[00:01:52] https://serverfault.com/questions/382511/iis-not-displaying-detailed-php-errors-shows-server-fault-500-instead [00:09:33] lol what the hell.. if i add the wgurlprotocol session and reload site, it complains about the skin now [00:09:33] ;) [00:11:22] complains? [00:15:52] figured it out [00:16:03] was using BeyondCompare to compare the .php files and it copied over wrong section [00:16:12] or it overwrote proper section [00:16:18] i got the links to show now (thanks) [00:16:21] but clicking them does nothing [00:16:31] should launch the file from network directory [00:16:34] probably a browser setting [00:18:55] progress :) speed still an issue [00:19:09] thx for all your help guys [00:21:53] PHP's opcode cache is likely a starting point [07:44:47] https://meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/394409/open-source-advertising-1h-2020 is taking suggestions for FLOSS projects to advertise on StackOverflow [10:12:41] Krinkle: can you help me with `npm run qunit` + fresh-node? [10:16:09] Krinkle: actually... nevermind, problem solved :) [10:18:15] Hi. Is there a "good practice" for text formatting syntax on mediawiki? The edit toolbar uses apostrophes for bold and italics, but etc for sub and superscripts. Would it be better to use etc for bold? [12:26:24] kostajh: k :) [12:26:56] kostajh: Was it anything I could perhaps improve or avoid with docs? [12:27:55] Krinkle: um, no, it's me typing http://localhost instead of http://localhost:8080. The error returned from `npm run qunit` didn't clue me into what was wrong. When I tried `npm run selenium` it was obvious. [12:28:24] Krinkle: I did file https://github.com/wikimedia/fresh/issues/16 which would have helped me avoid the problem [12:36:03] kostajh: ah I see. Where the env variables set in a bashrc file or such? [12:37:56] Krinkle: no, I didn't have them set. And when I set them, I mistyped and left out the port [12:38:19] Ok [12:38:26] so if we read from a .env file, that would be useful as I'd be able to share the same values for docker-compose.yml, and for fresh-node [12:39:22] kostajh: An env is interesting indeed. Is that easy to read out from bashrc to avoid duplication? I imagine there'd still be some stuff that would want to read it out directly from CLI [12:41:40] Krinkle: not sure [12:42:35] Maybe the easiest thing is a separate `--env-file` flag, so `fresh-node --env-file` uses `.env` in the directory it is executing in [12:42:59] otherwise trying to combine `-env` into one flag that reads `.env`, but allows overrides via .bashrc or at runtime, would be kind of complicated [14:55:45] If I'm using the approach in https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Wiki_family#Basic_principles to set up a wikifarm, and I want to install a fresh site using SQLite, how would I do that? [14:58:10] A wiki farm on sqlite? scary [14:59:13] I guess you either set $wgDBprefix as something for the individual wiki... [14:59:31] Or a different $wgSQLiteDataDir per wiki, so the db don't all end up with the same name and file.. [15:08:48] the context of this is core's docker-compose environment. so while scary, maybe not totally unreasonable :) [15:09:34] Reedy: what is the least painful way to populate the database file? Step 5 advises runing update.php which won't do anything, since the SQLite file for my the additional site doesn't yet exist. [15:09:50] and if I try to run install.php then I get complaints about LocalSettings.php already existing [15:23:29] OK, I guess this is pretty easy -- after setting the wikiId, you copy the existing SQLite file to a new location and you're done. [15:53:12] Reedy: poking around.. i added "zend_extension=" to patch of php_opcache.dll [15:53:15] didnt notice a dif yet [15:53:25] did you restart your webserver? [15:53:31] nope! will do [15:53:38] havent had to do that yet when making changes to php.ini [15:54:04] It might be differnet for IIS... But certainly for a lot of things like that on apache et al, something needs restarting [15:54:18] still like a 3-5 second delay for every page [15:54:41] It's possible/probable you need other caching too [15:54:48] you can use phpinfo to find out it's actually loaded via the web interface [15:56:49] Opcode Caching Up and Running [15:59:06] !slow [15:59:08] !performance [15:59:08] [16:00:14] i fixed it [16:00:23] changed 'localhost' to 127.0.0.1 [16:00:28] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Topic:S3i13ujo45jtkp2h [16:00:49] much faster now [16:01:06] lol [16:01:16] You might want to check DNS setup on that server tehn [16:01:40] ping localhost <1 ms [16:02:14] that doesn't tell you how long it took to resolve [16:02:58] seemed instant to me :\ [16:03:12] Could've been cached [16:03:23] And the resolution process via cli vs php in IIS is potentially different [16:03:53] hosts file looks