and it'll show a popup with the full exception message [19:22:05] Script error: No such module "Infobox". [19:22:23] you need to import Module:infobox then [19:22:38] but Infobox software relies on it [19:22:38] and I checked that thingy [19:23:21] Special:Export [X] Include templates [19:23:27] trying to import again [19:23:34] ah, that's it [19:24:09] er no [19:24:51] this time the XML import ran all the way without an error and ended with a message that it was successful, but http://www.princed.org/wiki/Template:Infobox_software is still saying "Script error" [19:25:48] I also included Cite web in the Export+Import; it looks really weird http://www.princed.org/wiki/Template:Cite_web [19:27:01] looks like Parser Functions aren't enabled [19:27:24] okay, so I install the ParserFunctions extension? [19:27:26] indeed, they are not enabled http://www.princed.org/wiki/Special:Version [19:28:24] that's a bit awkward, they're supposed to be enabled by default [19:28:46] ah, no, they're bundled, not part of core [19:30:28] weird, there's already a ParserFunctions directory in extentions/ [19:31:11] that's not weird, that extension is bundled. You only need to enable it (add the require_once in LocalSettings.php) [19:31:20] ok, thanks [19:34:28] Vulpix: looks better now, but still not 100% http://www.princed.org/wiki/Template:Infobox_software#Example [19:34:45] like a border is missing or something [19:34:59] yeah, and a different background color and such [19:35:00] images are missing, and CSS styles [19:35:10] !CSS [19:35:10] There is no such key, you probably want to try: !colon, !console, !css, !csshideheader, !firebug, !important, !pagecss, !refresh, !resourceloader, !sorttable, !wptemplates, [19:35:15] !css [19:35:15] To change styles for your wiki, go to one of the MediaWiki:xxx.css wiki page (NOT a file) and put your custom styles there (sysop/admin rights required). MediaWiki:Common.css is for all skins and should be used for content styles. MediaWiki:Vector.css is for the Vector skin (default), etc. For more information, see !skins and [19:35:47] actually, that link should be https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Interface/CSS [19:36:14] !del css [19:36:14] Deleting users is very messy and not recommended, because this breaks referential integrity in the database (they appear in many different tables like users, edit histories, recentchanges, preferences, etc). A safe solution is to block the users, and possibly rename them with . You can also try [19:36:35] !css del [19:36:35] Successfully removed css [19:36:52] !css is To change styles for your wiki, go to one of the MediaWiki:xxx.css wiki page (NOT a file) and put your custom styles there (sysop/admin rights required). MediaWiki:Common.css is for all skins and should be used for content styles. MediaWiki:Vector.css is for the Vector skin (default), etc. For more information, see !skins and https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Interface/CSS [19:36:52] Key was added [19:37:30] yes, thanks Vulpix [19:46:24] I've created my own special page, which I wish to include on my main page by transclusion. So, after setting it up to do so (By putting it in IncludableSpecialPage), whatever page I decide to include it on automatically takes on the title of the special page. So, if the page is located at Special:MyPages, and I include in on "Main Page", then the main page's title becomes Special:MyPages. [19:46:47] Why is that happening? [19:59:58] Memphis: You need to override the setting of the title if it's being included [20:00:11] As it can still be viewed standalone, and that needs a title [20:00:18] Chances are there's some examples or 7 in the code [20:00:26] thanks again folks; gotta go [20:00:47] if ( $this->including() ) { } [20:01:23] Reedy: I actually found the issue, $output->addWikiText causes the page to adopt the special page title. $output->addHTMl doesn't, but the text of course isn't wikitext. [20:01:55] It seems to be a glitch. [20:03:34] anyway, blame $wgTitle [20:06:06] <^d> Vulpix: It's what I do. [20:06:10] <^d> I blame it