[00:11:09] (03CR) 10jenkins-bot: build: Update devDependencies [extensions/ORES] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/473047 (owner: 10Esanders) [00:14:04] (03CR) 10jenkins-bot: Remove obsolete aliases from closures [extensions/ORES] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/473046 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T208951) (owner: 10Esanders) [01:23:10] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Epic: [Epic] JADE accessibility audit - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T209444 (10awight) [01:23:26] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Accessibility, 10Epic: [Epic] JADE accessibility audit - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T209444 (10awight) [02:06:13] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team (Current), 10DBA, 10Operations, 10TechCom-RFC: Introduce a new namespace for collaborative judgments about wiki entities - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T200297 (10awight) @Marostegui Pinging for review of these two files, https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/diffusion/EJ... [02:22:49] o/ for now [09:17:57] 10ORES, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Growth-Team, 10MediaWiki-Recent-changes, 10Wikidata: Wikidata recentchages API request with oresscores parameter returns 0 results - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T209459 (10Addshore) [09:20:24] 10ORES, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Growth-Team, 10MediaWiki-Recent-changes, 10Wikidata: Wikidata recentchages API request with oresscores parameter returns 0 results - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T209459 (10Addshore) A profile of the request: https://performance.wikimedia.org/xhgui/run/view?id=5beb... [09:22:28] 10ORES, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Growth-Team, 10MediaWiki-Recent-changes, 10Wikidata: Wikidata recentchages API request with oresscores parameter returns 0 results - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T209459 (10Addshore) p:05Triage>03High [09:22:50] 10ORES, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Growth-Team, 10MediaWiki-Recent-changes, 10Wikidata: Wikidata recentchages API request with ORESscores parameter returns 0 results - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T209459 (10Addshore) [09:41:37] 10ORES, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Growth-Team, 10MediaWiki-Recent-changes, 10Wikidata: Wikidata recentchages API request with ORESscores parameter returns 0 results - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T209459 (10Addshore) Logs for the request can be found @ https://logstash.wikimedia.org/goto/a1655d3903... [09:46:38] 10ORES, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Growth-Team, 10MediaWiki-Recent-changes, and 2 others: Wikidata recentchages API request with ORESscores parameter returns 0 results - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T209459 (10Addshore) [12:59:04] 10ORES, 10Scoring-platform-team (Current), 10Growth-Team, 10MediaWiki-Recent-changes, and 3 others: Wikidata recentchages API request with ORESscores parameter returns 0 results - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T209459 (10Ladsgroup) a:03Ladsgroup I will work on it. [13:20:02] awight: o/ [15:02:14] Technical Advice IRC meeting starting in 60 minutes in channel #wikimedia-tech, hosts: @Thiemo_WMDE & @CFisch_WMDE - all questions welcome, more infos: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Technical_Advice_IRC_Meeting [15:52:14] Technical Advice IRC meeting starting in 10 minutes in channel #wikimedia-tech, hosts: @Thiemo_WMDE & @CFisch_WMDE - all questions welcome, more infos: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Technical_Advice_IRC_Meeting [17:55:29] harej: Here's the patch that requires "not null" for both damaging and good-faith, if you want to reference it: https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/#/c/mediawiki/extensions/JADE/+/466781/ [18:50:12] 10JADE: In a multi-part judgment, can one of the parts be null? - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T209524 (10Harej) [18:55:26] * awight shelters in place [18:58:10] uh oh [19:03:37] hehe just having fun [19:51:21] Hi to all [20:28:17] harej: https://etherpad.wikimedia.org/p/Jade_MVP unless you have one? [20:42:41] awight: we have https://etherpad.wikimedia.org/p/JADE_potential_UI_integrations from the other day, no? [20:44:27] Thanks! [20:44:46] * awight tiptoes out of harej's kitchen [20:48:38] awight: I've caught up now on the docs meeting notes, and I note in there it was suggested that we use the focus group for figuring out a new name for judgments. I thought we weren't in favor of using the focus group to bikeshed? [20:50:14] harej: agreed for now, IIRC I was lamenting that we couldn't do this, rather than suggesting that we do [20:51:23] Ahhh. [20:51:33] I imagine there might be harmless ways to attempt this, like pre- and post-experiment surveys with optional questions like "rate 'opionion' as a label for this concept, 1-5" [20:52:22] I'll also want to see if anyone reacts to the name "Judgment." People might not really care. Not that that's a reason for (in)action. [20:53:02] The thinking behind not bothering our focus group is something like, these are not expendable resources we're paying for, with our communities the trade is limited social capital for attention given. Also, the bikeshedding could spiral out of control if done wrong. [20:53:32] +1 to a passive check as well, but how do we quantify the effect? [20:54:22] "cares enough to bring up an issue