[00:03:00] <MatmaRex>	 teward: normally not. some special pages accept some parameters as "subpage", e.g. [[Special:Whatlinkshere/Foo]]
[00:03:53] <teward>	 MatmaRex: yeah, that's what I thought, but subpages don't apply (Special:ListUsers, query= group:Administrators)
[00:03:58] <teward>	 so... *shrugs*
[00:04:21] <teward>	 i'm fine using a span to make an external link look like internal
[00:04:50] <MatmaRex>	 teward: actually i think that one can be done, [[Special:ListUsers/sysop]]?
[00:05:01] <teward>	 *loads up tests*
[00:06:48] <teward>	 MatmaRex: that worked!
[00:07:01] <teward>	 MatmaRex: guess i'm tired, i'd have tested otherwise :)
[00:07:19] <MatmaRex>	 yay
[00:08:27] <teward>	 thanks much!
[00:08:31] <teward>	 (This channel is SO helpful!)
[00:09:04] <teward>	 i still remember staying here for about an hour when asking how to fuss around with disabling some builtin groups while creating high-granularity permission sets heh
[00:10:23] <Reedy>	 teward: wait till the invoices start coming in ;)
[00:11:13] <teward>	 :P
[00:11:18] <Skizzerz>	 wait, we can charge people? why did I not know this
[00:11:48] <teward>	 Reedy: given i'm having fun testing/fleshing-out the postgresql compatibility, i think the 'invoices' are already paid in both directions because of all the postgresql bugs I keep notcing
[00:11:50] <teward>	 noticing*
[00:12:02] <Reedy>	 are you fixing them too? ;)
[00:12:24] <teward>	 some of them, and then i don't report them (some are pgsql related config changes that need done).
[00:12:27] <teward>	 obscure errors I report
[00:12:39] <teward>	 and they're usually fixed because someone fubar'd when typing a query line in the code level :P
[00:12:52] <teward>	 in any case
[00:12:58] <teward>	 most stuff works out of the box
[00:13:42] <Reedy>	 there's very few queries that are postgres specific
[00:13:54] <Reedy>	 they start with the abstraction and are made from arrays of stuffs
[00:14:21] <teward>	 true, except in some of the extensions, in which case they just need to update to be really SQL-generic rather than mysql/SQL-flavor-specific
[00:14:33] <Reedy>	 mmmm
[00:14:35] <teward>	 the only issue I have had was with the simultaneous query limit
[00:14:36] <Reedy>	 Stupid extensions
[00:14:40] <teward>	 and that's a psql config option
[00:14:40] <Reedy>	 Every little helps
[00:14:44] <Skizzerz>	 I really want to kill the query() method on DatabaseBase
[00:14:51] <Skizzerz>	 just outright block you from using raw queries
[00:15:42] <Skizzerz>	 or rather, make it obvious it's dbms-specific
[00:15:55] <Skizzerz>	 so you could have $dbr->queryMysql( 'SELECT ...' )
[00:15:55] <teward>	 mhm
[00:16:01] <Reedy>	 making it protected would fix most of hte issues
[00:16:35] <Skizzerz>	 I also want to rip dbs out of core a la skins, I should maybe work on that RFC some more
[00:17:03] <teward>	 i forget, MSSQL isn't supported is it as the DB backend, is it?
[00:17:10] <Reedy>	 It has some support
[00:17:14] <teward>	 "some support"
[00:17:15] <Reedy>	 Skizzerz: You know they've been mostly moved to the libs folder now?
[00:17:30] <teward>	 Reedy: "some" as in comparable to psql support, or "some" as in "only a little" support?
[00:17:32] <Skizzerz>	 teward: it should work just fine on 1.27
[00:17:34] <teward>	 because MSSQL really irritates me
[00:17:37] <Skizzerz>	 beyond that I guarantee nothing
[00:17:41] <Reedy>	 Probably less than pg
[00:17:49] <Skizzerz>	 (I'm the maintainer for the mssql layer)
[00:18:04] <teward>	 Skizzerz: aha, so when my workplace has issues trying to implement I can come bother the heck out of you >:)
[00:18:07] <teward>	 (loljk)
[00:18:12] <Skizzerz>	 yes, please
[00:18:16] <Skizzerz>	 I can't fix things I don't know about
[00:18:28] <Reedy>	 Useless
[00:18:30] <Skizzerz>	 (or rather, file bugs in phabricator)
[00:18:38] <Skizzerz>	 Reedy: that's a good start
[00:18:55] <Skizzerz>	 but my aim is so that "less-supported" dbs aren't shipped with core, but can be added in just as easily as you would add a custom skin or extension
[00:19:02] <Reedy>	 // See IDatabase::select for the docs for this function
[00:19:10] <Reedy>	 I can't decide if that should be removed
[00:19:18] <Reedy>	 Or replaced with @see IDatabase::selec
[00:19:39] <teward>	 Skizzerz: that sounds like a good idea, though I'm curious what is being considered "supported" DBs, because MySQL/Maria, postgres, those're two pretty common db systems.