fine [16:04:17] dns servers look fine [16:07:37] https://serverfault.com/questions/66347/why-is-the-response-on-localhost-so-slow/444338#444338 [16:09:19] holy crap [16:09:23] just noticed in hosts [16:09:27] both localhost lines are commented out [16:09:37] pretty sure thats not supposed to be like that [16:10:07] err nevermind [16:10:08] guess it is [17:01:13] Is there a way to get a minimal version of the Translate extension up and going without downloading everything else ? [17:02:23] I'm trying to figure out T128137 but I've been fighting my internet connection for the rest of the evening trying to git clone everything... [17:02:24] T128137: Stop using onclick attributes and globally scoped functions - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T128137 [17:44:23] Any chance theres a trick to getting file:// files to launch via media wiki? I see the links but when I click on them, nothing happens. Im assuming its a browser security thing but not 100% [18:21:38] ZeroWarz: it's a browser security thing [18:22:00] pretty much every browser these days blocks file links when accessed from an http:// or https:// scheme [18:22:48] you can tweak your browser's config to disable that [18:23:15] you really shouldn't [18:25:39] yeah I just confirmed it works fine in IE11/win7, but not on chrome [18:25:44] definitely a browser thing [18:26:35] DSquirrelGM: if you can whitelist certain sites for it as opposed to enable it on a global basis, it should be fine for sites in intranet environments [18:27:09] if it's a public wiki, then yeah, keep it off as it could otherwise enable certain attacks that can exfiltrate local files [18:27:43] another option is to simply not use file links, and manage the files via some other means (such as by uploading them to the wiki or having some other sort of http-accessible file manager) [18:28:22] definitely intranet site [18:30:52] might help if I put a cert on the mediawiki site too [18:30:56] make chrome a little happier [18:34:28] When I click on the Logo, it takes me to the Main Page, rather than Home. [18:34:43] quantum: edit the page on your wiki MediaWiki:Mainpage [18:36:11] That doesn't seem to be right. That only contains "Main Page, rather than "MediaWiki has been installed." etc [18:36:30] I already have home all kitted out. [18:36:30] quantum: the contents of that page defines the page name the logo links to [18:36:59] all the pages in the MediaWiki: namespace are "meta" pages that control various software features/appearance [18:37:28] Ok there's no underline between Main Page. Yet the actual Main_Page has one. [18:38:10] spaces and underscores are equivalent in mediawiki; URLs use underscores to be "prettier" (since a space in a url must be encoded as "%20", and you'll probably agree that "Main%20Page" doesn't look all that great) [18:38:37] My home page is The_Unofficial_Tesla_Tech_wiki, so it would be that without underscores? [18:38:37] outside of URLs, the underscores are converted to spaces [18:38:53] yeah use spaces [18:39:06] everything will Just Work(tm) [18:39:11] Thx [18:39:42] similarly in internal links you can just use spaces, [[The Unofficial Tesla Tech wiki]] will properly link the page [18:39:57] YAY! [18:40:30] I'd suspected that was the way but didn't want to go down a rabbit hole. [18:41:14] ZeroWarz: there's apparently no way to configure chrome to allow them, but there are extensions on the chrome webstore which enable them. I can't vouch for any of them as I haven't used them, so do your due diligence before installing any to ensure they are not malicious or spyware [18:42:13] if you find one you like, you can push it out to the other computers in your intranet via Chrome's GPO templates (assuming you mostly manage Windows desktops) [18:57:05] Skizzerz: eek.. figured thered be a way to do it w/ chrome [18:57:34] is that only because its a "insecure" site via chrome? if you make it https: will it allow it? [19:42:08] ZeroWarz: no, there is no way to allow it with chrome config. The security risk doesn't care whether it's http vs https -- both of them share the same risks [19:48:08] My sidebar categories are almost illegible. https://unofficial-tesla-tech.com/index.php?title=The_Unofficial_Tesla_Tech_wiki [19:48:47] I use CSS to fix everything else, but I can identify the secret code to define sidebar categories. G**gle is baffled. [19:51:33] quantum: seems like you can easily style them with CSS via #mw-panel .portal ... { ... } [19:52:06] Don't understand that syntax. [19:52:13] quantum: also your MediaWiki:Sidebar page is screwed up [19:52:17] If you just want the categories #p-Categories [19:52:20] you can't have blank lines between entries [19:52:39] maybe [19:52:47] I want blank lines between entries. [19:53:11] bawolff: Is that the CSS code? [19:53:13] hmm, nvm looks right on the