spontaneously" is a very high bar, I think. [20:55:34] It's the bar I'm proposing. It's fair to say it's too high. What would you recommend to prime the test subject's thinking, short of asking them "So what would you call this thing?" [20:55:54] I don't think it needs to be a strictly quantifiable measurement. [21:02:33] awight: Did you attend the session on health benefits? [21:03:59] harej: yeah, Elena's presentation was great. [21:04:10] I liked the use of p e r s o n a s [21:04:12] I was worried at first, when she was reading the numbers off charts, but [21:04:15] I swear they're everywhere these days [21:04:16] ^ yes exactrly [21:04:25] it was mad helpful to me [21:04:51] Maybe, personas are everywhere because life is filling with inscrutably complex legal and financial arrangements. [21:04:59] and bad software ;-) [21:20:15] okay, I want to propose optimizing for the watchlist use case [21:22:00] It seems like the best use case we can optimize for. Wiki-wide patrolling requires changing existing workflows, affinity group patrolling requires workflows that don't exist in any meaningful sense, whereas the watchlist is a reasonably stable thing we can improve upon. [21:22:39] harej: Question for you on line 6. [21:23:46] Watchlist sounds good. This seems like a nice level of reward for writing judgments, that they show up for people who care. [21:25:08] harej: I think your suggestion solves the issue in line 6, actually. [21:25:43] Also, if I am not mistaken, if we make changes to watchlists, we get recent changes for free, don't we? [21:28:18] I always have to check that--tgr summarized the status of revision pager code reuse recently... [21:30:21] * awight pounds on the saltpetered cellar walls, reading through HTML concatenations [21:31:13] Have you ever thought about creative writing, as a hobby? [21:32:37] I'm stealing from film noir <3 [21:33:07] All art is stolen, approximately. [21:35:39] This is me eating the cold walls, https://andrewsidea.files.wordpress.com/2013/09/hma6.png [21:39:44] this is interesting --> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Community_Wishlist_Survey_2019/Watchlists#AfD/prod_flags_in_Wikipedia_watchlist [21:41:23] harej: oho! [21:41:42] "Cherry my watchlist" [21:42:17] https://www.reddit.com/r/Shitty_Car_Mods/comments/6w490j/apparently_xzibit_and_pimp_my_ride_came_to/ [21:50:39] It looks like a hearse. [21:51:53] This line is interesting, > More comments: One of the current proposals at the Village Pump is to require notification of editors when an article is PRODded. This is a more practical and useful solution. [21:52:17] Weird that that's something that can't just be done automatically. [21:52:18] Perhaps we can notify, without even doing watchlist integration? [21:53:07] Oh, tangential question: does the ORES extension work on watchlists, or just recent changes? [21:53:21] Good Q [21:53:55] with watchlist. [21:54:40] oh boom, I have it figured out [21:54:51] :) [21:55:13] * awight leans in [21:55:26] We can use newfangled watchlists (now available on all wikis, I believe) to propose unjudged revisions as a highlighter/filter [21:56:03] link? [21:56:44] * awight considers searching for "newfangled" :p [21:57:23] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:MusikAnimal/customWatchlists ? [21:57:39] New WMF product naming strategy. "Newfangled watchlists" "Newfangled wikitext editor" [21:58:05] no, I'm referring to the magic box on the top of watchlists/RC [21:58:19] That lets you highlight revisions or filter them out based on criteria, including ORES-based ones [22:00:45] ah makes sense now [22:01:31] We would support both old and new-style, IMO [22:01:59] Adding just a filter and a flag is a nice start, it's simpler than showing the judgment as a sub-list item. [22:02:51] Weird UI alert: I think you're right, the state of interest is "unjudged". [22:02:58] That is a strange button label [22:03:36] I just asked in the staff channel about adoption rate for the new watchlists; this will give me an idea of whether we should support the old ones [22:04:41] For E:ORES we did support the old ones, as a data point. [22:04:58] "new RC filter" is the name I hear used most often. [22:06:33] Another weakish data point, https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/#/c/mediawiki/extensions/ORES/+/464007/ is someone who should know, referring to [22:06:38] to "classic RC" [22:06:41] awight: just talked to the product owner for watchlists; he says adoption of the new watchlists is near 100% and that his team has no plans on doing anything with old watchlists, so we should probably move in a similar direction [22:06:48] Great! [22:07:03] BTW it is only a few lines of extra code, but this is good news still. [22:07:58] It's more complex than that. If we're using the new RC filters we can make use of existing highlighting/filtering code. If we were not to use that then we'd have to figure out our own UI magic to differentiate between judged and unjudged edits. [22:09:12] And that involves making UI changes at the level of individual pager entries... not fun [22:11:39] Also, Marshall recommends we loop him in on any ideas we have to change the watchlist. [22:12:36] 10JADE: Create system for recommending revisions and diffs to be reviewed in JADE - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T208820 (10Harej) p:05Triage>03Low [22:12:58] 10JADE: JADE user experience requirements for the group-interest patroller - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T208814 (10Harej) p:05Triage>03Low [22:13:04] 10JADE: JADE user experience requirements for the site-wide patroller - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T208811 (10Harej) p:05Triage>03Low [22:13:21] 10JADE: JADE user experience requirements for the group-interest patroller - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T208814 (10Harej) This use case is de-prioritized. [22:13:29] 10JADE: JADE user experience requirements for the site-wide patroller - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T208811 (10Harej) This use case is de-prioritized. [22:14:50] I'll loop you in on this brand new email thread. [22:16:03] There's nothing fun about any of the RC integrations, but we're talking like a week or two of work, so it's mostly about planning our impact on existing workflows, IMO [22:16:41] So far, I really like the watchflow integration you're proposing, and the notifications. [22:21:38] I like that we don't have to sell the team on building a new UI :) [22:22:24] Welll [22:22:34] Lines 7-10 so far [22:22:48] 7 and 8 are not for free [22:22:55] 7 was reasonable [22:23:00] 8 is a UI, and I think we can't avoid it. [22:24:24] harej: Which of our integrations should be opt-out? [22:24:37] Or... opt-in... [22:24:55] I'd like for as many things to be opt-out as possible [22:25:31] Do we even give the option? [22:25:55] If it's just a highlighting setting, for example, it includes a "off" by design. [22:25:59] *an [22:27:14] Notifications might need a preference. <- btw, are you interested in this as a potential MVP feature? [22:29:16] Notifications for... your edit was judged? [22:29:17] Hmm. notifications on watched pages don't scale nicely, if judgments become very common. I guess we would develop a back-off digest approach by that point. [22:29:41] yeah that's one question. notifying for your edit getting judged seems quite nice. [22:29:53] notifying for watched pages is less obviously useful... [22:30:07] I mean we have notifications for edits/pages being patrolled so this would be equivalent to that. [22:30:22] Oh? Yeah that's pretty much the exact precedent. [22:31:43] Wait, I read something between the lines and not sure it's there. When you say "pages" being patrolled, this means that watchlists have this behavior? [22:39:00] Watchlists do not have this behavior. It's a behavior associated with uhhh page patrol and the special enwiki version of it. [22:42:15] (Do you know what I'm referring to?) [22:47:42] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team: Document group polarization as a risk to JADE - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T208349 (10Harej) p:05Triage>03Low [22:50:40] awight: there are a lot of open tasks in the "in progress" column on the JADE workboard; are you still working on all of those things? [22:53:52] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team (Current), 10MW-1.33-notes (1.33.0-wmf.3; 2018-11-06), 10Patch-For-Review: Add endorsement.timestamp field - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T208334 (10awight) 05Open>03Resolved [22:54:49] This needs better scoping: https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T206352 [22:55:16] I implemented the most pressing bit, but never split that into a separate task. [22:55:31] 10JADE: JADE user experience requirements for the personal-interest patroller - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T208812 (10Harej) Notes are in https://etherpad.wikimedia.org/p/JADE_potential_UI_integrations We've decided that an integration with the watchlist/RC filters feature is adequate for supporting this... [22:55:40] 10JADE: JADE user experience requirements for the personal-interest patroller - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T208812 (10Harej) 05Open>03Resolved [22:55:42] 10JADE: Make JADE visible in the MediaWiki UI - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T208748 (10Harej) [22:56:07] yeah actually--being on the current workboard vs the backlog is how I've been flagging. feel free to make this workboard follow the main one if you notice inconsistencies. [22:56:11] I'll do this batch. [22:56:32] That's what I've been doing -- moving the "(Current)" tasks to the In Progress board [22:56:47] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team: Make JADE visible in the MediaWiki UI - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T208748 (10awight) [22:57:44] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team: Clean up JADE title calculations - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T207858 (10awight) [22:59:17] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Documentation: Updates to JADE diagrams - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T199486 (10Harej) p:05Triage>03Low [22:59:25] harej: It looks like you used a WMF standard for the columns in this project... If so, is there documentation somewhere? [22:59:27] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Documentation: Write full specification for the JADE API - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T199834 (10Harej) p:05Triage>03Normal [22:59:32] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Documentation: Develop "local" documentation for wikis where JADE will be deployed - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T199519 (10Harej) p:05Triage>03Normal [22:59:42] I used what Arthur Richards taught me three years ago :P [22:59:50] haha fair enough [23:00:15] I'm mostly wondering, when is a task "Product" or "Feature Requests" rather than "Radar"? [23:00:25] "Radar" means "doesn't concern our team directly" [23:00:47] ooh I thought that was like a backlog [23:00:48] Or, doesn't concern the JADE project directly [23:01:03] * awight stares at the "Backlog" column. was that there all