[00:43:15] <bd808>	 !log tools.admin Restarted webservice. seemed to be hung
[00:43:17] <stashbot>	 Logged the message at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Nova_Resource:Tools.admin/SAL
[00:43:28] <Oshwah>	 Ruh roh
[00:57:08] <bd808>	 !log tools.zoomviewer Restarted webservice to rebalance load on job grid. The webgrid node it was on spiked to a load of 15 and was unresponsive to ssh.
[00:57:10] <stashbot>	 Logged the message at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Nova_Resource:Tools.zoomviewer/SAL
[03:08:55] <greg-g>	 I don't want to make a dummy tool account to test this, but, when creating a new tool, does toolsadmin/striker still offer to create a repo for you on Phabricator?
[03:16:09] <greg-g>	 yes: https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T182142
[03:38:12] <bd808>	 greg-g: it's an option for any tool account and allows unlimited repos per tool 
[03:40:42] <greg-g>	 oh, so I could have tried with one of the ones I'm already in, oops :)
[03:40:56] <greg-g>	 bd808: thanks :)
[03:41:14] <bd808>	 greg-g: :) tool accounts are cheap
[03:45:10] <greg-g>	 meh, I feel bad about dirty'ing up the namespace :)
[03:45:23] <greg-g>	 all those "aa" and "aaaaaa" at the top of the list get to me
[03:46:09] <Dragonfly6-7>	 is WMFLabs down?
[03:46:15] <Dragonfly6-7>	 i have a tool that's not loading
[03:47:07] <bd808>	 Dragonfly6-7: which tool?
[03:47:50] <Dragonfly6-7>	 https://tools.wmflabs.org/shortnames/
[03:48:17] <bd808>	 that one does seem sick. let me see if I can see why
[03:50:00] <bd808>	 !log tools.shortnames Restarted webservice to see if that would help it out
[03:50:02] <stashbot>	 Logged the message at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Nova_Resource:Tools.shortnames/SAL
[03:51:52] <bd808>	 Dragonfly6-7: I'm watching the error log and can't see what is causing it problems yet
[03:52:38] <bd808>	 hmmmm... it's an old tool of coren's
[03:54:44] <bd808>	 Dragonfly6-7: I see what it wrong with it. That tool is trying to use the now offline c3.labsdb database
[03:58:53] <Dragonfly6-7>	 can the tool be adjusted?
[03:59:20] <bd808>	 !log tools.shortnames Changed database connection to use *.web.db.svc.eqiad.wmflabs
[03:59:22] <stashbot>	 Logged the message at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Nova_Resource:Tools.shortnames/SAL
[03:59:27] <bd808>	 Dragonfly6-7: I think I got it working again
[03:59:32] <Dragonfly6-7>	 thank you, very kind
[03:59:47] * Dragonfly6-7 tests
[04:00:51] <Dragonfly6-7>	 there we go, thank you
[04:00:55] * Dragonfly6-7 goes in and resumes renaming files
[04:01:03] <bd808>	 have fun :)
[12:39:21] <arturo>	 !log tools aborrero@tools-clushmaster-01:~$ clush -w @all 'sudo puppet agent -t -v'
[12:39:27] <stashbot>	 Logged the message at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Nova_Resource:Tools/SAL
[12:56:26] <TheresNoTime>	 wotcha guys, https://quarry.wmflabs.org/query/24140 (and https://quarry.wmflabs.org/query/24243) has been returning the same value since 04:20 UTC this morning. I'm guessing this could be replication lag (?), but that seems rather excessive?
[12:56:55] <arturo>	 !log tools the puppet status across the fleet seems good, only minor things like T185314 , T179388 and T179386
[12:57:02] <stashbot>	 Logged the message at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Nova_Resource:Tools/SAL
[12:57:02] <stashbot>	 T179386: Prometheus crontab installations via Puppet failing on Toolforge bastion hosts due to remote crontab wrapper script - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T179386
[12:57:03] <stashbot>	 T185314: tools-cron-01.tools.eqiad.wmflabs: failed to apply catalog - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T185314
[12:57:03] <stashbot>	 T179388: tools-docker-builder-05.tools.eqiad.wmflabs firewall rules don't allow ssh from tools-clushmaster-01.eqiad.wmflabs - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T179388
[13:35:20] <TheresNoTime>	 ho hum, https://tools.wmflabs.org/replag *does* say 9 hours of lag..