for all my problems. [20:07:43] Well are there any workarounds? The no title extension can't remove the title, and the magic word for changing the title doesn't work either. [20:08:45] The strange thing is that the actually title of the special page is not "Special:MyPages", it's "My Pages" and it gets that from a system message. [20:10:42] No special page using IncludableSpecialPage seems to use $output->addWikiText either, it's always HTML. [20:15:18] hm... I'm back with a question [20:15:26] I want to be able to with my MediaWiki [20:15:34] I already enabled require_once Cite.php [20:15:46] but it keeps saying "Cite error: tags exist, but no tag was found" [20:16:12] even when I add [20:16:28] I probably also need to Export+Import the Reflist template [20:18:29] norbert: be sure to add after all other and not before. Otherwise, it should work [20:18:37] Hi. I have a MediaWiki 1.21.2 installation with sqlite3 as the database. Occasionally, the page will stall for about 30 seconds during load. In the profiler, the functions using the time appear to be LocalisationCache::getItem-load or LocalisationCache::recache… when I turn on SQL debug output, it appears to be waiting for: Query (9) (slave): SELECT /* LCStore_DB::get */ lc_value FROM l10n_cache WHERE lc_lang = 'en' AND lc_key = 'preload' LIMIT [20:19:16] Vulpix: it works now, I made a stupid mistake (forgot ) [20:22:12] brb, trying a few things. [20:22:31] woolie_: set $wgCacheDirectory ? [20:26:15] AaronSchulz: trying that now. [20:31:05] Hi everyone. My wikis has been infested with spam. I have already stopped unregistred editing and people registring new accounts. (May replace this total ban with CAPTCHA later.) However, the site already have thousands of bot accounts registred, and thousands of spam pages on the wiki. I have taken a manual backup of the real pages. Before I nuke the database and start pasting the backup [20:31:05] pages into a brand new database... is there any way to delete all pages? Preferably with some exceptions, or the ability to restor deleted pages manually afterwards? [20:31:23] Also, is there any way to ban all users who are not administrators? [20:31:49] I have checked the "combat spam" manual page, but didn't find the answer there. [20:37:57] how's the VI doing? [20:38:14] it's been about 6 months since I tried it [20:40:15] EPiSKiNG-, VI? [20:40:23] sorry... [20:40:25] visual editor [20:40:28] VE :) [20:40:37] hehe [20:40:39] yes, that [20:40:43] James_F, ^ [20:41:24] Is the ability to upload a photo and embed in place? [20:42:09] and is there a functioning sandbox with the latest? [20:43:58] AaronSchulz: $wgCacheDirectory and an update to the current version seem to be helping. Testing it under load now. [21:01:53] I guess I'm looking for a more WYSIWYG type editor [21:03:27] !visualeditor [21:03:27] VisualEditor is a project to create a simple editor for MediaWiki that would make it far simpler for people to contribute to Wikimedia projects. See also https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/VisualEditor and #mediawiki-visualeditor channel. [21:14:08] bawolff [21:14:16] yeah, it's a nice toolbar [21:14:27] but I don't like the WML view of the body [21:14:50] (we use wiki for internal documentation and our employeebase doesn't want to learn WML) [21:14:53] EPiSKiNG-: by WML you mean wiki-markup (as opposed to wireless markup language)? [21:15:11] they'd prefer to use something that looks like MS Word [21:15:13] EPiSKiNG-: And I think you're thinking of WikiEditor, not visual editor (they're fairly different) [21:15:38] yes, wiki-markup [21:16:56] is visual editor available on current production wikipedia? [21:17:51] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Sandbox?veaction=edit [21:18:15] ah yes, visual editor is much nicer [21:18:26] only in certain namespaces [21:18:45] Also if you have js disabled or an old browser it will fallback to the other editor [21:18:58] and on en.wp only if you enable it in your preferences :( it's immediately available on most other wikis [21:19:14] Oh they finally got it disabled. I