along... [23:01:04] Or tasks that we otherwise aren't in a position to act on. [23:01:31] So for example https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T168993 [23:01:33] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T153162 << Perfect example. This is a feature request for ORES but it tangentially involves JADE [23:02:16] The example you give is trickier I think [23:02:28] cool. I'll move everything directly relevant into Backlog, maybe? [23:02:29] It's related to the JADE project, I think, even if the two of us aren't working on it necessarily. [23:02:58] I like keeping backlog empty and sorting things into more directly relevant columns. This may be a unique perspective. [23:03:20] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team (Current), 10Design: Discuss and create a UI mockup for the JADE editor interface - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T168993 (10awight) a:03Harej [23:03:48] I'm sorry if the columns are confusing; it awkwardly combines columns for categories of tasks with a Kanban-type flow [23:04:27] No problem at all--I just want to get better at working in this framework [23:04:56] Just... let me know if I'm making mistakes here, I think I have a perfect 0.000 batting average for this session :) [23:06:35] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Advanced-Search, 10Discovery-Search, and 3 others: Advanced field indexing to support search. - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T206352 (10awight) [23:08:04] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Design: JADE UI should provide the target's ORES score, and a human-readable explanation - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T181327 (10awight) [23:08:52] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Huggle: Use JADE as a repository for exisiting ORES counterexamples - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T197098 (10awight) [23:10:00] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Huggle: Use JADE as a repository for exisiting ORES counterexamples - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T197098 (10awight) p:05Normal>03Low This is sort of on hold, we've decided that we're only interested in Jade-like collaborative judgments, and there's no point in ju... [23:12:05] It looks good to me. [23:12:34] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team (Current), 10Operations, 10TechCom, and 3 others: Deploy JADE extension to production - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T183381 (10Harej) p:05Triage>03Normal [23:12:37] 10JADE: In a multi-part judgment, can one of the parts be null? - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T209524 (10Harej) p:05Triage>03Normal [23:12:48] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team: Bikeshed: Explore alternative names for "judgment" in JADE - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T200365 (10Harej) p:05Triage>03Normal [23:12:55] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Accessibility, 10Epic: [Epic] JADE accessibility audit - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T209444 (10Harej) p:05Triage>03Normal [23:14:48] Thank you for accommodating my project management hobby horse. :) [23:15:06] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Design: Create overlay UI for editing Judgement pages - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T199128 (10awight) [23:15:10] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Design: JADE: Link from scored edit to this tool feedback interface - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T153157 (10awight) 05Open>03Invalid This isn't really task-scoped, but a principle behind our UI design. [23:15:18] Haha you wish. [23:15:24] It's not a hobby once you get paid :p [23:15:56] 10JADE, 10Design: Find way to re-surface judgments for continuous evaluation - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T204064 (10awight) [23:16:34] We should do this more often, though. Phab grooming in general doesn't happen enough, and we split it up in a strange way. Maybe it's time to consolidate the grooming into a regular meeting? [23:17:53] We've been in an awkward place for the last few months, but now that we're shoring up our requirements we can be more methodical with how we distribute work. [23:18:06] It was hard to organize the work not knowing what the work was [23:18:30] ah yeah not just this workboard though, I mean we have the backlog grooming attached to one meeting, current workboard attached to another, and now have this one to maintain. [23:18:53] I honestly don't know if it's better to do all at once or discretely, but happy to experiment. [23:20:04] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Design: Find way to re-surface judgments for continuous evaluation - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T204064 (10awight) [23:20:28] A.aron and I have talked in the past about me doing more project management work once JADE stabilizes. [23:21:50] Anyways, to explain the other columns, "Bugs" are reported defects with existing features and "Feature Requests" are for use cases that are not implemented yet. "Documentation" should be obvious and "Product" is kind of an awkward grab-bag column for things that are my problem. [23:22:01] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Design: Come up with view mode for JADE pages - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T208819 (10awight) > Some early ideas I have are to embed context in the page so that you don't have to look up the diff. Yes, thanks! I can go ahead and implement something basic, then we c... [23:23:24] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Design: Come up with view mode for JADE pages - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T208819 (10awight) Thinking we can borrow the RC list style. Right below the page title, a line line: > 16:08 Wikimedia Foundation‎ (diff | hist) . . (-20)‎ . . 