[13:35:50] <Adotchar>	 is that normal???
[13:58:28] <chasemp>	    Adotchar it's not typical but there may be a maintenance going on I'm not sure
[16:43:27] <wikibugs>	 (03CR) 10Arturo Borrero Gonzalez: [C: 032] crontab: convert to mostly binary processing, and use surrogates for text [labs/toollabs] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/394923 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T181948) (owner: 10Zhuyifei1999)
[16:43:46] <wikibugs>	 (03CR) 10Arturo Borrero Gonzalez: [V: 032 C: 032] crontab: convert to mostly binary processing, and use surrogates for text [labs/toollabs] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/394923 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T181948) (owner: 10Zhuyifei1999)
[16:50:42] <tomthirteen>	 !help hi could someone help me try to understand the table information for logging?
[16:50:42] <wm-bot5>	 tomthirteen: If you don't get a response in 15-30 minutes, please create a phabricator task -- https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/maniphest/task/edit/form/1/?projects=wmcs-team
[16:50:57] <tomthirteen>	 I have an instance of what I was talking about yesterday
[16:51:03] <bd808>	 hi tomthirteen
[16:51:14] <tomthirteen>	 copa america centenario in spanish has that it's closed from march to september in 2016 9975924 protect protect 20160309044200 32328 0 Copa_América_Centenario [[WP:REF|Adición reiterada de información sin referenciar]] a:3:{s:14:"4::description";s:52:"‎[edit=autoconfirmed] (caduca el 04:41 9 sep 2016)";s:14:"5:bool:cascade";b:0;s:7:"details";a:1:{i:0;a:4:{s:4:"type";s:4:"edit";s:5:"level";s:13:"autoconfirmed";s:6:"
[16:51:26] <tomthirteen>	 but if you look at the edit history it's full of IP edits https://es.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Copa_Am%C3%A9rica_Centenario&action=history&year=2016&month=9&tagfilter=
[16:51:41] <tomthirteen>	 is this because there was another page? 10201815 move move 20160608193634 1310500 0 Copa_América_Centenario a:2:{s:9:"4::target";s:29:"Copa América Centenario 2016";s:10:"5::noredir";s:1:"0";} 0 Tarawa1943 5233099
[16:51:53] <tomthirteen>	 hi bd808 any help is much appreciated
[16:52:41] <bd808>	 tomthirteen: I'm in a meeting right now but I can try to help you in a bit
[16:52:53] <tomthirteen>	 thanks! i would really appreciated it
[16:55:33] <chicocvenancio>	 tomthirteen: let me see if I can understand, you are looking for the protection status of pages from table queries
[16:55:49] <tomthirteen>	 yes sir
[16:56:32] <tomthirteen>	 i don't understand the discrepancy. according to the logging table, the title is locked to IP edits from march to september 2016
[16:56:49] <tomthirteen>	 however, if you look at the edit history, it's full of IP edits
[16:57:13] <tomthirteen>	 the only thing I can think of was that there were other pages that were "merged" into at that time
[16:57:20] <tomthirteen>	 am I right?
[16:57:47] <paladox>	 bd808 im not sure if i addressed faidons comments correctly, but we need a default => for any os not defined but is being used. So i had to add a new variable that is used for default and jessie.
[16:58:00] <paladox>	 but at least puppet is happy with the change :).
[16:58:55] <paravoid>	 no that's still incorrect
[16:59:36] <bd808>	 paladox: I appareciate your enthusiasm, but I think this one may be a bit tricker to get working properly
[17:00:35] <paladox>	 paravoid oh. Would you be able to write more comments on what you would like to see please. :)
[17:01:05] <paladox>	 bd808 yep, probaly will, but puppet will at least run allowing us to fix any other issues + it will prevent other cloud users from having broken instances.