[00:19:43] <Skizzerz>	 teward: try to convince your coworkers/boss/whatever to use MySQL though, it's far and away the best supported
[00:19:48] <Skizzerz>	 (MariaDB rather)
[00:20:05] <Skizzerz>	 everything else, with exception of maybe sqlite, falls short in numerous areas
[00:20:09] <teward>	 Skizzerz: if we use MySQL it'd be Percona, the DBA likes that if we need to use something MySQL-esque
[00:20:12] * teward is just the linux guy :P
[00:20:25] * teward prefers postgresql though
[00:20:31] <PMZ_>	 Dear pals, I have a category, and it contains many subcategories.
[00:20:38] <PMZ_>	 How can I format the category list?
[00:21:00] <PMZ_>	 I want some subcategories shown in italics, is this possible?
[00:21:18] <Reedy>	 some? based on what variable?
[00:22:37] <PMZ_>	 Well, based on its contents, or magic word in its contents.
[00:22:49] * Skizzerz afks
[00:22:58] <PMZ_>	 The idea is, there are 2 types of subcategories, and I want to mark those types.
[00:23:14] <PMZ_>	 So they could look different.
[00:26:37] <PMZ_>	 Reedy, I mean, based on the contents of subcategories.
[00:40:04] <teward>	 so, if I redefine the array for $wgRestrictionLevels, does that permit me to basically rewrite the entire protection level structure and override the default?
[00:40:08] <teward>	 or would that torpedo some things?
[00:40:14] <teward>	 (and cause hellish evil)
[00:41:02] <Reedy>	 Behaviour is probably mostly undefined
[00:41:28] <teward>	 sounds like (insert_any_change_here)
[00:41:41] <teward>	 maybe i'll test in a destructible sandbox env.
[00:42:05] * teward just wants to remove 'autoconfirmed' and replace it with a different already-present custom group)
[00:42:29] <teward>	 s/group/permission/
[00:42:35] <Reedy>	 I think the only thing would be if any page is already using a predefined level
[00:43:00] <Reedy>	 it's usage in code, is minimal at best
[00:43:02] <teward>	 the only thing I can see being borked is if I were to remove the 'sysop' one, most of the protects are currently admin-only
[00:43:12] <teward>	 *that* would probably throw some 500s
[00:43:41] <Reedy>	 I think it'll just become unprotected tbh
[00:43:50] <Reedy>	 				$r = $this->getRestrictions( $type );
[00:43:50] <Reedy>	 				foreach ( $wgRestrictionLevels as $level ) {
[00:43:50] <Reedy>	 					if ( in_array( $level, $r ) && $level != '' ) {
[00:43:50] <Reedy>	 						return true;
[00:43:51] <Reedy>	 					}
[00:43:51] <Reedy>	 				}
[04:25:08] <ulfr>	 Hi all! Has anyone seen anything like this before? http://ec2-54-83-121-216.compute-1.amazonaws.com/index.php/Special:Version
[04:25:27] <ulfr>	 I just switched to a new apache config and I can't get page content to show up without ?action=purge, and other stuff just looks funky.
[04:55:54] <legoktm>	 ulfr: looks like your message cache is broken?
[05:00:20] <ulfr>	 legoktm: How might I go about fixing this
[07:49:05] <Ulfr>	 So I just got this message trying to run update.php
[07:49:06] <Ulfr>	 MWException from line 370 of /mnt/wikidoc/mediawiki-1.27.1/includes/installer/MysqlUpdater.php: Missing rc_timestamp field of recentchanges table. Should not happen.
[07:49:09] <Ulfr>	 What does it mean?
[10:13:44] <Nightcinder>	 blah, an hour until i have to start work on my wiki again
[12:18:15] <Nightcinder>	 my mediawiki totally broke
[12:18:21] <Nightcinder>	 i had made short url's, then vector and LDAP broke
[12:18:24] <Nightcinder>	 i reverted the changes
[12:18:27] <Nightcinder>	 vector and LDAP remain broken
[12:18:28] <Nightcinder>	 ._.
[12:20:00] <Nightcinder>	 sigh
[12:20:03] <Nightcinder>	 why does this happen to me
[12:23:04] <ShoeMaker>	 Nightcinder: if you reverted the changes, than anything that was broken that still is was broken by an earlier change that you didn't notice right away due to caching or it was fixed by the revert and is cached in a broken state.