sidebar itself. I didn't think wiki lists liked having blanks [19:54:15] That's the selector part of the CSS code (Similar to how Skizzerz gave you the selector part for the entire sidebar) [19:54:40] O [19:55:00] e.g. you do something like: #p-Categories { font-size: larger; } [19:55:08] or if you want the whole thing [19:55:22] #mw-panel .portal { font-size: larger; } [19:55:34] replacing font-size with whatever you actually want to change about the sidebar [19:55:40] or if you want to style certain things within the sidebar, add further selectors after those bits [19:56:10] which selectors to use depends on what the DOM looks like, which you can easily view with your browser's dev tools [19:56:38] you'll also want to make sure the specifity is high enough to actually apply the styles compared to the built-in stylings [19:56:53] but since you're giving an id selector plus maybe other things it should be fine [19:58:30] I grafted in #p-Categories color:#777777, saved, and no change. [20:00:02] that isn't correct css syntax [20:01:04] It's the best I can make out from here. [20:02:27] Time to start drinking... [20:02:32] there are plenty of online tutorials on how to style things with CSS that can teach you the syntax and offer advice on finding the correct selectors to use, I suggest availing yourself of them [20:03:09] this channel is more geared towards offering advice and help with mediawiki, and many of us largely assume you already understand the fundamentals of what you're trying to accomplish [20:03:50] I know CSS syntax, but have never used it in a thousand-word string. [20:04:11] what thousand word string? [20:04:25] My custom CSS. [20:04:30] where are you trying to edit it [20:04:33] for Vector. [20:04:43] MediaWiki:Vector.css&action=edit [20:05:29] I'd highly recommend breaking that up to make it human-readable [20:07:04] I can't always tell where one stanza begins and ends. It's so beautiful on my site I just beed to make this one change, and to fsck everything up for this is a non-starter. [20:08:16] This #p-Categories sh1t is a mystery in the context of CSS, in my experince. [20:08:18] quantum: copy/paste all of it into a prettifier like https://www.cleancss.com/css-beautify/ [20:08:31] that'll make it easier to edit that page at the very least [20:10:11] if you don't understand id selectors or DOM navigation, on the other hand, I can't help you there [20:10:52] ... even though that's what MW uses... [20:11:49] what's what MW uses? [20:12:01] ffs [20:12:12] Never mind. [20:12:13] I really can't understand where it is you're being tripped up [20:13:03] You've already lost track of what we were just talking about. [20:14:51] #p-Cateogries is an id selector, meaning it styles an id in the DOM. You need to look at the DOM to determine what selectors to apply. This is CSS 101 [20:16:43] Well the prettyfier did work. Thanks for that. [20:18:47] quantum: I think reading through a tutorial on CSS might be useful to you. For example https://www.w3schools.com/css/css_selectors.asp [20:27:49] Whups the prettyfier messes me up. I was cached before. [20:52:54] Well I've gotten #p-Categories{ to work now, but #p-Articles{, #p-Caution: Science Content, #p-Tools{, and #p-Wiki Reference{ are impervious to my attempts. [20:54:51] what is "#p-Caution: Science Content," supposed to be? [20:55:19] That is one of the categories of articles in my sidebar. [20:55:52] https://unofficial-tesla-tech.com/index.php?title=MediaWiki:Vector.css&action=edit [20:56:12] er, https://unofficial-tesla-tech.com/ [20:59:10] You mean I can't change anything but Categories? [21:00:36] quantum: you can, you're just doing it very wrong [21:01:04] Oh. That's useful information. [21:02:04] Skizzerz: these files that they're using file:// for on network drives.. if they "uploaded" the files to the wiki.. would those work? [21:02:30] ZeroWarz: sure, although you'd change the links to [[File:Uploaded filename.whatever]] [21:02:42] and if they're edited, a new version needs to be uploaded [21:02:54] alternatively, you can configure the file share as a foreign file repo [21:03:06] dunno why I didn't think of that earlier actually, that may be your best bet [21:03:21] ZeroWarz: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:$wgForeignFileRepos [21:03:44] Nobody actually knows, but chooses to criticize. Well I've tried and tried and gotten nowhere. [21:03:51] then you can use the [[File:Filename.whatever]] syntax and it'll point directly to the share, meaning people who edit files in the share will see those edits semi-live on the wiki [21:03:55] quantum: What is it that you think "#p-Caution: Science Content" does? What is it that you're trying to do with that line [21:04:26] (semi-live because mediawiki caches things and won't know that the underlying file got changed unless it's told to