[17:04:12] <chicocvenancio>	 tomthirteen: the page was moved on june 8 2016
[17:05:58] <chicocvenancio>	 that was when the protection was dropped, which seems weird to me but it is clear (looking at web logs and history alone) that it was the behaviour at the time (might still be)
[17:08:38] <tomthirteen>	 yes, so does that explain why there are IP edits during the time that it's saying the page is locked?
[17:09:07] <chicocvenancio>	 only in june 28 the protection was reestablished for a week. So IP edits (non-autoconfirmed actually) would be allowed between june 8 and june 28 and after july 5th 2016
[17:09:20] <chicocvenancio>	 tomthirteen: where does it say it is locked?
[17:10:14] <tomthirteen>	 9975924 protect protect 20160309044200 32328 0 Copa_América_Centenario [[WP:REF|Adición reiterada de información sin referenciar]] a:3:{s:14:"4::description";s:52:"‎[edit=autoconfirmed] (caduca el 04:41 9 sep 2016)";s:14:"5:bool:cascade";b:0;s:7:"details";a:1:{i:0;a:4:{s:4:"type";s:4:"edit";s:5:"level";s:13:"autoconfirmed";s:6:"expiry";s:14:"20160909044159";s:7:"cascade";b:0;}}} 
[17:10:45] <chicocvenancio>	 I see a log saying it was locked  on the march 9 and that it would stay locked until september if no one undid it
[17:11:04] <chicocvenancio>	 and then the move undid it (which I fully agree is non-transparent)
[17:11:06] <tomthirteen>	 yes, so why are the IP edits during that time?
[17:11:16] <tomthirteen>	 ok that
[17:11:20] <tomthirteen>	 s my question
[17:11:26] <tomthirteen>	 the move undid the lock?
[17:11:52] <chicocvenancio>	 yes, don't fully understand why, and if it is still the current behaviour but yes
[17:12:18] <tomthirteen>	 chicovenancio: ok thanks! thats what I needed to know
[17:12:31] <wikibugs>	 (03PS1) 10Arturo Borrero Gonzalez: d/changelog: refresh entry for relase [labs/toollabs] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/405325 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T181948)
[17:12:52] <tomthirteen>	 i am studying the edit history of some pages trying to map the IP addresses by countries
[17:13:03] <wikibugs>	 (03PS2) 10Arturo Borrero Gonzalez: d/changelog: refresh entry for release [labs/toollabs] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/405325 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T181948)
[17:13:09] <chicocvenancio>	 tomthirteen: it was moved three times that day, that might be a factor
[17:13:24] <tomthirteen>	 sometimes this happens, that the logging table says the page is locked, but then there are IP edits
[17:13:57] <chicocvenancio>	 bring the other examples you find so we can check
[17:14:04] <tomthirteen>	 chicovenancio: what do you think? if I see this happening, use the locked history of the page?
[17:14:15] <wikibugs>	 (03CR) 10Arturo Borrero Gonzalez: [C: 032] d/changelog: refresh entry for release [labs/toollabs] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/405325 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T181948) (owner: 10Arturo Borrero Gonzalez)
[17:14:28] <wikibugs>	 (03CR) 10Arturo Borrero Gonzalez: [V: 032 C: 032] d/changelog: refresh entry for release [labs/toollabs] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/405325 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T181948) (owner: 10Arturo Borrero Gonzalez)
[17:14:45] <tomthirteen>	 i would have to dig to find the others. I've been looking at a ton of pages. can i ping you chicovenancio?
[17:15:03] <wikibugs>	 (03Merged) 10jenkins-bot: d/changelog: refresh entry for release [labs/toollabs] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/405325 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T181948) (owner: 10Arturo Borrero Gonzalez)
[17:16:01] <tomthirteen>	 chicovenancio: do you know the proceedure for this? I can see that that there is a move protection. does that mean that a page has been moved?