[12:23:32] <Nightcinder>	 i restarted errythang tho
[12:24:16] <ShoeMaker>	 Then it's probably the "was broken by an earlier change that you didn't notice right away due to caching" part
[12:25:24] <Nightcinder>	 well
[12:25:26] <Nightcinder>	 i fixed the theme
[12:25:41] <Nightcinder>	 ldap is still not working
[12:26:12] <ShoeMaker>	 ldap isn't something I can directly help with... No experience there.
[12:26:19] <Nightcinder>	 2016-09-23 12:25:36 INFINITY5 my_wiki: 2.1.0 Either the user is using a local domain, or the wiki isn't allowing updates
[12:26:21] <Nightcinder>	 hmm
[12:41:52] <Nightcinder>	 fixed it
[12:41:55] <Nightcinder>	 php was set to dev mode
[12:41:58] <Nightcinder>	 instead of production mode
[12:58:49] <Nightcinder>	 what to break/fix next
[13:00:14] <Nightcinder>	 https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Gallery_of_user_styles wow these are godawful
[17:32:17] <QuasAtWork>	 are there any known issues with wfMessage() expansion and http vs https that would date back to MW 1.24.1 ?
[17:32:25] <QuasAtWork>	 cuz I'm having issue with this code...
[17:32:26] <QuasAtWork>	 https://github.com/haleyjd/monaco-port/blob/master/MonacoSidebar.class.php#L42
[17:32:52] <QuasAtWork>	 it gets the message, but if language is "en" then the link is always http even when the site is being accessed through https
[17:33:14] <QuasAtWork>	 if language is qqx it inexplicably works and gets a https link.
[17:34:48] <QuasAtWork>	 and this only happens for a message that's been customized (ie has a MediaWiki: page)
[17:35:02] <QuasAtWork>	 the other messages which are default all respect the current protocol.
[17:38:57] <marktraceur>	 QuasAtWork: Can you link to the wiki page where the issue happens?
[17:39:35] <Vulpix>	 the sidebar is heavily cached, maybe it was cached with http if you recently switched to https?
[17:40:30] <QuasAtWork>	 well it's possible but APCu has been installed and apache restarted twice and it still displays http:
[17:40:39] <QuasAtWork>	 https://doomwiki.org/wiki/Entryway
[17:40:54] <QuasAtWork>	 it's the "Help" link on the sidebar under "Upload a new image"
[17:45:50] <marktraceur>	 QuasAtWork: Why not make https://doomwiki.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Helppage just say "Help:Contents"?
[17:46:00] <QuasAtWork>	 I'll try that.
[17:46:15] <marktraceur>	 That's what the random page message does, e.g.
[17:49:24] <QuasAtWork>	 yup that did it.
[17:49:39] <marktraceur>	 Yay!
[18:04:44] <KyoriAsh>	 A question
[18:05:00] <^v>	 where do i find the logs that tell me why SMTP isnt working
[18:05:11] <KyoriAsh>	 Since Scribunto needs Tag:ExpandTemplate to use Mediawiki Templates
[18:05:39] <KyoriAsh>	 why {{border-radius|wpx xpx ypx zpx}} works in Scribunto LUA call?
[21:37:02] <PMZ_>	 Good evening. How can I check if the page is rendered in preview mode?
[21:37:24] <PMZ_>	 Would like to have one like for preview and other for ready saved page.
[21:37:28] <PMZ_>	 Thanks!
[21:37:43] <marktraceur>	 PMZ_: Could you elaborate on exactly why you would ever want that?
[21:38:19] <PMZ_>	 Well, I have a template. It shows me a picture. I want to see the picture in preview, and hide in final view.
[21:38:34] <Debra>	 Why?
[21:38:39] <Debra>	 You can vary CSS based on the action.
[21:38:41] <PMZ_>	 The reason is, the template is prepared to show the illustrations.
[21:38:47] <Debra>	 So action=view has a CSS class.
[21:38:49] <Debra>	 I think.
[21:38:52] <PMZ_>	 Yet now I cannot show them publicly.
[21:38:53] <Debra>	 As does action=edit and action=submit.
[21:39:01] <Debra>	 So you could do hiding with that, probably.
[21:39:05] <marktraceur>	 PMZ_: It makes literally no sense to show a preview of the saved page if it looks different from the saved page.
[21:39:16] <Debra>	 <body class="mediawiki ltr sitedir-ltr mw-hide-empty-elt ns-0 ns-subject page-Main_Page rootpage-Main_Page skin-monobook action-view
[21:39:19] <PMZ_>	 The difference is in images only.
[21:39:23] <Debra>	 That action-view class, you see it?
[21:39:33] <marktraceur>	 PMZ_: If you can't put the images on the saved page, why put them in the page at all?
[21:39:33] <Debra>	 So you would do like...