2600:1:C774:AA58:A15D:999C:A2... [23:24:05] Fantastic, thanks for the run-down! [23:24:38] awight upstream removed the old ui today! [23:24:42] (for gerrit) [23:26:15] paladox: Thanks for keeping us abreast of changes! The improvements so far have been good, it seems like the project is headed in a good direction from my outsider's perspective... [23:26:27] yes :) [23:35:22] harej: I'm not sure how to file T207858 [23:35:22] T207858: Clean up JADE title calculations - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T207858 [23:35:34] It's just some tech debt that bothers me. [23:35:37] "Bugs" is fine [23:35:55] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team: Clean up JADE title calculations - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T207858 (10awight) p:05Triage>03Low [23:35:59] Similarly, T196547 [23:36:00] T196547: [Epic] Extension:JADE scalability concerns - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T196547 [23:36:13] something between tech and social debt :) [23:36:14] Honestly I think that task should be closed [23:36:24] yes. good point! [23:37:05] We may want to wait until we get the official TechCom blessing, but I think we've addressed that task. [23:37:53] Can you remind me which wikis are above the 100GB limit? en, de, and wikidaata? [23:38:13] English Wikipedia and Wikidata are over 100 GB. German and French Wikipedia are technically under but they're close enough that I'm not deploying to them either. [23:38:27] thanks! [23:39:32] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team (Current), 10Operations, 10TechCom, and 3 others: Deploy JADE extension to production - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T183381 (10awight) [23:39:36] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team (Current), 10DBA, 10Operations, and 2 others: [Epic] Extension:JADE scalability concerns - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T196547 (10awight) 05Open>03Resolved This was addressed for now, by an agreement between our team and SRE to not install JADE on wikis with revisi... [23:39:39] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Advanced-Search, 10Discovery-Search, and 3 others: Advanced field indexing to support search. - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T206352 (10Harej) p:05Normal>03Low [23:45:01] 10JADE, 10Edit-Review-Improvements, 10Growth-Team: New watchlist filter: diffs without corresponding Judgment-space pages - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T209548 (10Harej) [23:45:35] awight: what is a "fluent API"? [23:46:16] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluent_interface [23:46:23] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team: Fix translations of "judgment" concept - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T208552 (10Harej) p:05Triage>03Normal [23:46:29] like jQuery or d3 [23:46:32] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Design: Come up with view mode for JADE pages - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T208819 (10Harej) p:05Triage>03Normal [23:46:38] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team: Provide a fluent API for JADE - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T201651 (10Harej) p:05Triage>03Normal [23:47:13] It works around the ambiguity of unnamed parameters [23:47:17] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Design: Find way to re-surface judgments for continuous evaluation - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T204064 (10Harej) p:05Triage>03Low [23:47:33] e.g. $judgment->setIsDamaging(true) [23:48:06] I don't know if I like the chaining aspect, but that's the current standard AFAIK [23:48:11] ooh, method chaining [23:48:29] I have a soft spot for method chaining even though JavaScript otherwise makes me frown. [23:48:45] well I think of the chaining as more of a side-effect than the main point [23:49:02] it's so that you don't have to say $judgment->setDamaging(); $judgment->persist(); [23:49:31] The main point is to get rid of excess verbiage and to make code look like sentences [23:49:39] yes [23:49:52] Ah yeah so I guess that's why chaining is part of the package ;-) [23:50:25] personally, I'm not okay seeing functions like "with", though. [23:50:55] I just like verbose labels, which are self-documenting [23:51:50] So is https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T201651 the task to create the JADE API for the first time ever, or to do some code cleanup on the inside? [23:52:31] it's to clean up what I have already, which is a public MW API and a public PHP API [23:53:09] obviously, there's a big advantage in doing known cleanup before deploying [23:55:57] I'll move it to the Bugs column since it's technically not a feature request but I'll leave it at Normal priority [23:57:23] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team, 10Design: JADE UI should provide the target's ORES score, and a human-readable explanation - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T181327 (10Harej) p:05Normal>03Low [23:58:12] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T209548 is the official proposal for the watchlist idea, by the way [23:58:20] 10JADE, 10Scoring-platform-team (Current), 10Design: Come up with view mode for JADE pages - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T208819 (10awight)