[17:16:28] <chicocvenancio>	 tomthirteen: move protection means a page cannot be moved
[17:17:09] <tomthirteen>	 but how can i tell that a page in fact has been moved?
[17:18:27] <chicocvenancio>	 or better phrased: that it is protected against moving by users without some restricted user group
[17:18:42] <chicocvenancio>	 you can check the move log
[17:18:58] <chicocvenancio>	 tomthirteen: or the whole public log https://es.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Especial:Registro&page=Copa+Am%C3%A9rica+Centenario
[17:19:02] <bd808>	 tracking moves is tricky unfortunately
[17:19:52] <bd808>	 the analytics team has built a dataset that helps with it, but it is not published to Cloud VPS/Toolforge users yet. They are working on that however I believe
[17:19:56] <tomthirteen>	 ugh now what is this?
[17:21:24] <tomthirteen>	 chicovenancio: "whole public log" will give the history of moves of the page?
[17:21:56] <tomthirteen>	 is there a table for this in every language wiki? i need to check every language for their corresponding title
[17:22:30] <chicocvenancio>	 tomthirteen: on the web it will give you the times a "move" action was taken from that page or to that page
[17:22:47] <chicocvenancio>	 tomthirteen: you can use english in every wiki for the special pages
[17:23:01] <tomthirteen>	 where is this?
[17:23:30] <chicocvenancio>	 https://es.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Log&page=Copa+Am%C3%A9rica+Centenario will work 
[17:23:49] <bd808>	 what you won't see if you are looking at TITLE_A is a move from TITLE_B to TITLE_C
[17:24:17] <bd808>	 so if the history goes A->B->C->A, then you would see A->B and C->A when looking at the logs for A
[17:25:05] <tomthirteen>	 but I need a systematic way of doing this, like a sql query
[17:25:24] <chicocvenancio>	 give me a minute
[17:25:41] <tomthirteen>	 chicovenancio: thanks!
[17:26:05] <bd808>	 "the analytics team has built a dataset that helps with it," -- it was like a year long project for them to figure out how to track title changes across time and make it a usable dataset
[17:26:56] <bd808>	 the data can be reconstructed from the log table, but it's not a simple sql query to do so for non-trival page moves
[17:27:56] <bd808>	 it becomes a recursive search: start a A, find a move to B, look at B, find a move to C, look at C, find a move to A, ...
[17:27:58] <tomthirteen>	 bd808: so given my work, what do you suggest?
[17:28:19] <tomthirteen>	 I just need to know the IP edits on a given page in 2016
[17:28:31] <tomthirteen>	 I don't need a complete history of the page
[17:29:37] <bd808>	 hmmm... isn't that a query against the revision table where the title is A and the user is an IP?
[17:29:59] <bd808>	 I thought there was some major part of this about page protection
[17:30:25] <tomthirteen>	 yes and that generally works but i need to know if the page was protected or not
[17:30:27] <bd808>	 I guess it might help to hear what your actual end goal is rather than the steps you have been trying to use to get there
[17:30:49] <tomthirteen>	 I have mapped out all the ip addresses for all pages in 2016
[17:31:25] <tomthirteen>	 but that just gives me a summary statistic in the end, e.g., page X was edited in 83 countries
[17:31:38] <chicocvenancio>	 https://quarry.wmflabs.org/query/24258 would be a very simple query for moves on eswiki
[17:31:53] <tomthirteen>	 I have linked the titles using interlanguage links
[17:32:18] <tomthirteen>	 but if the title was locked in a language i need to exclude it from study
[17:32:20] <arturo>	 !log tools T185314 deploying new version of jobutils 1.27
[17:32:21] <chicocvenancio>	 tomthirteen: why are you looking for periods of protection? To exclude them from the search?
