[07:30:03] <Ironholds>	 morning halfak :)
[07:30:11] <halfak>	 Hey Ironholds 
[07:30:23] <halfak>	 I'm hacking from the Lyon airport while I wait for my flight. 
[07:30:43] <halfak>	 Wifi lasts 30 minutes, so if I suddenly disappear, that's probably why. 
[07:30:50] <halfak>	 How you doin'?
[07:31:08] <Ironholds>	 pretty good! Rewriting the tm package
[07:31:20] <halfak>	 Which one is that?
[07:31:32] <halfak>	 Wait a sec, isn't it like 3AM there?
[07:31:33] <Ironholds>	 text mining! written by duncanTempleLang and oh dear gods is it bad.
[07:31:39] <Ironholds>	 yeah, I have pretty terrible insomnia
[07:31:48] <halfak>	 Boo.  I hope that gets better. 
[07:32:04] <halfak>	 I've been having a bout of that too.
[07:32:42] <halfak>	 Jetlag is weird sometimes.  I get sleepy at the right time and I wake up at the right time, but I keep getting up for hours in the middle of the night. 
[07:33:12] <halfak>	 I'm making progress in my Neal Stephenson book though.  I just picked up quicksilver. 
[07:33:33] <Ironholds>	 whoops, segfault
[07:33:34] <Ironholds>	 yay!
[07:33:56] <halfak>	 Have you read that one?
[07:35:15] <Ironholds>	 I haven't! I think I tried and got horribly bored
[07:35:17] <Ironholds>	 was I wrong?
[07:36:01] <halfak>	 I think so.  It's all about the sudden growth of empiricism around Newton's time
[07:36:29] <halfak>	 Although it seems that Neal Stephenson is fascinated with the fashion and excess of the upper class at the time. 
[07:36:41] <halfak>	 That's not exactly the most exciting bit. 
[07:39:58] <Ironholds>	 hah! Yeah, that was my recall
[07:40:06] <Ironholds>	 halfak, you know how much I hate my foci right now?
[07:40:24] <Ironholds>	 I build hyper-fast research code. That's my jam. I'm not an algorithms person. Matter of fact, I actively don't get on with a lot of algorithms people.
[07:40:39] <Ironholds>	 so of *course* I'm sat here being like "I have...time on a 16,000 core supercomputer?"
[07:40:59] <Ironholds>	 "...shit I should have something to run on this. I don't."
[07:40:59] <halfak>	 "algorithms people" is a deligitimizing term that isn't used by the people it labels. 
[07:41:30] <halfak>	 Oh.  I see what you mean. 
[07:41:48] <halfak>	 You don't naturally see problems that large scale computing systems can solve. 
[07:41:51] <Ironholds>	 that's fair; I guess I'd rephrase as: I'm not a tremendously mathy person and some of the mathy people I encounter kinda scare me.
[07:42:18] <Ironholds>	 "naturally" - I'd more phrase it as I don't know what I don't know.
[07:42:41] <Ironholds>	 I may in fact have a massive, natural flare for this kind of work and not know because I know so little about the area I mentally discount problems in it from "stuff I should tackle and/or think about" ;p
[07:42:48] <halfak>	 naturally --> intuitively
[07:43:00] <Ironholds>	 yeah, probably true
[07:43:14] <Ironholds>	 I don't know what I have an intuitive flair for, however.
[07:43:30] <halfak>	 Ironholds, the thing is, I'm pissed off when I find out that I have a high-computation, big-data problem. 
[07:43:42] <halfak>	 Because it means that I *need* a supercomputer to address it. 
[07:43:51] <Ironholds>	 yerp
[07:44:03] <halfak>	 intuition is trained :)  humans != ants 
[07:44:07] <Ironholds>	 (DO you have such a problem? Inquiring minds want to know)
[07:44:18] <Ironholds>	 (said inquiring minds are batshit insanely brilliant)
[07:44:32] <Ironholds>	 my contact in this area is a dude who, we had a discussion about pythonic versus R underlying C storage structures
[07:44:42] <Ironholds>	 namely that python stores lists non-contiguously and R stores vectors contiguously.
[07:44:54] <Ironholds>	 ...he went away looking thoughtful and came back with a pile of C that implemented non-contiguous types in R.
[07:45:05] <Ironholds>	 you know. Just for fun. And this is why he gets to build supercomputing clusters for fun and profit.
[07:46:21] <Ironholds>	 wb, halfak_ :)
[07:46:49] <halfak_>	 Bah. 
[07:46:51] <halfak_>	 That's my 30 minute wifi thingie
[07:46:53] <halfak_>	 But that also means I should start walking to the gate. 
[07:46:55] <halfak_>	 If all goes well, I'll be back online on the other side of security. 
[07:47:39] <halfak_>	 What's the last message you saw from me before I disconnected?
[07:47:41] <halfak_>	 Ironholds, ^
[07:48:07] <Ironholds>	 "18<halfak> intuition is trained :)  humans != ants "
[07:48:18] <halfak_>	 halfak> The wikicredit persistence-tracking problem is one that needs massive CPU resources. 