didn't hear [21:19:24] right... Still... Wish I could upload and embed photo in same movement [21:19:24] :) [21:19:39] There is a video at https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:VisualEditor_screencast_-_2013-06-06_-_inserting_an_image_from_Commons.webm [21:19:48] but the video doesn't seem to work. Guess I should fix that [21:20:22] Or the 360p ogg doesn't work. other resolutions do... aint that fun [21:20:42] worked for me [21:20:47] by 460p I meant to write 480p [21:20:53] bah, typing is hard [21:21:00] hrmm... maybe I'll try implementing VE [21:21:12] https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/transcoded/c/c6/VisualEditor_screencast_-_2013-06-06_-_inserting_an_image_from_Commons.webm/VisualEditor_screencast_-_2013-06-06_-_inserting_an_image_from_Commons.webm.480p.ogv <-- version doesn't seem to work [21:21:28] I'm on 1.17.2 right now [21:21:44] PHP 5.2.10 and mysql 5.0.77 [21:21:55] hmm, but mplayer can play it. Ugh [21:22:08] would the transition to 1.23.1 be very difficult? [21:22:18] and does 1.23.1 have VE? [21:22:38] EPiSKiNG-: Have you modified the source in anyway, or are deploying custom extensions not maintained by other people [21:22:46] modified template [21:22:47] If the answer to that is no, then it should be easy to upgrade [21:22:59] Modifying templates in the template namespace is fine [21:23:00] but i can re-do those mods I think [21:23:16] If you mean you modified the skin, you have to be a bit more careful [21:23:25] yeah, skin [21:23:51] How hard depends on how extensive your modifications are. Keep in mind that the skin has changed a bit between versions [21:24:04] k [21:24:36] Also, visual editor isn't included by default. Its an extension. It takes a little while to set up because it has various dependencies [21:24:57] ok... is there a guide? [21:25:05] !e VisualEditor [21:25:06] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:VisualEditor [21:25:25] Anyone know if there's any good forum for MediaWiki? Or only this IRC channel? [21:26:27] Xzenu: you can also try https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Project:Support_desk [21:26:32] (with forum, I mean like a web forum. I count this channel as a channel, not a s a forum) [21:26:42] Thanks [21:28:50] wow, the difference between the compression artificats on webm vs ogg encodings of https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:VisualEditor_screencast_-_2013-06-06_-_inserting_an_image_from_Commons.webm is really night and day [21:29:46] and the webm version is a tenth of the size [21:33:40] bawolff: you realize ogg is just the container format right [21:33:52] I do [21:33:56] Theora vs VP8 [21:34:30] well, webm actually refers to a (or at least one of two?) *specific* video format, no? [21:34:37] But we always use specific codecs in those specific container formats, so I have a tendency to use the names interchangably [21:34:43] even if it's not actually a codec named webm [21:34:50] Yes, but we don't support VP9 [21:35:01] or opus in webm [21:35:21] how's player support for those? [21:35:29] actually not bad [21:35:34] if you have a recent browser [21:35:56] well, I was thinking more like what if you wanted to download it and play it offline on, say, wheezy [21:36:27] you need libav 10 (if you're using that for your codecs) [21:37:07] which is not in debian wheezy [21:37:36] It is in Jessie though [21:37:47] it's also in backports on what looks like basically all architectures [21:38:41] libavcodec-dev | 6:10.1-1~bpo70+1 | wheezy-backports | amd64, armel, armhf, i386, ia64, kfreebsd-amd64, kfreebsd-i386, mips, mipsel, powerpc, s390, s390x, sparc [21:39:52] The main reason we don't support opus/vp9 is because the WMF servers don't have new enough libav package [21:44:06] * bawolff has filied RT 6891 to try to get it upgraded. It sounds as if we met get libav 10 backported to wmf cluster, but not for another couple months [22:32:25] bawolff: any suggestions for this? https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/#/c/137915/ [22:34:49] On mediawiki-1.23.1, occasionally a