[17:32:25] <stashbot>	 Logged the message at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Nova_Resource:Tools/SAL
[17:32:26] <stashbot>	 T185314: Toolforge crontab command needs to validate output - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T185314
[17:32:27] <tomthirteen>	 yes
[17:33:00] <chicocvenancio>	 tomthirteen: so you need to make sure nothing excluded the protection show in the log
[17:33:04] <chicocvenancio>	 *shown
[17:33:11] <tomthirteen>	 yes
[17:33:16] <tomthirteen>	 I see your sql
[17:33:49] <tomthirteen>	 does log_type = "move" actually show the times the page was moved?
[17:34:15] <tomthirteen>	 I'm sorry for these elementary questions, but I find the documentation to not be extremely clear at times
[17:34:19] <chicocvenancio>	 moves you do this, (today I learned) but protect actions that remove the protection or shorten the expiry date would aldo be important
[17:34:46] <tomthirteen>	 well i am first checking for protect
[17:35:08] <tomthirteen>	 but I need to also look for moves in case something cooky like copa america happens
[17:35:23] <chicocvenancio>	 log_type=move will catch all the moves
[17:36:17] <wikibugs>	 (03PS1) 10Greg Grossmeier: Remove #-devtools, merge into #-releng [labs/tools/wikibugs2] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/405336 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T185285)
[17:36:34] <wikibugs>	 (03CR) 10jerkins-bot: [V: 04-1] Remove #-devtools, merge into #-releng [labs/tools/wikibugs2] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/405336 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T185285) (owner: 10Greg Grossmeier)
[17:36:35] <chicocvenancio>	 you would also need a where clause pointing to the page name on both log_title and log_params
[17:37:32] <tomthirteen>	 yes i'm trying that now
[17:37:51] <chicocvenancio>	 like bd808 mentioned, this is not an extensive search for moves, but it will find if there was at least one move in the protected period (assuming you also filter the log _timestamp to the relevant dates)
[17:41:59] <chicocvenancio>	 also, I think administrators would be able to move a page and keep the protection, I'll try to find a definite answer about this for you
[17:45:27] <tomthirteen>	 chicovenancio: thank you for your help. but this log_type command says if the title was moved. sorry, i meant how do you find if a title has "received" other pages during a time period
[17:45:41] <tomthirteen>	 how do find out if a page has been merged into it?
[17:56:04] <wikibugs>	 (03PS2) 10Greg Grossmeier: Remove #-devtools, merge into #-releng [labs/tools/wikibugs2] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/405336 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T185285)
[17:58:39] <chicocvenancio>	 Merging is either an edit action or delete, move, and restore actions. But I am not sure how it would affect your research 
[17:59:37] <wikibugs>	 (03CR) 10Jforrester: [C: 031] Remove #-devtools, merge into #-releng [labs/tools/wikibugs2] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/405336 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T185285) (owner: 10Greg Grossmeier)
[18:00:20] <tomthirteen>	 chicocvenancio: in the case of copa, they merged or moved the other pages into the present page. if i can do an sql search systematically, at least i can find pages where this is an issue and then investigate
[18:03:26] <chicocvenancio>	 Copa was only moved, no merging involved 
[18:05:21] <tomthirteen>	  airarepano&Guaicaipuro |  5233099 | | 10224528 | protect  | move_prot  | 20160619020615 |  1025077 |             0 | Copa_América_Centenario            | [[Copa América Centenario 2016]] se trasladó a [[Copa América Centenario]]                                                                                  | a:1:{s:11:"4::oldtitle";s:29:"Copa América Centenario 2016"   
[18:05:33] <tomthirteen>	 but they did move a page
[18:05:50] <tomthirteen>	 6/19/2016
[18:06:17] <tomthirteen>	 this seems to have brought the IP edits with it
[18:06:18] <tomthirteen>	 yes?
[18:06:24] <chicocvenancio>	 Yes, they moved Copa América Centenario  to Copa América Centenario 2016
[18:06:27] <chicocvenancio>	 And back
[18:06:31] <chicocvenancio>	 A few times
[18:06:54] <tomthirteen>	 but that brought the IP addresses into the page, and they are there for the year, yes?