purge the caches) [21:04:38] bawolff: That is one of the categories of files in my wiki, in the Sidebar. [21:05:05] I just want to change the color. [21:05:54] But this has turned into a gigantic faff and criticisim fest. [21:06:33] quantum: People get help who help themselves. We aren't here to do it for you [21:07:01] We can help you if you need help understanding specific things, but you have to actually make an attempt to understand the problem first [21:07:32] quantum: Maybe http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/smart-questions.html might be helpful to you [21:07:35] Some of us do other things for a living with legal work piling up, and come to channels like this to ask quick advice. Tose with spare time and the knowledge usually chip in, that is unless they're here to take out their life's frustrations on others. [21:07:57] which is what both bawolff and I are trying to do, but we aren't going to do your work for you and we aren't going to teach you CSS [21:09:36] You have taught me one tiny microscoping thing, how to change Categories, but you have no perspective which would allow me to generalize principles and self-help. [21:09:54] quantum: Sure, and if you want someone to fix your site for you, without putting any effort in yourself, there are people who will do that for you for a fee, this channel will only give you with advice on how to learn to do the things, it won't do them for you [21:09:56] bawolff linked you to a CSS tutorial, I suggest reading it [21:10:20] I don't know how MW has chosen to do labels. And yet you act like this is about CSS. Bogus. [21:12:33] Hmm, why do wikipedians think that unpatrolled articles don't show up in google? I've never heard that before. Is it actually true? [21:13:23] Hello MW community! I've recently started working as an engineer for a platform that uses MW as its core engine. Even though I'm not new to programming/ software engineering, getting used to the MW codebase has been challenging for me. Any recommendations/ suggestions on how do I learn this quickly? [21:13:36] Is there a tutorial series? Or anything to get me familiar? [21:14:44] bawolff: how would google even know? you need the patrol or patrolmarks right in order to see if a page is unpatrolled, and * doesn't have that right [21:14:54] (on enwp) [21:15:09] I was thinking maybe it sets noindex tags without anything in UI, but i don't see any code to do so [21:15:22] GDev1: Is there a specific area you're intersted in, or just generally? [21:15:50] GDev1: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:MediaWiki_architecture is kind of a high level overview, but its a little dated now [21:16:34] Generally, I think I'm going to be working with them for a while and it'd be great to have some sort of a starting point to get familiar with the codebase/ architecture [21:17:43] I would say, key starting points, would maybe be SpecialPages (Pages that start with Special:), they're all implemented in includes/specials, they are pretty self-contained, but there are lots of examples of them doing lots of different things [21:18:17] So it might make a good place if you just want to jump in somewhere [21:19:23] ParserTags/Functions are also a common extension point, and where lots of the wikitext stuff happens. https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Parser_functions might be a starting point to that [21:20:09] bawolff: iirc enwp has it set that unpatrolled pages have noindex set until its patrolled or x days go by [21:20:58] Generally speaking, I would avoid looking at the Parser generally (except for parser functions/tags), and initialization code (e.g. includes/MediaWiki.php). Both of these parts are pretty complicated and aren't really important to know in practise. They can often seem like a good place to begin, but I would avoid looking at those initially [21:21:09] Zppix: Do you by any chance know where that's implemented? [21:22:54] bawolff: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Controlling_search_engine_indexing#Indexing_of_articles_(%22mainspace%22) [21:23:44] Thanks [21:23:46] np [21:23:49] So i guess its part of pagetriage [21:23:58] thats what im gathering [21:24:23] PageTriage is always kind of weird in how it interacts with normal mediaiwki rc patrol [21:25:23] Yep, can confirm it does work with https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacob_G._Vail [21:29:22] GDev1: If you're doing frontend stuff you should also look at resourceloader https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/ResourceLoader [21:31:01] GDev1: And feel free to ask if you have questions about things or are confused about anything, we're happy to talk about MW architecture [21:31:43] These are great starting points, thanks Brian! I'll definitely ping if I have more questions or if I'm confused