[21:39:34] <PMZ_>	 Yes, I see the style you propose.
[21:39:41] <Debra>	 .action-view img { display: none; }
[21:39:48] <Debra>	 That would hide all images when viewing a page.
[21:39:48] <PMZ_>	 If I hide the image with style, people will download it anyway.
[21:39:53] <Debra>	 And then you'd do like...
[21:39:57] <Debra>	 Oh, okay.
[21:40:06] <Debra>	 You want to remove the pictures from the rendered output altogether?
[21:40:18] <PMZ_>	 Yes.
[21:40:22] <Debra>	 Hmmm.
[21:40:28] <marktraceur>	 PMZ_: You're doing access control wrong
[21:40:31] <Debra>	 Probably need to write a custom parser function or something.
[21:40:32] <PMZ_>	 While preview, I hope, my template will return images.
[21:40:33] <marktraceur>	 That's all I'm going to say about that
[21:40:39] <Debra>	 marktraceur: Promise?
[21:40:43] <marktraceur>	 Debra: No.
[21:40:44] <PMZ_>	 In render, I hope, my template will return nothing.
[21:40:50] <Debra>	 Hmmm.
[21:40:59] <Debra>	 I think you'd need a custom parser function, yeah.
[21:41:04] <Debra>	 That has context/awareness of the current action.
[21:41:16] <PMZ_>	 OK, gone then. Will not try so hard :-)
[21:41:17] <Debra>	 Like {{#hideonview:Image name.jpg}} or something.
[21:41:38] <Debra>	 And then you'd tell #hideonview to only affect action=view and not action=edit or action=submit.
[21:42:09] <PMZ_>	 Let me ask another question. There is a category. It contains many sub-categories. These sub-categories are of 2 types, the types are marked in their contents text.
[21:42:26] <PMZ_>	 May I show them in 2 different styles in the top category?
[21:42:32] <PMZ_>	 Example!
[21:42:36] <Debra>	 Probably with JavaScript, sure.
[21:42:41] <PMZ_>	 Top category Category:Names
[21:42:48] <Debra>	 You can just read the HTML DOM and add classes based on the category names.
[21:43:06] <PMZ_>	 Subcats are of dead people and of alive people. Dead are marked in their text contents.
[21:43:18] <Debra>	 Oh, you mean like the category description page?
[21:43:23] <PMZ_>	 Wish to show dead in italics, alive in regular.
[21:43:26] <PMZ_>	 Yes!
[21:43:30] <Debra>	 That sounds trickier.
[21:43:36] <Debra>	 But certainly doable.
[21:43:47] <PMZ_>	 Top cat to show subcat names depending on subcat descriptions.
[21:43:51] <Debra>	 You'd probably categorize each category itself differently.
[21:43:56] <Debra>	 And then query based on that, I guess?
[21:44:29] <PMZ_>	 I. e. subcats in Category:One and subcats in Category:Two, both also in Category:Basic.
[21:44:46] <PMZ_>	 How can I query? With what tool / in what process place?
[21:45:26] <PMZ_>	 You know, like they mark redirect categories in Enwiki...
[21:45:37] <PMZ_>	 Redirect categories go italics in Enwiki.
[22:02:36] <jonzi69>	 JOIN
[22:03:05] <marktraceur>	 jonzi69: Success! :)
[22:56:12] <crhylove>	 Hey all!  About to do a disaster recovery for a mediawiki DB, so I'm here in case something doesn't go well. :)
[23:55:05] <Debra>	 Hi crhylove.
[23:55:15] <Debra>	 Sorry to hear that you had a disaster. Hopefully the recovery goes okay.
[23:56:06] <darkdreamingdan>	 hey guys, what's the easiest way to include a javascript and css file as part of LocalSettings.php ?
[23:56:12] <darkdreamingdan>	 i started created an extension, but it got really complicated
[23:58:30] <crhylove>	 Debra, not that bad a disaster.  I have several recent copies of the DB.  Just want to build a fresh VM for it.
[23:58:42] <Debra>	 All right.
[23:58:56] <Debra>	 Hi darkdreamingdan.
[23:59:14] <Debra>	 darkdreamingdan: There are wiki pages you can edit to inject CSS and JavaScript. Would those work?
[23:59:26] <crhylove>	 But I'm also spinning up several other fresh VMs, so I'm going slow.
[23:59:31] <Debra>	 !css
[23:59:31] <wm-bot>	 To change styles for your wiki, go to one of the MediaWiki:xxx.css wiki page (NOT a file) and put your custom styles there (sysop/admin rights required). MediaWiki:Common.css is for all skins and should be used for content styles. MediaWiki:Vector.css is for the Vector skin (default), etc. For more information, see !skins and https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Interface/CSS