[18:07:02] <tomthirteen>	 sorry i'm just trying to understand this
[18:07:46] <chicocvenancio>	 My current working theory is that one of those moves was made by an user without the right to protect the page and that left the page without protection for some time 
[18:08:11] <chicocvenancio>	 But the jury is still out on that, there might be another reason 
[18:08:15] <tomthirteen>	 also when you search for Copa América Centenario 2016, copa america centario comes up
[18:08:29] <chicocvenancio>	 Yes, that is called a redirect page
[18:09:03] <tomthirteen>	 yes, but does that make the IP edits in the former page appear in the new page like apparently what is happening?
[18:09:14] <chicocvenancio>	 You can make one manually, but moves generally create one automagically
[18:09:26] <tomthirteen>	 sorry?
[18:09:32] <chicocvenancio>	 When a page is moved its history goes with it
[18:09:45] <chicocvenancio>	 You can create a redirect manually 
[18:09:47] <tomthirteen>	 does move mean redir?
[18:10:01] <chicocvenancio>	 You move page a to page b
[18:10:13] <chicocvenancio>	 Page a will become a redirect 
[18:10:17] <chicocvenancio>	 To page b
[18:10:24] <tomthirteen>	 also how do i sql query to find if a page has receive a redir during a year
[18:11:05] <tomthirteen>	 sorry for the millions of question. just trying to figure this out
[18:11:09] <chicocvenancio>	 If it was a redirect at some point? 
[18:11:20] <tomthirteen>	 yes during a year specifically
[18:11:25] <tomthirteen>	 2016
[18:12:18] <chicocvenancio>	 The only way I can think of is to get the first few characters of each revision of the page
[18:12:35] <tomthirteen>	 sorry?
[18:12:57] <chicocvenancio>	 Each edit to a page creates a new revision of that page
[18:13:11] <tomthirteen>	 ok
[18:13:27] <chicocvenancio>	 As far as I know, being a redirect is not in a table (I will double check this) 
[18:13:51] <mutante>	 i dont think it is, it's just normal page content , the string REDIRECT
[18:14:07] <tomthirteen>	 but if a page has been redirected into a new page, the ip edits of the old page should appear in the new page, yes?
[18:14:29] <mutante>	 no, i don't think it's the same as "merging" a page
[18:14:50] <tomthirteen>	 then how do i search for merges?
[18:14:57] <mutante>	 afaict it just means that a page has  #REDIRECT in the content   https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Redirects#Creating_a_redirect
[18:15:07] <mutante>	 and then there is special parsing magic 
[18:15:22] <chicocvenancio>	 Yes, I agree with mutante 
[18:15:24] <tomthirteen>	 i thought of another instance: page pokemon go
[18:15:59] <chicocvenancio>	 Which wiki? 
[18:16:06] <chicocvenancio>	 Eswiki again? 
[18:16:48] <tomthirteen>	 english
[18:18:11] <tomthirteen>	 if i remember correctly, there was a Pokemon GO but it should be Pokemon Go 
[18:18:23] <tomthirteen>	 so there are two things, a redir and a merge
[18:18:39] <tomthirteen>	 a redir simply redirects the wiki query to the new page
[18:18:53] <tomthirteen>	 a merge actually merges the entire content into the new page
[18:19:21] <tomthirteen>	 but how do i sql query to see if any page has had this done to it?
[18:22:48] <chicocvenancio>	 There is no merge action
[18:22:57] <chicocvenancio>	 We have a move action
[18:23:13] <tomthirteen>	 ok so move mean merge
[18:23:16] <mutante>	 yea, there is no real merge as in "merge the edit histories of 2 pages"
[18:23:31] <chicocvenancio>	 It will change the title of the page, and should keep the history
[18:23:39] <mutante>	 move means to copy it to a new place and then replace the old place with the REDIRECT content
[18:23:43] <mutante>	 old page is still just a page
[18:23:50] <mutante>	 (if you leave a redirect)
[18:24:12] <jynus>	 I always said talked to analytics how easy would it be if mediawiki had a more historic-friendly database format
[18:24:19] <chicocvenancio>	 But the old page has only one entry in its history 
[18:24:29] <jynus>	 apend-only rows
[18:24:36] <tomthirteen>	 ugh
[18:24:52] <jynus>	 would be more efficient performance-wise, and easier to trace back events
[18:24:58] <tomthirteen>	 ok so if a page has been moved, the history of edits goes with it yes?