[07:48:18] <halfak_>	 [09:44:24] <halfak> But I already have compute clusters for that. 
[07:48:18] <halfak_>	 [09:44:42] <halfak> So, now I'm blocked on writing the code to handle the distributed problem 
[07:48:18] <halfak_>	 [09:44:53] <halfak> (Which is blocked on VE and revscoring)
[07:48:49] <halfak_>	 OK.  Off I run.  Hopefully you'll be sleeping when I get back and we can pick this up in our timezone overlap :) 
[07:49:01] <halfak_>	 :D
[07:49:02] <halfak_>	 o/
[07:49:06] <Ironholds>	 take care!
[08:44:41] <halfak>	 o/ Ironholds 
[08:44:43] <halfak>	 still around?
[08:44:47] <Ironholds>	 halfak, I deny everythingh
[08:44:53] <halfak>	 :) 
[08:44:57] <Ironholds>	 it was some other dashingly brilliant R programmer
[08:45:18] <halfak>	 There are no equally dashingly brilliant R programmers.  :P
[08:45:55] <Ironholds>	 why thank you!
[08:45:59] <Ironholds>	 what's up?
[08:48:48] <halfak>	 Ironholds, Sorry.  Nothing in particular.  Just said I'd reconnect after security. 
[08:49:20] <halfak>	 Was wondering about the Elsevier stuff. 
[08:49:52] <halfak>	 And reading about the plos guy that wrote about about how open science is bigger than publishing and so he needed to leave and work independently. 
[08:50:08] <halfak>	 http://blogs.plos.org/opens/2015/05/15/moving-on/
[08:51:37] <Ironholds>	 halfak, reached out to Katherine, got Jake and Yana involved
[08:51:46] <halfak>	 When it comes to /open knowledge thingies/, it seems like there is a growing swell in open/amateur science. 
[08:51:49] <halfak>	 Woot.  
[08:51:55] * halfak hopes they respond positively. 
[08:52:01] <halfak>	 Would like to collaborate on this. 
[08:52:30] <halfak>	 I mentally associate "Wikimedia" with "Open knowledge thingies"
[08:52:49] <halfak>	 And we just so happen to run a set of reference wikis. 
[08:52:57] <Ironholds>	 agreed!
[08:54:25] <halfak>	 I want to get some thoughts together around practice proxies (think social learning) and reach out to Neylon
[08:55:03] <halfak>	 I suspect that the lack of visibility into scientific practice is one of the biggest hurdles we have. 
[08:55:21] <halfak>	 When we say "open science" we often are assumed to mean "open access"
[08:55:38] <halfak>	 But I don't think that's the kill application of openness to science. 
[08:55:42] <halfak>	 I think it is open practice. 
[08:56:05] <halfak>	 i.e. being able to *see* how others do what it is that they do.  not just their methods, but their process. 
[09:07:03] <Ironholds>	 halneylon?
[09:07:05] <Ironholds>	 aww
[09:08:10] <halfak>	 Bah!  Stopid airport wifi
[09:08:12] <halfak>	 I filed a nice rant and I'm not sure how much made it through. 
[09:09:11] <Ironholds>	 most of it
[09:09:17] <Ironholds>	 last message was halfak> i.e. being able to *see* how others do what it is that they do.  not just their methods, but their process. 
[09:09:21] <Ironholds>	 and then me asking who Neylon is :D
[09:09:33] <harej>	 LYS wi-fi, c'est le méchance de France.
[09:09:48] <halfak>	 The link to the plos blog is his "Goodbye PLOS, I must do more than open access"
[09:10:00] <halfak>	 OK.  Here's the second half of the rant: 
[09:10:01] <halfak>	 I suspect that such visibility into practice would distribute scholarly power substantially. 
[09:10:02] <halfak>	 It may also render my degrees irrelevant :) 
[09:10:02] <halfak>	 A degree isn't really merit.  You don't give back to the world by getting one.  They aren't a very good predictor of competence.  But they are a threshold in many cases.  
[09:10:02] <halfak>	 I think that the value I got in going to grad school was really in being able to participate in and observe the practice of science in a healthy sub-community. 
[09:10:02] <halfak>	 It would be great if someone didn't need to pay all that tuition (gotta include undergrad too) and pass a bunch of leaky filters (applying to grad school, taking tests, etc.) to be able to observe and participate in the practice. 
[09:10:06] <halfak>	 </rant>
[09:10:44] <halfak>	 o/ harej
[09:10:56] <harej>	 Gruß aus München.
[09:11:26] <Ironholds>	 halfak, agreed!
[09:11:35] <Ironholds>	 I was glad to bypass the leaky filters for a while
[09:11:42] <Ironholds>	 that bit of my life appears to be at a close, but que sera
[09:16:17] * halfak runs to airplane
[09:34:29] <harej>	 this place is my refuge from -en