request to “load.php?debug=false&lang=en&modules=startup&only=scripts&skin=vector&*” won’t return… [22:35:20] e.g. the stylesheet isn’t loaded. The rest of the page and main html appears to return fine. But the browser just hangs waiting for the css. [22:35:55] woolie: maybe doing some sort of language cache update and taking too long [22:36:08] woolie_: also check apache error log to see if anything bad is happening there [22:36:28] ok, I was watching the mediawiki log and didn’t see any hints there. Checking apache... [22:37:58] e.g. Apache would have if php segfaults or something like that [22:38:12] Weird, I see the line in access_log for the request... [22:38:22] and I seem to curl it fine [22:38:45] but the browser isn’t cool with it… [22:41:16] ok, now curl is stalling as well. [22:41:36] load.php?debug=false&lang=en&modules=mediawiki.legacy.commonPrint%2Cshared%7Cmediawiki.skinning.interface%7Cmediawiki.ui.button%7Cskins.vector.styles&only=styles&skin=vector&* [22:43:32] it’s so intermittent, which is what is strange [22:43:45] kunalg: Why not just check if mDbPageLanguage is false? [22:44:51] bawolff: You mean I should set it to false if it is null in db? That would complicate the code everywhere [22:45:13] bawolff: complicate->change [22:45:35] You want to know if you've already checked the db right [22:45:59] bawolff: Yes [22:46:02] Well the variable starts off as being false, so why not check if it is false, if it isn't, skip loading it from the db again [22:46:44] bawolff: Hmm, yeah, that should do I think [22:47:09] bawolff: Thanks a lot :) Don't know why I didn't see the easier way [22:48:08] It’s not an error or a crash, because the response does return... [22:48:19] eventually, just takes up to 30 seconds [22:49:09] woolie_: You can enable profiling to see what's up [22:50:11] Alright, trying that again [22:54:27] erm, requests to load.php don’t seem to log anything... [23:02:54] so frustrating and hard to debug. [23:02:55] brb [23:14:46] Hi [23:17:02] Does someone know how I may create a template that gives as a restult the parameter without the last or two last characters ? [23:17:36] for example {{template|qwertzu}} --> qwert [23:18:38] Canasta: What extensions do you have installed on your wiki? [23:20:09] marktraceur: I don`t know exactly, it's a wikia's wikia, I'm really bad in programming questions... [23:20:56] Hm. [23:21:58] I suspect wikia has a help channel [23:22:17] Try #wikia maybe [23:22:45] could be, I try it [23:25:18] marktraceur it's ok, but not many people there :) [23:25:34] Canasta: Go to Special:Version on the wiki. It will list extensions installed [23:25:36] They could at least tell you if you have e.g. scribunto [23:25:42] Yeah that's a good plan. [23:25:48] I believe wikia has string functions at the very least, and possibly scribunto [23:25:58] !e StringFunctions [23:25:58] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:StringFunctions [23:26:06] bawolff: But wikia does some black magic to allow a bunch of different extensions...don't know where to look for ones they have [23:26:37] wikia installs basically anything (or they used to) [23:27:25] bawolff, marktraceur: I can't see scribunto on Spécial:Version [23:27:55] !lua | Canasta [23:27:55] Canasta: Scribunto is a new extension that makes it easier to write repeatable code in Lua, rather than in complex wikitext templates. See http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Lua_scripting and http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Scribunto for more information. [23:28:54] oh yes, I've hear they had activated Lua recently (but it doesn't mean anything to me) [23:30:15] Canasta: Lua is a scripting language. It will allow you to make templates of the type you want [23:33:35] bawolff: is it such a complex thing to do? I've understood php allowed to do it using chop/chomp/substr ut I could not find a media wiki or php equivalent [23:34:03] Thanks all, I'm going to tryasking to wikia staff [23:34:29] chomp is perl [23:34:57] lua has a substr function [23:35:49] ok, so I think it's possible, thanks bawolff