[18:25:07] <chicocvenancio>	 Yes
[18:25:27] <tomthirteen>	 what happens if you don't have a redirect?
[18:25:47] <mutante>	 it copies the contents and then deletes the old page
[18:25:58] <tomthirteen>	 ok
[18:26:29] <tomthirteen>	 so if i do a simple query of "protect" that should capture the true history of the blocking of the IP 
[18:26:44] <tomthirteen>	 the copa instance was just a fluke?
[18:27:05] <chicocvenancio>	 Well, if there is a move you need to check protection on the other names 
[18:27:08] <tomthirteen>	 regardless of whether the page was moved in that year
[18:27:42] <tomthirteen>	 ok, but how do i check if a page has received a move?
[18:28:00] <chicocvenancio>	 That query, with a filter for its name
[18:28:17] <tomthirteen>	 what is that query?
[18:28:35] <chicocvenancio>	 https://quarry.wmflabs.org/query/24258
[18:29:08] <tomthirteen>	 but that query just says if that page has been moved. it does not say whether it has received a move
[18:29:49] <tomthirteen>	 i queried copa with that and no results because the page copa was not moved. but it received the move copa .... 2016.
[18:30:13] <chicocvenancio>	 Log_params is the destination 
[18:30:40] <tomthirteen>	 how does that look?
[18:30:43] <chicocvenancio>	 Log_title is the source
[18:31:38] <tomthirteen>	 i don't understand
[18:33:03] <chicocvenancio>	 Give me a minute 
[18:33:08] <tomthirteen>	 thank you
[18:41:53] <zhuyifei1999_>	 chicocvenancio: congrats on https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T185273 :)
[18:49:40] <tomthirteen>	 chicocvenancio: I have downloaded all the revision tables for the titles I am interested in. I see in the Copa instance that they are using the word "target" for the move across all the languages. What do you think, query for that?
[18:56:23] <chicocvenancio>	 tomthirteen: Where did you find "target"? 
[18:56:35] <chicocvenancio>	 zhuyifei1999_: thanks! 
[19:06:00] <tomthirteen>	 chicocvenancio: in spanish 
[19:06:02] <tomthirteen>	 10202717	move	move_redir	20160609024717	355499	0	Copa_América_Centenario	Ver discusión	a:2:{s:9:"4::target";s:29:"Copa América Centenario 2016";s:10:"5::noredir";s:1:"0";}	0	Butoro	5233099
[19:06:38] <tomthirteen>	 in polish 28872346	move	move_redir	20160622104857	477800	0	Copa_América_2016	Tak figuruje w Amerykach.	a:2:{s:9:"4::target";s:24:"Copa América Centenario";s:10:"5::noredir";s:1:"0";}	0	"Coreytaylor"	3598006
[19:07:04] <tomthirteen>	 in german 84329898	move	move_redir	20160719150115	2419011	0	Copa_América_Centenario_2016	Jahreszahl weg; s. ca2016.com, concacaf.com/category/copa-america-centenario und en-Wiki	a:2:{s:9:"4::target";s:24:"Copa América Centenario";s:10:"5::noredir";s:1:"0";}	0	Wladislawski	8544987
[19:07:34] <tomthirteen>	 it seems like the wikipedians in each language are setting a "target"
[19:10:52] <tomthirteen>	 does that seem reasonable?
[19:13:00] <wikibugs>	 (03CR) 10Merlijn van Deen: [C: 032] Remove #-devtools, merge into #-releng [labs/tools/wikibugs2] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/405336 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T185285) (owner: 10Greg Grossmeier)
[19:13:04] <chicocvenancio>	 I'll have to check, checking for actions move and move_redir would be the "documented" way
[19:13:26] <wikibugs>	 (03Merged) 10jenkins-bot: Remove #-devtools, merge into #-releng [labs/tools/wikibugs2] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/405336 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T185285) (owner: 10Greg Grossmeier)
[19:13:38] <wikibugs>	 (03CR) 10jenkins-bot: Remove #-devtools, merge into #-releng [labs/tools/wikibugs2] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/405336 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T185285) (owner: 10Greg Grossmeier)
[19:15:32] <tomthirteen>	 at this point, i'll take anything lol
[19:16:17] <wikibugs>	 !log tools.wikibugs Updated channels.yaml to: 82f35a133ffe502920845f25a616e3e64de66be2 Remove #-devtools, merge into #-releng
[19:16:20] <stashbot>	 Logged the message at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Nova_Resource:Tools.wikibugs/SAL
[19:22:34] <tomthirteen>	 chicocvenancio: thanks again for all your help. I really appreciate it. is this your employment? can I give you an email to get back to me if that's possible?
[19:28:24] <Zppix>	 tomthirteen:  some of the people here are staff majority are volunteers
[19:28:55] <Zppix>	 like myself I am a volunteer
[19:33:38] <chicocvenancio>	 tomthirteen: yep, I started this week. I can email you back, but it is best to keep questions and responses in a public forum whenever possible. Are you subscribed to the cloud mailing list? 
[19:37:23] <zhuyifei1999_>	 (convenience link: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/cloud)
[19:41:12] <chicocvenancio>	 zhuyifei1999_: thanks 
[19:49:40] <tomthirteen>	 chicocvenancio: No, I'm not. Could you give me the email to subscribe?
[19:50:02] <zhuyifei1999_>	 chicocvenancio: if bastion-03 goes unresponsive, I'll probably nag you about it :P
[19:50:58] <zhuyifei1999_>	 one of the most often reported issues is 'help tools-login is unresponsive'
[19:51:25] <zhuyifei1999_>	 because people running bots, qaact, and NFS intensive tasks on it
[20:01:52] <bd808>	 tomthirteen: you can sign up for the Cloud mailing list at https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/cloud
[20:02:25] <tomthirteen>	 Thank you! This forum is always very helpful.
[20:16:00] <wikibugs>	 (03PS1) 10Greg Grossmeier: Follow-up: I forgot Phabricator's sub-projects [labs/tools/wikibugs2] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/405362 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T185285)
[20:17:21] <wikibugs>	 (03CR) 10Merlijn van Deen: [C: 032] Follow-up: I forgot Phabricator's sub-projects [labs/tools/wikibugs2] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/405362 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T185285) (owner: 10Greg Grossmeier)
[20:17:59] <wikibugs>	 (03Merged) 10jenkins-bot: Follow-up: I forgot Phabricator's sub-projects [labs/tools/wikibugs2] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/405362 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T185285) (owner: 10Greg Grossmeier)
[20:19:13] <greg-g>	 bd808: put that helpful quote in your annual review
[20:35:00] <wikibugs>	 (03CR) 10jenkins-bot: Follow-up: I forgot Phabricator's sub-projects [labs/tools/wikibugs2] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/405362 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T185285) (owner: 10Greg Grossmeier)
[20:35:28] <wikibugs>	 !log tools.wikibugs Updated channels.yaml to: e85e5b9d9cd2b574d72bf2292b19f8a256f888fd Follow-up: I forgot Phabricator's sub-projects
[20:35:31] <stashbot>	 Logged the message at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Nova_Resource:Tools.wikibugs/SAL
[21:11:09] <wikibugs>	 (03PS1) 10Pamputt: Add "s" for second in missing places [labs/tools/ptable] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/405370
[23:07:01] <wikibugs>	 (03PS1) 10Chico Venancio: Add Chicocvenancio's key for Cloud Services [labs/private] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/405376 (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T185273)